Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:37 AM - Re: Looking for a quick build right wing! (DLM)
2. 07:11 AM - Re: FW: RV 10 40409 released from the womb (Jesse Saint)
3. 07:14 AM - Re: Looking for a quick build right wing! (Jesse Saint)
4. 10:53 AM - Re: RV-10 Sensor Platform (Jim Combs)
5. 02:37 PM - Wheel Bearings and Grease (Phillip Perry)
6. 02:37 PM - Brake caliper Viton O-rings for RV-10 (Strasnuts)
7. 02:54 PM - Re: Wheel Bearings and Grease (Seano)
8. 03:08 PM - Re: Wheel Bearings and Grease (Tim Olson)
9. 03:31 PM - wheel pants spacers (DLM)
10. 04:51 PM - Re: Wheel Bearings and Grease (Kelly McMullen)
11. 06:50 PM - X Country Questions ()
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for a quick build right wing! |
I had both QB fuselage(#24) and QB wings (#8) and bolts inserted without
difficulty. Of course we froze the bolts.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 7:36 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Looking for a quick build right wing!
Understand some things have changed. Other things like standard script
by certain person(s) to questions they don't want to answer haven't
changed. Had lunch next to Ken at Copperstate. He categorically denied
there was anything wrong with the nose wheel/axle combination Vans
supplies, that 410RV ever had any nose wheel shimmy, etc. I
experienced it my self at demo flight, with follow up flight with
Randy Debauw whose plane had none of the vibration in nose wheel that
the factory plane had. You remember all the issues we had with our QB
kits. IIRC you got a reply from Scott. I got missing parts and
slightly better ailerons and flaps, but no acknowledgment that
anything was ever wrong.
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 6:04 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
> I purchased the carry through with the fuselage and separate from the
> wings
> Kelly. They never asked me to return it for match drilling, so I suspect
> they're right in this case.
>
> But you're right. It wasn't too long ago that they were match drilled so a
> set of wings only matched one carry through.
>
> Phil
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 6:01 PM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Yeah, right. Sounds like Ken. Yeah, we've never heard of a (nose wheel
>> fork) issue before, or that the supplied nose wheel isn't the correct
>> one for a 5X5 tire. The spar carrythrough/wing spar connection isn't
>> pre-punched. I suspect it may be CAD drilled, but probably finish
>> reamed after that to precise size. Maybe the location precision is
>> good enough now, but wasn't long ago if you wanted QB wings and had a
>> slow build fuse you had to send the carry through back to be match
>> fitted/drilled. I don't recall if that was on the -10 or the 2 place
>> models or both.
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 10:51 AM, David Watterson
>> <davidw@dddirectories.com> wrote:
>> > Just spoke with Vans and they say this is a pre-punched airplane and
>> > all
>> > parts match up perfectly.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > David
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Phillip
>> > Perry
>> > Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 10:53 AM
>> > To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Looking for a quick build right wing!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > If you do discover that you need a new carry through for match
>> > drilling,
>> > let
>> > me know.
>> >
>> > They're around $1,300 from Vans and I purchased a second one in the
>> > process
>> > of acquiring a friends kit. I'll be happy to make you a deal for it
>> > because
>> > I'm not going to be needing it.
>> >
>> > Phil
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > Could be an easy rebuild even with the bent spar....the
>> > Van's RV-10 Wing kit is $9250.0 Figure maybe that
>> > you would have to spend 60% of that ($5550) to buy all
>> > of the components for one new Starbord wing. It took
>> > me maybe 325 hours to build both wings, slow build.
>> > Cut that by 25% for having done one before and you'd
>> > be at 250 hrs for a pair, 125 hours for one.
>> > 125 hours could be done in a pretty short time...far
>> > less than the wait for a quickbuild wing. Also, if
>> > you factored in the parts that you could re-use, like
>> > the control rods, control rod ends, brackets,
>> > ailerons, flaps, and all the pieces that are easily
>> > removable, you'd only really have to build the wing
>> > itself and it would be a whole new wing. If the
>> > insurance company let you re-use ailerons/flaps,
>> > and some control rods and parts, you could probably
>> > rebuild the entire wing in 100 hours or so,
>> > and spend less than $5000 doing it. If you could
>> > talk them into obtaining a couple quotes for new
>> > wings from other sources, maybe they'd cut a check
>> > for >$5000 and you could end up with getting some
>> > money back for the time invested, too.
