---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 10/28/08: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:53 AM - Re: Purge Valves (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 2. 03:57 AM - Re: cowl hinges (Bob Leffler) 3. 05:03 AM - Re: Purge Valves (Ralph E. Capen) 4. 05:11 AM - Re: cowl hinges (Ralph E. Capen) 5. 05:28 AM - Re: cowl hinges (Lew Gallagher) 6. 08:13 AM - Re: Purge Valves (Michael Kraus) 7. 09:25 AM - Re: Re: cowl hinges (William Curtis) 8. 09:25 AM - Re: cowl hinges (John Cox) 9. 10:29 AM - Re: cowl hinges (Lew Gallagher) 10. 12:00 PM - Re: Re: cowl hinges (Robin Marks) 11. 03:09 PM - Re: Re: cowl hinges (Carl Froehlich) 12. 03:59 PM - Re: Purge Valves (Carl Froehlich) 13. 05:34 PM - Fw: cowl hinges (dogsbark@comcast.net) 14. 06:43 PM - TCW Technologies Products (Bob-tcw) 15. 06:49 PM - Re: Purge Valves (rv10builder) 16. 07:04 PM - Re: Purge Valves (Rick Sked) 17. 08:13 PM - Re: Wegith and Balance (Rene) 18. 09:27 PM - Fuel senders (John Gonzalez) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:53:40 AM PST US From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Purge Valves Bob, many people did option two and routed it back to the line before the selector. Seems to work ok. You wouldn't have hot fuel circulating as lo ng as you select the opposite tank. In my particular case I plumbed the re turn to the right tank so when purging hot fuel I would select the left tan k to draw from. Michael http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=22&c ategory=0&log=57694&row=22 http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=22&c ategory=0&log=56523&row=23 From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 9:01 PM Subject: RV10-List: Purge Valves I'm in the process of building my tanks at the moment and have been researc hing how to plumb the purge valve. I didn't want to have to add anymore li nes after I complete the tanks. I was under the impression that it would be best for the line from the purg e valve to be run back to the left tank. If you really want to go with a lavish solution you can run the return lines through the fuel tank switch a nd let the switch control which tank is connected. Just having it routed t o the tank left tank saves $$$ on the andair valve. In reading the purge valve documentation from AFP, it shows two solutions. The first solution routes the return line to a tee connection in the fuel vent line. My concern with this approach is that I'm not sure what would prevent the fuel not going out the vent line when purging. The second solution in their documentation has the return line routed to th e left fuel line before the fuel selector valve. My concern here is that the hot fuel will get mixed into the fuel line too soon and defeat one of t he reasons of for the purge valve in a hot start situation. I am interested in hearing what others have done in regards to routing the return line and if my concerns are well founded or not. Thanks, Bob #40684 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:57:30 AM PST US From: "Bob Leffler" Subject: RE: RV10-List: cowl hinges Has anyone tried Carbinge hinges? (http://www.carbinge.com/carbinge1.htm) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 11:23 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: cowl hinges If you use the hinges , be sure and cover the rivet heads with a glass tape or see the heads work their way through the paint after some hours. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 8:04 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: cowl hinges I'd use it again. It seems to be holding up just fine, and it works better than I thought it ever would. I was a die-hard camloc planner in the beginning but decided to give it a try and now I'm very happy with the results. Just don't use them on the bottom section. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying do not archive dogsbark@comcast.net wrote: > *I'm just getting started with the cowl and associated hinges. For > those that used the stock hinge material....would you still use it if > you did it again? How is it holding up? I seem to remember something > mentioned of a heavier hinge material. Or...would you switch to > Skybolts? I'm aware of the problem of the lower hinges losing ears, > so I'll use an alternative approach there.* > > *Thanks in advance.