Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:44 AM - Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report (Tim Lewis)
2. 08:22 AM - Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report (Condrey, Bob (US SSA))
3. 08:50 AM - Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report (Tim Olson)
4. 09:32 AM - Re: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom (Jesse Saint)
5. 11:52 AM - Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom (Nick Nafsinger)
6. 12:03 PM - Re: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom (Tim Olson)
7. 12:47 PM - Re: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom (g.combs)
8. 12:48 PM - Re: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom (Pascal)
9. 01:08 PM - Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report (Kelly McMullen)
10. 01:15 PM - Re: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom (Tim Olson)
11. 06:46 PM - Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report (Bob Turner)
12. 10:36 PM - Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report (AirMike)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report |
FWIW, I used an Archer antenna on my -6A and my -10. I've had no
problems using either for LOC or ILS approaches.
Tim
--
Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA)
RV-6A N47TD -- 1090 hrs
RV-10 N31TD -- First Flight 20 Mar 2010
AirMike said the following on 8/18/2010 2:05 AM:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "AirMike"<Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>
>
> In building my RV10, I decided to bury my VOR antenna (running my Garmin SL30)
in the upper front area of the cabin top using a thin copper tape that Vans
sells as an antenna. I had checked it out on the Fallon NV VOR some time back,
and it drove the NAV functions ok, but due to my phase 1 flight restrictions,
I could not do an ILS over populated areas. Anyway today I did the Reno NV ILS
and I was sorry to find quite a few anomalies as well as a general lack of sensitivity.
By the way, it was pretty cool when the controller asked me to keep
my speed up for a trailing 737, that we could run down the ILS at 165 kts.
>
> At this point I do not think that I will mess with the Bob Archer thing. Looks
like ugly or not that there are some cat whiskers in my RV10's future
>
> Now the real question. Put it on top of the Vertical Stab or under the tail cone?
Any suggestions on reception or sensitivity appreciated
>
> --------
> OSH '10 or Bust
> Q/B - finally done
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309236#309236
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | VOR Antenna Experiment - report |
"me too" I've got an Archer in each wingtip and have zero reception issues on
any sort of VOR/LOC/GS tracking. With that said, they are apparently very sensitive
to the installation, how wiring to other wingtip stuff is routed, etc.
If you follow the install instructions to the letter you'll have great success
otherwise... I've got one antenna feeding an SL-30 and the other feeding a
GNS-430W.
The Archer comm antenna is a different story - nobody reports great success and
even Bob Archer himself will tell you that they don't work well.
Bob
RV-10 N442PM
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Lewis
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 4:44 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: VOR Antenna Experiment - report
FWIW, I used an Archer antenna on my -6A and my -10. I've had no
problems using either for LOC or ILS approaches.
Tim
--
Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA)
RV-6A N47TD -- 1090 hrs
RV-10 N31TD -- First Flight 20 Mar 2010
AirMike said the following on 8/18/2010 2:05 AM:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "AirMike"<Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>
>
> In building my RV10, I decided to bury my VOR antenna (running my Garmin SL30)
in the upper front area of the cabin top using a thin copper tape that Vans
sells as an antenna. I had checked it out on the Fallon NV VOR some time back,
and it drove the NAV functions ok, but due to my phase 1 flight restrictions,
I could not do an ILS over populated areas. Anyway today I did the Reno NV ILS
and I was sorry to find quite a few anomalies as well as a general lack of sensitivity.
By the way, it was pretty cool when the controller asked me to keep
my speed up for a trailing 737, that we could run down the ILS at 165 kts.
>
> At this point I do not think that I will mess with the Bob Archer thing. Looks
like ugly or not that there are some cat whiskers in my RV10's future
>
> Now the real question. Put it on top of the Vertical Stab or under the tail cone?
Any suggestions on reception or sensitivity appreciated
>
> --------
> OSH '10 or Bust
> Q/B - finally done
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309236#309236
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report |
Sorry to hear about the homebuilt antenna. At least
it's truly experimental then though.
I see probably 20% better reception with my whiskers
than the Archer. That's not to say the archer is
bad, but if you're really planning to use it for
approaches and stuff, I would say don't compromise
on reception and all and risk having something that
is easily shadowed in one direction like that.
