---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 11/11/08: 14 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:30 AM - IFLYRV10.COM parts videos on youtube (Steven DiNieri) 2. 08:01 AM - February in Arizona (curtis groote) 3. 09:20 AM - Re: Measuring Amp draw (marcausman) 4. 09:22 AM - Re: VP200 Load Planning Worksheet (marcausman) 5. 09:29 AM - Re: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning (LES KEARNEY) 6. 10:53 AM - Re: Control Stick Grips (MauleDriver) 7. 11:48 AM - Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning (tomhanaway) 8. 12:20 PM - Re: Control Stick Grips (gary) 9. 03:44 PM - Re: Control Stick Grips (Patrick Pulis) 10. 04:53 PM - Re: Air box and alternate air door (Dan Benua) 11. 05:49 PM - Re: Fuel Selector Mounting and Scat Problem (partner14) 12. 08:17 PM - Re: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning (LES KEARNEY) 13. 08:56 PM - Ignition Harness for sale (Dawson-Townsend,Timothy) 14. 11:48 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Selector Mounting and Scat Problem (John Cox) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:30:37 AM PST US From: "Steven DiNieri" Subject: RV10-List: IFLYRV10.COM parts videos on youtube Hi Listers, I've started posting small videos of some of the parts I'm making on youtube to get a better look at them. Also A couple Quick announcements... IFLYRV10.COM has partnered up with Cleveland Aircraft Tool as a distributor for most all our products. they are already stocking the most popular items. New RV10 seat handle extensions are available and can be viewed at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwsvkJAIm0U New RV10 Front Axle assembly is now available and can be viewed at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EHoDdL_X28 both new products will be on the website within the next day. thanks for all your support Steven DiNieri IFLYRV10.COM capsteve@iflyrv10.com ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:01:20 AM PST US From: curtis groote Subject: RV10-List: February in Arizona I'll be down in Arizona for the month of February, probably Casa Grande or near there.- Is there any problem leaving the -10 outside, unsheltered, t hat time of the year?- I do have a canopy cover. Any recommendations for places to fly to, to see or eat?- Thanks. =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:20:15 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Measuring Amp draw From: "marcausman" Gary, We saw the same thing with the shunts on my RV, prior to installing the VP-200. The current draw based on the shunts, once stabilized, read about double of the actual current (your mileage may vary). Once the VP-200 was installed (which is calibrated at the factory) and could compare the two, it was clear that the shunts needed calibrating. Problem is, most people don't have the capability to do this and the manual didn't say they needed calibrating. We saw this with a few beta customers too. So I suspect there are lots of people with shunts that are not calibrated. Of course with the VP-200 you don't need to install the shunts and this is a non-issue. :) Also, you have both alternators going into a single shunt, which implies that they are both wired to the same spot. Perhaps the switched side of the battery contactor? My recommendation is to wire the backup alternator to the battery side of the contactor, and the primary alternator to the switched side of the contactor. Why? If you lose the battery contactor, then you can run the backup alternator which is able to "see" the battery (needed to regulate itself). -------- Marc Ausman http://www.verticalpower.com RV-7 IO-390 Flying Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213522#213522 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:22:43 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: VP200 Load Planning Worksheet From: "marcausman" Michael, I've got a bunch. What configuration are you planning? Internal or external voltage regualtors? What type of EFIS? I'll sanitize any personal info and send you something that should be close. -------- Marc Ausman http://www.verticalpower.com RV-7 IO-390 Flying Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213524#213524 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:29:05 AM PST US From: LES KEARNEY Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning David While my contributions to the gene pool are now at an end, I would still like to see how my contributions work out. To that end I will use rivets if that is the correct solution. At this point I don't know if the stresses that cause the oil canning are significant. I have spoken to Ken at Van's whose guidance was to find out what is causing the problem and then fix that. He was surprised that oil canning ocurred given the match drilled nature of the kit I have a couple of other expert sources that I will tap into before I do anything. Cheers Les ----- Original Message ----- From: David McNeill Subject: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning > > > In order to continue to exercise your rights to contribute to > the gene pool > I suggest that proseal not be used to glue angles inside wings. > Proseal is a > sealant not an adhesive; hence it possible that a piece my come > loose and > interfere with control mechanisms. Jammed ailerons or > asymmetrical flaps > could ruin someone's day. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney > Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 8:22 PM > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning > > > Tom > > Thanks for the comments. > > I have thought about proseal as well. My only concern is I don't > know how > well the proseal will attach to my primer. I wouldn't want the > angle to > depart the skin and mess up the controls etc. My inclination > would be to > rivet the stiffner. With effort I can reach the square and use a > pop rivet > dimpler. Then again perhaps I am just being a bit to anal. > > Cheers > > Les > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of tomhanaway > Sent: November-09-08 8:03 PM > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Cannnig > > > Les, > I went through the same thing. I ended up using > proseal to attach a 6" > piece of aluminum angle to the inside of the square that was > oilcanning. > Can't speak for final result as the plane hasn't flown yet but > ground test > (me pushing on panel) showed any canning was completely gone. > > Tom Hanaway > Boynton Beach, FL > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213193#213193 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lists This Month -- > (And Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!) > Click on > _- > = -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > RV10-List Email Forum - > _- > = - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:53:00 AM PST US From: MauleDriver Subject: Re: RV10-List: Control Stick Grips Thanks for all the great feedback! I love this list and I do contribute. The most impressive thing about the Infinity grip is that people that have put them in earlier a/c, are putting them in their '10s. And the jet-gamer aesthetic is cool. 'Nuff said. I'm still thinking through the function thing and I'm still leaning towards FREQFUNC (frequently used functions) rather than HOTAS. Hat switch, PTT, and autopilot disco are mandatory. Thinking through a typical IFR CC, a freq flip/flop makes sense. I do that every 45mins or so now and dreaming of doing it every 30mins or less in the future (see RV grin here). An ident switch? I do that once every 2 or 3 flights. Probably once a flight VFR. Doesn't need to be on the stick. Flaps remain an open switch. At 17 I learned that the electric flaps are on a switch next to the throttle (C150). Since then, I've flown with a Johnson bar between the seats (Maule) , a sliding lever in my left hand (LS6), and a rotating wheel with index stops going from -8 to +90 (PIK20b). At 5X I'm regressing so a simple switch next to the throttle should see me through dementia. Use it once a flight on the way up and once on the way down. And as a former glider guider, I don't do go-arounds. While the Ray Allen stick grips aren't impressive in pics or on display, I have to admit that the set I saw in a '10 looked pretty good. The CS-8 from Tosten looks sexier (they're bi btw), have just enough buttons, and could be a good choice. But does anyone have them? How's the material selection and the fit and finish? I'm going to investigate that one a bit more. Bill "really enjoying building my own panel" Watson ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:48:29 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning From: "tomhanaway" Les, I took a look at the panel. I'd have to agree that the proseal by itself is not sufficient. At the same time, used in conjunction with rivets, I believe it improves the contact between the panel and the brace (epoxy would probably do the same thing). In any event, may be a temperature change (not likely in Florida) but the minor oil can is no longer in the panel even with brace removed. Tom Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213552#213552 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:20:59 PM PST US From: "gary" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Control Stick Grips I do have the CH sticks and love them. Just enough buttons and not too many. Good quality and you can adjust the rotation to suit your grip. You won't be disappointed if you get them. Gary Specketer 40274 Flying -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of MauleDriver Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2008 1:48 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Control Stick Grips Thanks for all the great feedback! I love this list and I do contribute. The most impressive thing about the Infinity grip is that people that have put them in earlier a/c, are putting them in their '10s. And the jet-gamer aesthetic is cool. 'Nuff said. I'm still thinking through the function thing and I'm still leaning towards FREQFUNC (frequently used functions) rather than HOTAS. Hat switch, PTT, and autopilot disco are mandatory. Thinking through a typical IFR CC, a freq flip/flop makes sense. I do that every 45mins or so now and dreaming of doing it every 30mins or less in the future (see RV grin here). An ident switch? I do that once every 2 or 3 flights. Probably once a flight VFR. Doesn't need to be on the stick. Flaps remain an open switch. At 17 I learned that the electric flaps are on a switch next to the throttle (C150). Since then, I've flown with a Johnson bar between the seats (Maule) , a sliding lever in my left hand (LS6), and a rotating wheel with index stops going from -8 to +90 (PIK20b). At 5X I'm regressing so a simple switch next to the throttle should see me through dementia. Use it once a flight on the way up and once on the way down. And as a former glider guider, I don't do go-arounds. While the Ray Allen stick grips aren't impressive in pics or on display, I have to admit that the set I saw in a '10 looked pretty good. The CS-8 from Tosten looks sexier (they're bi btw), have just enough buttons, and could be a good choice. But does anyone have them? How's the material selection and the fit and finish? I'm going to investigate that one a bit more. Bill "really enjoying building my own panel" Watson ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:44:55 PM PST US From: Patrick Pulis Subject: Re: RV10-List: Control Stick Grips Bill, I have been showing the local guys here a sample of the CS-8 grip tha t were sent out by the supplier a while back and other builders=C2-have a ll been impressed.