Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:19 AM - Engine Delivery Question (nukeflyboy)
2. 05:50 AM - Re: Engine Delivery Question (Lew Gallagher)
3. 06:09 AM - Re: Re: Tube Bender (Bill Mauledriver Watson)
4. 06:11 AM - Winglts ? (Lew Gallagher)
5. 06:24 AM - Re: Engine Delivery Question (Bill Mauledriver Watson)
6. 06:34 AM - Re: Engine Delivery Question (Linn Walters)
7. 07:10 AM - Re: Re: Tube Bender (Fred Williams, M.D.)
8. 07:40 AM - Re: Winglts ? (orchidman)
9. 07:49 AM - Re: Winglts ? (johngoodman)
10. 07:53 AM - Re: Winglts ? (Dave Saylor)
11. 07:54 AM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Ron Walker)
12. 08:56 AM - Re: Engine Delivery Question (AirMike)
13. 09:15 AM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Robin Marks)
14. 09:23 AM - Re: High Oil temps (Kevin O'Shea)
15. 11:43 AM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Linn Walters)
16. 12:14 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Linn Walters)
17. 12:16 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Robert Brunkenhoefer)
18. 12:22 PM - Re: Re: Tube Bender (Bill Mauledriver Watson)
19. 01:25 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (John Cox)
20. 01:28 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (John Cox)
21. 02:05 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Robert Brunkenhoefer)
22. 02:48 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (John Cox)
23. 02:48 PM - Re: Winglts ? (Kelly McMullen)
24. 04:49 PM - Re: Engine Delivery Question (nukeflyboy)
25. 04:50 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Robert Brunkenhoefer)
26. 07:23 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Linn Walters)
27. 07:40 PM - Re: Engine Delivery Question (Dave Leikam)
28. 07:40 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (Robin Marks)
29. 09:29 PM - Re: Re: Winglts ? (John Cox)
30. 10:23 PM - Re: Re: Engine Delivery Question (Don McDonald)
31. 10:36 PM - Stewart Systems Primer Sealer (Dave Fritzsche (Building))
Message 1
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| Subject: | Engine Delivery Question |
I decided to order the Van's deal on the Lycoming engine and got in before the
price increase. Delivery is scheduled for some time next week. For those of
you that received an engine from Lyc via Van's, what do I need to do to prepare?
Will I be expected to remove it from the truck or will they have a lift or
some means to get it to ground level? [Question]
--------
Dave Moore
RV-6 flying
RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253294#253294
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
Hey Dave,
We didn't get our engine from Van's, but I imagine they'll all be about the same.
Ours came bolted to a pallet using two temporary mounts for the two lower
rear mount ears and a third brace that supported the front hub -- it works quite
well. The delivery truck had a hydraulic tail gate and the driver had a manual
pallet jack he used to roll it into the shop. I took the sides and top off
the crating, used an engine jack to raise the engine and pallet together and
screwed swivel wheels from harbor freight onto the four corners -- as long as
you're on a hard floor, it roles very easily. With an engine leveler gizmo
attached to the engine hoist so that the angle is the same every time it is picked
up, it is no trouble at all to mount and dismount the engine to the plane
and back to the pallet during the cowling fitting, hose/cable fitting, etc.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Painting done!
On with wiring and avionics.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253307#253307
Message 3
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AirMike wrote:
> Also, buy or borrow a GOOD QUALITY 37 degree flare tool.
> There are a lot of crappy products out there.
>
...and if you've never seen the tool used to make a flare, have someone
demonstrate it. It was obvious to this builder.
Message 4
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Hey guys,
I've been thinking about this for awhile and thought I'd air it out -- especially
now that many of you might check it out at Osh with the vendors.
What do you think of winglets instead of just wingtips? Supposedly they create
a better vortex, enhance lift ... ? I dunno, but now I see them in the magazines
(Plane & Pilot) on the new Diamonds and Cessna 400 etc. -- not just the big
commercial planes.
