---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 12/18/08: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:46 AM - AFS-3500 distance from glare shield (Michael Wellenzohn) 2. 08:31 AM - Re: AFS-3500 distance from glare shield (Ralph E. Capen) 3. 08:59 AM - Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (pascal) 4. 09:41 AM - Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (Jim Berry) 5. 09:41 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (John Cumins) 6. 10:02 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 7. 10:13 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (Rick Sked) 8. 10:20 AM - Re: AFS-3500 distance from glare shield (orchidman) 9. 10:33 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (David McNeill) 10. 10:38 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (pascal) 11. 10:44 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (pascal) 12. 10:57 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (linn Walters) 13. 11:03 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (Chris) 14. 11:08 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (linn Walters) 15. 11:43 AM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (John Gonzalez) 16. 01:08 PM - APRS Installation (Albert Gardner) 17. 02:33 PM - Re: Overhead console (Perry, Phil) 18. 03:03 PM - Re: Overhead console (John Gonzalez) 19. 03:46 PM - Re: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming (Miller John) 20. 06:23 PM - Re: Overhead console (Rick Sked) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:46:50 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: AFS-3500 distance from glare shield From: "Michael Wellenzohn" H, I am in the final planning stage of my panel and in order to make a precise CAD drawing I'd like to know what the minimum distance for the AFS-3500 from the glare shield and the side should be. Based on the feedback I received I did some changes to the panel. See attached file. In case you have also the distances from the glare shield handy required for the AFS-4500 that would be great as well. Best Michael -------- RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219961#219961 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/ynn_v15_208.jpg ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:31:46 AM PST US From: "Ralph E. Capen" Subject: Re: RV10-List: AFS-3500 distance from glare shield At a minimum, you'll need to observe the 3/4" x 3/4" angle that attaches the panel to the glare shield (or notch it if you find yourself near a curve enabling slot). I don't think that the 3500 is deep enough that you need to worry about the glareshield converging in to the box. -----Original Message----- >From: Michael Wellenzohn >Sent: Dec 18, 2008 10:46 AM >To: rv10-list@matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: AFS-3500 distance from glare shield > > >H, >I am in the final planning stage of my panel and in order to make a precise CAD drawing I'd like to know what the minimum distance for the AFS-3500 from the glare shield and the side should be. >Based on the feedback I received I did some changes to the panel. See attached file. > >In case you have also the distances from the glare shield handy required for the AFS-4500 that would be great as well. > >Best >Michael > >-------- >RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing) >#511 > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219961#219961 > > >Attachments: > >http://forums.matronics.com//files/ynn_v15_208.jpg > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:59:16 AM PST US From: "pascal" Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming From: pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:57 AM Subject: canopy top smoothing/priming Looking for a good way to smooth (aka fill pin holes) on the canopy top as well as prime. I know there is Smooth Prime but that is a "smoother" than requires another coat of actual primer. Many reasons I am trying to avoid doing the multiple layers. Also any suggestions for how I should go about doing the canopy top. I gather based on my review of the top that laying a filler primer wont get it all, is the idea to do a coat of .5/.5 acetone/epoxy with some balloons before spraying filler needed? anything else I should be considering? Thanks! Pascal ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:41:41 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming From: "Jim Berry" Pascal, On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work full-time, I used PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. Applied with a 3" Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home Depot; get several). Apply the first coat with moderate pressure to work the primer into the pin holes. By the time you finish the first coat you can go back to your starting point and apply another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The roller will start to disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the primer, which is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the primer off. Let the primer cure for 2-3 days, depending on your shop temperature. Block sand to remove orange peel, bits of roller foam, etc. Spray a final coat of primer, and you are done. I think I wound up with 6 pin holes that had to be filled individually. I