Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:24 AM - Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (jkreidler)
2. 05:40 AM - Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Tim Olson)
3. 05:40 AM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Tim Olson)
4. 06:07 AM - Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Alan Mekler)
5. 06:51 AM - Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Tim Olson)
6. 07:27 AM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Kelly McMullen)
7. 07:41 AM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Phillip Perry)
8. 08:51 AM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Tim Olson)
9. 09:24 AM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Robin Marks)
10. 10:49 AM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Bobby J. Hughes)
11. 01:46 PM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Kelly McMullen)
12. 03:13 PM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Tim Olson)
13. 03:19 PM - Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Bob Turner)
14. 04:05 PM - Re: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question (Tim Olson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
The internal GPS works fine for on road or in flight use. You do not have to have
a data subscription to use the GPS you only have to ignore the pop up that
keeps asking you if you want to add a data subscription. One little detail,
if you turn on airplane mode the GPS also gets turned off. You want to turn off
wifi and cellular data separately, then the GPS still works.
This is not to say that the built in GPS is great, I am sure the external receivers
are better. But we have been flying with only the internal GPS for almost
a year now and find the accuracy and lock to be just fine.
--------
Jason Kreidler
4 Partner Build - Sheboygan Falls, WI
Tony Kolar, Kyle Hokel, Wayne Elser, Jason Kreidler
N44YH - Flying - #40617
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336503#336503
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
It will work fine. For me it was pretty good. The chipset in my ipad 2 verizon
version is different I believe and that one worked excellent for me on a trip
I just got back on. My AT&T ipad 1 wasn't quite as good and quick to acquire
but it worked ok. The bad elf stuff would make it even quicker, if you want
the extra bump sticking out to bang around. I don't. The jailbreak isn't out
for ipad 2 yet so the jailbreak and bluetooth method i used on my old ipad
isn't an option on that one yet. But my verizon ipad 2 worked fine with the internal
GPS on my trip to the Baja of over 4000miles and it didn't let mr down
once.....so I don't think I'll even do anything different there.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 1:25 AM, "AirMike" <Mikeabel@Pacbell.net> wrote:
>
> I have a I-Pad2 3G (ATT) unit and I do not quite understand the GPS functions
of the machine. I have not yet subscribed to ATT 3G service, but intend to do
so in a a month or so.
>
> Do I need to buy the Bad Elf unit to exploit the GPS capabilities on land and
in the air or will it do fine in the US without Bad elf.
>
> --------
> See you OSH '11
> Q/B - flying 1 yr+
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336500#336500
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than either my AT&T or verizon
ipad. The worst thing about either is just that you can't put it in full airplane
mode. Other than that, it works well. I wish the gps chip was separate
and you could turn it on separately. But what Jason said works good.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 6:21 AM, "jkreidler" <jason.kreidler@regalbeloit.com> wrote:
>
> The internal GPS works fine for on road or in flight use. You do not have to
have a data subscription to use the GPS you only have to ignore the pop up that
keeps asking you if you want to add a data subscription. One little detail,
if you turn on airplane mode the GPS also gets turned off. You want to turn
off wifi and cellular data separately, then the GPS still works.
>
> This is not to say that the built in GPS is great, I am sure the external receivers
are better. But we have been flying with only the internal GPS for almost
a year now and find the accuracy and lock to be just fine.
>
> --------
> Jason Kreidler
> 4 Partner Build - Sheboygan Falls, WI
> Tony Kolar, Kyle Hokel, Wayne Elser, Jason Kreidler
> N44YH - Flying - #40617
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336503#336503
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Subject: | I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
Tim,
I flew with my Ipad2 for the first time yesterday on a kneeboard. It was a
bright sunny day. I had trouble reading it. Any suggestions?
Alan
Ps. Would like to hear more about your Baha trip
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question
It will work fine. For me it was pretty good. The chipset in my ipad 2
verizon version is different I believe and that one worked excellent for me
on a trip I just got back on. My AT&T ipad 1 wasn't quite as good and quick
to acquire but it worked ok. The bad elf stuff would make it even quicker,
if you want the extra bump sticking out to bang around. I don't. The
jailbreak isn't out for ipad 2 yet so the jailbreak and bluetooth method i
used on my old ipad isn't an option on that one yet. But my verizon ipad 2
worked fine with the internal GPS on my trip to the Baja of over 4000miles
and it didn't let mr down once.....so I don't think I'll even do anything
different there.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 1:25 AM, "AirMike" <Mikeabel@Pacbell.net> wrote:
>
> I have a I-Pad2 3G (ATT) unit and I do not quite understand the GPS
functions of the machine. I have not yet subscribed to ATT 3G service, but
intend to do so in a a month or so.