>From a builder's point of view, is it just as easy to fit a winglet as a wingtip?,
stress/structure issues?, would they change flying/handling? how to engineer
them for the -10?
I read here about counting ounces and fine tuning everything from injectors to
positioning antennas to tweak the most out of efficiency, reducing drag, etc.
... winglets would seem to be an obvious area to look into.
Whatcha think?
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Painting done!
On with wiring and avionics.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253313#253313
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
I did the same thing. As I recall, the delivery as either 'free'or
involved no additional charges.
The trucker called and I explained that we could take it at the driveway.
For the delivery, I was prepared to have my neighbor help with his tractor.
The truck came, used his lift ramp to put it on the ground, and used a
hand fork lift to roll it onto the gravel drive.
Later, my neighbor came over, we strapped it on his shovel and put it
in the hangar/shop. No problems.
A week later, I rec'd a letter in the mail from the trucking company for
a $90 lift gate charge. It took a few calls and a fax of the charge
back (to Lycoming I recall) for the charge to be voided.
That was my experience.
BTW, when the time came, I was able to unpack and otherwise move the
engine around and mount it using the HF engine hoist and balancer. A
good deal.
Note that the engine is sealed in heavy plastic along with some large
dry packs. As I recall, the dry packs are visible from outside the
plastic. And they have an indicator telling you whether they are still
functioning (they can be renewed in an oven). So you can leave the
engine packed with some assurance that it will remain dry.
nukeflyboy wrote:
>
> I decided to order the Van's deal on the Lycoming engine and got in before the
price increase. Delivery is scheduled for some time next week. For those of
you that received an engine from Lyc via Van's, what do I need to do to prepare?
Will I be expected to remove it from the truck or will they have a lift
or some means to get it to ground level? [Question]
>
> --------
> Dave Moore
> RV-6 flying
> RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253294#253294
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
When mine came the truck had a hydraulic tail gate, which was paid extra
for. I have a fork lift (ancient and decrepit, but it runs) and I used
that.
Since I didn't use the tailgate ..... the charge was refunded .....
probably to Lycoming :-( . Depending on whether you have to go over
grass or not, I'd build a dolly with good casters on it that will handle
a 4 X 4 pallet so you can get it from the spot in your driveway to your
shop. I have all my parts stored in a room in my shop, and the engine
wouldn't fit through the door, so I uncrated it and put it on a dolly
.... and tyhen it just fit. In hindsight, I'd probqbly just push it
into a corner and leave it alone.
Linn
nukeflyboy wrote:
>
> I decided to order the Van's deal on the Lycoming engine and got in before the
price increase. Delivery is scheduled for some time next week. For those of
you that received an engine from Lyc via Van's, what do I need to do to prepare?
Will I be expected to remove it from the truck or will they have a lift
or some means to get it to ground level? [Question]
>
> --------
> Dave Moore
> RV-6 flying
> RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253294#253294
>
>
>
Message 7
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Ditto on this post. I have a friend who replaced the entire fuel line
system in his L19. Then he found out about his crappy flare tool and
got to redo the whole system again. Couple days down the drain. A drop
or two of oil on the tool also helps. Also, make sure you have filed
and taken all the burrs off the end of the tube before you flare. The
burrs and chinks are the nidus to start a crack in the flare. I used
some fine scotch brite to polish the ends before flaring. Rise out the
tubing to get rid of any bugs/chips etc before final installation.
Dr Fred.
Bill Mauledriver Watson wrote:
> <MauleDriver@nc.rr.com>
>
> AirMike wrote:
>> Also, buy or borrow a GOOD QUALITY 37 degree flare tool.
>> There are a lot of crappy products out there.
>>
> ...and if you've never seen the tool used to make a flare, have
> someone demonstrate it. It was obvious to this builder.
