---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 02/27/11: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:49 AM - penetrating oil (David Leikam) 2. 07:50 AM - seatbelt bolt bushings (John Gonzalez) 3. 09:05 AM - Re: seatbelt bolt bushings (AirMike) 4. 10:47 AM - Re: seatbelt bolt bushings (David Leikam) 5. 12:49 PM - Re: penetrating oil (Kelly McMullen) 6. 02:07 PM - fuel leak (Wayne Williams) 7. 02:58 PM - Re: penetrating oil (davidsoutpost@comcast.net) 8. 04:39 PM - Penetrating oil (Kelly McMullen) 9. 04:43 PM - Re: fuel leak (James McGrew) 10. 04:43 PM - Re: fuel leak (Kelly McMullen) 11. 04:48 PM - Re: fuel leak (Bruce Johnson) 12. 05:50 PM - Re: fuel leak (DLM) 13. 06:05 PM - Re: fuel leak (Kelly McMullen) 14. 06:16 PM - Re: fuel leak (Kelly McMullen) 15. 06:31 PM - HD Video Action Camera with Remote! (Robin Marks) 16. 06:44 PM - Need wheel pant part numbers!!! Need new nosewheel pant (Eric_Kallio) 17. 07:25 PM - Re: fuel leak (Rob Kochman) 18. 07:38 PM - Re: Need wheel pant part numbers!!! Need new nosewheel pant (Tim Olson) 19. 07:59 PM - Re: seatbelt bolt bushings (John Gonzalez) 20. 08:05 PM - Re: Penetrating oil (David Leikam) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:49:30 AM PST US From: David Leikam Subject: RV10-List: penetrating oil This is a bit off subject, but a while ago there was some suggestions for using MEK and something else I think for a good rusty bolt penetrating liquid. Can anyone forward me the thread or suggest what the other ingredient was? Thanks! PS My inspection is set for this Wednesday :-) David Leikam RV10 N89DA ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:50:34 AM PST US From: John Gonzalez Subject: RV10-List: seatbelt bolt bushings Does anyone know where in the kit the aluminum tubing is for making the bus hing which go through the selt belts and over the bolts which fasten the se atbelts to the airframe?? Thanks ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:05:33 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: seatbelt bolt bushings From: "AirMike" I am not sure of the size, but you surely have a lot of scrap aluminum tubing (fuel, brake, pitot, etc.) that you will use for this application. Just cut a few pieces from the tubing with a band saw. Cut carefully, as they are easy to lose when they are so small. Measure with your harbor freight micrometer. -------- See you OSH '11 Q/B - flying 1 yr+ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332203#332203 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:47:39 AM PST US From: David Leikam Subject: Re: RV10-List: seatbelt bolt bushings I went to the hardware store and bought some SS tubing with the correct ID and OD and cut it to fit. The plans say to drill out the aluminum tubing supplied but that was a bit cumbersome. I did not find anything in the kit which had the correct ID for the bushings you speak of. David Leikam RV10 N89DA On Feb 27, 2011, at 9:44 AM, John Gonzalez wrote: > Does anyone know where in the kit the aluminum tubing is for making the bushing which go through the selt belts and over the bolts which fasten the seatbelts to the airframe?? > > Thanks > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:49:56 PM PST US From: Kelly McMullen Subject: Re: RV10-List: penetrating oil IIRC it was either brake fluid or transmission fluid. I'll search my archives to see what I can find. On 2/27/2011 7:45 AM, David Leikam wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: David Leikam > > This is a bit off subject, but a while ago there was some suggestions for using MEK and something else I think for a good rusty bolt penetrating liquid. > Can anyone forward me the thread or suggest what the other ingredient was? > Thanks! > > PS > > My inspection is set for this Wednesday :-) > > David Leikam > RV10 > N89DA > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:07:51 PM PST US From: "Wayne Williams" Subject: RV10-List: fuel leak So, doing my first condition inspection and found a small fuel leak (big blue stain) at the inboard leading edge of my fuel tank. The sealant feels like putty. I had a quickbuild so the tanks were done so I have no proseal experience. How in the world do you fix something like this? Thanks. Wayne ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:58:28 PM PST US From: davidsoutpost@comcast.net Subject: Re: RV10-List: penetrating oil Get yourself a can of Kroil. This stuff is amazing. http://www.kanolabs.com/ David Clifford RV-10 Builder Howell, MI ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Leikam" Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 9:45:39 AM Subject: RV10-List: penetrating oil This is a bit off subject, but a while ago there was some suggestions for using MEK and something else I think for a good rusty bolt penetrating liquid. Can anyone forward me the thread or suggest what the other ingredient was? Thanks! PS My inspection is set for this Wednesday :-) David Leikam RV10 N89DA ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:39:27 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Penetrating oil From: Kelly McMullen This is the information you were looking for. ========= Machinist's Workshop magazine tested penetrants for break out torque on rusted nuts. They arranged a subjective test of all the popular penetrants with the control being the torque required to remove the nut from a "scientifically rusted" environment. The results are as follows; Penetrating oil..... Average load None ............ ......516 pounds WD-40 ................238 pounds PB Blaster ............214 pounds Liquid Wrench ..... 127 pounds Kano Kroil ............106 pounds ATF-Acetone mix....53 pounds The ATF-Acetone mix was a "home brew" mix of 50-50 automatic transmission fluid and acetone. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 04:43:04 PM PST US From: "James McGrew" Subject: RE: RV10-List: fuel leak Wayne, I had a similar leaking rivet during my first annual on my quick build wings. I used green loctite 290 to seal it up. No problems now almost 4 years later. My rivet was on the bottom, so I drained the fuel. Someone told me to put a little vacuum on the tank to help the Loctite get into the rivet, that sounded like a lot of work to do. I thought it was easier to put a little pressure on the outside, so I put a piece of rubber hose into a balloon and held that over the rivet to force some of the Loctite under the rivet. So I laid on my back under the wing for an hour or so and held it there. I also used a heat gun to help the Loctite dry. Then I probably let it sit for a couple weeks before filling the tank back up. -Jim N312JE From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Williams Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 3:05 PM Subject: RV10-List: fuel leak So, doing my first condition inspection and found a small fuel leak (big blue stain) at the inboard leading edge of my fuel tank. The sealant feels like putty. I had a quickbuild so the tanks were done so I have no proseal experience. How in the world do you fix something like this? Thanks. Wayne ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:43:05 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak From: Kelly McMullen If the sealant is soft, it is bad. The bad sealant has to be removed, then replaced. Hard plastic or plexiglass scrapers to avoid damaging your aluminum. There is a solvent. It is slow acting. You probably are going to have to remove the tank to work on it and find the actual leak. I can get you the source of the solvent. For hand work the gel form is best. On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 3:04 PM, Wayne Williams wrote: > So, doing my first condition inspection and found a small fuel leak (big > blue stain) at the inboard leading edge of my fuel tank. The sealant feels > like putty. I had a quickbuild so the tanks were done so I have no proseal > experience. How in the world do you fix something like this? > > Thanks. > > > Wayne > > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 04:48:07 PM PST US From: Bruce Johnson Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak Join the club, The experts at Vans said the proseal gets gummy due to the =0Aexposure to air. So in their words, keep your tanks full. I scraped the proseal =0Aoff and applied some two part epoxy to my leaking- rivets, but they were-in-the =0Athe area between the wing and cabin that is hidden from sight. Deem's said the =0Acourse of action for visible leaks is-put ting the tanks under vacuum and letting =0Asome green loc-tite get sucked i n. I did that and then added the epoxy, so not =0Asure which worked but my blue stain had gone away. Mine were quick build too and =0Aboth leaked at t he the same location. Good luck. And for the vacuum-I used my =0Ashop vac and it seemed to work well. Good Luck=0A=0ABruce 151BJ 39 hrs--=0A=0A =0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Wayne Williams =0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Sun, February 27, 2011 3: 04:49 PM=0ASubject: RV10-List: fuel leak=0A=0A=0ASo, doing my first conditi on inspection and found a small fuel leak (big blue =0Astain) at the inboar d leading edge of my fuel tank. The sealant feels like =0Aputty. I had a qu ickbuild so the tanks were done so I have no proseal =0Aexperience. How in the world do you fix something like this?=0AThanks.