Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 11:15 AM - Hottest Cyl CHT (Deems Davis)
2. 11:39 AM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (John Cumins)
3. 11:51 AM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (DLM)
4. 12:04 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (BPA)
5. 12:50 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (Linn Walters)
6. 12:54 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (gary)
7. 01:08 PM - Re: Lower cowling slot (aerosport1)
8. 01:11 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (Scott Schmidt)
9. 01:25 PM - Re: Re: Lower cowling slot (John Cumins)
10. 01:35 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (BPA)
11. 01:36 PM - Re: Re: Lower cowling slot (Geoff Combs)
12. 01:55 PM - Re: Re: Lower cowling slot (John Cumins)
13. 02:26 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (Pascal)
14. 02:38 PM - Re: Re: Lower cowling slot (Don McDonald)
15. 02:50 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (Linn Walters)
16. 02:52 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (Don McDonald)
17. 03:13 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (McGann, Ron)
18. 03:21 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (Tim Olson)
19. 05:38 PM - Re: Hottest Cyl CHT (John Cox)
20. 09:48 PM - Re: Lower cowling slot (Albert Gardner)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I
was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several
others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high
is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily
top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with
the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake
much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being
that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air flow
from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't indicate
much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that
the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Deems
If you cut back the baffling make sure to do it on the top of the cylinders
and not the bottom side. You need to increase the differential pressure
between the top of the engine and the bottom. I have see several people
trim back the front plate on the #2 cylinder but since you have the fancy
cowl I am not too sure how to help you on that one. On our Saratoga we have
both oil coolers on the aft baffling right next to the #5 and # 6 cylinders
and the engine stays nice and cool here in our 105 degree heat in northern
California. So I do not think it is the oil cooler air outlet causing the
issues.
I would be looking at getting the max air in the top of the engine and then
making sure there is not blockage or reverse pressure on the bottom of the
engine.
If you have access to a couple of gauges it would be worth the trouble to do
some pressure checks to determine the differential pressure in the cowl that
will answer a lot of questions and take some guess work out of it.
John Cumins 40864
Emp done reorganizing garage for Wings
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:12 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I was
asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others?
During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I
need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and
with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the
plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower
and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and
would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I
just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl
similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the
lower cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a
test flight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped around
the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van's
baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
I have completely removed the air dams on cyls 1 and 2. CHTs rarely get
above 360 and it is usually 6 and 2. I never see above 400; only seen
during break-in.
----- Original Message -----
From: Deems Davis
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:11 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH
I was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several
others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high
is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily
top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with
the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake
much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being
that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air flow
from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't indicate
much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that
the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Deems,
410F on climb out is not IMO considered high, even 420 isn't out of the
norm on a 'steep/ long climb, but getting warm.
What are the other 4 cylinders' CHT during normal climb out/, steep/
long climbs?
Allen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I
was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several
others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high
is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily
top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with
the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake
much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being
that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air flow
from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't indicate
much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that
the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
Having had nightmares about high oil temps (I live in FL), I've taken
a good look at the oil cooler installation ..... and here's my thoughts:
1: The oil cooler plenum is poor at best .... the incoming air (from
the baffle) only hits about 1/3 of the cooler directly, and turbulent
air at that. Some kind of baffle inside the plenum should help direct
some of the air to the top part of the cooler.
2: The outlet air of the cooler dumps into the corner of the lower
cowl, and I suspect there's not too much flow in that area. The
differential pressure from upper to lower cowl determines how much air
flow is available for the cooler. Subtract the drag caused by the oil
cooler itself, and now the differential pressure is even less. It would
seem that an outlet plenum with scat hose connected to louvers on the
bottom of the cowl would create a lower pressure area and would enhance
the airflow through the cooler.
someone tell me where I'm fooling myself here!!!
Linn
do not archive
On 9/29/2010 2:34 PM, John Cumins wrote:
>
> Deems
>
> If you cut back the baffling make sure to do it on the top of the
> cylinders and not the bottom side. You need to increase the
> differential pressure between the top of the engine and the bottom. I
> have see several people trim back the front plate on the #2 cylinder
> but since you have the fancy cowl I am not too sure how to help you on
> that one. On our Saratoga we have both oil coolers on the aft
> baffling right next to the #5 and # 6 cylinders and the engine stays
> nice and cool here in our 105 degree heat in northern California. So
> I do not think it is the oil cooler air outlet causing the issues.