>
>
Message 8
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I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown off because they
didn't think it would add any significant performance. Something about having
relatively short wings.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
Message 9
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You need a big wing before it really makes any difference, and it's minor at that.
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished. Finish Kit started.
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253331#253331
Message 10
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There was a great discussion of winglets on the Lancair Mail List a few
weeks ago. What I took from it was that winglets improve efficiency at high
angles of attack: take-off, climb, landing, and very high altitude cruise.
Perfect for airliners and pressurized GA planes but not so helpful for
planes like RVs. At low angles of attack, where RVs excel, winglets would
most likely slow the plane down.
Plus, there's a lot of engineering and testing that goes into a
winglet--they aren't a simple bolt-on. The angles and airfoils are
critical. I understand the airlines use them to gain tiny efficiencies that
pay off over millions of miles.
Dave
On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 6:10 AM, Lew Gallagher <lewgall@charter.net> wrote:
>
> Hey guys,
>
> I've been thinking about this for awhile and thought I'd air it out --
> especially now that many of you might check it out at Osh with the vendors.
>
> What do you think of winglets instead of just wingtips? Supposedly they
> create a better vortex, enhance lift ... ? I dunno, but now I see them in
> the magazines (Plane & Pilot) on the new Diamonds and Cessna 400 etc. -- not
> just the big commercial planes.
>
> >From a builder's point of view, is it just as easy to fit a winglet as a
> wingtip?, stress/structure issues?, would they change flying/handling? how
> to engineer them for the -10?
>
> I read here about counting ounces and fine tuning everything from injectors
> to positioning antennas to tweak the most out of efficiency, reducing drag,
> etc. ... winglets would seem to be an obvious area to look into.
>
> Whatcha think?
>
> Later, - Lew
>
> --------
> non-pilot
> crazy about building
> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
> Painting done!
> On with wiring and avionics.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253313#253313
>
>
--
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
Message 11
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A neighbor of mine hosted a rotary engine fly-in a couple months ago. There
was a guy there that has a custom fiberglass molding business - he brought a
pair of what are called "finch-tips". These are tips where the outboard edge
sweeps down and rearward. They only fit the 4/6/7/9 currently and he was
looking for someone to test fly them to gather numbers.
I did the work to install them on my 7a and have flown them twice so far.
The stall speeds are unchanged, but in my trials so far, I've seen that the
mid-power range speeds are improved by about 7mph. I'm far from complete
with my flight testing, but they are showing promise. I have photo's posted
on my picasa page - http://picasaweb.google.com/n520tx/NewWingtips#.
When I get all my testing done, I plan to post up the final numbers on my
web site.
For what it's worth ...
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "orchidman" <gary@wingscc.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:39 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>
> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown off
> because they didn't think it would add any significant performance.
> Something about having relatively short wings.
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
You may have to pay extra for the lift gate, but worth it.
I tipped mine onto a Harbor Freight (1000# capacity) furniture dolly which has
two advantages. One - you can move it around easily, and two - you can get the
forks of the engine lift under it when it is time to mount it,
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253347#253347
Message 13
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Ron,
Thanks for the post. The tip looked like a pretty good match for
a prototype. It's funny how ego plays a part in these things. The exact
same wing tip flipped up has some marketing potential but a turned down
winglet much like the old Cherokee wing tips are more of an eyesore (to
my design sensibilities). Regardless please keep us informed of your
test results.
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ron Walker
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 7:54 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
A neighbor of mine hosted a rotary engine fly-in a couple months ago.
There
was a guy there that has a custom fiberglass molding business - he
brought a
pair of what are called "finch-tips". These are tips where the outboard
edge
sweeps down and rearward. They only fit the 4/6/7/9 currently and he was
looking for someone to test fly them to gather numbers.
I did the work to install them on my 7a and have flown them twice so
far.
The stall speeds are unchanged, but in my trials so far, I've seen that
the
mid-power range speeds are improved by about 7mph. I'm far from complete
with my flight testing, but they are showing promise. I have photo's
posted
on my picasa page - http://picasaweb.google.com/n520tx/NewWingtips#.