* > > *Sean Blair* > > *#40225 * > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:03:37 AM PST US From: "Ralph E. Capen" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Purge Valves I put in the Andair dual valve and plumbed both sides in to the tank and further in to the second bay. I had QB tanks and had to open them up for two SB's and getting my fuel senders aligned. My thinking was that now I won't have to placard "Select Left tank for purge operations" as it will always go back from where it came. Also, since I had the tanks open to put in a return line, I ran it in to the next bay at the same level to dilute the heat as you have discussed. I'll be testing my fuel system this weekend - if it passes, the dragon will breathe..... Ralph Capen -----Original Message----- >From: Bob Leffler >Sent: Oct 27, 2008 10:01 PM >To: rv10-list@matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Purge Valves > >I'm in the process of building my tanks at the moment and have been >researching how to plumb the purge valve. I didn't want to have to add >anymore lines after I complete the tanks. > > > >I was under the impression that it would be best for the line from the purge >valve to be run back to the left tank. If you really want to go with a >lavish solution you can run the return lines through the fuel tank switch >and let the switch control which tank is connected. Just having it routed >to the tank left tank saves $$$ on the andair valve. > > > >In reading the purge valve documentation from AFP, it shows two solutions. >The first solution routes the return line to a tee connection in the fuel >vent line. My concern with this approach is that I'm not sure what would >prevent the fuel not going out the vent line when purging. > > > >The second solution in their documentation has the return line routed to the >left fuel line before the fuel selector valve. My concern here is that the >hot fuel will get mixed into the fuel line too soon and defeat one of the >reasons of for the purge valve in a hot start situation. > > > >I am interested in hearing what others have done in regards to routing the >return line and if my concerns are well founded or not. > > > >Thanks, > > > >Bob > >#40684 > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:11:35 AM PST US From: "Ralph E. Capen" Subject: Re: RV10-List: cowl hinges I used SkyBolts around the perimeter of the firewall and heavier hinge material for the two horizontal runs. -----Original Message----- >From: dogsbark@comcast.net >Sent: Oct 27, 2008 10:33 PM >To: rv10-list@matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: cowl hinges > >I'm just getting started with the cowl and associated hinges. For those that used the stock hinge material....would you still use it if you did it again? How is it holding up? I seem to remember something mentioned of a heavier hinge material. Or...would you switch to Skybolts? I'm aware of the problem of the lower hinges losing ears, so I'll use an alternative approach there. Thanks in advance. Sean Blair #40225 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:59 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: cowl hinges From: "Lew Gallagher" After reading about cracked ears on the cowl hinges, we decided to go with camlocs all around the firewall, and it is sooo easy to mount/disassemble the cowl. As others have said, it's a one man operation. I didn't see the need to scallop -- the weight is negligible, it's easier, and stronger. I was searching for ideas on anchoring the hinge pin at the intake (I KNOW I saw a whole picture display of close ups at OSH or something -- maybe Tim? ... still can't find it!) and I ran across a reference to using a smaller hinge pin than the one that comes with the hinge. Did I miss something? I've been sweating getting that dang pin in, even with the extra length and an angle on the surplus, it's a really tight fit to get it all the way in. With the bottom on first, if I put the tightest side hinge pin in first, thump it toward the other side, put the second pin in, then camloc it down -- it works. Really snug! I may just hand sand down the pin if folks are using a smaller pin. I've glassed in a tunnel from the entrance of the pin to the first ear (coated a scrap of pin with vasoline and glassed around it) so that I don't have to poke around hunting for that first ear. Let me know if anyone knows where to find those pics of anchoring the pins. I remember one guy in that thread said he'd fed his pin in through the cabin ... Wow! Later, - Lew -------- non-pilot crazy about building NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 Prop is on, cowl almost finished, paint prep! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210754#210754 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:13:39 AM PST US From: Michael Kraus Subject: RE: RV10-List: Purge Valves This is exactly what we did. It works great with very little additional pl umbing and no modifications to the tank. Just be sure the fuel selector v alve is on the opposite tank than the return is plumbed to when purging the system. -----Original Message----- From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 6:51 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Purge Valves - Bob, many people did option two and routed it back to the line before t he selector.- Seems to work ok.- You wouldn=92t have hot fuel circulati ng as long as you select the opposite tank.