>> >
>> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
>> > do not archive
>> >
>> >
>> > On 11/11/2010 10:03 AM, David Watterson wrote:
>> >
>> > Watterson"<davidw@dddirectories.com>
>> >
>> > Thank you for your comments. The spar is bent! The insurance company
>> > recommended a full wing replacement. I am talking with a few local
>> > builders
>> > to determine the best action to take.
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> >
>> > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly
>> > McMullen
>> > Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 9:36 AM
>> > To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Looking for a quick build right wing!
>> >
>> >
>> > It would appear(from photos) the damage is confined to the leading edge
>> > outside the fuel tank. I would expect that replacement of the leading
>> > edge skin and a rib or two is likely what is needed. There may be some
>> > issues with exactly how to do the riveting given the rest of the wing
>> > is
>> > done, but likely most could be done conventionally with perhaps a few
>> > cherry max rivets on the bottom side to finish closing it off. Or you
>> > may be able to access it all by first removing the fuel tank, then
>> > reinstalling tank after repairs. It would be surprising if there is
>> > damage to the spar itself, which would be the only reason to consider a
>> > full replacement wing. These kind of things get fixed on certified
>> > planes all the time. More difficult on say a Mooney where wing skin is
>> > continuous from bottom trailing edge all the way over leading edge back
>> > to top trailing edge. In some cases on weaker spars like a Cezzna the
>> > spar may get a splice if there is spar damage. RV-10 spar is pretty
>> > beefy, so should be okay.
>> > Kelly
>> > 40866, waiting for finish kit.
>> > A&P/IA
>> >
>> >
>> > On 11/11/2010 8:01 AM, David Watterson wrote:
>> >
>> > I went bird hunting this last weekend with my RV10. Got the bird but
>> > broke my wing in the process. I have talked to Vans and they do not
>> > have a quick build right wing in stock. It will be many months before
>> > they can build one. Does anyone out there have a quick build right
>> > wing for sale? I have attached pictures to show what happens when you
>> > have a bird strike at 170 mph.
>> >
>> > David C. Watterson
>> >
>> > N2733K
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ==========
>> > om" target="_blank">www.aeroelectric.com
>> > ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
>> > et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
>> > ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> > le, List Admin.
>> > ==========
>> > arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> > ==========
>> > http://forums.matronics.com
>> > ==========
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > www.aeroelectric.com
>> >
>> > www.buildersbooks.com
>> >
>> > www.homebuilthelp.com
>> >
>> > http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> >
>> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> ="_blank">www.aeroelectric.com
>> ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
>> et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> le, List Admin.
>> ==========
>> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> ==========
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: FW: RV 10 40409 released from the womb |
That looks a LOT less painful than the last birth I witnessed. I won't
go into detail. Congratulations on the milestone!
do not archive
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
C: 352-427-0285
F: 815-377-3694
On Nov 11, 2010, at 3:11 PM, John Gonzalez wrote:
>
> Next house I build will have bigger doors or all planes I build will
be of scaled down proportions.
>
> A great line from the Incredibles, "Would you care for another
mimosa?"
> <Leaving the basement.jpg><Leaving the basement 2.jpg><Leaving the
basement 3.jpg><leaving the basement 4.jpg><Leaving the basement
5.jpg><leaving the basement 6.jpg><leaving the basement 7.jpg><leaving
the basement 8.jpg><leaving the basement 9.jpg><Leaving the basement
11.jpg><leaving the basement 12.jpg><Leaving the basement 13.jpg>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for a quick build right wing! |
I remember talking to Van's engineering years ago about the wings. I remember
the rumor going around that they were match drilled, but I was told that they
were not match drilled, but were CNC drilled to very tight tolerances and were
interchangeable.