When I get all my testing done, I plan to post up the final numbers on
my
web site.
For what it's worth ...
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "orchidman" <gary@wingscc.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:39 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>
> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown off
> because they didn't think it would add any significant performance.
> Something about having relatively short wings.
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: High Oil temps |
I had identical issue with my Glastar. Cleaned out RTV and spaced the
baffle with one washer. Dropped the CHT over 30 degrees on #3 cyl. Will
soon see if RV 10 has temp issues.
Message 15
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That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
Linn
orchidman wrote:
>
> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown off because
they didn't think it would add any significant performance. Something about having
relatively short wings.
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>
>
>
Message 16
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Well, I kinda like the droop tips on the Cherokee. Klingon warship
comes to mind. I think the droop style would help the low speed stall
far more than a swept up winglet. The droop tips on the Cherokee really
do make a short field landing far shorter!!!
Linn
Robin Marks wrote:
>
> Ron,
> Thanks for the post. The tip looked like a pretty good match for
> a prototype. It's funny how ego plays a part in these things. The exact
> same wing tip flipped up has some marketing potential but a turned down
> winglet much like the old Cherokee wing tips are more of an eyesore (to
> my design sensibilities). Regardless please keep us informed of your
> test results.
>
> Robin
>
Message 17
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Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
Sent from my iPhone
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
520 Lawrence St.
Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
Phone: 361-888-8808
Facsimile: 361-888-6753
robert@brunklaw.com
On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
wrote:
> >
>
> That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
> winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
> Linn
>
> orchidman wrote:
>>
>> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown
>> off because they didn't think it would add any significant
>> performance. Something about having relatively short wings.
>>
>> --------
>> Gary Blankenbiller
>> RV10 - # 40674
>> (N2GB Flying)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 18
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It was NOT obvious to this builder
Bill Mauledriver Watson wrote:
> <MauleDriver@nc.rr.com>
>
> AirMike wrote:
>> Also, buy or borrow a GOOD QUALITY 37 degree flare tool.
>> There are a lot of crappy products out there.
>>
> ...and if you've never seen the tool used to make a flare, have
> someone demonstrate it. It was obvious to this builder.
>
>
Message 19
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The larger mass of an upgraded rotor can assist cooling as can a larger
caliper. The technical support at Cleveland can assist in beginning
with their parts used and larger upgrades. Tim James did a great job
with OEM Cessna. There is also Beringer. Beyond the benefit of cooler
temperatures is the shorter stopping distance at the same speed and same
weight. Don't forget to think about a fluid upgrade as H-5606 is more
combustible than alternatives. Once a brake line leaks the chain
reaction begins.
John Cox
,
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Brunkenhoefer
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:14 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
<rebrunk42@gmail.com>
Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
Sent from my iPhone
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
520 Lawrence St.
Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
Phone: 361-888-8808
Facsimile: 361-888-6753
robert@brunklaw.com
On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
wrote:
<pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net
> >
>
> That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
> winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
> Linn
>
> orchidman wrote:
>>
>> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown
>> off because they didn't think it would add any significant
>> performance. Something about having relatively short wings.
>>
>> --------
>> Gary Blankenbiller
>> RV10 - # 40674
>> (N2GB Flying)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 20
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VGs also help the slow speed characteristics without shocking the design
sensibilities of a few readers. What one calls a winglet might not
reach the NACA standard, but might be just another unique wing tip
design.
New ideas are always a fresh perspective with OSH just around the
corner.
John Cox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Walters
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
<pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
Well, I kinda like the droop tips on the Cherokee. Klingon warship
comes to mind. I think the droop style would help the low speed stall
far more than a swept up winglet. The droop tips on the Cherokee really
do make a short field landing far shorter!!!