>
> I would be looking at getting the max air in the top of the engine and
> then making sure there is not blockage or reverse pressure on the
> bottom of the engine.
>
> If you have access to a couple of gauges it would be worth the trouble
> to do some pressure checks to determine the differential pressure in
> the cowl that will answer a lot of questions and take some guess work
> out of it.
>
> John Cumins 40864
>
> Emp done reorganizing garage for Wings
>
> *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Deems Davis
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:12 AM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
>
> What's your hottest cylinder ?
>
> The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH
> I was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several
> others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high
> is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will
> easily top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
>
> My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
> cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us
> with the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air
> intake much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
>
> I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
> and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
> done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
> the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory
> being that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air
> flow from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't
> indicate much if any improvement.
>
> I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
> around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying
> that the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Deems
>
> * *
> * *
> http://www.matronic=================
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://forums.matronics.com
> - List Contribution Web generous nbsp; -->
> http://www.matronics.com/c= <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
> * * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Alan, I was told that the metallurgy starts changing at about 420 degrees
and getting the CHT up that high is bad. You obviously aren't concerned.
Why are others concerned and not you?
Gary Specketer
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of BPA
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 3:06 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Deems,
410F on climb out is not IMO considered high, even 420 isn't out of the norm
on a 'steep/ long climb, but getting warm.
What are the other 4 cylinders' CHT during normal climb out/, steep/ long
climbs?
Allen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I was
asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others?
During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I
need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and
with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the
plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower
and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and
would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I
just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl
similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the
lower cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a
test flight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped around
the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van's
baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Lower cowling slot |
I just thought I would throw this out about oil temps. I have noticed over the
past that some people that have had oil temp problems only had 4 cooling slots
per side on either side of the nose gear cut out. There are suppose to be five
slots. If you go back through this discussion you can see that Albert only had
4 slots cut. I have seen this before. This is a easy
thing to do and miss cutting out the front slots. Ask me how I know. I caught mine
2 days before the first flight. This could possibly be some
of the cooling problems for people with the standard Van's cowl.
FWIW
Geoff
N829GW
--------
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying
40033
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=314140#314140
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
#2 for me.
-Scott Schmidt
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 29, 2010, at 1:06 PM, "BPA" <BPA@bpaengines.com> wrote:
> Deems,
>
>
>
> 410F on climb out is not IMO considered high, even 420 isn=99t out o
f the norm on a =98steep/ long climb, but getting warm.
>
>
>
> What are the other 4 cylinders=99 CHT during normal climb out/, stee
p/ long climbs?
>
>
>
>
>
> Allen
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@
matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:12 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
>
>
>
> What's your hottest cylinder ?
>
> The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I w
as asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others? Du
ring the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I need t
o pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and with a
steep/long climb will reach 420.
>
> My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the cylind
ers which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the plenu
m, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower and e
clipsing the cylinder.
>
> I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and w
ould appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I just
finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl simil
ar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the lower
cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a test fl
ight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
>
> I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped arou
nd the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van
's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Deems
>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Lower cowling slot |
Geoff
So would 6 slot be better for people that live in warm climates, and did you
install the grates a lot of people recommend or did you just open 6 slots in
the bottom of the cowl on each side.
John G. Cumins
President
2499 B1 Martin Rd
Fairfield Ca 94534
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
Your Total Technology Solution Provider
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of aerosport1
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 1:04 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
<g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
I just thought I would throw this out about oil temps. I have noticed over
the past that some people that have had oil temp problems only had 4 cooling
slots per side on either side of the nose gear cut out. There are suppose to
be five slots. If you go back through this discussion you can see that
Albert only had 4 slots cut. I have seen this before. This is a easy
thing to do and miss cutting out the front slots. Ask me how I know. I
caught mine 2 days before the first flight. This could possibly be some
of the cooling problems for people with the standard Van's cowl.