I do agree, however, that they do act ignorant of issues that are ongoing that
they don't wish to address. Also, it's important to know that there is one Ken
there who is often considered a "problem" by builders. There is another Ken
there who is a great guy and great to deal with.
do not archive
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
C: 352-427-0285
F: 815-377-3694
On Nov 11, 2010, at 7:01 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> Yeah, right. Sounds like Ken. Yeah, we've never heard of a (nose wheel
> fork) issue before, or that the supplied nose wheel isn't the correct
> one for a 5X5 tire. The spar carrythrough/wing spar connection isn't
> pre-punched. I suspect it may be CAD drilled, but probably finish
> reamed after that to precise size. Maybe the location precision is
> good enough now, but wasn't long ago if you wanted QB wings and had a
> slow build fuse you had to send the carry through back to be match
> fitted/drilled. I don't recall if that was on the -10 or the 2 place
> models or both.
>
> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 10:51 AM, David Watterson
> <davidw@dddirectories.com> wrote:
>> Just spoke with Vans and they say this is a pre-punched airplane and all
>> parts match up perfectly.
>>
>>
>>
>> David
>>
>>
>>
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Phillip Perry
>> Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 10:53 AM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Looking for a quick build right wing!
>>
>>
>>
>> If you do discover that you need a new carry through for match drilling, let
>> me know.
>>
>> They're around $1,300 from Vans and I purchased a second one in the process
>> of acquiring a friends kit. I'll be happy to make you a deal for it because
>> I'm not going to be needing it.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Could be an easy rebuild even with the bent spar....the
>> Van's RV-10 Wing kit is $9250.0 Figure maybe that
>> you would have to spend 60% of that ($5550) to buy all
>> of the components for one new Starbord wing. It took
>> me maybe 325 hours to build both wings, slow build.
>> Cut that by 25% for having done one before and you'd
>> be at 250 hrs for a pair, 125 hours for one.
>> 125 hours could be done in a pretty short time...far
>> less than the wait for a quickbuild wing. Also, if
>> you factored in the parts that you could re-use, like
>> the control rods, control rod ends, brackets,
>> ailerons, flaps, and all the pieces that are easily
>> removable, you'd only really have to build the wing
>> itself and it would be a whole new wing. If the
>> insurance company let you re-use ailerons/flaps,
>> and some control rods and parts, you could probably
>> rebuild the entire wing in 100 hours or so,
>> and spend less than $5000 doing it. If you could
>> talk them into obtaining a couple quotes for new
>> wings from other sources, maybe they'd cut a check
>> for >$5000 and you could end up with getting some
>> money back for the time invested, too.
>>
>> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>> On 11/11/2010 10:03 AM, David Watterson wrote:
>>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "David
>> Watterson"<davidw@dddirectories.com>
>>
>> Thank you for your comments. The spar is bent! The insurance company
>> recommended a full wing replacement. I am talking with a few local builders
>> to determine the best action to take.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
>> Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 9:36 AM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Looking for a quick build right wing!
>>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen<kellym@aviating.com>
>>
>> It would appear(from photos) the damage is confined to the leading edge
>> outside the fuel tank. I would expect that replacement of the leading
>> edge skin and a rib or two is likely what is needed. There may be some
>> issues with exactly how to do the riveting given the rest of the wing is
>> done, but likely most could be done conventionally with perhaps a few
>> cherry max rivets on the bottom side to finish closing it off. Or you
>> may be able to access it all by first removing the fuel tank, then
>> reinstalling tank after repairs. It would be surprising if there is
>> damage to the spar itself, which would be the only reason to consider a
>> full replacement wing. These kind of things get fixed on certified
>> planes all the time. More difficult on say a Mooney where wing skin is
>> continuous from bottom trailing edge all the way over leading edge back
>> to top trailing edge. In some cases on weaker spars like a Cezzna the
>> spar may get a splice if there is spar damage. RV-10 spar is pretty
>> beefy, so should be okay.
>> Kelly
>> 40866, waiting for finish kit.