also used this method on all other composite pieces. Jim Berry 40482 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:41:46 AM PST US From: "John Cumins" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Pascal There is a product that is designed for just that I will try and look it up and send it to you . It is not a filler primer but a filler then you pay the primer on top of that. John G. Cumins President JC'S Interactive Systems 2499 B1 Martin Rd Fairfield Ca 94533 707-425-7100 707-425-7576 Fax Your Total Technology Solution Provider _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:58 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming From: pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:57 AM Subject: canopy top smoothing/priming Looking for a good way to smooth (aka fill pin holes) on the canopy top as well as prime. I know there is Smooth Prime but that is a "smoother" than requires another coat of actual primer. Many reasons I am trying to avoid doing the multiple layers. Also any suggestions for how I should go about doing the canopy top. I gather based on my review of the top that laying a filler primer wont get it all, is the idea to do a coat of .5/.5 acetone/epoxy with some balloons before spraying filler needed? anything else I should be considering? Thanks! Pascal ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:02:21 AM PST US From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Pascal, You left out a critical part of the name below. It's actually called UV Smooth Prime and also acts as a UV blocker for composite parts which is cri tical. UV WILL breakdown our composites eventually making them brittle. W hatever you use make sure it has a UV inhibitor in it or you put it on thic k enough to have enough solids to do the job. Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:58 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming From: pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:57 AM Subject: canopy top smoothing/priming Looking for a good way to smooth (aka fill pin holes) on the canopy top as well as prime. I know there is Smooth Prime but that is a "smoother" than r equires another coat of actual primer. Many reasons I am trying to avoid do ing the multiple layers. Also any suggestions for how I should go about doing the canopy top. I gath er based on my review of the top that laying a filler primer wont get it al l, is the idea to do a coat of .5/.5 acetone/epoxy with some balloons befor e spraying filler needed? anything else I should be considering? Thanks! Pascal ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:13:58 AM PST US From: Rick Sked Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Having filled way too many glass parts now and before I find one of the biggest time saving steps is to clean the part with soap and water, wipe clean with acetone, sand any gloss off the surface, clean with acetone again then apply epoxy resin to the entire surface using a playing card, they are abundunt here in Vegas :) or old credit cards (they last longer) to press the epoxy into all the pinholes, scrape the entire surface with the cards. Once it is cured sand the rmove the gloss and fuzz. Apply any of the high fill epoxy primers, use the same brand as the top coat you are planning to use, sprayed then sanded almost all the way off will start the process. I don't recommend rolling/brushing because the first coats should be almost sanded away, rolling applies more than you need and the epoxy process seals and fills the pinholes so minimal primer is usually needed. Once the pinholes have disappeared fill any exposed weave and imperfections with micro/epoxy prime and sand until you acheive the smoothness you desire or just say that's good enough, I quit. It sounds like more work than it is but that's the process that has worked well for me. There is no looks great with minimal work method I have found, sanding-priming-sanding-priming always made for the best prep. This works well on the pants, cowl, doors, top, all the parts. Rick Sked 40185 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Berry" Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:40:31 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Pascal, On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work full-time, I used PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. Applied with a 3" Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home Depot; get several). Apply the first coat with moderate pressure to work the primer into the pin holes. By the time you finish the first coat you can go back to your starting point and apply another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The roller will start to disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the primer, which is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the primer off. Let the primer cure for 2-3 days, depending on your shop temperature. Block sand to remove orange peel, bits of roller foam, etc. Spray a final coat of primer, and you are done. I think I wound up with 6 pin holes that had to be filled individually. I also used this method on all other composite pieces. Jim Berry 40482 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:20:04 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: AFS-3500 distance from glare shield From: "orchidman" I have a 4500 on the left side and a 3500 on the right side. If you can handle a Corel Draw file, I can send mine to you. I used it to design and then cut the panel. Just looking at your jpg file, I would say that the right side needs to be moved down about an inch. The main reason is how much you need to chop the rib above. If you are going for a 4500 on the left, then I think you need to move your 3 back up round instruments and move the 4500 down similar to the right side. I did have to cut an extra 1/4" from the rib for the 4500 as the top of the case appears to sit a little higher. -------- Gary Blankenbiller RV10 - # 40674 Engine, Fiberglass - SB (N2GB registered) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219988#219988 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:33:12 AM PST US From: "David McNeill" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming spread and spray by Sherman Williams is the primer/filler used by Piper and their fiberglass starts pretty rough (about like Vans). _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:58 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming From: pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:57 AM Subject: canopy top smoothing/priming Looking for a good way to smooth (aka fill pin holes) on the canopy top as well as prime. I know there is Smooth Prime but that is a "smoother" than requires another coat of actual primer. Many reasons I am trying to avoid doing the multiple layers. Also any suggestions for how I should go about doing the canopy top. I gather based on my review of the top that laying a filler primer wont get it all, is the idea to do a coat of .5/.5 acetone/epoxy with some balloons before spraying filler needed? anything else I should be considering? Thanks! Pascal ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:33 AM PST US From: "pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Good point, I'll be using a paint that has the UV protection in it, Same one used for corvettes and such. Thanks for pointing that out. Pascal From: RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:59 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Pascal, You left out a critical part of the name below. It's actually called UV Smooth Prime and also acts as a UV blocker for composite parts which is critical. UV WILL breakdown our composites eventually making them brittle. Whatever you use make sure it has a UV inhibitor in it or you put it on thick enough to have enough solids to do the job. Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:58 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming From: pascal Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:57 AM Subject: canopy top smoothing/priming Looking for a good way to smooth (aka fill pin holes) on the canopy top as well as prime. I know there is Smooth Prime but that is a "smoother" than requires another coat of actual primer. Many reasons I am trying to avoid doing the multiple layers. Also any suggestions for how I should go about doing the canopy top. I gather based on my review of the top that laying a filler primer wont get it all, is the idea to do a coat of .5/.5 acetone/epoxy with some balloons before spraying filler needed? anything else I should be considering? Thanks! Pascal http://www.matronics.com/contributionhttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?R V10-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:44:39 AM PST US From: "pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Rick and all that responded, thank you for the guidance with this. I had an idea and your feedback has allowed me to use my brain cells to think about something else now. Thanks all! Pascal -------------------------------------------------- From: "Rick Sked" Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:12 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming > > > Having filled way too many glass parts now and before I find one of the > biggest time saving steps is to clean the part with soap and water, wipe > clean with acetone, sand any gloss off the surface, clean with acetone > again then apply epoxy resin to the entire surface using a playing card, > they are abundunt here in Vegas :) or old credit cards (they last longer) > to press the epoxy into all the pinholes, scrape the entire surface with > the cards. Once it is cured sand the rmove the gloss and fuzz. Apply any > of the high fill epoxy primers, use the same brand as the top coat you are > planning to use, sprayed then sanded almost all the way off will start the > process. I don't recommend rolling/brushing because the first coats should > be almost sanded away, rolling applies more than you need and the epoxy > process seals and fills the pinholes so minimal primer is usually needed. > Once the pinholes have disappeared fill any exposed weave and > imperfections with micro/epoxy prime and sand u! > ntil you acheive the smoothness you desire or just say that's good enough, > I quit. It sounds like more work than it is but that's the process that > has worked well for me. There is no looks great with minimal work method I > have found, sanding-priming-sanding-priming always made for the best prep. > This works well on the