FWIW
Geoff
N829GW
--------
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying
40033
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=314140#314140
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Gary, I'm not saying its good for them. I AM concerned at 420 if the
CHT's are run there for long periods of time, but not necessarily if
only occasionally. Ideally, the best temps to run the cylinders are
between 350-380. This will give you best cylinder life. I have seen
cylinders that have been run in the low 430's on aerobatic engines that
have shown no noticeable effects. But then, I haven't done any fatigue
analysis on them either.
Allen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 1:52 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Alan, I was told that the metallurgy starts changing at about 420
degrees and getting the CHT up that high is bad. You obviously aren't
concerned. Why are others concerned and not you?
Gary Specketer
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of BPA
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 3:06 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Deems,
410F on climb out is not IMO considered high, even 420 isn't out of the
norm on a 'steep/ long climb, but getting warm.
What are the other 4 cylinders' CHT during normal climb out/, steep/
long climbs?
Allen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I
was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several
others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high
is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily
top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with
the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake
much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being
that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air flow
from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't indicate
much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that
the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Lower cowling slot |
John I just have the standard 5 slots per the plans. Not sure what 6 slots
would do.
Geoff
Geoff Combs
President
Aerosport Modeling & Design
8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
Canal Winchester, Ohio 43110
614-834-5227p
614-834-5230f
www.aerosportmodeling.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Cumins
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 4:16 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
Geoff
So would 6 slot be better for people that live in warm climates, and did you
install the grates a lot of people recommend or did you just open 6 slots in
the bottom of the cowl on each side.
John G. Cumins
President
2499 B1 Martin Rd
Fairfield Ca 94534
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
Your Total Technology Solution Provider
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of aerosport1
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 1:04 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
<g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
I just thought I would throw this out about oil temps. I have noticed over
the past that some people that have had oil temp problems only had 4 cooling
slots per side on either side of the nose gear cut out. There are suppose to
be five slots. If you go back through this discussion you can see that
Albert only had 4 slots cut. I have seen this before. This is a easy thing
to do and miss cutting out the front slots. Ask me how I know. I caught mine
2 days before the first flight. This could possibly be some of the cooling
problems for people with the standard Van's cowl.
FWIW
Geoff
N829GW
--------
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying
40033
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=314140#314140
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Lower cowling slot |
Geoff
Thanks
John G. Cumins
President
2499 B1 Martin Rd
Fairfield Ca 94534
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
Your Total Technology Solution Provider
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Geoff Combs
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 1:30 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
<g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
John I just have the standard 5 slots per the plans. Not sure what 6 slots
would do.
Geoff
Geoff Combs
President
Aerosport Modeling & Design
8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
Canal Winchester, Ohio 43110
614-834-5227p
614-834-5230f
www.aerosportmodeling.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Cumins
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 4:16 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
Geoff
So would 6 slot be better for people that live in warm climates, and did you
install the grates a lot of people recommend or did you just open 6 slots in
the bottom of the cowl on each side.
John G. Cumins
President
2499 B1 Martin Rd
Fairfield Ca 94534
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
Your Total Technology Solution Provider
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of aerosport1
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 1:04 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
<g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
I just thought I would throw this out about oil temps. I have noticed over
the past that some people that have had oil temp problems only had 4 cooling
slots per side on either side of the nose gear cut out. There are suppose to
be five slots. If you go back through this discussion you can see that
Albert only had 4 slots cut. I have seen this before. This is a easy thing
to do and miss cutting out the front slots. Ask me how I know. I caught mine
2 days before the first flight. This could possibly be some of the cooling
problems for people with the standard Van's cowl.
FWIW
Geoff
N829GW
--------
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying
40033
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=314140#314140
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
concerning #1 if I understand you correctly- Tim made mention of it on
his website and commented that is was worse having the splitter in the
plenum than before he added it.
From: Linn Walters
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:46 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Having had nightmares about high oil temps (I live in FL), I've taken a
good look at the oil cooler installation ..... and here's my thoughts:
1: The oil cooler plenum is poor at best .... the incoming air (from
the baffle) only hits about 1/3 of the cooler directly, and turbulent
air at that. Some kind of baffle inside the plenum should help direct
some of the air to the top part of the cooler.
