Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:21 AM - Please Make A Contribution To Support Your Lists (Matt Dralle)
1. 06:38 AM - Re: O2 / Headset Connections (Les Kearney)
2. 06:38 AM - Re: door safety latch (Les Kearney)
3. 06:38 AM - Re: O2 / Headset Connections (Les Kearney)
4. 07:46 AM - Re: O2 / Headset Connections (Kelly McMullen)
5. 09:33 AM - Re: O2 / Headset Connections (Dave Saylor)
6. 09:49 AM - Seat rail alignment issue (Rob Kochman)
7. 10:10 AM - Re: O2 / Headset Connections (Linn Walters)
8. 01:03 PM - descent profile (DLM)
9. 01:13 PM - Re: descent profile (Miller John)
10. 01:49 PM - Re: Seat rail alignment issue (Bob Leffler)
11. 05:21 PM - Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows (Masys, Daniel R)
12. 05:59 PM - Re: Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows (Pascal)
13. 06:23 PM - Re: Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows (Tim Olson)
14. 06:24 PM - Center Console (Les Kearney)
15. 06:33 PM - Wheel Fairing Mount maintenance issue - a must-read for flying -10's (Tim Olson)
16. 07:06 PM - Re: Wheel Fairing Mount maintenance issue - a must-read for flying -10's (Lew Gallagher)
Message 0
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| Subject: | Please Make A Contribution To Support Your Lists |
Dear Listers,
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Thank you in advance for your generous support!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List and Forum Administrator
Message 1
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| Subject: | O2 / Headset Connections |
Hi Deems
Thanks for the opinion. In the absence of any compelling reason to put them
above, I think I'll take your suggestion and move the headset connections
elsewhere. I may put my O2 lines above, however, as I would like to keep the
O2 away from anything that carries hydrocarbons (which means the tunnel
etc). For some reason they don't coexist too well.
Cheers
Les
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: November-03-10 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: O2 / Headset Connections
Les, I plumbed the O2 connections (distribution block) into the overhead
console:
http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%20The%20Home%20Stretch/slides/DSC06124.html
(click forward for 5 pics).
The position is such that for the pilot and copilot the O2 is behind the
heads and out of the way, with easy access to control. For the rear seaters
its an easy access, but does cause some plumbing to hang in front of them.
It was a trade-off, easy installation by having a single distribution point,
versus convienience and aesthetics, by placing each O2 in their
armrest/panel. I can say that in 2 years and 200+ hours, I've not needed or
used O2 for rearseaters.
WRT the headphones, I wouldn't even consider putting them in the overhead
console.
Deems
On 11/3/2010 12:58 PM, Les Kearney wrote:
Hi
I read in a recent post about plumbing heatset / O2 connectons into an
overhead consol. I still have this option but would like some real world
insight before I make the plunge. Has anyone done this yet? Where seems to
be the best location for the connecions? Is it much of a distraction for the
rear seat passengers?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les
#40643
Message 2
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| Subject: | door safety latch |
Chris
I have retrofitted Sean's (Planearound.com) safety latch (90 degree kit). I
also have the IFLYRV10 door handle.
I preferred Sean's latch over Van's as it eliminates an extra step to open
the door from the outside. It also does't look like a Rube Golberg setup.
Steve's IFYRV10.com handles do have a small button that is used to disengage
the interior door lock. It is just not located on the handle as it is on the
Van's handle.
Sean's cam is great as there is no way the door can be incorrectly locked if
the cam is engaged. Physcally it would mean the door is hugely warped -
somthing that would not escape notice. I m not even sure sure if this
physically possible. I'll check this out when I am at the hanger today.
Whatever tech you use, be sure to work you mechanism component by component
to see where "stiffness" occurs. Friction in the doors is additive so it is
best to get each section moving easily. I found that even a slight
misalignment on the door pin travel can cause a great deal of friction in
the door side delrin blocks. I also used white grease to eliminate most of
the friction in the gear / rack mechanism.
I can't speak for the "stock handles" as I never installed them, but the
IFLYRV10 mechanism doesn't seem to like a lot of internal frction. That
being said, the addition of the Planearound safety lock into the mix did not
seem to impact how easily the overall door mechanism works. I ctually think
it introduced a bit of "forgiveness" in the long rear door pin as it reduces
the pin length and makes alignment a bit easier.
All in all, I am very happy with Sean's and Steve's products.