pants, cowl, doors, top, all the parts. > > Rick Sked > 40185 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Berry" > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:40:31 AM (GMT-0800) > America/Los_Angeles > Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming > > > Pascal, > > On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work full-time, I used > PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. Applied with a 3" > Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home Depot; get several). Apply the > first coat with moderate pressure to work the primer into the pin holes. > By the time you finish the first coat you can go back to your starting > point and apply another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The roller will > start to disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the primer, which > is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the primer off. Let the > primer cure for 2-3 days, depending on your shop temperature. Block sand > to remove orange peel, bits of roller foam, etc. Spray a final coat of > primer, and you are done. I think I wound up with 6 pin holes that had to > be filled individually. I also used this method on all other composite > pieces. > > Jim Berry > 40482 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977 > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:57:40 AM PST US From: linn Walters Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming pascal wrote: > > > *From:* pascal > *Sent:* Thursday, December 18, 2008 8:57 AM > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* canopy top smoothing/priming > > Looking for a good way to smooth (aka fill pin holes) on the canopy > top as well as prime. I know there is Smooth Prime but that is a > "smoother" than requires another coat of actual primer. Many reasons I > am trying to avoid doing the multiple layers. If you really want it to come out nice, you need the multiple layers ..... you'll be sanding most all of it off, but it really needs to be done. > Also any suggestions for how I should go about doing the canopy top. I > gather based on my review of the top that laying a filler primer wont > get it all, is the idea to do a coat of .5/.5 acetone/epoxy with some > balloons before spraying filler needed? anything else I should be > considering? I wouldn't do the epoxy route because it won't be smoother than the top is now, and you do not want to trap air in the pinholes .... the chances of them creating bubbles down the road is high. Sanding out the Smooth Prime is much easier than sanding the epoxy. It's a lot of work and it's messy (dusty) but the Smooth Prime is my choice, followed by a urethane primer for the paint to adhere to. Linn > Thanks! > > Pascal > * > > * ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:03:12 AM PST US From: "Chris" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Van's and Loehle aviation were raving about the Loehle product called Wonderfil to take care of the pinholes, there was an article in the latest RVator. I plan to try it. -Chris Lucas #40072 ----- Original Message ----- From: "pascal" Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 1:44 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming > > Rick and all that responded, thank you for the guidance with this. I had > an idea and your feedback has allowed me to use my brain cells to think > about something else now. > Thanks all! > Pascal > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Rick Sked" > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:12 AM > To: > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming > >> >> >> Having filled way too many glass parts now and before I find one of the >> biggest time saving steps is to clean the part with soap and water, wipe >> clean with acetone, sand any gloss off the surface, clean with acetone >> again then apply epoxy resin to the entire surface using a playing card, >> they are abundunt here in Vegas :) or old credit cards (they last longer) >> to press the epoxy into all the pinholes, scrape the entire surface with >> the cards. Once it is cured sand the rmove the gloss and fuzz. Apply any >> of the high fill epoxy primers, use the same brand as the top coat you >> are planning to use, sprayed then sanded almost all the way off will >> start the process. I don't recommend rolling/brushing because the first >> coats should be almost sanded away, rolling applies more than you need >> and the epoxy process seals and fills the pinholes so minimal primer is >> usually needed. Once the pinholes have disappeared fill any exposed weave >> and imperfections with micro/epoxy prime and sand u! >> ntil you acheive the smoothness you desire or just say that's good >> enough, I quit. It sounds like more work than it is but that's the >> process that has worked well for me. There is no looks great with minimal >> work method I have found, sanding-priming-sanding-priming always made for >> the best prep. This works well on the pants, cowl, doors, top, all the >> parts. >> >> Rick Sked >> 40185 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jim Berry" >> To: rv10-list@matronics.com >> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:40:31 AM (GMT-0800) >> America/Los_Angeles >> Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming >> >> >> Pascal, >> >> On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work full-time, I >> used PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. Applied with a >> 3" Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home Depot; get several). Apply >> the first coat with moderate pressure to work the primer into the pin >> holes. By the time you finish the first coat you can go back to your >> starting point and apply another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The >> roller will start to disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the >> primer, which is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the >> primer off. Let the primer cure for 2-3 days, depending on your shop >> temperature. Block sand to remove orange peel, bits of roller foam, etc. >> Spray a final coat of primer, and you are done. I think I wound up with 6 >> pin holes that had to be filled individually. I also used this method on >> all other composite pieces. >> >> Jim Berry >> 40482 >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:08:33 AM PST US From: linn Walters Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming I agree with almost all Rick says here ..... but instead of the epoxy, use the card to apply the first one (or maybe two) coat of _UV_ Smooth Prime (thanks Michael for the reminder) and roll the subsequent layers. That epoxy gets hard and I'm a little on the lazy side!!! You can also lightly (really lightly, like a mist) spray black paint on top of the UV Smooth Prime which will really highlight the highs and lows when you start to sand. Alternate with another dark color (such as blue) between successive coats. Linn_ _Rick Sked wrote: > > > Having filled way too many glass parts now and before I find one of the biggest time saving steps is to clean the part with soap and water, wipe clean with acetone, sand any gloss off the surface, clean with acetone again then apply epoxy resin to the entire surface using a playing card, they are abundunt here in Vegas :) or old credit cards (they last longer) to press the epoxy into all the pinholes, scrape the entire surface with the cards. Once it is cured sand the rmove the gloss and fuzz. Apply any of the high fill epoxy primers, use the same brand as the top coat you are planning to use, sprayed then sanded almost all the way off will start the process. I don't recommend rolling/brushing because the first coats should be almost sanded away, rolling applies more than you need and the epoxy process seals and fills the pinholes so minimal primer is usually needed. Once the pinholes have disappeared fill any exposed weave and imperfections with micro/epoxy prime and sand u! > ntil you acheive the smoothness you desire or just say that's good enough, I quit. It sounds like more work than it is but that's the process that has worked well for me. There is no looks great with minimal work method I have found, sanding-priming-sanding-priming always made for the best prep. This works well on the pants, cowl, doors, top, all the parts. > > Rick Sked > 40185 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Berry" > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:40:31 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles > Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming > > > Pascal, > > On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work full-time, I used PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. Applied with a 3" Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home Depot; get several). Apply the first coat with moderate pressure to work the primer into the pin holes. By the time you finish the first coat you can go back to your starting point and apply another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The roller will start to disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the primer, which is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the primer off. Let the primer cure for 2-3 days, depending on your shop temperature. Block sand to remove orange peel, bits of roller foam, etc. Spray a final coat of primer, and you are done. I think I wound up with 6 pin holes that had to be filled individually. I also used this method on all other composite pieces. > > Jim Berry > 40482 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977 > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:43:28 AM PST US From: John Gonzalez Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming Linn hit the nail on the head. You need atleast two different colors so tha t you can see the highs and lows when profiling the top. John> Date: Thu=2C 18 Dec 2008 14:05:34 -0500> From: pitts_pilot@bellsouth. net> To: rv10-list@matronics.com> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top sm ot@bellsouth.net>> > I agree with almost all Rick says here ..... but inste ad of the epoxy=2C > use the card to apply the first one (or maybe two) coa t of _UV_ Smooth > Prime (thanks Michael for the reminder) and roll the sub sequent layers. > That epoxy gets hard and I'm a little on the lazy side!!! You can also > lightly (really lightly=2C like a mist) spray black paint o n top of the UV > Smooth Prime which will really highlight the highs and lo ws when you > start to sand. Alternate with another dark color (such as blu e) between > successive coats.