The archer would probably work ok much of the time,
but the people that are huge proponents are more
that way because they like the cost and hidden aspect,
and that it basically works...but they're not necessarily
concerned with getting the absolute best receiving
antenna that they can get. It's personal choice
on priorities. I figure though that when you're
in the clouds on an approach, I'm not willing to
sacrifice the quality of reception on a navigational
antenna. Things like APRS antennas are non-critical,
and those are better served to prioritizing the
hidden aspect over performance if you choose.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
do not archive
On 8/18/2010 1:05 AM, AirMike wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "AirMike"<Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>
>
> In building my RV10, I decided to bury my VOR antenna (running my
> Garmin SL30) in the upper front area of the cabin top using a thin
> copper tape that Vans sells as an antenna. I had checked it out on
> the Fallon NV VOR some time back, and it drove the NAV functions ok,
> but due to my phase 1 flight restrictions, I could not do an ILS over
> populated areas. Anyway today I did the Reno NV ILS and I was sorry
> to find quite a few anomalies as well as a general lack of
> sensitivity. By the way, it was pretty cool when the controller asked
> me to keep my speed up for a trailing 737, that we could run down the
> ILS at 165 kts.
>
> At this point I do not think that I will mess with the Bob Archer
> thing. Looks like ugly or not that there are some cat whiskers in my
> RV10's future
>
> Now the real question. Put it on top of the Vertical Stab or under
> the tail cone? Any suggestions on reception or sensitivity
> appreciated
>
> -------- OSH '10 or Bust Q/B - finally done
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309236#309236
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom |
The 8000B should slide right into the tray for the 340. You could check with Stein
or whoever your avionics guy is, but I'm pretty sure, if you're already wired,
this will work without any changes.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
C: 352-427-0285
F: 815-377-3694
On Aug 17, 2010, at 6:18 PM, McGann, Ron wrote:
>
> If I was to upgrade my GMA-340 to a PS system, what are the things I need to
consider? Does the PS series fit a Garmin rack? Are the pinouts the same on
both units? Or is there a serious amount of rewiring required?
>
> Pretty happy with the 340, just curious.
>
> Cheers
> Ron
> VH-XRM flying in Oz
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Turner
> Sent: Wednesday, 18 August 2010 8:12 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom
>
>
> I flew behind an 8000 in my last airplane (182) and can attest that it is a fine
audio panel. I might have been interested if I wasn't planning to attempt
to build my own. OTOH, you're competing against PS's new 5000EX, which is less
expensive (who needs Marker Beacons?).
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309172#309172
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom |
Tim,
What phone do you have? We've got a 9000EX in the 10 and it won't sync with my
Iphone 3G. I called PS on it, and they are aware of the problem... Perhaps
its fixed a new firmware version.
Also, as far as headsets go... The new Bose will NOT do music over Bluetooth.
:-( It syncs to the phone and makes calls... but no music.
Zulu does both, and to think I thought bose would get something correct.
Nick
Houston
--------
RV-10 40569
Flying!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309307#309307
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom |
I've got an iphone 3GS, with iOS4. It sync's fine,
and does all functions, including a couple that
the manual says it won't do.
That sucks about the new Bose that it won't offer
what Zulu does for music, but, even if it did,
would a Zulu pump the music into the rest of the
intercom so everyone can hear it? If not, I'd
consider it useless for music anyway.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
do not archive
On 8/18/2010 1:51 PM, Nick Nafsinger wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Nick
> Nafsinger"<nicknaf@gmail.com>
>
> Tim,
>
> What phone do you have? We've got a 9000EX in the 10 and it won't
> sync with my Iphone 3G. I called PS on it, and they are aware of the
> problem... Perhaps its fixed a new firmware version.
>
> Also, as far as headsets go... The new Bose will NOT do music over
> Bluetooth. :-( It syncs to the phone and makes calls... but no
> music.
>
> Zulu does both, and to think I thought bose would get something
> correct.
>
> Nick Houston
>
> -------- RV-10 40569 Flying!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309307#309307
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom |
Tim I take that you got the 5000ex?
I to have the 9000ex and will not sync
To my iPhone. PSE says we will need to send back once they figure it
out.
My understanding is the 5000 has a different Bluetooth device or
something.
Geoff Combs
N829GW
Sent from my iPhone Geoff
On Aug 18, 2010, at 3:02 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
>
> I've got an iphone 3GS, with iOS4. It sync's fine,
> and does all functions, including a couple that
> the manual says it won't do.
>
> That sucks about the new Bose that it won't offer
> what Zulu does for music, but, even if it did,
> would a Zulu pump the music into the rest of the
> intercom so everyone can hear it? If not, I'd
> consider it useless for music anyway.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
> do not archive
>
>
> On 8/18/2010 1:51 PM, Nick Nafsinger wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Nick
>> Nafsinger"<nicknaf@gmail.com>
>>
>> Tim,
>>
>> What phone do you have? We've got a 9000EX in the 10 and it won't
>> sync with my Iphone 3G. I called PS on it, and they are aware of the
>> problem... Perhaps its fixed a new firmware version.