Cheers
Les
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Hukill
Sent: November-04-10 6:55 PM
Subject: RV10-List: door safety latch
Has anyone come up with a cool CNC machined replacement for the C1018 safety
latch that Vans provides for the door service bulletin?
Can I buy a couple?
I also wonder why the latch is installed in the center of the door, instead
of the front, near the handle. Maybe the idea is that the rear seat pax can
reach it there, with an unconscious co-pilot after a wreck. But the forward
location would allow the front seater to reach it without turning or
reaching behind them during normal ops or an emergency.
Also the fact that it is forward would maybe provide more security for it's
designed function, that is keeping the door from opening and flying off the
airplane. If the door is held in the center, due to the failure of the
primary latches, it could flex quite a bit, and maybe catch the wind enough
to tear off the airplane. If the safety latch is forward, then the small
partial opening in the front should not allow the air to get behind the
door, flex it, and create havoc.
Anyone deviate from the plans? I'm getting ready to cut some holes, and
would like a discussion on this.
Doors are kicking my #!**?
Chris Hukill
Message 3
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| Subject: | O2 / Headset Connections |
Kelly
Sure make fun of my typing. Then again, perhaps this worth a look:
http://www.seatheaters.ca/products.php
Cheers
Les
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: November-03-10 2:24 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: O2 / Headset Connections
I know you Canadians have some of the most innovative ways to keep warm, but
plug-in heat sets? Rear seat pax will be distracted if you are warm and they
are cold. ;-) How much do you want hanging off the ceiling? You will already
have shoulder belts. Headset wires and O2 hoses as well? Everyone has
differing missions. I don't expect to carry backseat pax and go to O2
altitudes. My only debate is where to put front seat jacks to keep them out
of way of seat belts, stick, etc. O2 will likely be on tunnel between rear
seats so I can reach valves on cylinder.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
> Hi
>
>>>> I read in a recent post about plumbing heatset / O2 connectons into
>>>> an<<<<
> overhead consol. I still have this option but would like some real
> world insight before I make the plunge. Has anyone done this yet?
> Where seems to be the best location for the connecions? Is it much of
> a distraction for the rear seat passengers?
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: O2 / Headset Connections |
I know Les. Just figured you had drafted your message without
remembering to deburr it be for sending 8^) and yes, like I said,
Canuckistan has the best vehicle heating products around. Every engine
heater, battery heater, interior heater, etc that we used in
Alaskistan was imported from Canuckistan.
In case you wondered, I am going a bit crazy, spending 6 weeks doing
an annual on my Mooney(which required substantial sheet metal work
fabricating some new engine baffles, among other things) while waiting
even longer for my finish kit to arrive. I am certain you know the
feeling.
Kelly
On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 7:23 AM, Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> Kelly
>
> Sure make fun of my typing. Then again, perhaps this worth a look:
> http://www.seatheaters.ca/products.php
>
> Cheers
>
> Les
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: O2 / Headset Connections |
I like having the headset jacks preferably on the panel but in any
case somewhere that they can be easily seen and touched in flight.
Headset seem take more attention than most builders anticipate. Once
a headset quits working (yours or a passengers) it's pretty easy to
get distracted trying to fix it.
The new Bose/Zulu style connectors are a lot better than the old
two-pronged approach. They lock more positively and rarely
disconnect. They could be retrofitted to any headset.
My jacks are on the outboard sides of the panel (for the front seats)
and admittedly don't provide the most convenience for entry and exit.
But it's workable and easy to deal with in flight.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
> Hi
>
> I read in a recent post about plumbing heatset / O2 connectons into an
> overhead consol. I still have this option but would like some real world
> insight before I make the plunge. Has anyone done this yet? Where seems to
> be the best location for the connecions? Is it much of a distraction for the
> rear seat passengers?
>
> Inquiring minds need to know
>
> Les
> #40643
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Seat rail alignment issue |
Hi, all... I'm installing the seat rails now, and I have a fit problem. I
bolted the outboard mid rail support to the landing gear weldment (that was
fun), but the holes for the rail aren't lining up with the seat floor. The
seat floor and rails agree, but the mid rail support doesn't. Pic attached
(left side of the picture is forward). The right seat is pictured, but It's
pretty much the same on the left side. Anyone run into this issue?
Thanks...
-Rob
--
Rob Kochman
RV-10 "Finishing" Kit
Woodinville, WA (near Seattle)
http://kochman.net/N819K
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: O2 / Headset Connections |
I was going to mount my jacks on left/right lower panel (need to fill
those holes!), but since I'm going to hang headsets on my overhead
plenum when not in use, I mounted them on the tunnel covers between the
seats.