> Linn_> > _Rick Sked wrote:> > --> RV10-List message posted by: Rick Sked > >> >> > Having fil led way too many glass parts now and before I find one of the biggest time saving steps is to clean the part with soap and water=2C wipe clean with ac etone=2C sand any gloss off the surface=2C clean with acetone again then ap ply epoxy resin to the entire surface using a playing card=2C they are abun dunt here in Vegas :) or old credit cards (they last longer) to press the e poxy into all the pinholes=2C scrape the entire surface with the cards. Onc e it is cured sand the rmove the gloss and fuzz. Apply any of the high fill epoxy primers=2C use the same brand as the top coat you are planning to us e=2C sprayed then sanded almost all the way off will start the process. I d on't recommend rolling/brushing because the first coats should be almost sa nded away=2C rolling applies more than you need and the epoxy process seals and fills the pinholes so minimal primer is usually needed. Once the pinho les have disappeared fill any exposed weave and imperfections with micro/ep oxy prime and sand!> u!> > ntil you acheive the smoothness you desire or ju st say that's good enough=2C I quit. It sounds like more work than it is bu t that's the process that has worked well for me. There is no looks great w ith minimal work method I have found=2C sanding-priming-sanding-priming alw ays made for the best prep. This works well on the pants=2C cowl=2C doors =2C top=2C all the parts. > >> > Rick Sked> > 40185> > ----- Original Messa ge -----> > From: "Jim Berry" > > To: rv10-list@matroni cs.com> > Sent: Thursday=2C December 18=2C 2008 9:40:31 AM (GMT-0800) Ameri ca/Los_Angeles> > Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming> >> ascal=2C> >> > On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work ful l-time=2C I used PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. Applie d with a 3" Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home Depot=3B get several ). Apply the first coat with moderate pressure to work the primer into the pin holes. By the time you finish the first coat you can go back to your st arting point and apply another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The roller w ill start to disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the primer=2C which is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the primer off. Le t the primer cure for 2-3 days=2C depending on your shop temperature. Block sand to remove orange peel=2C bits of roller foam=2C etc. Spray a final co at of primer=2C and you are done. I think I wound up with 6 pin holes that had to be filled individually. I also used this method on all other composi te pieces.> >> > Jim Berry> > 40482> >> >> >> >> > Read this topic online h ere:> >> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977> >> ========================> _ =========> > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:08:40 PM PST US From: "Albert Gardner" Subject: RV10-List: APRS Installation I put mine in the wingtip also. Powered from the Nav lights as it was convenient and controllable without running an extra circuit. Figured I'd always want it on at night. I used the MicroTrak 8000FA from Byonics.com and it works good. GPS antenna is RTV'd into the wingtip trailing edge and the transmitter was fitted into a piece of AL bent up at the ends. The DB9 connector was bolted onto one end and the coax supports the other end through a grommet. I used the access cover kit that Van's supplies for the stall warning switch and put a BNC bulkhead connector on the cover with the 2 meter rubber duck antenna mounted there. With the cover removed, enough of the DB9 connecter is exposed so you can change programming without removing the unit from the wing although it is only held on by 2 screws one of which is a cover screw. Albert Gardner Yuma, AZ ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:33:56 PM PST US Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console From: "Perry, Phil" Is Zolatone a roll on?? ________________________________ From: John Gonzalez [mailto:indigoonlatigo@msn.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 9:04 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console Charcoal Zolatone and I have Stein's LEDs in six location on the overhead and that is what the buttons are for. The nice thing about Zolatone is that it looks great and it saves time in prep because you don't need to make the fiberglass sooooo smooth. Seem lines blend in. I also made this removable with ten screws that anchor into brass screw receivers. It covers the screws on the fuse that hold down the hinge, makes a little cleaner look. Thanks JOhn ________________________________ Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console From: Phil.Perry@netapp.com John, Looks great! What did you cover it with and what are the red buttons for? Phil ________________________________ From: John Gonzalez [mailto:indigoonlatigo@msn.