Linn
Robin Marks wrote:
>
> Ron,
> Thanks for the post. The tip looked like a pretty good match for
> a prototype. It's funny how ego plays a part in these things. The
exact
> same wing tip flipped up has some marketing potential but a turned
down
> winglet much like the old Cherokee wing tips are more of an eyesore
(to
> my design sensibilities). Regardless please keep us informed of your
> test results.
>
> Robin
>
Message 21
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are you using this upgrade on your rv10?
On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:24 PM, John Cox wrote:
>
> The larger mass of an upgraded rotor can assist cooling as can a
> larger
> caliper. The technical support at Cleveland can assist in beginning
> with their parts used and larger upgrades. Tim James did a great job
> with OEM Cessna. There is also Beringer. Beyond the benefit of cooler
> temperatures is the shorter stopping distance at the same speed and
> same
> weight. Don't forget to think about a fluid upgrade as H-5606 is more
> combustible than alternatives. Once a brake line leaks the chain
> reaction begins.
>
> John Cox
> ,
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> Brunkenhoefer
> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:14 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>
> <rebrunk42@gmail.com>
>
> Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
> wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
> Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
> 520 Lawrence St.
> Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
> Phone: 361-888-8808
> Facsimile: 361-888-6753
> robert@brunklaw.com
>
> On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
> wrote:
>
> <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net
>>>
>>
>> That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
>> winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
>> Linn
>>
>> orchidman wrote:
>>>
>>> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown
>>> off because they didn't think it would add any significant
>>> performance. Something about having relatively short wings.
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Gary Blankenbiller
>>> RV10 - # 40674
>>> (N2GB Flying)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 22
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Robert,
I am going with 0.375" thick rotors and dual pad calipers per side to
spread the force. A couple of RV-x main landing gear caliper fires that
consumed the glass pant caused a few to change from H-5606 a few years
back. The flame propagation was right below each main AVGAS fuel tank.
Fiberglass fires are a perverted thing to watch. So take a test sample
and learn by experiment not experience how the cured resin and glass
strands come to life until gone. Mine was watching a '69 Vette being
prepped for custom paint.
VANS mantra is stay conservative with the brakes and build your kit bone
stock. Some of us tend to lean into the wind - just for the fresh sea
breeze in the summer. With a Barrett and Forsling Exhaust, the brake
upgrade was an easy choice. Ask about VGs for the RV-10 at OSH.
Mil H-83282 provides another level of combustion protection. I have
found that H-5606 tends to coagulate with age. Its low flash point is
routinely accepted by most builders without consideration of
alternatives.
Some will yell "Stay off the brakes and learn Happy Feet". Then your
neighborhood A&P will explain how proper engine leaning and a higher
idle than 700 or 800 will cause the aircraft to move in a forward
direction requiring those darned toes again.
Fly Often, Fly Safe, Earn your grey hair over time. Take a Grandchild
for a Young Eagles flight. Stop by Camp Condrey for a beer.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Brunkenhoefer
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
<rebrunk42@gmail.com>
are you using this upgrade on your rv10?
On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:24 PM, John Cox wrote:
>
> The larger mass of an upgraded rotor can assist cooling as can a
> larger
> caliper. The technical support at Cleveland can assist in beginning
> with their parts used and larger upgrades. Tim James did a great job
> with OEM Cessna. There is also Beringer. Beyond the benefit of cooler
> temperatures is the shorter stopping distance at the same speed and
> same
> weight. Don't forget to think about a fluid upgrade as H-5606 is more
> combustible than alternatives. Once a brake line leaks the chain
> reaction begins.
>
> John Cox
> ,
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> Brunkenhoefer
> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:14 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>
> <rebrunk42@gmail.com>
>
> Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
> wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
> Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
> 520 Lawrence St.
> Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
> Phone: 361-888-8808
> Facsimile: 361-888-6753
> robert@brunklaw.com
>
> On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
> wrote:
>
> <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net
>>>
>>
>> That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
>> winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
>> Linn
>>
>> orchidman wrote:
>>>
>>> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown
>>> off because they didn't think it would add any significant
>>> performance. Something about having relatively short wings.