- In my particular case I plum bed the return to the right tank so when purging hot fuel I would select th e left tank to draw from. - Michael - http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=22&c ategory=0&log=57694&row=22 http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=22&c ategory=0&log=56523&row=23 - - From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 9:01 PM To: rv10-list@matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: Purge Valves - I=92m in the process of building my tanks at the moment and have been resea rching how to plumb the purge valve.- I didn=92t want to have to add anym ore lines after I complete the tanks. - I was under the impression that it would be best for the line from the purg e valve to be run back to the left tank.-- If you really want to go wit h a lavish solution you can run the return lines through the fuel tank swit ch and let the switch control which tank is connected.- Just having it ro uted to the tank left tank saves $$$ on the andair valve. - In reading the purge valve documentation from AFP, it shows two solutions. -- The first solution routes the return line to a tee connection in the fuel vent line.- My concern with this approach is that I=92m not sure wh at would prevent the fuel not going out the vent line when purging. - The second solution in their documentation has the return line routed to th e left fuel line before the fuel selector valve.-- My concern here is t hat the hot fuel will get mixed into the fuel line too soon and defeat one of the reasons of for the purge valve in a hot start situation. - I am interested in hearing what others have done in regards to routing the return line and if my concerns are well founded or not. - Thanks, [The entire original message is not included] ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:25:37 AM PST US Subject: re: RV10-List: Re: cowl hinges From: "William Curtis" > I was searching for ideas on anchoring the hinge pin at the intake (I KNOW I saw a whole picture display of close ups at OSH or something -- maybe Tim? ... still can't find it!) http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/HingePin/ William http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/ ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:25:37 AM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: cowl hinges From: "John Cox" Composite hinges on composite cowls... A novel idea. Kind of like metal hinges and metal locks on metal cowls of yester year. John Cox -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 4:01 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: cowl hinges Has anyone tried Carbinge hinges? (http://www.carbinge.com/carbinge1.htm) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 11:23 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: cowl hinges If you use the hinges , be sure and cover the rivet heads with a glass tape or see the heads work their way through the paint after some hours. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 8:04 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: cowl hinges I'd use it again. It seems to be holding up just fine, and it works better than I thought it ever would. I was a die-hard camloc planner in the beginning but decided to give it a try and now I'm very happy with the results. Just don't use them on the bottom section. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying do not archive dogsbark@comcast.net wrote: > *I'm just getting started with the cowl and associated hinges. For > those that used the stock hinge material....would you still use it if > you did it again? How is it holding up? I seem to remember something > mentioned of a heavier hinge material. Or...would you switch to > Skybolts? I'm aware of the problem of the lower hinges losing ears, > so I'll use an alternative approach there.* > > *Thanks in advance.* > > *Sean Blair* > > *#40225 * > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:29:05 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: cowl hinges From: "Lew Gallagher" Thanks, William! Yes, that was YOUR the site! There are so many good sites, sometimes I get lost. This should be fun. And Ralph is sending me pictures on how he routed his through the cabin. Later, - Lew do not archive -------- non-pilot crazy about building NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 Prop is on, cowl almost finished, paint prep! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210812#210812 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:00:49 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: cowl hinges From: "Robin Marks" Here is a sweet pin cover: Robin ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:09:58 PM PST US From: "Carl Froehlich" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: cowl hinges I ran the hinge pins aft on my 8A. They run though 1/4" aluminum tube to out of sight bulkhead fittings under the panel. I'll do the same on the 10. Carl Froehlich -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Curtis Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 12:43 PM Subject: re: RV10-List: Re: cowl hinges > I was searching for ideas on anchoring the hinge pin at the intake (I KNOW I saw a whole picture display of close ups at OSH or something -- maybe Tim? ... still can't find it!) http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/HingePin/ William http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/ ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 03:59:06 PM PST US From: "Carl Froehlich" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Purge Valves I have 450 hours on my Airflow Performance 8A. I installed a return line to top of the left tank for the purge valve. Returning to either vent line is not a good idea. That said, I have never had a need to actually purge the engine. I do however use the purge valve for normal engine shut down to bleed the pressure out of the spider. Bottom line is I see no =93hot fuel=94 problem for returning the purge line fuel to a T in the left tank fuel line, nor is there any reason to do the expensive option of having a ganged fuel selector valve. If you are still building, installing a =BC=94 bulkhead fitting in the left tank is simple enough to do even if you end up not using a purge valve and just cap it. This is what I did for my 10. Carl Froehlich From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 10:01 PM Subject: RV10-List: Purge Valves I=92m in the process of building my tanks at the moment and have been researching how to plumb the purge valve. I didn=92t want to have to add anymore lines after I complete the tanks. I was under the impression that it would be best for the line from the purge valve to be run back to the left tank. If you really want to go with a lavish solution you can run the return lines through the fuel tank switch and let the switch control which tank is connected. Just having it routed to the tank left tank saves $$$ on the andair valve. In reading the purge valve documentation from AFP, it shows two solutions. The first solution routes the return line to a tee connection in the fuel vent line. My concern with this approach is that I=92m not sure what would prevent the fuel not going out the vent line when purging. The second solution in their documentation has the return line routed to the left fuel line before the fuel selector valve. My concern here is that the hot fuel will get mixed into the fuel line too soon and defeat one of the reasons of for the purge valve in a hot start situation. I am interested in hearing what others have done in regards to routing the return line and if my concerns are well founded or not. Thanks, Bob #40684 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 05:34:13 PM PST US From: dogsbark@comcast.net Subject: RV10-List: Fwd: cowl hinges Sean, This got bounced when I tried to send to the digest. =C2-I must not be si gned up correctly. =C2-I have photos of several applications. The neatest seri es is the Lancair IV with hinges all the way around on the cowl. =C2-Let me kno w if you'd like to see them - I can email them to you. Would you mind forwarding the text below to the Digest for me? Thanks, John Barrett -----Original Message----- From: John Barrett [mailto:2thman@cablespeed.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 7:07 AM Subject: re: cowl hinges Sean Blair writes: **************** I'm just getting started with the cowl and associated hinges. =C2-For tho se that used the stock hinge material....would you still use it if you did it again? How is it holding up? I seem to remember something mentioned of a heavier hinge material. =C2-Or...would you switch to Skybolts? =C2-I'm aware of the p roblem of the lower hinges losing ears, so I'll use an alternative approach there. Thanks in advance. Sean Blair #40225 **************** Sean, Most people agree that fastening the cowl with a hidden system is far superior esthetically to Cam Locks or screws or other systems that require insertion and removal with a driver of some kind at various points along th e outside of the cowl. Aside from the extra work to service the engine compartment with the Skybolts, the likelihood of dinging up the paint is real and almost certain. =C2-There is additional drag that accompanies th ese systems as well. If you accept the above premises, then the discussion centers around what kind of hinge to use and how you apply it. =C2-Metal hinges attached to composite material may be a choice but if you had access to a composite hinge that weighs a lot less, and would outperform and outlast the metal hinge wouldn't that be preferable? With Carbinge, you simply bond the hinge to place with Hysol or some other high peel strength adhesive then secure the hinge at either end with a rive t or two and the job is done. =C2-We have applications in aircraft that are much higher performance than the RV's. The Lancair IVP that uses the initial prototype hinges we made has been flying almost 10 years and has well over 1,000 hours on it. =C2-The prototype hinges have about 1/3 the strength a nd