Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:12 AM - Contributions Down By 17%... (Matt Dralle)
1. 06:06 AM - Fuel Pressure Sender Failure (Ralph E. Capen)
2. 07:41 AM - Re: Weight & Balance datum (Marcus Cooper)
3. 07:53 AM - Re: cab-o-sil (Bill Watson)
4. 09:36 AM - Re: Matco Nose Axle Torquing (Phillip Perry)
5. 09:56 AM - Re: Matco Nose Axle Torquing (Tim Olson)
6. 12:51 PM - Re: cab-o-sil (woxofswa)
7. 12:55 PM - Re: Copperstate RV10 Nest 2010 (woxofswa)
8. 02:30 PM - Re: Re: Copperstate RV10 Nest 2010 (Robin Marks)
9. 02:45 PM - Re: Fuel Pressure Sender Failure (RobHickman@aol.com)
10. 04:01 PM - Re: fuel flow transducer location (John Cumins)
11. 04:57 PM - Re: Fuel Pressure Sender Failure (Ralph E. Capen)
12. 06:26 PM - Re: drilling gear legs (Roxanne and Mike Lefever)
13. 06:45 PM - Nose gear maintenance (Dick & Vicki Sipp)
14. 07:12 PM - Transition Training LODA (dmaib@me.com)
15. 07:49 PM - paint weight? (Dawson-Townsend,Timothy)
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| Subject: | Contributions Down By 17%... |
Dear Listers,
As of today, Contributions to the Matronics List Fund Raiser are lagging behind
last year at this time by roughly 17%. I have a Fund Raiser each year simply
to cover my operating costs for the Lists. I *do not* accept any advertising
income to support the Lists and rely solely on the Contributions of members to
keep the expenses paid.
I run all of my own servers and they are housed here locally, and the Internet
connection is a commercial-grade, T1 connection with public address space. I
also maintain a full backup system that does nightly backups of all List-related
data so that in the event of a server crash or worse, all of the Lists and
the many years of List archive data could be restored onto a new server in a matter
of hours.
All of this costs a fair amount of money, not to mention a significant amount of
my personal time. I have a Fund Raiser each year to cover these costs and I
ask that members that feel they receive a benefit from my investments make a
modest Contribution each year to support the continued operation and upgrade of
these services.
If you enjoy the Lists, please make a Contribution today. I also offer some incentive
gifts for larger Contribution levels. At the Contribution Web Wite, you
can use a credit card, Paypal, or personal check to show your support for the
continuation of these services:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Or, drop a personal check in the mail to:
Matt Dralle / Matronics
581 Jeannie Way
Livermore CA 94550
USA
Thank you for your support!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Message 1
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| Subject: | Fuel Pressure Sender Failure |
Thought I would share this.
Yesterday morning, I launched from Laurel, DE (N06) destined for Campbell Field,
VA (9VG).
Pre-flight, start-up, and run-up were all normal...as were take-off and climbout
to 2500' during the southbound turn...including turning off the boost-pump.
After levelling off, throttling back, setting the prop and mixture, I got a 'check
fuel pressure' warning from my Advanced Flight Systems AF3400EM engine monitor.
Quick scan showed I was still flowing 12 GPH throught the flow meter and
the engine purred along just fine - with the pressure at zero PSI! That didn't
make sense, so I fired up the boost-pump - now the pressure is fluctuating
between 6 and 7 PSI - everything else is fine...but I've already started the
turn back for HomePlate. During the remainder of the trip back I checked various
throttle, prop, mixture, fuel-tank selection and boost-pump settings to see
what changes things. The only change inducing event is the boost-pump which
presents as fluctuating 6-7 PSI while on.
Landing and rollout are uneventful as was taxi back and shutdown.
Post-flight examination and testing showed proper fuel pressure (approx 32 PSI)
with boost pump running and purge valve selected on the ground with engine not
running. There was no fuel leakage at any of the fuel system components. Wire
wiggling sohwed the single fuel pressure sender wire was intact and tightly
captive on the stud - however the stud assembly wiggled a bit within the sender
body. Comparing this to the oil pressure sender mounted right next to it
told me something wasn't right. The pressure sender is mounted on Vans manifold
on the upper part of the firewall. The manifold is mounted with a spacer to
allow the combination oil-pressure light / Hobbs meter activator to clear the
firewall. There is a little curve in the wire to allow for movement.