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Gary Blankenbiller
>>> RV10 - # 40674
>>> (N2GB Flying)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 23
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IIRC the blended airfoil winglets on B7x7 aircraft account for 3-4% fuel
economy as well as lowered stall speed, etc. There are droop wingtips for
aircraft such as hersey bar Cherokees and C172s that apparently are
effective for stall reduction without too much drag addition.
On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Dave Saylor <
dave.saylor.aircrafters@gmail.com> wrote:
> There was a great discussion of winglets on the Lancair Mail List a few
> weeks ago. What I took from it was that winglets improve efficiency at high
> angles of attack: take-off, climb, landing, and very high altitude cruise.
> Perfect for airliners and pressurized GA planes but not so helpful for
> planes like RVs. At low angles of attack, where RVs excel, winglets would
> most likely slow the plane down.
>
> Plus, there's a lot of engineering and testing that goes into a
> winglet--they aren't a simple bolt-on. The angles and airfoils are
> critical. I understand the airlines use them to gain tiny efficiencies that
> pay off over millions of miles.
>
> Dave
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
Thanks guys - that's what I needed to know. I'll be ready with the HF dollies
and an engine hoist on standby.
--------
Dave Moore
RV-6 flying
RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253418#253418
Message 25
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Thanks for the help. Where do I get the parts and how much has to be
done to the fairings brackets to make the upgrade fit
Sent from my iPhone
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
520 Lawrence St.
Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
Phone: 361-888-8808
Facsimile: 361-888-6753
robert@brunklaw.com
On Jul 16, 2009, at 4:46 PM, "John Cox" <johnwcox@pacificnw.com> wrote:
> Robert,
>
> I am going with 0.375" thick rotors and dual pad calipers per side to
> spread the force. A couple of RV-x main landing gear caliper fires
> that
> consumed the glass pant caused a few to change from H-5606 a few years
> back. The flame propagation was right below each main AVGAS fuel tank.
> Fiberglass fires are a perverted thing to watch. So take a test sample
> and learn by experiment not experience how the cured resin and glass
> strands come to life until gone. Mine was watching a '69 Vette being
> prepped for custom paint.
>
> VANS mantra is stay conservative with the brakes and build your kit
> bone
> stock. Some of us tend to lean into the wind - just for the fresh sea
> breeze in the summer. With a Barrett and Forsling Exhaust, the brake
> upgrade was an easy choice. Ask about VGs for the RV-10 at OSH.
>
> Mil H-83282 provides another level of combustion protection. I have
> found that H-5606 tends to coagulate with age. Its low flash point is
> routinely accepted by most builders without consideration of
> alternatives.
>
> Some will yell "Stay off the brakes and learn Happy Feet". Then your
> neighborhood A&P will explain how proper engine leaning and a higher
> idle than 700 or 800 will cause the aircraft to move in a forward
> direction requiring those darned toes again.
>
> Fly Often, Fly Safe, Earn your grey hair over time. Take a Grandchild
> for a Young Eagles flight. Stop by Camp Condrey for a beer.
>
> John
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> Brunkenhoefer
> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 2:00 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>
> <rebrunk42@gmail.com>
>
> are you using this upgrade on your rv10?
> On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:24 PM, John Cox wrote:
>
>>
>> The larger mass of an upgraded rotor can assist cooling as can a
>> larger
>> caliper. The technical support at Cleveland can assist in beginning
>> with their parts used and larger upgrades. Tim James did a great job
>> with OEM Cessna. There is also Beringer. Beyond the benefit of
>> cooler
>> temperatures is the shorter stopping distance at the same speed and
>> same
>> weight. Don't forget to think about a fluid upgrade as H-5606 is
>> more
>> combustible than alternatives. Once a brake line leaks the chain
>> reaction begins.