2: The outlet air of the cooler dumps into the corner of the lower
cowl, and I suspect there's not too much flow in that area. The
differential pressure from upper to lower cowl determines how much air
flow is available for the cooler. Subtract the drag caused by the oil
cooler itself, and now the differential pressure is even less. It would
seem that an outlet plenum with scat hose connected to louvers on the
bottom of the cowl would create a lower pressure area and would enhance
the airflow through the cooler.
someone tell me where I'm fooling myself here!!!
Linn
do not archive
On 9/29/2010 2:34 PM, John Cumins wrote:
Deems
If you cut back the baffling make sure to do it on the top of the
cylinders and not the bottom side. You need to increase the
differential pressure between the top of the engine and the bottom. I
have see several people trim back the front plate on the #2 cylinder but
since you have the fancy cowl I am not too sure how to help you on that
one. On our Saratoga we have both oil coolers on the aft baffling right
next to the #5 and # 6 cylinders and the engine stays nice and cool here
in our 105 degree heat in northern California. So I do not think it is
the oil cooler air outlet causing the issues.
I would be looking at getting the max air in the top of the engine and
then making sure there is not blockage or reverse pressure on the bottom
of the engine.
If you have access to a couple of gauges it would be worth the trouble
to do some pressure checks to determine the differential pressure in the
cowl that will answer a lot of questions and take some guess work out of
it.
John Cumins 40864
Emp done reorganizing garage for Wings
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:12 AM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH
I was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several
others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high
is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily
top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with
the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake
much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being
that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air flow
from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't indicate
much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that
the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
http://www.matronic=================htt
p://forums.matronics.com - List Contribution Web generous nbsp;
--> http://www.matronics.com/c=
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Lower cowling slot |
First we must all be talking apples and apples.- Deems not lonly doesn't
have-a stock engine, but he lives in AZ.- So all of us with cold air in
duction, and/or higher compression, and/or are living in a hot climate, nee
d to do things different than Van's stock setup.
There's already a baffle out that inserts into the oil cooler box.- I bel
ieve most of us with heating problems, including Deems, has already install
ed this.- I did a number of things and I seem to have the heat issue mana
gaeable.- I have 8ea. 3" louvers on each side of the bottom cowl (Van's h
as 5ea. 4"), then I have 4 additional louvers on each bottom outside edge o
f the cowl.- 4 of these are directly below the oil cooler.- All of thes
e louvers have a reverse scoop to allow the air to escape without having to
compete with the relative wind.- The last thing I did was something I ju
st thought up.- I used the 2nd 2" scat coming off the back of cyl #5 (bot
h of my heater scats come off the back of #5), routed it over to a fabricat
ed fiberglass "Y" and input it, along with the 4" from #6, into the oil coo
ler.- #6 was my hottest cyl, and the difference between #5 and #6 was aro
und 20 degrees.- After installing the mod, the temperature difference is
usually between 5 and 10 degrees and
on a hot Texas day, after going to lunch, on the way back at 3,000' I ran 3
120 degree different course headings at 25sq.- My TAS calculated out to
199mph, and my oil temp never exceeded 197 degrees.
I attached a few pics of what I've done..... no engineer here, just trying
stuff that I thought might work.
Don McDonald
-
Anyone going to LOE?
-
Funny,,, last year I didn't know what an LOE was!
--- On Wed, 9/29/10, aerosport1 <g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com> wrote:
From: aerosport1 <g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lower cowling slot
m>
I just thought I would throw this out about oil temps. I have noticed over
the past that some people that have had oil temp problems only had 4 coolin
g slots per side on either side of the nose gear cut out. There are suppose
to be five slots. If you go back through this discussion you can see that
Albert only had 4 slots cut. I have seen this before. This is a easy
thing to do and miss cutting out the front slots. Ask me how I know. I caug
ht mine 2 days before the first flight. This could possibly be some
of the cooling problems for people with the standard Van's cowl.
FWIW
Geoff
N829GW
--------
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying
40033
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=314140#314140
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
Thanks Pascal .... I looked at Tim's site and that was what I was
contemplating. +5 degrees could be anything from time of year to phase
of moon. Thanks for the heads up. Anyone else have data??? Might
forget #1.
Linn
On 9/29/2010 5:20 PM, Pascal wrote:
> concerning #1 if I understand you correctly- Tim made mention of it on
> his website and commented that is was worse having the splitter in the
> plenum than before he added it.