quality of our production hinge and even so they have shown no deterioratio n such as the broken loops discussed on this thread. =C2-We now have a few aircraft that utilize Carbinge for attachment of the lower cowl to fuselage . Once again the reports are that the system works well and holds up because the composite doesn't deteriorate with load cycles and vibration like the aluminum ones do. =C2-There is at least one L IV that uses the Carbinge t o attach the rear of the top cowl to the fuselage. =C2-It has several hundr ed hours of flight time on it and still looks beautiful - the owner is very happy with it. =C2-He visited us from Southern California a couple of mon ths ago and I have to say the application is really cool. =C2- There are literally many hundreds of builders including lots of RV guys who have used our product for cowling attachment and who thank us for Carbinge. They appreciate the quality, the service, the ease of installation and the performance over time. This is a shameless plug, I realize, but it comes with a strong belief in the product and commitment to customer satisfaction. See www.carbinge.com Regards, John Barrett, CEO Leading Edge Composites PO Box 428 Port Hadlock, WA 98339 www.carbinge.com =C2- ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:43:55 PM PST US From: "Bob-tcw" Subject: RV10-List: TCW Technologies Products Fellow RV builders, Just a note to let you know that the new products we had on display at Oshkosh are now available and in stock. We introduced two products: 1) The Intelligent Power Stabilizer (IPS) which allows critical equipment in the plane, such as GPS, EFIS and engine monitors to be up and running before and during engine starting without the need to carry an auxiliary battery. Additionally, based on feedback from the show, we've introduced an 8 amp model of this product as well. 2) The Intelligent Lighting Controller (ILC) which allows remote, electronic switching of the primary aircraft lighting circuits and includes the wig-wag function as well as dimming control of 3 lighting circuits. All the details are available on our web site. www.tcwtech.com As always thanks for your support Bob Newman RV-10 (40176) TCW Technologies, LLC. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:19 PM PST US From: rv10builder Subject: Re: RV10-List: Purge Valves I too have the AFP system. I installed a "T" in the right fuel line. For hot starts I select the left tank and valve open which flushes cool fuel from the left tank back into the right (follow link below). http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=rv10builder&project=7&category=501&log=15056&row=37 Brian Sutherland Nashville, TN N104BS - 91 flying hours Bob Leffler wrote: > > Im in the process of building my tanks at the moment and have been > researching how to plumb the purge valve. I didnt want to have to add > anymore lines after I complete the tanks. > > I was under the impression that it would be best for the line from the > purge valve to be run back to the left tank. If you really want to go > with a lavish solution you can run the return lines through the fuel > tank switch and let the switch control which tank is connected. Just > having it routed to the tank left tank saves $$$ on the andair valve. > > In reading the purge valve documentation from AFP, it shows two > solutions. The first solution routes the return line to a tee > connection in the fuel vent line. My concern with this approach is > that Im not sure what would prevent the fuel not going out the vent > line when purging. > > The second solution in their documentation has the return line routed > to the left fuel line before the fuel selector valve. My concern here > is that the hot fuel will get mixed into the fuel line too soon and > defeat one of the reasons of for the purge valve in a hot start situation. > > I am interested in hearing what others have done in regards to routing > the return line and if my concerns are well founded or not. > > Thanks, > > Bob > > #40684 > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:04:51 PM PST US From: Rick Sked Subject: Re: RV10-List: Purge Valves Well...almost flying, but=C2-I ran mine through the firewall with a AN-4 bulkhead adapter, inside the=C2-cabin and out the right=C2-wing root an d tee'd it to the fuel supply, I also put a check valve from Andair inline to allow fuel to only flow to the tank, not from it. It seemed like a good idea to prevent fuel from being somehow drawn up to the purge valve. I real ly want to point out that the valve is a critical part of flight for the fu el system. If it should somehow open, you're gonna shut down the engine. I used the same control cable on the valve as I did the throttle and took the same care to run the cable as I did with all the engine/mixture/prop contr ols. I played with a failsafe closed=C2-return spring but ended up gettin g frustrated trying to find a balanced spring to make it work well in all p ositions as well as allowing me to operate the control. Rick Sked 40185 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carl Froehlich" Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 3:57:59 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles Subject: RE: RV10-List: Purge Valves I have 450 hours on my Airflow Performance 8A.