Linn
On 11/7/2010 12:27 PM, Dave Saylor wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Dave Saylor<dave.saylor.aircrafters@gmail.com>
>
> I like having the headset jacks preferably on the panel but in any
> case somewhere that they can be easily seen and touched in flight.
> Headset seem take more attention than most builders anticipate. Once
> a headset quits working (yours or a passengers) it's pretty easy to
> get distracted trying to fix it.
>
> The new Bose/Zulu style connectors are a lot better than the old
> two-pronged approach. They lock more positively and rarely
> disconnect. They could be retrofitted to any headset.
>
> My jacks are on the outboard sides of the panel (for the front seats)
> and admittedly don't provide the most convenience for entry and exit.
> But it's workable and easy to deal with in flight.
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA 95076
> 831-722-9141 Shop
> 831-750-0284 Cell
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Les Kearney<kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> I read in a recent post about plumbing heatset / O2 connectons into an
>> overhead consol. I still have this option but would like some real world
>> insight before I make the plunge. Has anyone done this yet? Where seems to
>> be the best location for the connecions? Is it much of a distraction for the
>> rear seat passengers?
>>
>> Inquiring minds need to know
>>
>> Les
>> #40643
>>
>>
>
>
Message 8
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While in the LS/VS mode and using the Cheltons for control of the TT AP
VSGV and aircraft, I get more descent rate than I requested. I am using
the target altitudes as descend to /climb to altitudes. I set
descent/climb angle on the Cheltons. The initial descent is an
uncomfortable descent profile even though I told the Cheltons a descent
of less than 1 degree. The only thing that seems to shallow the descent
is reduction in maximum air speed defined to the TT . I probably have a
parameter improperly specified. Any suggestions?
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: descent profile |
I've seen similar issues with mine.
I've tried setting degree as well as FPM, and FPM seems to work a bit
better than degree.
Like you, Dave, there is probably something I'm missing as well.
Maybe Tim the Master can get us both on track??!!
grumpy
On Nov 7, 2010, at 2:59 PM, DLM wrote:
> While in the LS/VS mode and using the Cheltons for control of the TT
> AP VSGV and aircraft, I get more descent rate than I requested. I am
> using the target altitudes as descend to /climb to altitudes. I set
> descent/climb angle on the Cheltons. The initial descent is an
> uncomfortable descent profile even though I told the Cheltons a
> descent of less than 1 degree. The only thing that seems to shallow
> the descent is reduction in maximum air speed defined to the TT . I
> probably have a parameter improperly specified. Any suggestions?
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Seat rail alignment issue |
I'm sure you've already thought of this, but I when I run into this
situation, it's usually because I've orientated the piece incorrectly. i.e.
upside down or left swapped with right.
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Kochman
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2010 12:40 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Seat rail alignment issue
Hi, all... I'm installing the seat rails now, and I have a fit problem. I
bolted the outboard mid rail support to the landing gear weldment (that was
fun), but the holes for the rail aren't lining up with the seat floor. The
seat floor and rails agree, but the mid rail support doesn't. Pic attached
(left side of the picture is forward). The right seat is pictured, but It's
pretty much the same on the left side. Anyone run into this issue?
Thanks...
-Rob
--
Rob Kochman
RV-10 "Finishing" Kit
Woodinville, WA (near Seattle)
http://kochman.net/N819K
Message 11
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| Subject: | Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows |
Back when I was building my -10 in 2006-7, there was a lot of discussion on
this newsgroup about alternatives to Weld-On #10, and one of the epoxy adh
esives highly recommended by the Glasair builder community and some RV10 bu
ilders was FE6026, because of its ability to bond materials with dissimilar
expansion coefficients, including fiberglass, lexan and acrylic. (see: ht
tp://www.matronics.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=138148&sid=753e5e6cc22788
dd55bfd58fbdfc75f5 ). That's what a I chose for my windows.
Fast forward 420 flight hours TTSN to Friday, 5 Nov 2010 when I was enroute
in N104LD from Nashville to Orlando, happy as the proverbial clam cruising
above the undercast in blue skies at 13,000 ft. Atlanta Center called and
said I either had to go up to 15K or take an amended route around their ve
ry large airspace, so I elected to climb to 15K, where the outside air temp
was -20C/-4F. Was ripping along at a TAS of 177kts and groundspeed > 200k
ts, with both cabin heaters going strong. Suddenly there was a large thump
and a lot of wind noise from behind the pilot seat, and I looked back to s
ee the left rear window had departed the plane. A few tense minutes ensued
while I determined that other than the noise and a new cool breeze in the
cockpit, all was well in terms of controllability. In fact, the window blo
w-out only took a couple of knots off the TAS. I was able to complete the
trip safely with an appreciation that an RV10 would make a fine air-to-air
camera ship if you happen to remove a rear window. :) Luckily, it missed t
he empennage on its way back and down somewhere over northwestern Georgia.
