---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 08/24/08: 30 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:13 AM - Re: Elevator Skin Trailing Edge Bowing... (nukeflyboy) 2. 05:02 AM - Re: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 (Wayne Edgerton) 3. 05:05 AM - Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 (Wayne Edgerton) 4. 08:03 AM - Re: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 (John Gonzalez) 5. 08:20 AM - Re: Elevator Skin Trailing Edge Bowing... (William Curtis) 6. 11:24 AM - Re: Re: Countersink (pascal) 7. 12:54 PM - Brake Linings (Marcus Cooper) 8. 01:28 PM - Re: Re: Countersink (Bob Kaufmann) 9. 01:34 PM - Re: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 (MauleDriver) 10. 02:32 PM - Re: Brake Linings (Kelly McMullen) 11. 02:32 PM - Re: Brake Linings (David McNeill) 12. 02:34 PM - Re: Brake Linings (David McNeill) 13. 02:43 PM - oil consumption (Chris, Susie, Darcy) 14. 02:49 PM - Re: Brake Linings (Kelly McMullen) 15. 02:58 PM - Re: Brake Linings (William Curtis) 16. 03:06 PM - Re: Brake Linings (Marcus Cooper) 17. 03:07 PM - Re: Brake Linings (Marcus Cooper) 18. 03:20 PM - Re: Brake Linings (Marcus Cooper) 19. 03:47 PM - Re: oil consumption (GenGrumpy@aol.com) 20. 03:56 PM - Re: oil consumption (Chris, Susie, Darcy) 21. 04:06 PM - Re: Brake Linings (Tim Olson) 22. 05:11 PM - Re: Brake Linings (David McNeill) 23. 05:11 PM - Re: Re: Countersink (pascal) 24. 05:15 PM - Re: Brake Linings (David McNeill) 25. 05:16 PM - O-540 A2B? (Andy Turner) 26. 05:18 PM - Re: Brake Linings (David McNeill) 27. 07:13 PM - Re: O-540 A2B? (Jesse Saint) 28. 07:42 PM - Re: Re: Hartzell Composite Three blade (pascal) 29. 08:38 PM - QB Wing Questions (LES KEARNEY) 30. 09:42 PM - Re: QB Wing Questions (Dave Leikam) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:13:22 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Elevator Skin Trailing Edge Bowing... From: "nukeflyboy" Matt, On the RV-10, the elevator is a 3-piece rivited trailing edge. I am not that familiar with the RV-8 but it looks like my RV-6. I have never heard of any flutter issues on the elevator due to this condition and your problem appears to be primarily esthetic. Bending the trailing edges is always a little tricky and on the ailerons, too little (or too much) can cause one wing to be "heavy". Van talks about this in the manual and you can correct the heavy wing by pinching the trailing edge, ie, make the radius smaller. The slight bowing on the skin is also of no concern, and under flight loads the skins will do this regardless. Since your radius is within spec, I don't see a safety issue here. The only problem is is whether or not you can live with it. -------- Dave Moore RV-6 flying RV-10 QB building fuselage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 0227#200227 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:53 AM PST US From: "Wayne Edgerton" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 I don't see any real downside to installing speed brakes but in my case I wouldn't see any real advantage for my type of flying. I've got around 200 hours on it now and I've not had any difficulty slowing it down. If you want to descend and not pick up speed the old side slip works fine. If you want to slow down quickly pull back the power and raise the nose. I'm not saying speed brakes wouldn't be interesting to have but for me they probably would be used much. Wayne Edgerton N602WT do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:05:43 AM PST US From: "Wayne Edgerton" Subject: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 I forgot to say that I'm glider rated so I'm use to using speed brakes and they are the life blood of the glider but the 10 is definitely not a glider. Chop the power and she wants to come down. Wayne Edgerton do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Wayne Edgerton Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 7:01 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 I don't see any real downside to installing speed brakes but in my case I wouldn't see any real advantage for my type of flying. I've got around 200 hours on it now and I've not had any difficulty slowing it down. If you want to descend and not pick up speed the old side slip works fine. If you want to slow down quickly pull back the power and raise the nose. I'm not saying speed brakes wouldn't be interesting to have but for me they probably would be used much. Wayne Edgerton N602WT do not archive ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:03:00 AM PST US From: John Gonzalez Subject: RE: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 To call them speed brakes on a sailplane is incorrect as mentioned before. To use them to reduce speed may cause real problems, as in very hard landing even at high speed. Correctly, they are for altitude loss and control, causing the glider wing to be less efficient. A real speed brake....think of an A-1 Skyraider with those barn doors that come out of the side of the fuselage so they can point the nose straight down at the ground and not overspeed. About to put the sailplane away and get back to building. JOhn G. ________________________________ > From: wayne.e@grandecom.net > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 > Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 07:05:12 -0500 > > I forgot to say that I'm glider rated so I'm use to using speed brakes and they are the life blood of the glider but the 10 is definitely not a glider. Chop the power and she wants to come down. > > Wayne Edgerton > > do not archive > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Wayne Edgerton > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 7:01 AM > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 > > I don't see any real downside to installing speed brakes but in my case I wouldn't see any real advantage for my type of flying. I've got around 200 hours on it now and I've not had any difficulty slowing it down. If you want to descend and not pick up speed the old side slip works fine. If you want to slow down quickly pull back the power and raise the nose. > > I'm not saying speed brakes wouldn't be interesting to have but for me they probably would be used much. > > Wayne Edgerton N602WT > > do not archive > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:20:07 AM PST US Subject: re: RV10-List: Elevator Skin Trailing Edge Bowing... From: "William Curtis" Yeah, this happened to my first trim tabs. Fortunately, or un, the trim tab is the only flying surface of the -10 that uses this construction technique. Us 9 & 10 builders have the AEX extrusion and Proseal to contend with for our flying surfaces with their own "got ya's." With the trim tabs, I created a brake from 2X4 to provide a more continuous mold while curing than the V brackets called for in the plans. William http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/ -------- Original Message -------- > Dear Listers, > > Backing into the garage today I noticed the elevator skin bowing at > the trailing edge in the review mirror because of the way the light > was hitting it. Basically what the deal is I think is that I bent > the trailing edge of the elevators more than necessary. So, when I > pulled the leading edge apart to fit it over the spar, I now have a > concave bowing effect between some of the bays. Van's goes to great > lengths in the manual to make sure that bend the elevator trailing > edges *enough*, but doesn't make mention of what is "too much". The > radius of the trailing edge is still within spec and there is no > cracking or stress marks. Its just bent too much and looks like of > stupid. Somehow, I did the rudder perfectly, but both elevators > suffer from the effect. I've included some pictures below. > > What the common thought on this issue? Are the safety/flutter issues > with over-bending as I have done? What to do...? > > Thanks! > > Matt Dralle > RV-8 #82880 > RV-8 Fuse/Wing QB Kit Delivery Next Week! (Ordered May 20 2008) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:24:41 AM PST US From: "pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Countersink Charles; The countersink is on it's way to you and should arrive in the next day or so. I have the labels Lew sent enclosed for Gary. Thanks Lew ! Also the builder that owns and is sharing the countersink. Sorry forget your name but I appreciate it nevertheless. Pascal -------------------------------------------------- From: "Lew Gallagher" Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 5:47 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Countersink > > Hey Don, > > I was wondering if/why Fred sent it back to you and where it was. Here is > the revised list: > > 10) Pascal Reid > 11) Charles Usery > 12) Gary Blankenbiller > 13) Phil White > 14) Bob Kaufmann > 15) Lew Gallagher > > And then Pascal has "deferred" and then undeferred -- so let's just stick > with the list. I'll snail mail Pascal the list with new labels so that by > the time he gets it and is ready to send it on, it should be up to date. > > Shouldn't be too difficult for guys who can navigate across the country in > intricate flyin' machines they've meticulously assembled! Just cross > yourself off the list and send it on to the next. > > Unless you are installing different seatbelts (retractable, etc.) the > standard one from Van's uses this countersink for one hole each, left and > right, for the front shoulder belts, centered in the "hard point" in the > canopy. The bolts are included in the bag labeled miscellaneous (I think > #1541), so you don't need to wait until you get the belts to go ahead and > countersink the canopy. > > Of course this is much ado about nothing -- but it's a great bonding > exercise! And as long as it's still cutting clean countersinks, why not. > Heck, if I could think of a way to circulate my laser guided dimpler this > easily, I'd circulate that! > > Later, - Lew > > do not archive > > -------- > non-pilot > crazy about building > NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 > Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=199055#199055 > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:54:44 PM PST US From: "Marcus Cooper" Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them anyway. Thanks, Marcus Do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 01:28:19 PM PST US From: "Bob Kaufmann" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Countersink Scratch Bob Kaufmann from the list. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pascal Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 11:24 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Countersink Charles; The countersink is on it's way to you and should arrive in the next day or so. I have the labels Lew sent enclosed for Gary. Thanks Lew ! Also the builder that owns and is sharing the countersink. Sorry forget your name but I appreciate it nevertheless. Pascal -------------------------------------------------- From: "Lew Gallagher" Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 5:47 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Countersink > > Hey Don, > > I was wondering if/why Fred sent it back to you and where it was. Here is > the revised list: > > 10) Pascal Reid > 11) Charles Usery > 12) Gary Blankenbiller > 13) Phil White > 14) Bob Kaufmann > 15) Lew Gallagher > > And then Pascal has "deferred" and then undeferred -- so let's just stick > with the list. I'll snail mail Pascal the list with new labels so that by > the time he gets it and is ready to send it on, it should be up to date. > > Shouldn't be too difficult for guys who can navigate across the country in > intricate flyin' machines they've meticulously assembled! Just cross > yourself off the list and send it on to the next. > > Unless you are installing different seatbelts (retractable, etc.) the > standard one from Van's uses this countersink for one hole each, left and > right, for the front shoulder belts, centered in the "hard point" in the > canopy. The bolts are included in the bag labeled miscellaneous (I think > #1541), so you don't need to wait until you get the belts to go ahead and > countersink the canopy. > > Of course this is much ado about nothing -- but it's a great bonding > exercise! And as long as it's still cutting clean countersinks, why not. > Heck, if I could think of a way to circulate my laser guided dimpler this > easily, I'd circulate that! > > Later, - Lew > > do not archive > > -------- > non-pilot > crazy about building > NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 > Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=199055#199055 > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:34:53 PM PST US From: MauleDriver Subject: Re: RV10-List: Speedbrake installation kit for RV-10 ...to continue down the OT glider discussion I would submit that the devices used on glider wings serve to degrade the L/D performance of aircraft independent of whether they are called spoilers, dive brakes, or speed brakes. Whether you spoil lift or increase drag - you will come down at a greater rate and everything else being equal, you will slow down. Cases on point: - The Schweitzer 1-34, a 60s vintage a metal glider had "terminal velocity" dive brakes. You could point the ship straight down with what I assume you would call 'dive brakes' and you would not exceed Vne. There was nothing special about Vne, but just a good example of the drag created by what is now a typical glider 'spoiler' configuration. I understand that more than a few modern sailplanes have spoilers capable of terminal velocity performance, but simply haven't been fully tested and certified as such. - Trim a modern sailplane for a typical approach speed, apply the 'spoilers', and try to maintain the same pitch attitude without losing speed. Or conversely, apply spoilers and note the pitch change required to maintain speed. I'm thinking the banking devices on an MU-2 would properly be called (lift) spoilers since their function is drop a wing with minimal drag. The landing approach devices on gliders do varying amounts of lift spoiling and drag increasing based on their design but few are primarily 'spoilers' and most are very effective dive/speed brakes by design. And some like those on the Schweitzer 2-22 are excellent side slip trainers because they barely do anything at all. OK, I've returned home aboard the Maule on a very nice soaring day her in NC. Now I'm ready to go do some building before this weekend gets away. John Gonzalez wrote: > > To call them speed brakes on a sailplane is incorrect as mentioned before. To use them to reduce speed may cause real problems, as in very hard landing even at high speed. Correctly, they are for altitude loss and control, causing the glider wing to be less efficient. > > A real speed brake....think of an A-1 Skyraider with those barn doors that come out of the side of the fuselage so they can point the nose straight down at the ground and not overspeed. > > About to put the sailplane away and get back to building. > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:32:58 PM PST US From: "Kelly McMullen" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings AS&S shows Cleveland version for 15.60 a pair, under Beech Skipper. So tax vs shipping would be the tie brake. On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Marcus Cooper wrote: > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of > requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 > linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts > so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll > happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd > like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them > anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:32:58 PM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings I believe you will find that the Rapco brake linings use same numbering system as Cleveland but have RA as a prefix. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 12:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them anyway. Thanks, Marcus Do not archive ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:34:13 PM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings You might order the brake rivet set and use your hand squeeze on them. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 12:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them anyway. Thanks, Marcus Do not archive ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:43:12 PM PST US From: "Chris, Susie, Darcy" Subject: RV10-List: oil consumption For those that are flying after 40 hours I am using 1 quart every 7 hours. Is this to much? I know what the manual says but if one went by that you would have to take spare oil on every flight! Chris ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:49:24 PM PST US From: "Kelly McMullen" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings Unfortunately, Rapco doesn't supply equivalents for every variety brake pad. On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 2:31 PM, David McNeill wrote: > > I believe you will find that the Rapco brake linings use same numbering > system as Cleveland but have RA as a prefix. > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper > Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 12:54 PM > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings > > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of > requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 > linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts > so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll > happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd > like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them > anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:58:51 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings From: "William Curtis" I looked at these and though it was about time that someone came out with something like this, but then the price makes no sense. $37 for brake rivet set only when the old complete "hammer" version is only $23. The brake rivet set should be no more than $10. For example this 5 piece rivet set is only $18.95: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/rivset4sqzr.php It may be better to just grind down a set of an old rivet set. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/brakerivset.php William http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/ -------- Original Message -------- > > You might order the brake rivet set and use your hand squeeze on them. > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper > Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 12:54 PM > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings > > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of > requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 > linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts > so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll > happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd > like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them > anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:06:22 PM PST US From: "Marcus Cooper" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings Thanks, good catch on the part number but I read it as price per lining so with the new price of $16.95 that would be double Vans price. I have a question in to AS&S so we'll see. If anyone has confidence that the price is per pair please let me know and I'll hit send on the order. My concern is because there are several airplanes mentioned that need 1 versus 2 of the same part number but the price is the same leading me to believe price is per lining. Thanks, Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 4:29 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings AS&S shows Cleveland version for 15.60 a pair, under Beech Skipper. So tax vs shipping would be the tie brake. On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Marcus Cooper wrote: > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of > requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 > linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts > so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll > happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd > like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them > anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:07:12 PM PST US From: "Marcus Cooper" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings Great call, now why didn't I think of that?! -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 4:34 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings You might order the brake rivet set and use your hand squeeze on them. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 12:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them anyway. Thanks, Marcus Do not archive ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:20:59 PM PST US From: "Marcus Cooper" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings I found Rapco's full catalog on the AS&S sight and you're correct, RA66-112 for the Skipper. Unfortunately AS&S site doesn't have them available. I'll keep looking though. Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 4:32 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings I believe you will find that the Rapco brake linings use same numbering system as Cleveland but have RA as a prefix. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 12:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Linings It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them anyway. Thanks, Marcus Do not archive ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:47:47 PM PST US From: GenGrumpy@aol.com Subject: Re: RV10-List: oil consumption You're doing just fine. 7-10 hours per quart is normal. Mine uses the normal as long as I don't fill it past 9 qts, otherwise it blows it out. If it's a new engine, don't forget to start taking oil samples at every oil change once you get past 100 hours. grumpy N184JM 80+ hours DO NOT ARCHIVE In a message dated 8/24/2008 4:45:08 P.M. Central Daylight Time, vhmum@bigpond.com writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: "Chris, Susie, Darcy" For those that are flying after 40 hours I am using 1 quart every 7 hours. Is this to much? I know what the manual says