> *From:* Linn Walters <mailto:pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:46 PM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com <mailto:rv10-list@matronics.com>
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
>
> Having had nightmares about high oil temps (I live in FL), I've taken
> a good look at the oil cooler installation ..... and here's my thoughts:
> 1: The oil cooler plenum is poor at best .... the incoming air (from
> the baffle) only hits about 1/3 of the cooler directly, and turbulent
> air at that. Some kind of baffle inside the plenum should help direct
> some of the air to the top part of the cooler.
>
> 2: The outlet air of the cooler dumps into the corner of the lower
> cowl, and I suspect there's not too much flow in that area. The
> differential pressure from upper to lower cowl determines how much air
> flow is available for the cooler. Subtract the drag caused by the oil
> cooler itself, and now the differential pressure is even less. It
> would seem that an outlet plenum with scat hose connected to louvers
> on the bottom of the cowl would create a lower pressure area and would
> enhance the airflow through the cooler.
>
> someone tell me where I'm fooling myself here!!!
> Linn
> do not archive
> On 9/29/2010 2:34 PM, John Cumins wrote:
>>
>> Deems
>>
>> If you cut back the baffling make sure to do it on the top of the
>> cylinders and not the bottom side. You need to increase the
>> differential pressure between the top of the engine and the bottom.
>> I have see several people trim back the front plate on the #2
>> cylinder but since you have the fancy cowl I am not too sure how to
>> help you on that one. On our Saratoga we have both oil coolers on
>> the aft baffling right next to the #5 and # 6 cylinders and the
>> engine stays nice and cool here in our 105 degree heat in northern
>> California. So I do not think it is the oil cooler air outlet
>> causing the issues.
>>
>> I would be looking at getting the max air in the top of the engine
>> and then making sure there is not blockage or reverse pressure on the
>> bottom of the engine.
>>
>> If you have access to a couple of gauges it would be worth the
>> trouble to do some pressure checks to determine the differential
>> pressure in the cowl that will answer a lot of questions and take
>> some guess work out of it.
>>
>> John Cumins 40864
>>
>> Emp done reorganizing garage for Wings
>>
>> *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Deems Davis
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:12 AM
>> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
>> *Subject:* RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
>>
>> What's your hottest cylinder ?
>>
>> The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @
>> OSH I was asking around and it seemed that the same was true for
>> several others? During the summer which lasts a while here in AZ
>> (Today's high is 105) I need to pay attention to these during climb
>> as # 6 will easily top 410F and with a steep/long climb will reach 420.
>>
>> My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the
>> cylinders which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us
>> with the plenum, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air
>> intake much lower and eclipsing the cylinder.
>>
>> I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2,
>> and would appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have
>> done/attempted. I just finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on
>> the bottom of the cowl similar to what Al Gardner did, the theory
>> being that it would increase the lower cowl exit area and improve air
>> flow from upper to lower cowl, but a test flight yesterday didn't
>> indicate much if any improvement.
>>
>> I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped
>> around the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying
>> that the Van's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Deems
>>
>> * *
>> * *
>> http://www.matronic=================
>> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://forums.matronics.com
>> - List Contribution Web generous nbsp; -->
>> http://www.matronics.com/c= <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>> * * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>> *
>>
>>
>> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>
> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List* <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
> *href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
> *
> *
>
>
> *
Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
I'm not sure he actually said it was worse... but maybe not noticeably bett
er.
Don
--- On Wed, 9/29/10, Pascal <rv10builder@verizon.net> wrote:
From: Pascal <rv10builder@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
concerning #1 if I understand you correctly- Tim made mention of it on his
website and commented that is was worse having the splitter in the plenum t
han before he added it.
From: Linn Walters
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:46 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Having had nightmares about high oil temps (I live in FL), I've taken a goo
d look at the oil cooler installation ..... and here's my thoughts:
1:- The oil cooler plenum is poor at best .... the incoming air (from the
baffle) only hits about 1/3 of the cooler directly, and turbulent air at t
hat.- Some kind of baffle inside the plenum should help direct some of th
e air to the top part of the cooler.