Pictures of the damage are here:
http://160.129.203.138/rv10/RV10_lostwin_frontview.jpg
http://160.129.203.138/rv10/RV10_lostwind_rearview.jpg
A close examination showed a clean separation between the epoxy glue and th
e coarse sanded inside surface of the window. Since I have flown the bird
a lot at 15-17K I think the difference this day was the exceptionally cold
air outside and very hot air coming from the rear heater vents, augmented p
erhaps by some pressure differential of a tight cabin with all vents closed
and both heaters pumping air in to the cabin.
A new window is on order. Suffice it to say, it will be installed with Wel
d-On #10.
Fly safely friends,
-Dan Masys
RV10 N104LD briefly AOG
RV12 N122LD at the paint shop
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows |
I am jumping the gun on this, but I think for those looking for a window
or windscreen replacement- ready to plug in... it is in the near future.
I saw a request in VAF about a month ago for parts which I jumped on.
Thus far if they produce a windscreen as good as their R&D it will be a
very nice replacement. Did I mention it is pretty much ready to go with
the required fine tuning to fit each plane? that's right no need to cut
off a chunk than fine tune.
I hope to get my windscreen back soon, weather wise they are delayed
getting the mold set. When I do I'll give a report if it's worth leaving
out the plexi pieces in the kits and going this route. I gain nothing by
this other than hopefully helping others in the future. My
windscreen,BTW had a 1/4 gap on the sides, which Vans said was normal
and could be filled with micro, I thought it was lousy so I am quite
happy to see what comes back. There is another builder that provided the
sides and canopy and that is expected to be done by December as well.
Wont help Dan but knowing that Weldon is a better option than the FE6026
makes me sure glad I stuck (pun intended) with the Weldon.
More to follow!
Pascal
From: Masys, Daniel R
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2010 5:17 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows
Back when I was building my -10 in 2006-7, there was a lot of discussion
on this newsgroup about alternatives to Weld-On #10, and one of the
epoxy adhesives highly recommended by the Glasair builder community and
some RV10 builders was FE6026, because of its ability to bond materials
with dissimilar expansion coefficients, including fiberglass, lexan and
acrylic. (see:
http://www.matronics.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=138148&sid=753e5e6cc2
2788dd55bfd58fbdfc75f5 ). That's what a I chose for my windows.
Fast forward 420 flight hours TTSN to Friday, 5 Nov 2010 when I was
enroute in N104LD from Nashville to Orlando, happy as the proverbial
clam cruising above the undercast in blue skies at 13,000 ft. Atlanta
Center called and said I either had to go up to 15K or take an amended
route around their very large airspace, so I elected to climb to 15K,
where the outside air temp was -20C/-4F. Was ripping along at a TAS of
177kts and groundspeed > 200kts, with both cabin heaters going strong.
Suddenly there was a large thump and a lot of wind noise from behind the
pilot seat, and I looked back to see the left rear window had departed
the plane. A few tense minutes ensued while I determined that other
than the noise and a new cool breeze in the cockpit, all was well in
terms of controllability. In fact, the window blow-out only took a
couple of knots off the TAS. I was able to complete the trip safely
with an appreciation that an RV10 would make a fine air-to-air camera
ship if you happen to remove a rear window. J Luckily, it missed the
empennage on its way back and down somewhere over northwestern Georgia.
Pictures of the damage are here:
http://160.129.203.138/rv10/RV10_lostwin_frontview.jpg
http://160.129.203.138/rv10/RV10_lostwind_rearview.jpg
A close examination showed a clean separation between the epoxy glue and
the coarse sanded inside surface of the window. Since I have flown the
bird a lot at 15-17K I think the difference this day was the
exceptionally cold air outside and very hot air coming from the rear
heater vents, augmented perhaps by some pressure differential of a tight
cabin with all vents closed and both heaters pumping air in to the
cabin.
A new window is on order. Suffice it to say, it will be installed with
Weld-On #10.