>
> Do I need to buy the Bad Elf unit to exploit the GPS capabilities on land
and in the air or will it do fine in the US without Bad elf.
>
> --------
> See you OSH '11
> Q/B - flying 1 yr+
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336500#336500
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
I use the brando anti-glare screen protector. They come from china but are the
only one I really found that I like. Also, turn the brightness all the way up.
With those 2 things it was working well for me over the southwest on bright
sunny days. It's better than my motion le1600 tablet with viewanywhere.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 8:04 AM, "Alan Mekler" <amekler@metrocast.net> wrote:
>
> Tim,
> I flew with my Ipad2 for the first time yesterday on a kneeboard. It was a
> bright sunny day. I had trouble reading it. Any suggestions?
> Alan
> Ps. Would like to hear more about your Baha trip
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
> Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 8:34 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question
>
>
> It will work fine. For me it was pretty good. The chipset in my ipad 2
> verizon version is different I believe and that one worked excellent for me
> on a trip I just got back on. My AT&T ipad 1 wasn't quite as good and quick
> to acquire but it worked ok. The bad elf stuff would make it even quicker,
> if you want the extra bump sticking out to bang around. I don't. The
> jailbreak isn't out for ipad 2 yet so the jailbreak and bluetooth method i
> used on my old ipad isn't an option on that one yet. But my verizon ipad 2
> worked fine with the internal GPS on my trip to the Baja of over 4000miles
> and it didn't let mr down once.....so I don't think I'll even do anything
> different there.
> Tim
>
>
>
> On Apr 10, 2011, at 1:25 AM, "AirMike" <Mikeabel@Pacbell.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> I have a I-Pad2 3G (ATT) unit and I do not quite understand the GPS
> functions of the machine. I have not yet subscribed to ATT 3G service, but
> intend to do so in a a month or so.
>>
>> Do I need to buy the Bad Elf unit to exploit the GPS capabilities on land
> and in the air or will it do fine in the US without Bad elf.
>>
>> --------
>> See you OSH '11
>> Q/B - flying 1 yr+
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336500#336500
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
How is the altitude accuracy in GPS only mode? I notice substantial
improvement with WAAS equipped GPS vs non-WAAS on altitude, not so
much in horizontal position. Has anyone compared having Bad Elf vs
internal?
On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 5:38 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than either my AT&T or verizon
ipad. The worst thing about either is just that you can't put it in full airplane
mode. Other than that, it works well. I wish the gps chip was separate
and you could turn it on separately. But what Jason said works good.
> Tim
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
My internal was absolutely perfect last night on the iPad 2.
On Apr 10, 2011 9:30 AM, "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> How is the altitude accuracy in GPS only mode? I notice substantial
> improvement with WAAS equipped GPS vs non-WAAS on altitude, not so
> much in horizontal position. Has anyone compared having Bad Elf vs
> internal?
>
> On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 5:38 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
> >
> > Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than either my AT&T or
verizon ipad. The worst thing about either is just that you can't put it in
full airplane mode. Other than that, it works well. I wish the gps chip
was separate and you could turn it on separately. But what Jason said works
good.
> > Tim
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
I didn't really care about altitude. IMHO, lateral is really the only thing
that matters. Trusting any cheap gps for vertical guidance isn't something
I'd want to to. That said, my ipad 2 gps was pretty close to actual altitu
de when I looked a couple times on this trip. But, you're better off using b
aro altitudes. If you're relying on the ipad to be a backup vertical approa
ch gps, bad elf or not, you're putting too much faith in it.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 9:33 AM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
> My internal was absolutely perfect last night on the iPad 2.
> On Apr 10, 2011 9:30 AM, "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > How is the altitude accuracy in GPS only mode? I notice substantial
> > improvement with WAAS equipped GPS vs non-WAAS on altitude, not so
> > much in horizontal position. Has anyone compared having Bad Elf vs
> > internal?