=0A-=0AWayne=0A-=0A =================== =0A=0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 05:50:50 PM PST US From: "DLM" Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak Not a solution but questions. Do you allow passengers to stand on any portion of the tank during loading? Did you remove the QB tanks to install the stall warning? ----- Original Message ----- From: Bruce Johnson To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 5:44 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak Join the club, The experts at Vans said the proseal gets gummy due to the exposure to air. So in their words, keep your tanks full. I scraped the proseal off and applied some two part epoxy to my leaking rivets, but they were in the the area between the wing and cabin that is hidden from sight. Deem's said the course of action for visible leaks is putting the tanks under vacuum and letting some green loc-tite get sucked in. I did that and then added the epoxy, so not sure which worked but my blue stain had gone away. Mine were quick build too and both leaked at the the same location. Good luck. And for the vacuum I used my shop vac and it seemed to work well. Good Luck Bruce 151BJ 39 hrs ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: Wayne Williams To: rv10-list@matronics.com Sent: Sun, February 27, 2011 3:04:49 PM Subject: RV10-List: fuel leak So, doing my first condition inspection and found a small fuel leak (big blue stain) at the inboard leading edge of my fuel tank. The sealant feels like putty. I had a quickbuild so the tanks were done so I have no proseal experience. How in the world do you fix something like this? Thanks. Wayne ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:05:27 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak From: Kelly McMullen If that is what the so-called experts told you, they simply don't know what they are talking about, or are giving you a pacifying excuse with no basis in fact. Pro-seal only gets gummy if it wasn't mixed and cured correctly to start with, or was exposed long term to auto-gas. There are many Mooneys no only with wet wing tanks, but with wet wing aux tanks that are left empty most of the time. Current versions of Pro-seal, or Flamemaster Chemseal do not need to be kept wet with fuel. If that were true, your tanks would leak like a sieve the first time you put fuel in them, since it likely will have been a year or two from the sealing to the filling for first flight. On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 5:44 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: > > Join the club, The experts at Vans said the proseal gets gummy due to the exposure to air. So in their words, keep your tanks full. I scraped the proseal off and applied some two part epoxy to my leaking rivets, but they wereinthe the area between the wing and cabin that is hidden from sight. Deem's said the course of action for visible leaks isputting the tanks under vacuum and letting some green loc-tite get sucked in. I did that and then added the epoxy, so not sure which worked but my blue stain had gone away. Mine were quick build too and both leaked at the the same location. Good luck. And for the vacuumI used my shop vac and it seemed to work well. Good Luck > > Bruce 151BJ 39 hrs ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:16:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak From: Kelly McMullen http://www.rpm-technology.com/PG300-AG_Gel.htm Used a fair amount stripping and resealing a Mooney tank. The smallest container should be enough for your job. They do sell direct. On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 5:40 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > If the sealant is soft, it is bad. The bad sealant has to be removed, then > replaced. Hard plastic or Plexiglas scrapers to avoid damaging your > aluminum. There is a solvent. It is slow acting. You probably are going to > have to remove the tank to work on it and find the actual leak. I can get > you the source of the solvent. For hand work the gel form is best. > > On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 3:04 PM, Wayne Williams wrote: >> >> So, doing my first condition inspection and found a small fuel leak (big >> blue stain) at the inboard leading edge of my fuel tank. The sealant feels >> like putty. I had a quickbuild so the tanks were done so I have no proseal >> experience. How in the world do you fix something like this? >> >> Thanks. >> >> >> >> Wayne >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:31:18 PM PST US From: Robin Marks Subject: RV10-List: HD Video Action Camera with Remote! As a follow up to our discussion of video cameras I came across this unit that seems to have unique features including: Rotating Lens for level framing Remote Control to turn on/off from a distance (no idea what range) Screen to review footage Audio In jack (proprietary but then connects to standard plug [I think]) Note the reviews also say it=92s larger than you expect from the photos. http://driftinnovation.com/ They even have an Aviation page: http://driftinnovation.com/category/airshow/ Some good aviation reviews. The