I have already contacted Advanced Flight Systems for their input on obtaining a
replacement sender. My questions to the list members are: Has anyone else experienced
this failure mode? Is it possible that my spacer contributed to vibration-induced
stress?
Any input would be appreciated,
Ralph
Message 2
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance datum |
FWIW the pilot location is pretty insignificant as you are essentially
sitting on the CG. As for the baggage area I would guess the center, but
you could measure it pretty easily comparing one of the other fixed points
(like the leading edge of the wing if I remember correctly).
Marcus
Do not archive
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Dawson-Townsend,Timothy
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 1:02 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weight & Balance datum
I guess I can call Van's this week, but I had a couple questions I throw out
there on W&B moment arms:
a) The pilot moment arm is given as 114.58", but of course, the front
seats are adjustable through a range. Where did Van's place that point?
b) Likewise, the baggage area is quite large, so is the Van's-chosen
moment arm location in the center? At the (conservative) aft end of the
baggage area?
I guess I can measure those myself next time I'm at the hangar, but thought
I would write this while thinking about it.
TDT
Tim Dawson-Townsend
RV-10 N52KS (http://aprs.fi/?call=n52ks)
tdt@aurora.aero
617-500-4812 (office)
617-905-4800 (mobile)
smaller flight
Message 3
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They call out for Cabosil when bonding the inner and out door halves
together in particular. It will run all over the place inside the door
unless you thicken it up. One imagines that with the thickened stuff
you get a bit of a fillet on the inside of the joint where you otherwise
can't get to during the bonding process. Whatever happens, you can't
see it after you finish.
Enjoy the doors, it's was a learning journey for me.
Bill "planning to work on the doors for the very last time over
Christmas, i.e final paint " Watson
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Dave Saylor<dave.saylor.aircrafters@gmail.com>
>
> Myron,
>
> 410 is a non-structural filler. Cabosil is a thickening agent that
> won't significantly reduce the strength of the resin. It allows the
> resin to adhere to vertical surfaces. Get some cabo. We get ours
> from Spruce.
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA 95076
> 831-722-9141 Shop
> 831-750-0284 Cell
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Matco Nose Axle Torquing |
Follow-up on the question I posted last night:
I just got off the phone with Matco and thought I'd pass along some
information that is not included in their documentation.
1) The wheel halves should be torqued to 99 inches. This is more than a
standard AN-4 bolt (50-70 inches).
2) Hand tight is probably too tight. You should be able to get the seals to
hold position (when rotating the wheel in the correct direction) before
reaching the maximum you can tighten by hand tight.
3) Be sure to lubricate the seals and mating surfaces with grease, this will
help them hold position.
4) Once you put weight on the nose wheel, the friction of the bearing will
help hold the seals in place too.
5) Make sure there is no grease between the seal and the nut. This friction
will help hold the seal in place.
Just thought I'd pass these nuggets of knowledge along to the group. I'm
going let the air out of mine tonight and re-torque it to 99 inches. Then
try the grease tricks to see if that works.
Tim, you might want to add a few of these nuggets to your site.
Phil
On Sun, Nov 21, 2010 at 6:14 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm getting prepared to put the plane up on the gear soon and was mounting
> the nose wheel to the fork today.
>
> I have the replacement Matco Axle and wheel and the sweet-spot to preload
> the bearings isn't real obvious on their setup.
>
> I tightened the nut as tight as I could get it by hand and besides having
> quite a bit of drag, the bearing seal creeps along (slowly) with the wheel.
>
> I could tighten the nut to the next locking spot. But to do that it will
> take some Channel Locks to spin the nut and I feel like that would be way
> too much load on the bearings.
>
> Have others who have gone hand-tight and still allowed the seal to creep
> along with the wheel been happy with the (Long-Term) results? Or should I
> just crank this baby down?
>
> Phil
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Matco Nose Axle Torquing |
Thanks Phil,
I'll try to get that in there soon.
Tim
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
do not archive
On 11/22/2010 11:30 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> Follow-up on the question I posted last night:
>
> I just got off the phone with Matco and thought I'd pass along some
> information that is not included in their documentation.
>
> 1) The wheel halves should be torqued to 99 inches. This is more than a
> standard AN-4 bolt (50-70 inches).
>
> 2) Hand tight is probably too tight. You should be able to get the
> seals to hold position (when rotating the wheel in the correct
> direction) before reaching the maximum you can tighten by hand tight.
>
> 3) Be sure to lubricate the seals and mating surfaces with grease, this
> will help them hold position.