> >
> > On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 5:38 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than either my AT&T o
r verizon ipad. The worst thing about either is just that you can't put it i
n full airplane mode. Other than that, it works well. I wish the gps chip w
as separate and you could turn it on separately. But what Jason said works g
ood.
> > > Tim
> >
> >
> ============
> st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ============
> .matronics.com
> ============
> Dralle, List Admin.
> p://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ============
> >
> >
> >
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
To avoid the annoying subscription requests from your carrier on a 3G iPad 2
I went to Settings > Cellular Data > Off and have not had a subscription
request prompt since.
I also own the Bad Elf for my iPad 1 and the iPad 2 (Verizon) version seems
to be good enough for me to not want to use the Bad Elf with the new iPad.
Robin
*From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Tim Olson
*Sent:* Sunday, April 10, 2011 8:46 AM
*To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
*Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question
I didn't really care about altitude. IMHO, lateral is really the only thing
that matters. Trusting any cheap gps for vertical guidance isn't something
I'd want to to. That said, my ipad 2 gps was pretty close to actual
altitude when I looked a couple times on this trip. But, you're better off
using baro altitudes. If you're relying on the ipad to be a backup vertical
approach gps, bad elf or not, you're putting too much faith in it.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 9:33 AM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
My internal was absolutely perfect last night on the iPad 2.
On Apr 10, 2011 9:30 AM, "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> How is the altitude accuracy in GPS only mode? I notice substantial
> improvement with WAAS equipped GPS vs non-WAAS on altitude, not so
> much in horizontal position. Has anyone compared having Bad Elf vs
> internal?
>
> On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 5:38 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
> >
> > Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than either my AT&T or
verizon ipad. The worst thing about either is just that you can't put it in
full airplane mode. Other than that, it works well. I wish the gps chip
was separate and you could turn it on separately. But what Jason said works
good.
> > Tim
>
>
============
st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
============
.matronics.com
============
Dralle, List Admin.
p://www.matronics.com/contribution
============
>
>
* *
* *
* *
* *
* *
<3D%22http:/www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>*
<3D%22http:/www.matronics.com/contribution>*
* *
------------------------------
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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
My first flight with the iPad2 was a 400 mile round trip over two days.
Running Foreflight my altitude was within 10ft, and ground speed within
1kt of my Garmin 430W. It's the Verizon version using only the internal
gps. I was amazed at the accuracy. But I'm not shooting IFR approaches.
Here's a fun test. Install Google Earth on your iPad2. Zoom in on your
current location. Then walk around your house.
Bobby Hughes
N416AS
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question
I didn't really care about altitude. IMHO, lateral is really the only
thing that matters. Trusting any cheap gps for vertical guidance isn't
something I'd want to to. That said, my ipad 2 gps was pretty close to
actual altitude when I looked a couple times on this trip. But, you're
better off using baro altitudes. If you're relying on the ipad to be a
backup vertical approach gps, bad elf or not, you're putting too much
faith in it.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 9:33 AM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
My internal was absolutely perfect last night on the iPad 2.
On Apr 10, 2011 9:30 AM, "Kelly McMullen" <
<mailto:apilot2@gmail.com> apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
<mailto:apilot2@gmail.com> apilot2@gmail.com>
>
> How is the altitude accuracy in GPS only mode? I notice
substantial
> improvement with WAAS equipped GPS vs non-WAAS on altitude,
not so
> much in horizontal position. Has anyone compared having Bad
Elf vs
> internal?
>
> On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 5:38 AM, Tim Olson <
<mailto:Tim@myrv10.com> Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
<mailto:Tim@myrv10.com> Tim@myrv10.com>
> >
> > Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than
either my AT&T or verizon ipad. The worst thing about either is just
that you can't put it in full airplane mode. Other than that, it works
well. I wish the gps chip was separate and you could turn it on
separately. But what Jason said works good.
> > Tim
>
>
============
st"> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
============
.matronics.com
============
Dralle, List Admin.
p://www.matronics.com/contribution
============
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
Sounds like the new version has significantly better GPS engine than
the original.
On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 11:52 AM, Bobby J. Hughes <bhughes@qnsi.net> wrote:
> My first flight with the iPad2 was a 400 mile round trip over two days.