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:57 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console And the final product...foam and fiberglass is fun!!! JOhn G. 409 Do Not Archive > From: toaster73@embarqmail.com > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Overhead console > Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 20:22:52 -0500 > > Just to reiterate "you can" do this yourself . If you can do all the > fiberglass work on the 10 you can make a console. I used blue foam and > molded the console in place, glassed it in place and then released it to get > the blue foam out, finally epoxied back on for good. Just takes time and the > will to do it. > -Chris Lucas > #40072 > > do not archive tronics.com/contribution /www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List .com ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:03:34 PM PST US From: John Gonzalez Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console You spray it on with a spray gun with a very large tip. Their web site spel ls out which guns and tips work. The reason is that it is very thick material with seperated texture peices than get stuck in guns with narrower tips. Fiberglass substrates require no primer=2C but the alluminum and the ferrou s metal require a specail primer for the Zolatone. It is not the most refin ed looking materail=2C but its simplicity expresses a different look. Best way to discribe it is no frills look=2C like the difference between a trana tlantic racing sailboat vs. a cruiser for luxury. It works for me. Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead consoleDate: Thu=2C 18 Dec 2008 14:30:15 - 0800From: Phil.Perry@netapp.comTo: rv10-list@matronics.com Is Zolatone a roll on?? From: John Gonzalez [mailto:indigoonlatigo@msn.com] Sent: Wednesday=2C Dece mber 17=2C 2008 9:04 AMTo: RV 10 groupSubject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead cons ole Charcoal Zolatone and I have Stein's LEDs in six location on the overhead a nd that is what the buttons are for. The nice thing about Zolatone is that it looks great and it saves time in p rep because you don't need to make the fiberglass sooooo smooth. Seem lines blend in. I also made this removable with ten screws that anchor into bras s screw receivers. It covers the screws on the fuse that hold down the hing e=2C makes a little cleaner look. Thanks JOhn Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead consoleDate: Wed=2C 17 Dec 2008 04:07:59 - 0800From: Phil.Perry@netapp.comTo: rv10-list@matronics.com John=2C Looks great! What did you cover it with and what are the red buttons for? Phil From: John Gonzalez [mailto:indigoonlatigo@msn.com] Sent: Wednesday=2C Dece mber 17=2C 2008 12:57 AMTo: RV 10 groupSubject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead con sole And the final product...foam and fiberglass is fun!!! JOhn G. 409 Do Not Archive> From: toaster73@embarqmail.com> To: rv10-list@m atronics.com> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Overhead console> Date: Tue=2C 16 Dec 2008 20:22:52 -0500> > Just to reiterate "you can" do this yourself . If y ou can do all the > fiberglass work on the 10 you can make a console. I use d blue foam and > molded the console in place=2C glassed it in place and th en released it to get > the blue foam out=2C finally epoxied back on for go od. Just takes time and the > will to do it.> -Chris Lucas> #40072> > do no t archive tronics.com/contribution /www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List .com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chr ef="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.co m/Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:46:04 PM PST US From: Miller John Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming That was my RV 10 in the picture, and I can personally attest to the superb qualities of Mike Loehle's products! Grumpy N184JM On Dec 18, 2008, at 1:02 PM, Chris wrote: > > Van's and Loehle aviation were raving about the Loehle product > called Wonderfil to take care of the pinholes, there was an article > in the latest RVator. I plan to try it. > -Chris Lucas > #40072 > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "pascal" > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 1:44 PM > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming > > >> >> Rick and all that responded, thank you for the guidance with this. >> I had an idea and your feedback has allowed me to use my brain >> cells to think about something else now. >> Thanks all! >> Pascal >> >> -------------------------------------------------- >> From: "Rick Sked" >> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:12 AM >> To: >> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming >> >>> >>> >>> Having filled way too many glass parts now and before I find one >>> of the biggest time saving steps is to clean the part with soap >>> and water, wipe clean with acetone, sand any gloss off the >>> surface, clean with acetone again then apply epoxy resin to the >>> entire surface using a playing card, they are abundunt here in >>> Vegas :) or old credit cards (they last longer) to press the epoxy >>> into all the pinholes, scrape the entire surface with the cards. >>> Once it is cured sand the rmove the gloss and fuzz. Apply any of >>> the high fill epoxy primers, use the same brand as the top coat >>> you are planning to use, sprayed then sanded almost all the way >>> off will start the process. I don't recommend rolling/brushing >>> because the first coats should be almost sanded away, rolling >>> applies