=C2- I installed a return l ine to top of the left tank for the purge valve.=C2- Returning to either vent line is not a good idea. That said, I have never had a need to actually purge the engine.=C2- I do however use the purge valve for normal engine shut down to bleed the press ure out of the spider.=C2- Bottom line is I see no =9Chot fuel =9D problem for returning the purge line fuel to a T in the left tank fu el line, nor is there any reason to do the expensive option of having a gan ged fuel selector valve.=C2- If you are still building, installing a =C2=BC=9D bulkhead fitting in the left tank is simple enough to do even if you end up not using a purge valve and just cap it.=C2- This is what I did for my 10. Carl Froehlich From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 10:01 PM Subject: RV10-List: Purge Valves I=99m in the process of building my tanks at the moment and have been researching how to plumb the purge valve.=C2- I didn=99t want to h ave to add anymore lines after I complete the tanks. I was under the impression that it would be best for the line from the purg e valve to be run back to the left tank.=C2-=C2- If you really want to go with a lavish solution you can run the return lines through the fuel tan k switch and let the switch control which tank is connected.=C2- Just hav ing it routed to the tank left tank saves $$$ on the andair valve. In reading the purge valve documentation from AFP, it shows two solutions. =C2-=C2- The first solution routes the return line to a tee connection in the fuel vent line.=C2- My concern with this approach is that I =99m not sure what would prevent the fuel not going out the vent line when purging. The second solution in their documentation has the return line routed to th e left fuel line before the fuel selector valve.=C2-=C2- My concern her e is that the hot fuel will get mixed into the fuel line too soon and defea t one of the reasons of for the purge valve in a hot start situation. I am interested in hearing what others have done in regards to routing the return line and if my concerns are well founded or not. Thanks, Bob #40684 =C2- =C2- http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List http://fo ====== ==== ======================= == ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:13:13 PM PST US From: "Rene" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Wegith and Balance Based on a request from John Acherman, here is my WB Spreadsheet. Use at your own risk. :-) Rene' 801-721-6080 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 5:43 PM Subject: RV10-List: Wegith and Balance I finally get around to getting an official weight and balance for my airplane. But it has lead to a few questions. (1) I find in surprising that vans RV-10 sample WB pdf does not have arms for the nose wheel and the mains. Do they expect those to be different from one builder to another? I could not find any spreadsheets from other builders showing what their moment arms were. Yes I know I am supposed to measure this but I want to compare my results to some others. My Nose wheel arm ended up being 50.125" forward of the leading edge (99.440 based on Vans numbers) which makes my nose wheel arm 49.315. My mains are back 24" from the wing LE making my mains arm 123.440". What did others measure? (2) So now I weigh the airplane (using certified scales) and I find the empty CG way forward (102.46"). I expected the forward CG but not quite that much. Even with me as the sole occupant and half fuel, I need to have 100 lbs in the baggage area just to get the CG back to the most forward allowable (107.84"). Now I played with the numbers and it does allow one to really load up the airplane for maximum capabilities, but wow I didn't expect to have to load up the baggage area on the first flights. Did others find the same conditions? If one were to take off on the first flight and not check the CG, it woudl make for an interesting landing! Looks like carrying passengers on the flights is not only good but maybe even required unless I want to carry around some extra weight (couple of 5 gallon water containers). Very interesting! Jim Combs N312F, 40192 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:27:40 PM PST US From: John Gonzalez Subject: RV10-List: Fuel senders Does anyone remember getting a 1.5K resistor and a voltage adaptor in the box with the fuel senders which Van's sent to us? Someone is telling me they should have been in the box, but I have absolutely no recollection of these in the blue and black cardboard box the units came in. Thanks, JOhn G. 409 Do Not Archive ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.