but if one went by that you would have to take spare oil on every flight! Chris **************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047) ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:56:33 PM PST US From: "Chris, Susie, Darcy" Subject: Re: RV10-List: oil consumption Thanks Grumpy just got back from a trip in central Australia and at first was using more than stated but has dropped a bit. I to now only fill to 9 quarts as it blows the rest out. regards Chris VH-ICY ----- Original Message ----- From: GenGrumpy@aol.com To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, August 25, 2008 8:46 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: oil consumption You're doing just fine. 7-10 hours per quart is normal. Mine uses the normal as long as I don't fill it past 9 qts, otherwise it blows it out. If it's a new engine, don't forget to start taking oil samples at every oil change once you get past 100 hours. grumpy N184JM 80+ hours DO NOT ARCHIVE In a message dated 8/24/2008 4:45:08 P.M. Central Daylight Time, vhmum@bigpond.com writes: For those that are flying after 40 hours I am using 1 quart every 7 hours. Is this to much? I know what the manual says but if one went by that you would have to take spare oil on every flight! Chris es y --> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS nbsp; - List Contribution Web Site ; ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 04:06:00 PM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings Cleaveland is the ONLY place making them at this point, so all linings of that part number are the ones you need. Rapco is thinking about it, but hasn't. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying do not archive Marcus Cooper wrote: > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes of > requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit with 4 > linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't Cleveland parts > so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a matching part? I'll > happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a lot closer to AS&S and I'd > like to save on the shipping since I have to order the brake tool from them > anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:11:04 PM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings I bought Cleveland replacements at Air suppliers out of Texas. Better price than AS&S IIRC. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 3:06 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings Thanks, good catch on the part number but I read it as price per lining so with the new price of $16.95 that would be double Vans price. I have a question in to AS&S so we'll see. If anyone has confidence that the price is per pair please let me know and I'll hit send on the order. My concern is because there are several airplanes mentioned that need 1 versus 2 of the same part number but the price is the same leading me to believe price is per lining. Thanks, Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 4:29 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings AS&S shows Cleveland version for 15.60 a pair, under Beech Skipper. So tax vs shipping would be the tie brake. On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Marcus Cooper wrote: > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes > of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit > with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't > Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a > matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a > lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have > to order the brake tool from them anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:11:05 PM PST US From: "pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Countersink So looks like Lew gets it after Phil >> 11) Charles Usery >> 12) Gary Blankenbiller >> 13) Phil White >> 14) Lew Gallagher >> 15) TBD -------------------------------------------------- From: "Bob Kaufmann" Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 1:26 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Countersink > > Scratch Bob Kaufmann from the list. > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pascal > Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 11:24 AM > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Countersink > > > Charles; > The countersink is on it's way to you and should arrive in the next day or > so. > I have the labels Lew sent enclosed for Gary. > > Thanks Lew ! Also the builder that owns and is sharing the countersink. > Sorry forget your name but I appreciate it nevertheless. > > Pascal > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Lew Gallagher" > Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 5:47 AM > To: > Subject: RV10-List: Re: Countersink > >> >> Hey Don, >> >> I was wondering if/why Fred sent it back to you and where it was. Here >> is > >> the revised list: >> >> 10) Pascal Reid >> 11) Charles Usery >> 12) Gary Blankenbiller >> 13) Phil White >> 14) Bob Kaufmann >> 15) Lew Gallagher >> >> And then Pascal has "deferred" and then undeferred -- so let's just stick >> with the list. I'll snail mail Pascal the list with new labels so that >> by > >> the time he gets it and is ready to send it on, it should be up to date. >> >> Shouldn't be too difficult for guys who can navigate across the country >> in > >> intricate flyin' machines they've meticulously assembled! Just cross >> yourself off the list and send it on to the next. >> >> Unless you are installing different seatbelts (retractable, etc.) the >> standard