2:- The outlet air of the cooler dumps into the corner of the lower cowl,
and I suspect there's not too much flow in that area.- The differential
pressure from upper to lower cowl determines how much air flow is available
for the cooler.- Subtract the drag caused by the oil cooler itself, and
now the differential pressure is even less.- It would seem that an outlet
plenum with scat hose connected to louvers on the bottom of the cowl would
create a lower pressure area and would enhance the airflow through the coo
ler.
someone tell me where I'm fooling myself here!!!
Linn
do not archive
On 9/29/2010 2:34 PM, John Cumins wrote:
Deems
-
If you cut back the baffling make sure to do it on the top- of the cylind
ers and not the bottom side.- You need to increase the differential press
ure between the top of the engine and the bottom.- I have see several peo
ple trim back the front plate on the #2 cylinder but since you have the fan
cy cowl I am not too sure how to help you on that one.- On our Saratoga w
e have both oil coolers on the aft baffling right next to the #5 and # 6 cy
linders and the engine stays nice and cool here in our 105 degree heat in n
orthern California.- So I do not think it is the oil cooler air outlet ca
using the issues.
-
I would be looking at getting the max air in the top of the engine and then
making sure there is not blockage or reverse pressure on the bottom of the
engine.
-
If you have access to a couple of gauges it would be worth the trouble to d
o some pressure checks to determine the differential pressure in the cowl t
hat will answer a lot of questions and take some guess work out of it.
-
John Cumins 40864
Emp done reorganizing garage for Wings
-
-
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:12 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
-
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I wa
s asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others? Du
ring the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I need
to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and wit
h a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the cylinde
rs which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the plenu
m, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower and
eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and w
ould appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I jus
t finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl sim
ilar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the lo
wer cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a tes
t flight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped aroun
d the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van
's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems - -http://www.matronic==============
=== http://forums.matronics.com -------- - List Contr
ibution Web generous nbsp;----------------
------- --> http://www.matronics.com/c= -
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
=0A=0A=0A
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
#2 - even after trimming the dam to 1/2 size.
cheers
Ron
VH-XRM flying in Oz
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Thursday, 30 September 2010 4:12 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I wa
s asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others? Du
ring the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I need
to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and wit
h a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the cylinde
rs which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the plenu
m, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower and
eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and w
ould appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I jus
t finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl sim
ilar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the lo
wer cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a tes
t flight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped aroun
d the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van
's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
Message 18
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Hottest Cyl CHT |
It wasn't consistent. It seemed to be about the same initially, but over ti
me I started to suspect it was slightly higher. Whatever the case I don't t
hink it was a very significant change. It may be one of those things that w
orks better or worse for you depending on other factors, so it may be worthw
hile, and I like the theory behind it, but I removed mine now and things are
no worse and maybe slightly better for me on climbout.
So it's hard to say for sure.
Tim
On Sep 29, 2010, at 4:49 PM, Don McDonald <building_partner@yahoo.com> wrote
:
> I'm not sure he actually said it was worse... but maybe not noticeably bet
ter.
> Don
>
> --- On Wed, 9/29/10, Pascal <rv10builder@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> From: Pascal <rv10builder@verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, September 29, 2010, 2:20 PM
>
> concerning #1 if I understand you correctly- Tim made mention of it on his
website and commented that is was worse having the splitter in the plenum t
han before he added it.
> From: Linn Walters
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:46 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
>
> Having had nightmares about high oil temps (I live in FL), I've taken a go
od look at the oil cooler installation ..... and here's my thoughts:
> 1: The oil cooler plenum is poor at best .... the incoming air (from the b
affle) only hits about 1/3 of the cooler directly, and turbulent air at that
. Some kind of baffle inside the plenum should help direct some of the air t
o the top part of the cooler.
>
> 2: The outlet air of the cooler dumps into the corner of the lower cowl, a
nd I suspect there's not too much flow in that area. The differential press
ure from upper to lower cowl determines how much air flow is available for t
he cooler. Subtract the drag caused by the oil cooler itself, and now the d
ifferential pressure is even less. It would seem that an outlet plenum with
scat hose connected to louvers on the bottom of the cowl would create a low
er pressure area and would enhance the airflow through the cooler.
>
> someone tell me where I'm fooling myself here!!!