>>
>> John Cox
>> ,
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
>> Brunkenhoefer
>> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:14 PM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>>
>> <rebrunk42@gmail.com>
>>
>> Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
>> wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
>> Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
>> 520 Lawrence St.
>> Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
>> Phone: 361-888-8808
>> Facsimile: 361-888-6753
>> robert@brunklaw.com
>>
>> On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net
>>>>
>>>
>>> That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
>>> winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
>>> Linn
>>>
>>> orchidman wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown
>>>> off because they didn't think it would add any significant
>>>> performance. Something about having relatively short wings.
>>>>
>>>> --------
>>>> Gary Blankenbiller
>>>> RV10 - # 40674
>>>> (N2GB Flying)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>
>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> <HYDRAULIC FLUIDS.pdf>
Message 26
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This is a first for me. I've used Cleveland brakes almost my whole
flying life, and find them better than the alternatives. My only guess
is that you ride the brakes while taxiing (give the brakes a tap or two
to keep the nose pointed to where you want to go rather than constant
pressure) ...... or your brakes don't relax when you release them. I'd
check to make sure the brake cylinder rides on the pins freely. They
don't need lubrication, which usually just gums them up and attracts
dirt. Are the pads wearing evenly??? Uneven wear is a sign of the
brake cylinder hanging up on the pins, or a mounting problem. Improper
break-in could also be a cause.
Linn
Robert Brunkenhoefer wrote:
> <rebrunk42@gmail.com>
>
> Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
> wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
> Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
> 520 Lawrence St.
> Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
> Phone: 361-888-8808
> Facsimile: 361-888-6753
> robert@brunklaw.com
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
They delivered mine with a lift gate truck. Then they used a hand fork to
roll it down my driveway to my shop.
Mine is still in the crate, delivered June 1st. I put some small snowmobile
dollies under the pallet so I can move it easily if I need to. No issues.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: "nukeflyboy" <flymoore@charter.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 6:18 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Engine Delivery Question
>
> I decided to order the Van's deal on the Lycoming engine and got in before
> the price increase. Delivery is scheduled for some time next week. For
> those of you that received an engine from Lyc via Van's, what do I need to
> do to prepare? Will I be expected to remove it from the truck or will
> they have a lift or some means to get it to ground level? [Question]
>
> --------
> Dave Moore
> RV-6 flying
> RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253294#253294
>
>
>
Message 28
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Yes I'll admit it, I would not add drop down winglets to my -10 if it
added 15 more knots in cruise and washed itself when it was dirty.
That being said... John have you seen the clear rubberized VG's on the
Cessna Columbia's leading edge? Small in profile and difficult to see
unless you are either looking for them or right up against the wing.
Also interesting because they are on the forward most portion of the
leading edge vs. typical VG's further up the curvature of the wing.
Interesting item.
I thought that one could design and mold them in 18" sections and just
link end to end. Then I remembered that one would have to conduct proper
R&D first. Oh that.....
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Cox
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
Robert,
I am going with 0.375" thick rotors and dual pad calipers per side to
spread the force. A couple of RV-x main landing gear caliper fires that
consumed the glass pant caused a few to change from H-5606 a few years
back. The flame propagation was right below each main AVGAS fuel tank.
Fiberglass fires are a perverted thing to watch. So take a test sample
and learn by experiment not experience how the cured resin and glass
strands come to life until gone. Mine was watching a '69 Vette being
prepped for custom paint.
VANS mantra is stay conservative with the brakes and build your kit bone
stock. Some of us tend to lean into the wind - just for the fresh sea
breeze in the summer. With a Barrett and Forsling Exhaust, the brake
upgrade was an easy choice. Ask about VGs for the RV-10 at OSH.
Mil H-83282 provides another level of combustion protection. I have
found that H-5606 tends to coagulate with age. Its low flash point is
routinely accepted by most builders without consideration of
alternatives.