Fly safely friends,
-Dan Masys
RV10 N104LD briefly AOG
RV12 N122LD at the paint shop
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Something *not* to use to bond your RV-10 windows |
Holy Cow Dan! That's amazing! I thank you for posting that.
You can tell from the photos that while the FE6026 may stick
well to the plexi, it doesn't bond as strongly with the
canopy top. It's a first-hand report that will definitively
illustrate one particular product that won't make a good
substitute for us at least. To me, -4F isn't really all
that unusual....of course, living where I am. In the winter
we're often way colder at altitude than that. But you're
probably right...it is likely the cold that caused it to
shrink and separate.
Again, thanks for reporting! I wonder if the window
was noticed by anyone as it came down...what a shocker
that would be. ;)
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
do not archive
On 11/7/2010 7:17 PM, Masys, Daniel R wrote:
> Back when I was building my -10 in 2006-7, there was a lot of discussion
> on this newsgroup about alternatives to Weld-On #10, and one of the
> epoxy adhesives highly recommended by the Glasair builder community and
> some RV10 builders was FE6026, because of its ability to bond materials
> with dissimilar expansion coefficients, including fiberglass, lexan and
> acrylic. (see:
> http://www.matronics.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=138148&sid=753e5e6cc22788dd55bfd58fbdfc75f5
> <http://www.matronics.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=138148&sid=753e5e6cc22788dd55bfd58fbdfc75f5>
> ). Thats what a I chose for my windows.
>
> Fast forward 420 flight hours TTSN to Friday, 5 Nov 2010 when I was
> enroute in N104LD from Nashville to Orlando, happy as the proverbial
> clam cruising above the undercast in blue skies at 13,000 ft. Atlanta
> Center called and said I either had to go up to 15K or take an amended
> route around their very large airspace, so I elected to climb to 15K,
> where the outside air temp was -20C/-4F. Was ripping along at a TAS of
> 177kts and groundspeed > 200kts, with both cabin heaters going strong.
> Suddenly there was a large thump and a lot of wind noise from behind the
> pilot seat, and I looked back to see the left rear window had departed
> the plane. A few tense minutes ensued while I determined that other than
> the noise and a new cool breeze in the cockpit, all was well in terms of
> controllability. In fact, the window blow-out only took a couple of
> knots off the TAS. I was able to complete the trip safely with an
> appreciation that an RV10 would make a fine air-to-air camera ship if
> you happen to remove a rear window. J Luckily, it missed the empennage
> on its way back and down somewhere over northwestern Georgia.
>
> Pictures of the damage are here:
>
> http://160.129.203.138/rv10/RV10_lostwin_frontview.jpg
>
> http://160.129.203.138/rv10/RV10_lostwind_rearview.jpg
>
> A close examination showed a clean separation between the epoxy glue and
> the coarse sanded inside surface of the window. Since I have flown the
> bird a lot at 15-17K I think the difference this day was the
> exceptionally cold air outside and very hot air coming from the rear
> heater vents, augmented perhaps by some pressure differential of a tight
> cabin with all vents closed and both heaters pumping air in to the cabin.
>
> A new window is on order. Suffice it to say, it will be installed with
> Weld-On #10.
>
> Fly safely friends,
>
> -Dan Masys
>
> RV10 N104LD briefly AOG
>
> RV12 N122LD at the paint shop
>
> *
>
> *
Message 14
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Hi
I have been trolling through the archives to see what people think of their
center consoles. I have read that they can reduce knee room, perhaps too
much so. I am hoping those who have them installed would venture an opinion
as to whether or not they would install them again, given the chance.
Cheers
Les
Message 15
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| Subject: | Wheel Fairing Mount maintenance issue - a must-read for flying |
-10's
This isn't a completely new issue....I think maybe Bill
DeRouchey reported the same problem a couple years back.
But, I can guarantee that this is going to be an issue that
will eventually affect most every RV-10 built to date, unless
they did something to fix it already.
See my write-up here:
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/maintenance/20101107/index.html
Just like the original axle extensions, and nosewheel axle
spacers, this is going to be one of those problems that will
almost definitely affect you....but luckily the problems it
causes aren't nearly as damaging as the other two things.
Check out the write-up though, and if you're not yet
up to section 46, just remember that you're going to want to
do something different with your U-1008 spacers. Maybe if
you're lucky, one of our great aftermarket parts sources will
come up with something before you get this far.
--
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Wheel Fairing Mount maintenance issue - a must-read for |
flying -10's
Great write up, Tim. Thanks, - Lew
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