> Linn
> do not archive
> On 9/29/2010 2:34 PM, John Cumins wrote:
>>
>> Deems
>>
>>
>>
>
> If you cut back the baffling make sure to do it on the top of the cylinde
rs and not the bottom side. You need to increase the differential pressure b
etween the top of the engine and the bottom. I have see several people trim
back the front plate on the #2 cylinder but since you have the fancy cowl I
am not too sure how to help you on that one. On our Saratoga we have both o
il coolers on the aft baffling right next to the #5 and # 6 cylinders and th
e engine stays nice and cool here in our 105 degree heat in northern Califor
nia. So I do not think it is the oil cooler air outlet causing the issues.
>
>
>
> I would be looking at getting the max air in the top of the engine and the
n making sure there is not blockage or reverse pressure on the bottom of the
engine.
>
>
>
> If you have access to a couple of gauges it would be worth the trouble to d
o some pressure checks to determine the differential pressure in the cowl th
at will answer a lot of questions and take some guess work out of it.
>
>
>
> John Cumins 40864
>
> Emp done reorganizing garage for Wings
>
>
>
>
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@
matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 11:12 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
>
>
>
> What's your hottest cylinder ?
>
> The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I w
as asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others? Du
ring the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I need t
o pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and with a
steep/long climb will reach 420.
>
> My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the cylind
ers which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the plenu
m, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower and e
clipsing the cylinder.
>
> I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and w
ould appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I just
finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl simil
ar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the lower
cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a test fl
ight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
>
> I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped arou
nd the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van
's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Deems
>
>
>
> http://www.matronic================= htt
p://forums.matronics.com - List Contribution Web generous nbsp;
--> http://www.matronics.com/c
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
>
>
> =nofollow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> et=_blank>http://forums.matronics.com
> llow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 19
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Metallurgical alteration of the longterm (life) strength of aluminum, cokin
g of lubricating oil on the exhaust valve guides/stems and development of c
racks in the proximity of exhaust valves/seats should be understood before
getting too deep into temperature ranges in the 400s. Note: Break In perio
ds are though not exempt are less lifetime critical.
Twenty plus years ago, very few operators had individual CHT sensors to war
n of those impending events. These new units are great. I concur that rega
rdless of extra horsepower, modified coolers, higher altitudes, dysfunction
al high pressure plenums, warmer climate and other factors, "Temperatures o
utside of the norm - Do matter". Some friends can just afford the cost ass
ociated with such elective activities more easily than others and handles t
hose temperature extremes better.
I like Allen's 350-380 and clearly understand the importance of consistent/
controlled operating temperatures. I get increased butt dyno sensitivity a
t over 400. I increase my monitoring vigilance in approaching 420 and I su
re as hell understand the Danger Zone of operating above that number for pe
riods of time during extended climb. I have remarked to fellow pilots when
I ride along that cowl flaps need opening, angle of attack needs monitorin
g, alternate landing sites need to be considered and then the music from To
p Gun begins in my head. A close friend with a Continental TSIO-550 got to
visit the price for such wild dancing and it was an eye opener. One of ou
r RV-10 brethren did not head such annunciation and also got to replace som
e aluminum parts. YMMV.
Choose Wisely your temperatures.
John Cox
From: BPA
Sent: Wed 9/29/2010 1:37 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Gary, I'm not saying its good for them. I AM concerned at 420 if the CHT's
are run there for long periods of time, but not necessarily if only occasio
nally. Ideally, the best temps to run the cylinders are between 350-380. Th
is will give you best cylinder life. I have seen cylinders that have been r
un in the low 430's on aerobatic engines that have shown no noticeable effe
cts. But then, I haven't done any fatigue analysis on them either.
Allen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 1:52 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Alan, I was told that the metallurgy starts changing at about 420 degrees a
nd getting the CHT up that high is bad. You obviously aren't concerned. W
hy are others concerned and not you?
Gary Specketer
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of BPA
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 3:06 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
Deems,
410F on climb out is not IMO considered high, even 420 isn't out of the nor
m on a 'steep/ long climb, but getting warm.
What are the other 4 cylinders' CHT during normal climb out/, steep/ long c
limbs?
Allen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2010 12:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Hottest Cyl CHT
What's your hottest cylinder ?
The reason I'm asking is that mine is #6, followed closely by #2 @ OSH I wa
s asking around and it seemed that the same was true for several others? Du
ring the summer which lasts a while here in AZ (Today's high is 105) I need
to pay attention to these during climb as # 6 will easily top 410F and wit
h a steep/long climb will reach 420.