=0A=0AI received my two grips and relay deck this week an d I'm=C2-very happy with the quality.=C2- In comparison to the grips fi tted to the Cirrus SR-20 which I am currently flying, the CS-8 grips are be tter in that they have a little more functionality, and=C2-they are reall y comfortable.=0A=0AHope this helps with your selection.=0A=0ARegards=0A=0A Pat=0AAdelaide, South Australia=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_____________________________ ___=0AFrom: MauleDriver =0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.c om=0ASent: Wednesday, 12 November, 2008 5:18:20 AM=0ASubject: Re: RV10-List uleDriver@nc.rr.com>=0A=0AThanks for all the great feedback!=C2- I love t his list and I do contribute.=0A=0AThe most impressive thing about the Infi nity grip is that people that have put them in earlier a/c, are putting the m in their '10s.=C2- And=C2- the jet-gamer aesthetic is cool.=C2- =C2 - 'Nuff said.=0A=0AI'm still thinking through the function thing and I'm still leaning towards FREQFUNC (frequently used functions) rather than HOTA S.=C2- Hat switch, PTT, and autopilot disco are mandatory.=C2- Thinking through a typical IFR CC, a freq flip/flop makes sense.=C2- I do that ev ery 45mins or so now and dreaming of doing it every 30mins or less in the f uture (see RV grin here).=C2- An ident switch?=C2- I do that once every 2 or 3 flights.=C2- Probably once a flight VFR.=C2- Doesn't need to be on the stick. =0AFlaps remain an open switch.=C2- At 17 I learned that t he electric flaps are on a switch next to the throttle (C150).=C2- Since then, I've flown with a Johnson bar between the seats (Maule) , a sliding l ever in my left hand (LS6), and a rotating wheel with index stops going fro m -8 to +90 (PIK20b). At 5X I'm regressing so=C2- a simple switch next to the throttle should see me through dementia.=C2- Use it once a flight on the way up and once on the way down.=C2- And as a former glider guider, I don't do go-arounds.=0A=0AWhile the Ray Allen stick grips aren't impressi ve in pics or on display, I have to admit=C2- that the set I saw in a '10 looked pretty good.=C2- The CS-8 from Tosten looks sexier (they're bi bt w), have just enough buttons, and could=C2- be a good choice.=C2- But d oes anyone have them?=C2- How's the material selection and the fit and fi nish?=C2- =C2- I'm going to investigate that one a bit more.=0A=0ABill =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Drall ===========0A=0A=0A Find your perfect match today at the new Yahoo!7 Dating. Get Started http://au.dating.yahoo.com/?cid=53 151&pid=1012 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:53:44 PM PST US From: Dan Benua Subject: Re: RV10-List: Air box and alternate air door I had the exact same failure on my RV-6A two years ago. In my case, some pop-rivet mandrels were ingested by the engine causing brief roughness, but no permanent damage. I complained to Vans engineering about the design, but they were not interested. Davids fix, using a backing ring and solid aluminum rivets, is just what I did to repair my 6A and what I installed on my RV-10. In my opinion there should be a Service Bulletin (and design change) on this alternate air door. Maybe Tim could add the issue to his web page. - Dan Benua #40001 - Flying > Just pulled the cowl for first 100 hours inspection. Found the galvanized > ring (VA192A) of the alternate air door partially pulled from the bottom of > the air box. the rivets had pulled through the glass and the nut plate for > the door pivot was holding it there. To fix this I fabricated an aluminum > ring for the inside and match drilled the ring and galvanized ring. I > cleaned the bottom with a scotchbrite pad and grinder and put two additional > layers of glass on the bottom. I will epoxy putty the VA192A and the > fabricated ring to the box and rivet (1097s) after cure. I will then add > small dabs of RTV on the rivet buck tails on the inside to ensure that even > if a rivet breaks, nothing will enter the injection system. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:49:56 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Fuel Selector Mounting and Scat Problem From: "partner14" Ok, attached are the pics.... but for some of you they're huge, sorry, haven't messed with the conversion software. I am awaiting one AN fitting, and then I can finish all the fuel lines and their connections. Also, will then have pics of the scat routing. This part had to be made from 3 pieces, welded, and then turned on a lathe. Still working on a price... which is mostly determined by the interest. Hopefully, we can make at least 10 at a time. So if interested, please let me know. Rough price is between $40 and $70. The welding is the expensive part. Don McDonald #40636 -------- Don A. McDonald 40636 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213601#213601 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2693c_152.