>> A&P/IA
>>
>>
>> On 11/11/2010 8:01 AM, David Watterson wrote:
>>
>> I went bird hunting this last weekend with my RV10. Got the bird but
>> broke my wing in the process. I have talked to Vans and they do not
>> have a quick build right wing in stock. It will be many months before
>> they can build one. Does anyone out there have a quick build right
>> wing for sale? I have attached pictures to show what happens when you
>> have a bird strike at 170 mph.
>>
>> David C. Watterson
>>
>> N2733K
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> om" target="_blank">www.aeroelectric.com
>> ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
>> et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> le, List Admin.
>> ==========
>> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> ==========
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> www.aeroelectric.com
>>
>> www.buildersbooks.com
>>
>> www.homebuilthelp.com
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Sensor Platform |
Actually air to ground photography is called out in the regs as NOT flying
for hire.
Jim C
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 7:07 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Re: the "work" part. Surprisingly, it's illegal for us to
> do any "work" in our experimentals. Even flying for the
> purpose of selling aerial photos would be illegal, since
> we're not allowed to operate commercially.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
> do not archive
>
>
> On 11/11/2010 12:01 PM, David Shelton wrote:
>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "David
>> Shelton"<SBaircraft@yahoo.com>
>>
>> Is anyone interested in using their RV-10 for aerial photography or
>> remote sensing? We=99re now customizing our cargo pods with camera
>> holes, equipment racks and other features to accommodate a variety of
>> payloads. The entire pod may be attached/removed in 30 seconds so you
>> can quickly reconfigure the airframe for work or play.
>>
>> Payloads: EO/IR, Laser Scanners, LADAR, Aux Fuel, Speakers, Radio
>> Repeaters, Etc.
>>
>> Applications: Aerial Photography, Security, Atmospheric Research,
>> Pipe Survey, Forestry Services, etc.
>>
>> Please visit the website (www.MotorcyclePilot.com) or call me to
>> discuss your needs. David Shelton, 847-651-4373
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=319013#319013
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Attachments:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_3780_signalsb_946.jpg
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Wheel Bearings and Grease |
I'm getting close to being on the gear and I noticed Vans calls for
Aeroshell #5 within the plans. So that's what I purchased from ACS and it
came in today.
Just a few minutes ago I noticed the Cleveland wheels in the finish kit have
Mobil Aviation SHC 100 already in the bearings. (Not sure if they're packed
though)
What does one need to know of or be cautious of when mixing grease types?
Phil
Message 6
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| Subject: | Brake caliper Viton O-rings for RV-10 |
Just a heads up. I found the Viton O-rings part number M83248/I-224 V-75 at McMaster
Carr under part number 1201T856. It looks to me like everything matches
up and it is mil spec.
http://www.mcmaster.com/#orders/=9ow7a8
--------
Cust. #40936
RV-10 SB Fuselage
N801VR reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=319162#319162
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Wheel Bearings and Grease |
I've always been told not to mix grease (A&P school) but here is a chart
I found.
http://www.finalube.com/reference_material/grease_compatibility_chart.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillip Perry
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2010 3:30 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Wheel Bearings and Grease
I'm getting close to being on the gear and I noticed Vans calls for
Aeroshell #5 within the plans. So that's what I purchased from ACS and
it came in today.
Just a few minutes ago I noticed the Cleveland wheels in the finish
kit have Mobil Aviation SHC 100 already in the bearings. (Not sure if
they're packed though)
What does one need to know of or be cautious of when mixing grease
types?
Phil
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Wheel Bearings and Grease |
Phil,
Normally I don't stray from Aviation grade on products. I use
aviation grade oil. Aviation grade brake fluid, and
on my prop I use Aviation grade grease.
On the wheels though, I went out and shopped at the local
stores and saw what they had, and got a semi-synthetic
grease that I use instead. I first got the specs for Aeroshell
to know what I needed to match. Temp ranges in particular,
and everything else. I found an exact or almost exact match
in the semi synthetic high performance wheel bearing grease
that I can buy in the store. The nice thing is, it's
cheaper, it's available, and I don't have to worry about
mixing or running out when I'm in the middle of an
unplanned wheel-pull. Whereas everything else that uses
grease deserves the right grease, wheel bearings are still
pretty much wheel bearings, so since we're experimental,
I step out and use a good quality grease that I can
get without the hassle. On the prop, I'd NEVER substitute.