only down side I read is the built in audio is lacking. I suspect wiring the 3.5 mm Mic-In would be the best way to capture intercom audio. Yes, I would recommend this to a friend I used the camera's mounting equipment and tie-wraps to attach my Drift HD 170 camera to the left wing strut of my Cessna 172 airplane. I have now taken several HD videos of flights in northern Michigan during very cold temps (15-20 degrees F). The videos are spectacular on my HD television. They look as good as the promotional videos on the manufacturer's website. The camera endures winds of more than 100 knots during the flights without any difficulty. Minor vibration on the first flight was cured with duct tap e on the base that made the mounting more secure and eliminated play. The camera's unique adjustment feature that allows me to mount the camera at an angle on the strut and twist the lens to level the picture is a key feature .. It does not move from the position that I've set it in. The audio even work s well at altitude with the engine roaring. I am thinking of buying a second camera to mount at another position on the plane. I would recommend it highly to others. *Bottom Line:* Yes, I would recommend this to a friend Just shot a promo using this camera mounted in a helicopter and airplane. I t was subjected to high frequency vibrations in the helicopter and performed superbly when mounted properly. I was very pleased with the quality of the video and the 170 degrees perfectly covered the inside of the cockpit. The rotating lens is ingenious! The only drawback of this camera is the audio proprietary plug. You can only use their wired mic for this camera. I attempted to acquire the aircraft audio by placing the Drift mic inside aircraft headsets... which was iffy. If Drift had offered a mini jack adapter I would have given this product 5 stars. Oh, and their "manual" is a folded pamphlet that excludes important info like how to charge the battery (plug the Drift into your computer just like an iPod). Otherwise, enjoy, it's a fun camera! ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:44:46 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Need wheel pant part numbers!!! Need new nosewheel pant From: "Eric_Kallio" I left my plans at the hanger and I need to order both halves of a front wheel fairing for my -10. Search of the webstore pointed me to the RV-12 gear. Here is why I need a new fairing. While on short final for the first of what was to be a couple of touch and goes during my fly-off I heard a bit of a buzzing out front. Nothing serious I thought since there was a bit of a cross wind I figured it was the nose wheel coming straight as I got below the trees and out of the crosswind. I touched down on the mains and started the flaps up, added power and picked right back up. At about 50 feet I heard a pop. That is when a friend in another aircraft waiting to take off called me on the radio asking if I planned to come back around and pick up the pieces of my nose wheel pant from the runway. According to him and another witness on the ground, when I first approached it looked like the left side of the wheel pant was fluttering as if it had pulled through the screws.When I hit the power for the go-around and picked up speed it "exploded"(their words) into about 8 major pieces. Post-mortem of the wheel pant supports the ground reports of potential pulled through mounting screws. The left screw holes are enlarged while the right ones held and I pulled some smaller pieces from under these screws. I will be redoing the wheel pant of course. Except this time I will be adding more glass to the sides and spreading the load with tinnerman washers at a minimum. Eric Kallio N518RV 16 hours of phase 1 remaining. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332252#332252 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:25:35 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: fuel leak From: Rob Kochman Hey, at least they've heard of the problem this time. On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 6:02 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > > If that is what the so-called experts told you, they simply don't know > what they are talking about, or are giving you a pacifying excuse with > no basis in fact. Pro-seal only gets gummy if it wasn't mixed and > cured correctly to start with, or was exposed long term to auto-gas. > There are many Mooneys no only with wet wing tanks, but with wet wing > aux tanks that are left empty most of the time. Current versions of > Pro-seal, or Flamemaster Chemseal do not need to be kept wet with > fuel. If that were true, your tanks would leak like a sieve the first > time you put fuel in them, since it likely will have been a year or > two from the sealing to the filling for first flight. > > On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 