Some will yell "Stay off the brakes and learn Happy Feet". Then your
neighborhood A&P will explain how proper engine leaning and a higher
idle than 700 or 800 will cause the aircraft to move in a forward
direction requiring those darned toes again.
Fly Often, Fly Safe, Earn your grey hair over time. Take a Grandchild
for a Young Eagles flight. Stop by Camp Condrey for a beer.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Brunkenhoefer
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
<rebrunk42@gmail.com>
are you using this upgrade on your rv10?
On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:24 PM, John Cox wrote:
>
> The larger mass of an upgraded rotor can assist cooling as can a
> larger caliper. The technical support at Cleveland can assist in
> beginning with their parts used and larger upgrades. Tim James did a
> great job with OEM Cessna. There is also Beringer. Beyond the benefit
> of cooler temperatures is the shorter stopping distance at the same
> speed and same weight. Don't forget to think about a fluid upgrade as
> H-5606 is more combustible than alternatives. Once a brake line leaks
> the chain reaction begins.
>
> John Cox
> ,
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> Brunkenhoefer
> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:14 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
>
> <rebrunk42@gmail.com>
>
> Anyone using other than Cleveland brakes mine are getting hot and
> wearing out too fast.any other brakes recommended or being used?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
> Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
> 520 Lawrence St.
> Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
> Phone: 361-888-8808
> Facsimile: 361-888-6753
> robert@brunklaw.com
>
> On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
> wrote:
>
> <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net
>>>
>>
>> That, and the fact that the wing is 'Hershey bar' shape. I think
>> winglets would be far more efficient on a swept wing.
>> Linn
>>
>> orchidman wrote:
>>>
>>> I asked this question in the Vans tent 2 years ago and was blown off
>>> because they didn't think it would add any significant performance.
>>> Something about having relatively short wings.
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Gary Blankenbiller
>>> RV10 - # 40674
>>> (N2GB Flying)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253329#253329
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 29
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Tim James #623 has done a major improvement in both handling and low
speed flight with his VGs. Others might query at OSH and post their
impressions here.
The 10 can provide some great, short, soft, H DenAlt landings and
unimproved surfaces with a few reasonably simple mods.
For many who never leave the asphalt jungle, I understand.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 7:37 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Winglts ?
Yes I'll admit it, I would not add drop down winglets to my -10 if it
added 15 more knots in cruise and washed itself when it was dirty.
That being said... John have you seen the clear rubberized VG's on the
Cessna Columbia's leading edge? Small in profile and difficult to see
unless you are either looking for them or right up against the wing.
Also interesting because they are on the forward most portion of the
leading edge vs. typical VG's further up the curvature of the wing.
Interesting item.
I thought that one could design and mold them in 18" sections and just
link end to end. Then I remembered that one would have to conduct proper
R&D first. Oh that.....
Robin
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: Engine Delivery Question |
Just rmember Dave you can always just use pipe, pvc or other, to just roll
the crate where you want it.- I moved a 2,000 milling machine into a gara
ge and then up a 12" step into my workshop using pipe.
Don
--- On Thu, 7/16/09, nukeflyboy <flymoore@charter.net> wrote:
From: nukeflyboy <flymoore@charter.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Engine Delivery Question
Thanks guys - that's what I needed to know.- I'll be ready with the HF do
llies and an engine hoist on standby.
--------
Dave Moore
RV-6 flying
RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=253418#253418
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Stewart Systems Primer Sealer |
I asked this question a while back and got no response. I will try
again as things may have changed. Has anyone used Stewart Systems
Primer Sealer to prime the inside of their aircraft? It is water based
making it much safer for the environment and the person spraying it. It
can be seen at www.stewartsystems.aero. If you have used it, what is
your experience? How does it compare to a two-part epoxy primer? I am
tempted to try it, but would like some user experience reports prior to
jumping into the water.
Dave
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave Fritzsche
40813 tail cone nearly finished
Puyallup, WA
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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