more than you need and the epoxy process seals and fills >>> the pinholes so minimal primer is usually needed. Once the >>> pinholes have disappeared fill any exposed weave and imperfections >>> with micro/epoxy prime and sand u! >>> ntil you acheive the smoothness you desire or just say that's good >>> enough, I quit. It sounds like more work than it is but that's the >>> process that has worked well for me. There is no looks great with >>> minimal work method I have found, sanding-priming-sanding-priming >>> always made for the best prep. This works well on the pants, cowl, >>> doors, top, all the parts. >>> >>> Rick Sked >>> 40185 >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jim Berry" >>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com >>> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:40:31 AM (GMT-0800) America/ >>> Los_Angeles >>> Subject: RV10-List: Re: canopy top smoothing/priming >>> >>> >>> Pascal, >>> >>> On the recommendation of a buddy who does composite work full- >>> time, I used PPG acrylic urethane primer K36 with K201 catalyst. >>> Applied with a 3" Shur-line roller( about $1.50 ea from Home >>> Depot; get several). Apply the first coat with moderate pressure >>> to work the primer into the pin holes. By the time you finish the >>> first coat you can go back to your starting point and apply >>> another coat. You want 3-4 coats total. The roller will start to >>> disintegrate and leave little pieces of foam in the primer, which >>> is no problem as you will be sanding almost all of the primer off. >>> Let the primer cure for 2-3 days, depending on your shop >>> temperature. Block sand to remove orange peel, bits of roller >>> foam, etc. Spray a final coat of primer, and you are done. I think >>> I wound up with 6 pin holes that had to be filled individually. I >>> also used this method on all other composite pieces. >>> >>> Jim Berry >>> 40482 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Read this topic online here: >>> >>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219977#219977 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 06:23:57 PM PST US From: Rick Sked Subject: Re: RV10-List: Overhead console I guess it needs a bit tip...2.0 to 2.3 mm....that's a hose!!=C2- I'm rea lly tempted to try this stuff..it looks great. John, do you order direct or do you have to use a distributer? Rick S. 40185 ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Gonzalez" Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 3:02:49 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console You spray it on with a spray gun with a very large tip. Their web site spel ls out which guns and tips work. =C2- The reason is that it is very thick material with seperated texture peices than get stuck in guns with narrower tips. =C2- Fiberglass substrates require no primer, but the alluminum and the ferrous metal require a specail primer for the Zolatone. It is not the most refined looking materail, but its simplicity expresses a different look. Best way to discribe it is no frills look, like the difference between a tranatlanti c racing sailboat vs. a cruiser for luxury. It works for me. Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console From: Phil.Perry@netapp.com Is Zolatone a roll on?? From: John Gonzalez [mailto:indigoonlatigo@msn.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 9:04 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console Charcoal Zolatone and I have Stein's LEDs in six location on the overhead a nd that is what the buttons are for.=C2- The nice thing about Zolatone is that it looks great and it saves time in p rep because you don't need to make the fiberglass sooooo smooth. Seem lines blend in. I also made this removable with ten screws that anchor into bras s screw receivers. It covers the screws on the fuse that hold down the hing e, makes a little cleaner look. Thanks JOhn Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console From: Phil.Perry@netapp.com John, Looks great! What did you cover it with and what are the red buttons for? Phil From: John Gonzalez [mailto:indigoonlatigo@msn.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:57 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead console And the final product...foam and fiberglass is fun!!! JOhn G. 409 Do Not Archive > From: toaster73@embarqmail.com > To: rv10-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Overhead console > Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 20:22:52 -0500 > > Just to reiterate "you can" do this yourself . If you can do all the > fiberglass work on the 10 you can make a console. I used blue foam and > molded the console in place, glassed it in place and then released it to get > the blue foam out, finally epoxied back on for good. Just takes time and the > will to do it. > -Chris Lucas > #40072 > > do not archive tronics.com/contribution /www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List .com href ="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref ="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/ Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matr onics.com ww.matronics.com/contribution ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?R ================= ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.