one from Van's uses this countersink for one hole each, left and >> right, for the front shoulder belts, centered in the "hard point" in the >> canopy. The bolts are included in the bag labeled miscellaneous (I think >> #1541), so you don't need to wait until you get the belts to go ahead and >> countersink the canopy. >> >> Of course this is much ado about nothing -- but it's a great bonding >> exercise! And as long as it's still cutting clean countersinks, why not. >> Heck, if I could think of a way to circulate my laser guided dimpler this >> easily, I'd circulate that! >> >> Later, - Lew >> >> do not archive >> >> -------- >> non-pilot >> crazy about building >> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 >> Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop. >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=199055#199055 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 05:15:49 PM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings You can figure about $15 per lining no matter which supplier you buy for aircraft; it goes on certified aircraft. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 3:06 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings Thanks, good catch on the part number but I read it as price per lining so with the new price of $16.95 that would be double Vans price. I have a question in to AS&S so we'll see. If anyone has confidence that the price is per pair please let me know and I'll hit send on the order. My concern is because there are several airplanes mentioned that need 1 versus 2 of the same part number but the price is the same leading me to believe price is per lining. Thanks, Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 4:29 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings AS&S shows Cleveland version for 15.60 a pair, under Beech Skipper. So tax vs shipping would be the tie brake. On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Marcus Cooper wrote: > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes > of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit > with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't > Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a > matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a > lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have > to order the brake tool from them anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 05:16:11 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: O-540 A2B? From: "Andy Turner" I'm hoping those of you more expert than I in the issues involved with using lycomings closely related to the recommended models can enlighten me here. I'm looking at a O-540 A2B. From what I can dig up, this model has short propeller governor studs, which I think is a good thing, but it lacks counterweights, which I understand to make it incompatible with Van's recommended compact hub props. Can one simply use a steel hub prop certified for use with this engine? Are there any other issues I should think about? Thanks in advance, -Andy -------- Andy Turner Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 0333#200333 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 05:18:30 PM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings Check http://www.airsuppliers.com/shop/search.asp for 66-11200. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 5:11 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings I bought Cleveland replacements at Air suppliers out of Texas. Better price than AS&S IIRC. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 3:06 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Linings Thanks, good catch on the part number but I read it as price per lining so with the new price of $16.95 that would be double Vans price. I have a question in to AS&S so we'll see. If anyone has confidence that the price is per pair please let me know and I'll hit send on the order. My concern is because there are several airplanes mentioned that need 1 versus 2 of the same part number but the price is the same leading me to believe price is per lining. Thanks, Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 4:29 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Linings AS&S shows Cleveland version for 15.60 a pair, under Beech Skipper. So tax vs shipping would be the tie brake. On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Marcus Cooper wrote: > > It's time to replace the brakes and my research has found Tim's notes > of requiring Cleveland part# 66-112. However, Vans has a brake kit > with 4 linings and the rivets for $33. I'm guessing those aren't > Cleveland parts so I was wondering if anyone knew of RAPCO now had a > matching part? I'll happily order the parts from Vans, however I'm a > lot closer to AS&S and I'd like to save on the shipping since I have > to order the brake tool from them anyway. > > Thanks, > Marcus > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 07:13:17 PM PST US From: Jesse Saint Subject: Re: RV10-List: O-540 A2B? I can't speak to the counterweights or prop hub, but if you go with the Van's FWF kit you will need the long prop governor studs, which you can pick up from anybody who sells Lycoming parts. I don't know the part number, but they should be able to look them up. I have had to replace several sets of studs because the ones sent with the engine were too short for the MT governor, which is included in the FWF kit. do not archive Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse@saintaviation.com Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 On Aug 24, 2008, at 8:15 PM, Andy Turner wrote: > > I'm hoping those of you more expert than I in the issues involved > with using lycomings closely related to the recommended models can > enlighten me here. I'm looking at a O-540 A2B. From what I can dig > up, this model has short propeller governor studs, which I think is > a good thing, but it lacks counterweights, which I understand to > make it incompatible with Van's recommended compact hub props. Can > one simply use a steel hub prop certified for use with this engine? > Are there any other issues I should think about? > > Thanks in advance, -Andy > > -------- > Andy Turner > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 0333#200333 > > ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 07:42:27 PM PST US From: "pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Hartzell Composite Three blade Rob; Are you using a MT governor or the Hartzell governor with the 3 blade prop? Any speed test done yet? max speed, climb speeds etc?? Thanks! Pascal From: RobHickman@aol.com Sent: Monday, August 18, 2008 5:42 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Hartzell Composite Three blade This is partly my fault as I have not finished testing either prop for them; it was just too hot to fly it against Dan's RV-10 over the weekend here in Oregon. Hartzell will not sell a prop until it is approved by the aircraft manufacturer and Van's will not approve the prop until they get test data from it. To get a reasonable price on the Harzell prop you are going to have to get it with an OEM agreement, and that means from Van's. Getting performance data to Hartzell and Van=99s is at the top of my list for the RV-4 and RV-10. Hopefully, I=99ll have data to them this week. I currently have over 70 hours on the prop in my RV-10 and I would not trade it for anything. Jennifer and I flew it to Van=99s home coming on Saturday and as soon as I shut it down we had a number of people telling me how quiet it was when we taxied in. We flew our neighbor (who has built aircraft engines for years) home with us in the RV-10, and he was amazed at how smooth and quiet the plane was with this prop. In my opinion, Hartzell is being very responsible for taking this stand and we should give them the credit that they deserve. Rob Hickman N402RH RV-10 IO-540 with three blade Hartzell Composite Prop N401RH RV-4 IO-360 with two blade Hartzell Composite Prop In a message dated 8/18/2008 3:23:39 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, rvbuilder@sausen.net writes: Glad MT and AeroComposite don't take that stance. Hartzell's loss is others gain. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rv@thelefflers.com Sent: Monday, August 18, 2008 4:05 PM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: RE: RV10-List: Re: Hartzell Composite Three blade Unfortunately, Hartzell won't say anything until they get the thumbs up from Van's. Our chapter just did a factory tour and they spent quite a bit of time on the approval process on what they sell. If you mention RV and it's not on the Van's approved list, they will ignore you. :^( ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 08:38:01 PM PST US From: LES KEARNEY Subject: RV10-List: QB Wing Questions Hi This wekend I started fininihsing off my QB wings. When installing the botton skins, the plans reference step 5 on pag 16-2 that describe how to improve the "aesthetics" of the wing overlaps. While the plans suggest removing material from the overlapped skins, they neglect to say how to do this. The range of possibilities go from a chain saw to a jeweler's file. I think a sanding block with a fine grit sandpaper might work but was wondering what others have used. As well, I have a couple of tie down rings for the wings. Looking at the ring attachment points, it looks like the there is not enough material to allow tapping holes for the rings. Am I missing something ? Inquiring minds need to know. Les Kearney #40643 - some assembly required ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 09:42:11 PM PST US From: "Dave Leikam" Subject: Re: RV10-List: QB Wing Questions Hi Les, There should be plenty of material for tapping the tie downs. I had no problem here. Just go slow, use plenty of oil, and reverse out the tap often to clear the threads. I then used a small angled pick to remove chips from the holes. I used a small Vixen file to put a bevel on the skin edges for overlapping. Again, go slow and steady and keep a constant angle. Be sure to remove some material from the aft edge of the skins so they do not buckle and cause oil canning. You'll see what I mean after you cleco the skins on the first time. Dave Leikam RV-10 #40496 N89DA (Reserved) Muskego, WI ----- Original Message ----- From: LES KEARNEY To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 10:35 PM Subject: RV10-List: QB Wing Questions Hi This wekend I started fininihsing off my QB wings. When installing the botton skins, the plans reference step 5 on pag 16-2 that describe how to improve the "aesthetics" of the wing overlaps. While the plans suggest removing material from the overlapped skins, they neglect to say how to do this. The range of possibilities go from a chain saw to a jeweler's file. I think a sanding block with a fine grit sandpaper might work but was wondering what others have used. As well, I have a couple of tie down rings for the wings. Looking at the ring attachment points, it looks like the there is not enough material to allow tapping holes for the rings. Am I missing something ? Inquiring minds need to know. Les Kearney #40643 - some assembly required ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.