>>
>> Also, as far as headsets go... The new Bose will NOT do music over
>> Bluetooth. :-( It syncs to the phone and makes calls... but no
>> music.
>>
>> Zulu does both, and to think I thought bose would get something
>> correct.
>>
>> Nick Houston
>>
>> -------- RV-10 40569 Flying!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309307#309307
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom |
My Zulu will do everything I want it to do, keep my wife happy as she
listens to what she wants. and my daughters have their own jacks so each can
listen to their own music. I don't have time for music trying to keep the
autopilot straight so I have the Bose. The jack on the intercom and front
passenger and rear passengers are fine if we ever want to hear the same
thing at the same time. But I know my daughters will want to hear their
movies more than music at this point so I built the plane for that.
Build it for what you will use now and upgrade when that need requires
something different. I agree that for having wireless music everyone
appreciates Tim has it made with the PMA.
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim@myrv10.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom
>
> I've got an iphone 3GS, with iOS4. It sync's fine,
> and does all functions, including a couple that
> the manual says it won't do.
>
> That sucks about the new Bose that it won't offer
> what Zulu does for music, but, even if it did,
> would a Zulu pump the music into the rest of the
> intercom so everyone can hear it? If not, I'd
> consider it useless for music anyway.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
> do not archive
>
>
> On 8/18/2010 1:51 PM, Nick Nafsinger wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Nick
>> Nafsinger"<nicknaf@gmail.com>
>>
>> Tim,
>>
>> What phone do you have? We've got a 9000EX in the 10 and it won't
>> sync with my Iphone 3G. I called PS on it, and they are aware of the
>> problem... Perhaps its fixed a new firmware version.
>>
>> Also, as far as headsets go... The new Bose will NOT do music over
>> Bluetooth. :-( It syncs to the phone and makes calls... but no
>> music.
>>
>> Zulu does both, and to think I thought bose would get something
>> correct.
>>
>> Nick Houston
>>
>> -------- RV-10 40569 Flying!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309307#309307
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report |
Since the Glideslope is rarely usable beyond 10nm, and you normally aren't
using it beyond 5nm, signal strength should not be an issue. And you are not
going to be in more than a 15 degree bank on an ILS(lets hope) so
directional blanking should never be an issue. Only if you are using the VOR
at great distance, say 100nm is signal strength going to be a big issue.
Given most are using GPS for primary and VOR for secondary nav, max signal
strength to the VOR receiver really should not be an issue. As long as there
isn't strobe or other electrical interference with the Archer antenna, it
should be a non-issue for navigation. Even the cat whisker antennas are
expensive, and the blade antennas are obscene in price.
On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 8:41 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Sorry to hear about the homebuilt antenna. At least
> it's truly experimental then though.
>
> I see probably 20% better reception with my whiskers
> than the Archer. That's not to say the archer is
> bad, but if you're really planning to use it for
> approaches and stuff, I would say don't compromise
> on reception and all and risk having something that
> is easily shadowed in one direction like that.
> The archer would probably work ok much of the time,
> but the people that are huge proponents are more
> that way because they like the cost and hidden aspect,
> and that it basically works...but they're not necessarily
> concerned with getting the absolute best receiving
> antenna that they can get. It's personal choice
> on priorities. I figure though that when you're
> in the clouds on an approach, I'm not willing to
> sacrifice the quality of reception on a navigational
> antenna. Things like APRS antennas are non-critical,
> and those are better served to prioritizing the
> hidden aspect over performance if you choose.
>
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
> do not archive
>
>
> On 8/18/2010 1:05 AM, AirMike wrote:
>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "AirMike"<Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>
>>
>> In building my RV10, I decided to bury my VOR antenna (running my
>> Garmin SL30) in the upper front area of the cabin top using a thin
>> copper tape that Vans sells as an antenna. I had checked it out on
>> the Fallon NV VOR some time back, and it drove the NAV functions ok,
>> but due to my phase 1 flight restrictions, I could not do an ILS over
>> populated areas. Anyway today I did the Reno NV ILS and I was sorry
>> to find quite a few anomalies as well as a general lack of
>> sensitivity. By the way, it was pretty cool when the controller asked
>> me to keep my speed up for a trailing 737, that we could run down the
>> ILS at 165 kts.