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2692c_109.jpg ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:17:36 PM PST US From: LES KEARNEY Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning Hi Well I called my resident expert who lives half a country away - my younger brother. After I explained my problem he gave me two very good solutions. First he suggested I try to identify which row of rivets is causing the problem - there may be some deformation / pillowing around the rivets in question. If not, he suggested I remove some rivets and see if the oil canning is eliminated. If the skin lifts off the underling structure a possible solution is to use a thin shim (tapered at each end) to fill the void. This will eliminate the stress causing the oil canning. Another solution, if the oil canning is slight, is to rivet on a stiffner that has a slight curve. He referred to this as "antipanting" - a British term. We also discussed the possible cause of the problem. I suspect I didn't have enough clecoes installed during rivetting due in large part to the rivet pattern I was using. Cheers Les #40643 - some assembly required ----- Original Message ----- From: LES KEARNEY Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning > David > > While my contributions to the gene pool are now at an end, I > would still like to see how my contributions work out. To that > end I will use rivets if that is the correct solution. At this > point I don't know if the stresses that cause the oil canning > are significant. I have spoken to Ken at Van's whose guidance > was to find out what is causing the problem and then fix that. > He was surprised that oil canning ocurred given the match > drilled nature of the kit > > I have a couple of other expert sources that I will tap into > before I do anything. > > Cheers > > Les > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: David McNeill > Date: Monday, November 10, 2008 9:26 pm > Subject: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > In order to continue to exercise your rights to contribute to > > the gene pool > > I suggest that proseal not be used to glue angles inside > wings. > > Proseal is a > > sealant not an adhesive; hence it possible that a piece my > come > > loose and > > interfere with control mechanisms. Jammed ailerons or > > asymmetrical flaps > > could ruin someone's day. > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les > Kearney> Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 8:22 PM > > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > > Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Canning > > > > > > Tom > > > > Thanks for the comments. > > > > I have thought about proseal as well. My only concern is I > don't > > know how > > well the proseal will attach to my primer. I wouldn't want the > > angle to > > depart the skin and mess up the controls etc. My inclination > > would be to > > rivet the stiffner. With effort I can reach the square and use > a > > pop rivet > > dimpler. Then again perhaps I am just being a bit to anal. > > > > Cheers > > > > Les > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > tomhanaway> Sent: November-09-08 8:03 PM > > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > > Subject: RV10-List: Re: QB Wing Angst- Oil Cannnig > > > > > > Les, > > I went through the same thing. I ended up using > > proseal to attach a 6" > > piece of aluminum angle to the inside of the square that was > > oilcanning. > > Can't speak for final result as the plane hasn't flown yet but > > ground test > > (me pushing on panel) showed any canning was completely gone. > > > > Tom Hanaway > > Boynton Beach, FL > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213193#213193 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lists This Month -- > > _- > = > > (And Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!) > > Click on > > _- > > > = -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > The > > RV10-List Email Forum - > > _- > > > = - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:56:58 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Ignition Harness for sale From: "Dawson-Townsend,Timothy" Champion Ignition Harness for sale, unused in box #CH12154E from Spruce Paid $438.95 originally Make an offer . . . TDT Tim Dawson-Townsend tdt@aurora.aero 617-500-4812 (office) 617-905-4800 (mobile) ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:48:30 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Fuel Selector Mounting and Scat Problem From: "John Cox" Don, those are beautiful and it is a thrill to watch Steve's Utube and your post showing how to dress up the RV-10. Keep up the great work. I will start the confirmation list offline for bandwidth consideration. John Cox 40600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of partner14 Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2008 5:49 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Fuel Selector Mounting and Scat Problem Ok, attached are the pics.... but for some of you they're huge, sorry, haven't messed with the conversion software. I am awaiting one AN fitting, and then I can finish all the fuel lines and their connections. Also, will then have pics of the scat routing. This part had to be made from 3 pieces, welded, and then turned on a lathe. Still working on a price... which is mostly determined by the interest. Hopefully, we can make at least 10 at a time. So if interested, please let me know. Rough price is between $40 and $70. The welding is the expensive part. Don McDonald #40636 -------- Don A. McDonald 40636 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=213601#213601 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2693c_152.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2692c_109.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.