My initial assumption is that #6 is loosing some cooling air to the cylinde
rs which is being sent to to the oil cooler. For those of us with the plenu
m, it's probably compounded due to having the oil air intake much lower and
eclipsing the cylinder.
I've been noodling about how to get more cooling air through #6 & #2, and w
ould appreciate any thoughts/efforts that others have done/attempted. I jus
t finished installing some 'fixed cowl flaps' on the bottom of the cowl sim
ilar to what Al Gardner did, the theory being that it would increase the lo
wer cowl exit area and improve air flow from upper to lower cowl, but a tes
t flight yesterday didn't indicate much if any improvement.
I've thought about cutting back the baffeling on #6 & #2 that wrapped aroun
d the lower portion of the cylinder. I recall Sam James saying that the Van
's baffeling wasn't opened up enough. Thoughts????
Thanks
Deems
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 20
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Lower cowling slot |
Now that several of us are working on this problem maybe a solution will
appear.
that latest data I recorded was on a flight from Maderia, CA back to Yuma
during cruise on Aug. 15th:
128 IAS, 160 TAS, 55f OAT, 207f Oil, 11,500', 2300 RPM. 19.6" MAP, 12.3 GPH
ROP
#1 396, 387, 348, 345, 373, 369
#1 1339, 1289, 1323, 1246, 1284, 1324
The addition of the cowl flaps helped keep oil temps down on climb by about
5-10 degrees. Before I installed them I found it very difficult to keep oil
temps down with high ground temps and any delay in TO. I had them go to
230-35 before I could drop the nose and get some airspeed if I had prolonged
taxi time.
Now I'm going to replace the temp cowl flaps with glass ones that look a
little better. However I don't see any way they can retract.
I am running an IO-540 with 10:1 and 1 Lightspeed at 315 HP. I have
installed a second oil cooler on the right side using the same setup as the
stock cooler on the left. With second cooler and the cowl flaps I aam
reasonably happy. I have a buddy with some thermocouples and we plan on
checking the oil temps going in and out of the 2 oil coolers which are
connected in series.
Albert Gardner
N991RV
Yuma, AZ
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2010 9:40 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower cowling slot
Albert,
THANKS for this idea, I'm in the process of fabricating something identical,
only out of fiberglass.
How much of an improvement do you feel you got? CHT? Oil Temp?
Did you see any reduction in TAS?
THANKS
Deems
(Hope to see you @ Copperstate!)
On 9/15/2010 3:20 AM, Albert Gardner wrote:
I fought high oil temps and installed a second oil cooler on the right side.
Final part of the solution was cowl flaps as these pics show. Before I put
the non-adjustable flaps in I had louvers in those locations but they didn't
do enough. Still have to be careful of extended ground operation in 100+
days though.
Albert Gardner
N991RV
Yuma, AZ
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Dunne
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 12:31 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Lower cowling slot
<mailto:acs@acspropeller.com.au> <acs@acspropeller.com.au>
I extended the slot forward to enable easier removal of the 3 blade prop as
others have done. I haven't made a cover for this area but it doesn't seem
to have made any real difference to the oil temps in any case.
My oil temps now average 206 deg F at 5000' OAT 50F
Initial running was around 215-216 deg F
I was told everything will eventually stabilise and don't be too concerned
about the high oil temps, but I'm not real comfortable with the temps
creeping up there.
A suggestion was put to me to install small ramp style wedges in front of
the stock louvers in order to drag the hot air out and away from the lower
cowl. Anybody had any experience with this?
John 40315
Phase 1 Fly off
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Strasnuts
Sent: Tuesday, 14 September 2010 3:50 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Lower cowling slot
<sean@braunandco.com>
I would like to make a removable plate on the lower cowling to make it
easier to put on and take off. I was wondering if it's worth it for those
of you who have done it and if I should close the gap to the front gear leg
or leave the same amount of space for cooling. Was this space used for the
equation for cooling? Any pics out there for reference?
Thanks
--------
Cust. #40936
RV-10 SB Fuselage
N801VR reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=312297#312297
E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.514)
Database version: 6.15860
http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/
E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.514)
Database version: 6.15870
http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|