>
> 4) Once you put weight on the nose wheel, the friction of the bearing
> will help hold the seals in place too.
>
> 5) Make sure there is no grease between the seal and the nut. This
> friction will help hold the seal in place.
>
>
> Just thought I'd pass these nuggets of knowledge along to the group.
> I'm going let the air out of mine tonight and re-torque it to 99
> inches. Then try the grease tricks to see if that works.
>
> Tim, you might want to add a few of these nuggets to your site.
>
> Phil
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 21, 2010 at 6:14 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com
> <mailto:philperry9@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> I'm getting prepared to put the plane up on the gear soon and was
> mounting the nose wheel to the fork today.
>
> I have the replacement Matco Axle and wheel and the sweet-spot to
> preload the bearings isn't real obvious on their setup.
>
> I tightened the nut as tight as I could get it by hand and besides
> having quite a bit of drag, the bearing seal creeps along (slowly)
> with the wheel.
>
> I could tighten the nut to the next locking spot. But to do that
> it will take some Channel Locks to spin the nut and I feel like that
> would be way too much load on the bearings.
>
> Have others who have gone hand-tight and still allowed the seal to
> creep along with the wheel been happy with the (Long-Term) results?
> Or should I just crank this baby down?
>
> Phil
>
> *
>
> *
Message 6
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Thanks for the tips.
I'll pick up the Colloidal silica and if I have some left over it sounds like it
might help with my constipation.
Cheers,
Myron
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done, finishing
kit in progress.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=320539#320539
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Copperstate RV10 Nest 2010 |
My life is complete now after mention of the RV-10 nest in the RVator.
Thanks Ken for the kind words, you guys are always welcome.
Looking forward to the fourth and last nest next year.
We've got to get Tim, Scott and some of the other celebrities to join us.
Hopefully Don, Robin, John, Bill, and other past guests we missed this year will
make it next year.
Cheers.
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done, finishing
kit in progress.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=320540#320540
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Copperstate RV10 Nest 2010 |
RV10-List: Re: Copperstate RV10 Nest 2010
My goal is to make it in 2011.Better start loading up on the rice krispies
now.
Robin
Do Not Archive
*From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *woxofswa
*Sent:* Monday, November 22, 2010 12:53 PM
*To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
*Subject:* RV10-List: Re: Copperstate RV10 Nest 2010
My life is complete now after mention of the RV-10 nest in the RVator.
Thanks Ken for the kind words, you guys are always welcome.
Looking forward to the fourth and last nest next year.
We've got to get Tim, Scott and some of the other celebrities to join us.
Hopefully Don, Robin, John, Bill, and other past guests we missed this year
will make it next year.
Cheers.
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done,
finishing kit in progress.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=320540#320540
------------------------------
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Pressure Sender Failure |
Did you use a restrictor fitting?
Your engine must have a pressure fitting with a .040=9D or smaller
restrictor hole in it, this prevents the fuel pump pulsations from damagi
ng the
transducer and will slow the flow of fuel if a hose were to fail.
Rob Hickman
N402RH RV-10
In a message dated 11/22/2010 6:06:55 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
recapen@earthlink.net writes:
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen@earthlink.net>
Thought I would share this.
Yesterday morning, I launched from Laurel, DE (N06) destined for Campbell
Field, VA (9VG).
Pre-flight, start-up, and run-up were all normal...as were take-off and
climbout to 2500' during the southbound turn...including turning off the
boost-pump.
After levelling off, throttling back, setting the prop and mixture, I got
a 'check fuel pressure' warning from my Advanced Flight Systems AF3400EM
engine monitor. Quick scan showed I was still flowing 12 GPH throught the
flow meter and the engine purred along just fine - with the pressure at ze
ro
PSI! That didn't make sense, so I fired up the boost-pump - now the
pressure is fluctuating between 6 and 7 PSI - everything else is fine...bu
t I've
already started the turn back for HomePlate. During the remainder of the
trip back I checked various throttle, prop, mixture, fuel-tank selection a
nd
boost-pump settings to see what changes things. The only change inducing
event is the boost-pump which presents as fluctuating 6-7 PSI while on.
Landing and rollout are uneventful as was taxi back and shutdown.