>>
>> At this point I do not think that I will mess with the Bob Archer
>> thing. Looks like ugly or not that there are some cat whiskers in my
>> RV10's future
>>
>> Now the real question. Put it on top of the Vertical Stab or under
>> the tail cone? Any suggestions on reception or sensitivity
>> appreciated
>>
>> -------- OSH '10 or Bust Q/B - finally done
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309236#309236
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: FS: PMA8000 Audio Panel / Intercom |
No, I spent more and got the 8000BT. I do like having a marker
beacon receiver, and the 8000's still offer some things that
the 5000EX doesn't. One of them is the 6-seat capability, which
I actually do use. I've used it for 3 rear-seat headsets, and
I've used it for Video Mic sound. The 5000EX wouldn't be my
choice for my plane, although it's not a bad audio panel. The
8000BT is just better. I loved my PMA8000 all this time. I
did use the cellphone jack a lot for getting clearances and
such. It's just that for all the cables I buy (many many many)
for all the gadgets that I play with (many), I get frustrated
that I even had to have that little 12" cable to hook up the
phone. So I upgraded. Never once did it matter to me that I
could get bluetooth in a headset, because while that would
work fine, it just is another "knobby thing" hanging off your
headset cord. The Bose panel powered stuff for the AviationX
are nice and slim and light. I had thought about building a
bluetooth dongle into the audio panel, or adding a bluetooth
handsfree wired in somehow, but there again, that was a hack.
It's a lot of money to pay to get headset phone access, but
PS Engineering makes great stuff and I was happy with the 8000
for all that time, so I figured since I didn't have anything
else to buy at OSH, I may as well do this while I have the
motivation, having just done a couple of IFR flights with
phone clearances just before OSH. Considering that the
audio panels are a slide-in upgrade, it was just the added cost
that was the sticking point.
Tim
do not archive
On 8/18/2010 2:44 PM, g.combs wrote:
>
> Tim I take that you got the 5000ex?
> I to have the 9000ex and will not sync
> To my iPhone. PSE says we will need to send back once they figure it out.
> My understanding is the 5000 has a different Bluetooth device or something.
>
> Geoff Combs
> N829GW
>
> Sent from my iPhone Geoff
>
>
> On Aug 18, 2010, at 3:02 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I've got an iphone 3GS, with iOS4. It sync's fine,
>> and does all functions, including a couple that
>> the manual says it won't do.
>>
>> That sucks about the new Bose that it won't offer
>> what Zulu does for music, but, even if it did,
>> would a Zulu pump the music into the rest of the
>> intercom so everyone can hear it? If not, I'd
>> consider it useless for music anyway.
>>
>> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>> On 8/18/2010 1:51 PM, Nick Nafsinger wrote:
>>> Nafsinger"<nicknaf@gmail.com>
>>>
>>> Tim,
>>>
>>> What phone do you have? We've got a 9000EX in the 10 and it won't
>>> sync with my Iphone 3G. I called PS on it, and they are aware of the
>>> problem... Perhaps its fixed a new firmware version.
>>>
>>> Also, as far as headsets go... The new Bose will NOT do music over
>>> Bluetooth. :-( It syncs to the phone and makes calls... but no
>>> music.
>>>
>>> Zulu does both, and to think I thought bose would get something
>>> correct.
>>>
>>> Nick Houston
>>>
>>> -------- RV-10 40569 Flying!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309307#309307
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report |
I'd guess the only localizer issue would be if you are, say, 10 miles out, and
vectored onto the localizer with a 30 degree intercept that requires the wingtip
antenna to look through the fuselage to "see" the localizer antenna. e.g.,
airport to your right if the antenna is in the left wing tip.
Can anyone comment on this scenario? Real world, is it an issue?
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309344#309344
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Experiment - report |
I appreciate all of the thoughtful responses to my comments ( especially Tim L,
Tim O, and Kelly). We asked Reno APP for vectors to the ILS. They essentially
sent us in a teardrop pattern. Approaching from close to the airport we had some
reception problems at 90 degrees off our rt wingtip - presumably the wingtip
blanketing the signal.
Then the N to So. approach is VERY long due to the Sierra Mtns at 8000 to 10000
ft to the west. Reno sits at 4200 ft. At 5-6 miles and on in (Loc & G/S) there
was no problem. It was out a ways like Kelly said on the intercept and even
after the intercept (10-12 miles) that the signal was erratic. Reno is a real
acid test of these antennas.
--------
OSH '10 or Bust
Q/B - finally done
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=309356#309356
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