5:44 PM, Bruce Johnson > wrote: > > > > Join the club, The experts at Vans said the proseal gets gummy due to the > exposure to air. So in their words, keep your tanks full. I scraped the > proseal off and applied some two part epoxy to my leaking rivets, but they > were in the the area between the wing and cabin that is hidden from sight. > Deem's said the course of action for visible leaks is putting the tanks > under vacuum and letting some green loc-tite get sucked in. I did that and > then added the epoxy, so not sure which worked but my blue stain had gone > away. Mine were quick build too and both leaked at the the same location. > Good luck. And for the vacuum I used my shop vac and it seemed to work well. > Good Luck > > > > Bruce 151BJ 39 hrs > > -- Rob Kochman RV-10 "Finishing" Kit Woodinville, WA (near Seattle) http://kochman.net/N819K ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:38:51 PM PST US From: Tim Olson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Need wheel pant part numbers!!! Need new nosewheel pant U-1013A Front U-1013B Rear Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD do not archive On 2/27/2011 8:42 PM, Eric_Kallio wrote: > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Eric_Kallio" > > I left my plans at the hanger and I need to order both halves of a front wheel fairing for my -10. Search of the webstore pointed me to the RV-12 gear. Here is why I need a new fairing. > > While on short final for the first of what was to be a couple of touch and goes during my fly-off I heard a bit of a buzzing out front. Nothing serious I thought since there was a bit of a cross wind I figured it was the nose wheel coming straight as I got below the trees and out of the crosswind. I touched down on the mains and started the flaps up, added power and picked right back up. At about 50 feet I heard a pop. That is when a friend in another aircraft waiting to take off called me on the radio asking if I planned to come back around and pick up the pieces of my nose wheel pant from the runway. According to him and another witness on the ground, when I first approached it looked like the left side of the wheel pant was fluttering as if it had pulled through the screws.When I hit the power for the go-around and picked up speed it "exploded"(their words) into about 8 major pieces. Post-mortem of the wheel pant supports the ground reports of potential pulled through m ou! > nting screws. The left screw holes are enlarged while the right ones held and I pulled some smaller pieces from under these screws. I will be redoing the wheel pant of course. Except this time I will be adding more glass to the sides and spreading the load with tinnerman washers at a minimum. > > Eric Kallio > N518RV 16 hours of phase 1 remaining. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332252#332252 > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:25 PM PST US From: John Gonzalez Subject: RE: RV10-List: seatbelt bolt bushings That's exactly what I found too=2C either too big ID or too large or too sm all OD From: daveleikam@wi.rr.com Subject: Re: RV10-List: seatbelt bolt bushings I went to the hardware store and bought some SS tubing with the correct ID and OD and cut it to fit. The plans say to drill out the aluminum tubing s upplied but that was a bit cumbersome.I did not find anything in the kit wh ich had the correct ID for the bushings you speak of. David LeikamRV10 N89DA On Feb 27=2C 2011=2C at 9:44 AM=2C John Gonzalez wrote:Does anyone know whe re in the kit the aluminum tubing is for making the bushing which go throug h the selt belts and over the bolts which fasten the seatbelts to the airfr ame?? Thanks href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics. com/Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/con tribution ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:05:12 PM PST US From: David Leikam Subject: Re: RV10-List: Penetrating oil That's what I was looking for thanks. David Leikam RV10 N89DA On Feb 27, 2011, at 6:36 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > This is the information you were looking for. > > ========= > Machinist's Workshop magazine tested penetrants for break out torque on rusted nuts. They arranged a subjective test of all the popular penetrants with the control being the torque required to remove the nut from a "scientifically rusted" environment. The results are as follows; > > Penetrating oil..... Average load > None ............ ......516 pounds > WD-40 ................238 pounds > PB Blaster ............214 pounds > Liquid Wrench ..... 127 pounds > Kano Kroil ............106 pounds > ATF-Acetone mix....53 pounds > > The ATF-Acetone mix was a "home brew" mix of 50-50 automatic transmission fluid and acetone. > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.