Post-flight examination and testing showed proper fuel pressure (approx 32
PSI) with boost pump running and purge valve selected on the ground with
engine not running. There was no fuel leakage at any of the fuel system
components. Wire wiggling sohwed the single fuel pressure sender wire was
intact and tightly captive on the stud - however the stud assembly wiggled
a
bit within the sender body. Comparing this to the oil pressure sender
mounted right next to it told me something wasn't right. The pressure sen
der is
mounted on Vans manifold on the upper part of the firewall. The manifold
is mounted with a spacer to allow the combination oil-pressure light /
Hobbs meter activator to clear the firewall. There is a little curve in t
he
wire to allow for movement.
I have already contacted Advanced Flight Systems for their input on
obtaining a replacement sender. My questions to the list members are: Ha
s
anyone else experienced this failure mode? Is it possible that my spacer
contributed to vibration-induced stress?
Any input would be appreciated,
Ralph
Message 10
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| Subject: | fuel flow transducer location |
We have the EI Fuel flow gauge with the red cube transducer in our Saratoga.
It works great. It is place between the mechanical fuel pump and the Servo
inlet. We have no bounce readings at all very stable and once the fuel flow
gauge was programmed for the proper number of pulses it is very accurate.
It is located right behind the fuel pump on the back of the engine. We now
have over 350 hours on it and no issues at all.
On the RV-10 I am going to mount it between the servo and the Divider valve
on the lower front part of the engine. I would not recommend it goes in the
tunnel at all.
John G. Cumins
40864 Winds (flutting ribs)
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Thyssen
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 7:18 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: fuel flow transducer location
Has any of you ask about the long term or short term of the vibration from
engine on the transducer,if you mount it on the engine and not a solid piece
of the aircraft such as the firewqll or engine mount?
My understanding is it shortens the life of the transducer.
Just my thoughts.
Patrick Thyssen
--- On Sat, 11/20/10, Robin Marks <Robin@PaintTheWeb.com> wrote:
From: Robin Marks <Robin@PaintTheWeb.com>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: fuel flow transducer location
I mounted mine (not the red cube) in the tunnel with a nice long smooth lead
in and out of the transducer and my readings were basically useless. Boost
pump on added 3-5 gph with some bouncing. Boost pump off had 1-3 gph
bouncing including low reading bouncing into the yellow that gave me low
fuel flow warnings both in climb out and randomly in cruse flight. BTW this
also threw off my fuel consumption/remaining fuel calculations. Not good!
Furthermore the bouncing makes it impossible to balance ones fuel injectors
as you cannot get accurate FF readings.
Finally fed up with the issue we relocated the transducer between the fuel
servo and flow divider. Since then my readings have been rock solid and all
low fuel pressure warnings + bouncing is gone. If building I would not waste
my time placing the transducer in the tunnel again.
Sorry no photos.
Robin
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
davidsoutpost@comcast.net
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 5:26 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel flow transducer location
I just finished mounting mine yesterday and used the EI red cube FT-60. I
mounted it in the tunnel and have 6" straight line before and after the
cube. I know it is between the electrical Andair pump and the mechanical
pump but it is the recommendation location by Vans and I want less fuel
fittings and lines in the engine compartment. I will move it if needed
after the plane is flying. I will make up a new bypass fuel line while the
tunnel is easily accessible just in case it needs to be moved.
David Clifford
RV-10 Builder
65% Done-95% To Go
N849RV (reserved)
----- Original Message -----
From: "rvdave" <davidbf@centurytel.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 2:19:45 AM
Subject: RV10-List: fuel flow transducer location
Plans show transducer to be in the tunnel, I've heard there are less
fluctuations if it is placed after the mechanical pump and before
distribution for fuel injection, is this correct?
--------
Dave Ford
RV6 flying
RV10 building
Cadillac, MI
Read this topic online here:
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(And Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!) e Contribution link below to
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ookstore www.buildersbooks.com
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Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Pressure Sender Failure |
Good thought - I installed the one that I got from Vans during engine
installation - it is a 45 degree fitting with what looks like an allen
plug threaded in there. I'll verify that it is intact though.
----- Original Message -----
From: RobHickman@aol.com
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 5:41 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Pressure Sender Failure
Did you use a restrictor fitting?
Your engine must have a pressure fitting with a .040=9D or
smaller restrictor hole in it, this prevents the fuel pump pulsations
from damaging the transducer and will slow the flow of fuel if a hose
were to fail.
Rob Hickman
N402RH RV-10
In a message dated 11/22/2010 6:06:55 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
recapen@earthlink.net writes:
<recapen@earthlink.net>
Thought I would share this.
Yesterday morning, I launched from Laurel, DE (N06) destined for
Campbell Field, VA (9VG).