I wouldn't mix greases...you just never know. Not saying
you should follow what i did, either, but IMHO, if there
is a place to change grease, that would be it. I use
a grease gun with the big tubes, and a cone shaped packer
that you inject them with. It's nice when/if I waste some
I don't feel so bad since I can always buy another
tube for $3 or whatever it is....and I keep extras at
home and the hangar for the cars too.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
do not archive
On 11/12/2010 4:30 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> I'm getting close to being on the gear and I noticed Vans calls for
> Aeroshell #5 within the plans. So that's what I purchased from ACS and
> it came in today.
>
> Just a few minutes ago I noticed the Cleveland wheels in the finish kit
> have Mobil Aviation SHC 100 already in the bearings. (Not sure if
> they're packed though)
>
> What does one need to know of or be cautious of when mixing grease types?
>
> Phil
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | wheel pants spacers |
Rather than make the spacers out of aluminium tubing between wheel pant
bracket and brake. They are supposed to be made 21/32" long. Three per
side. There is a 9368T44
from Mcmaster Carr when added to a .016 aluminium washer at each end
will serve as well or better. My wheel pants don't move but for those
who do this maybe a good solution.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Wheel Bearings and Grease |
Don't mix. Don't use automotive. Only aircraft wheel bearing grease is
formulated to handle the instantaneous spool up when you land. You
already have the Aeroshell. Clean out the other grease and use it. Esp
for Texas and other southern climes. I understand using something
different for cold country.
On 11/12/2010 3:30 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> I'm getting close to being on the gear and I noticed Vans calls for
> Aeroshell #5 within the plans. So that's what I purchased from ACS
> and it came in today.
>
> Just a few minutes ago I noticed the Cleveland wheels in the finish
> kit have Mobil Aviation SHC 100 already in the bearings. (Not sure if
> they're packed though)
>
> What does one need to know of or be cautious of when mixing grease types?
>
> Phil
>
>
> *
>
> *
Message 11
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| Subject: | X Country Questions |
Just completed a Maine to California trip in the 10. What a wonderful long range
machine!! But, as usual, the flight generated a few questions:
1) Regardless of height (6500 up to 12500) the plane seemed to "like" 2100rpm and
MAPs at 22-23 the best. Increasing RPM or MAPs (at lower altitudes) would
only gain a few knots increase but a greatly increased fuel flow. The 2100/22.5
settings gave me fuel flows in the low 11s down to low 9s depending on altitude.
Throughout the altitudes TAS was always between 151 and 156. I always ran
100ROP. Are these numbers what others are seeing on long flights?
2) I have the butterfly control air flow for the after market oil cooler. In order
to keep the oil temp at 180 I ALWAYS have to keep the valve at least partially
closed even on long climb outs. The temps in Maine (and on the X country
flight) are usually cool but even on day with OATs in the 70s I still can't open
the valve all the way. (I have checked my oil temp gauge--by using my wife's
high priced electronic candy thermometer probe (please don't tell)---and it
is spot on.) So two questions: a) Are other people experiencing these seemingly
low temps? and b) When one is on a long flight is it okay, or even better
for the engine, to have oil temps down in the 160s?
3) The flight confirmed the fact that I need XM weather. Had to do two unscheduled
stops because of what I saw out front but couldn't be seen by Flight Service.
I had an IPAD with Foreflight and SkyCharts which were wonderful for situational
awareness and planning but, of course, no weather. I have a two screen
GRT setup with a 430W. What are my options for XM? Should I wait until ABSD
is implemented? Will there be an XM APP for the IPAD? Or should I go ahead
and get the very expensive GRT weather receiver?
4) The flight also confirmed that I need oxygen and a system that will be a permanent
part of the equipment. Although I didn't go above 14K there was one occasion
that a level of 16500 would have let me go straight instead of a wide detour.
Does anyone have "numbers" (rpm,ff,etc) at these higher altitudes? And
is there a consensus on the type of oxygen system to install?
As always, thanks for the help/advice. Jay Rowe
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