Pre-flight, start-up, and run-up were all normal...as were take-off
and climbout to 2500' during the southbound turn...including turning off
the boost-pump.
After levelling off, throttling back, setting the prop and mixture,
I got a 'check fuel pressure' warning from my Advanced Flight Systems
AF3400EM engine monitor. Quick scan showed I was still flowing 12 GPH
throught the flow meter and the engine purred along just fine - with the
pressure at zero PSI! That didn't make sense, so I fired up the
boost-pump - now the pressure is fluctuating between 6 and 7 PSI -
everything else is fine...but I've already started the turn back for
HomePlate. During the remainder of the trip back I checked various
throttle, prop, mixture, fuel-tank selection and boost-pump settings to
see what changes things. The only change inducing event is the
boost-pump which presents as fluctuating 6-7 PSI while on.
Landing and rollout are uneventful as was taxi back and shutdown.
Post-flight examination and testing showed proper fuel pressure
(approx 32 PSI) with boost pump running and purge valve selected on the
ground with engine not running. There was no fuel leakage at any of the
fuel system components. Wire wiggling sohwed the single fuel pressure
sender wire was intact and tightly captive on the stud - however the
stud assembly wiggled a bit within the sender body. Comparing this to
the oil pressure sender mounted right next to it told me something
wasn't right. The pressure sender is mounted on Vans manifold on the
upper part of the firewall. The manifold is mounted with a spacer to
allow the combination oil-pressure light / Hobbs meter activator to
clear the firewall. There is a little curve in the wire to allow for
movement.
I have already contacted Advanced Flight Systems for their input on
obtaining a replacement sender. My questions to the list members are:
Has anyone else experienced this failure mode? Is it possible that my
spacer contributed to vibration-induced stress?
Any input would be
=======================
Message 12
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| Subject: | drilling gear legs |
Thanks
Subject: Re: RV10-List: drilling gear legs
From: philperry9@gmail.com
I've started down this path too..
It looks like the top of the LG mount is already 7.9mm and so is the hole i
n the gear leg. The only hole that needs to be enlarged is the very bottom
hole of the LG mount.
One thing I found is that the powder coating closed up the hole in the LG m
ount. So I've passed a 7.9mm reamer through the hole to get it to the corr
ect size. Then I also did the same thing to the LG leg=2C just to ensure i
t will allow the reamer to pass through it.
All I have to do is slide the gear leg into the socket and the reamer will
drop through the LG mount (top hole)=2C through the LG leg=2C and should bo
ttom-out on the bottom hole. With a little luck the hole is already close
enough to size that the reamer will punch on through it. Otherwise=2C I'm
going to have to drill it to a closer undersized hole and then punch it thr
ough with a reamer.
I agree=2C it looks pretty hard to screw up. I don't know if you could.
Phil
Message 13
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| Subject: | Nose gear maintenance |
I had the nose gear jacked off the ground to change a tire and thought
to check for any looseness or =9Cplay.=9D I discovered
about .75=9D of vertical movement. I recalled the instructions
for installing the 1/8th thick spacers under the retaining collar on the
top of the gear leg. They said that an additional spacer may be
required after the rubber shock absorbers wore in. The job of adding
another spacer (lucky to find the extras) turned out to much easier than
I would have thought; about 15 minutes and only one minor knuckle skin
nick. The single additional spacer took up all of the vertical slack
without making the collar difficult to re-install. Remember the collar
can only be removed with the gear on the ground supporting the weight of
the airplane.
Dick Sipp
N110DV 300 hours
Message 14
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| Subject: | Transition Training LODA |
The Orlando FSDO issued my LODA to give transition training in my RV-10, effective
today.
I re-submitted the packet that I had previously submitted last January, as soon
as the new guidelines were issued, in September. The process took about two months
and the inspector I worked with at the FSDO was great to work with. I got
things worked out with my Insurance, so all systems are go.
So, if anybody wants to come to sunny central Florida for transition training this
winter, I am now available. I will also consider bringing my airplane to your
location.
--------
David Maib
RV-10 #40559
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=320561#320561
Message 15
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Anyone got a feel for how much weight the average paint job adds to an RV-1
0?
TDT
Tim Dawson-Townsend
RV-10 N52KS (http://aprs.fi/?call=n52ks)
tdt@aurora.aero<mailto:tdt@aurora.aero>
617-500-4812 (office)
617-905-4800 (mobile)
smaller flight
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