> Running Foreflight my altitude was within 10ft, and ground speed within 1kt
> of my Garmin 430W. Its the Verizon version using only the internal gps. I
> was amazed at the accuracy. But Im not shooting IFR approaches.
>
>
> Heres a fun test. Install Google Earth on your iPad2. Zoom in on your
> current location. Then walk around your house.
>
>
> Bobby Hughes
>
> N416AS
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
> Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 9:46 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question
>
>
> I didn't really care about altitude. IMHO, lateral is really the only thing
> that matters. Trusting any cheap gps for vertical guidance isn't something
> I'd want to to. That said, my ipad 2 gps was pretty close to actual
> altitude when I looked a couple times on this trip. But, you're better off
> using baro altitudes. If you're relying on the ipad to be a backup vertical
> approach gps, bad elf or not, you're putting too much faith in it.
>
> Tim
>
>
> On Apr 10, 2011, at 9:33 AM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> My internal was absolutely perfect last night on the iPad 2.
> On Apr 10, 2011 9:30 AM, "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> How is the altitude accuracy in GPS only mode? I notice substantial
>> improvement with WAAS equipped GPS vs non-WAAS on altitude, not so
>> much in horizontal position. Has anyone compared having Bad Elf vs
>> internal?
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 5:38 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Exactly. The gps in my iPhone 3GS was less quick than either my AT&T or
>> > verizon ipad. The worst thing about either is just that you can't put it in
>> > full airplane mode. Other than that, it works well. I wish the gps chip
>> > was separate and you could turn it on separately. But what Jason said works
>> > good.
>> > Tim
>>
>>
> ============
> st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ============
> .matronics.com
> ============
> Dralle, List Admin.
> p://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ============
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
Actually, in digging to find out what chipset they used on
the new iPad2's, it looks like BOTH the Verizon and AT&T
should be in better shape than previous iPhone/iPad models.
It looks like both iPad 2's, got new chipsets for GPS.
Here are a few links and a little info grabbed from them:
iPad 2 3G teardown proves ties to iPhone 4 design, upgrades
** The EVDO-based 3G version is near identical to the Verizon iPhone 4 and
has the same dual-mode Qualcomm MDM6600 chipset. The MDM6600 is a
GSM/UMTS/HSPA+/EV-DO multi-mode processor.
** The HSPA-based 3G version for AT&T and the world is using an Infineon
337S3833 baseband chip to get online but has upgraded to a newer Broadcom
BCM4751 for the GPS chipset
http://www.electronista.com/articles/11/03/30/ipad.2.3g.torn.down.by.ifixit/
http://wirelesse2e.wordpress.com/2011/03/15/iphone-cdma-and-ipad-2-no-obvious-path-for-lte/
The GPS in the iPad is part of the 3G chipset. That does not mean it isn't
a true GPS. Assisted GPS means that you have a 'real' GPS that has other
services associated.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS
iPhone 5 will be a world-phone using Qualcomm MDM6600. Even though Apple
prefers not to change its proven designs frequently, MDM6600 is simply
superior to legacy Infineon baseband processor and it simplifies GPS
implementation.
So you're likely to be better off with GPS in any 3G version of iPad 2,
than you are with iPad 1, or with iPhones prior to iPhone 4. The MDM6600
chipset may be why the Verizon ones are really pretty good with the GPS
acquisition and accuracy. And I'm sure that Apple wouldn't have moved to
the Broadcom BCM4751 for the AT&T version unless it provided something
better too.
Tim
>
> Sounds like the new version has significantly better GPS engine than
> the original.
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
Just a reminder to all that gps altitude (True altitude) and our barometric altimeter
will not agree, except on the ground or on a "standard day" (which of course
almost never exists).
I find it interesting to see by how much they can sometimes differ. It's a reminder
to give oneself a good cushion if using baro altitude for terrain avoidance.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336569#336569
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: I-Pad2 and Bad elf question |
Or, if you're using baro vnav, make sure you always check and use the current altimeter
setting. Been done that way for years. And, get get regular required
pitot static tests for ifr flight, and, and verify your plane's static error
so that your airspeed reads correct and your altimeter does too. When it comes
to gps, I'd only trust one that's made for ifr use to be fast enough to provide
the altitude accuracy for an approach.
Tim
On Apr 10, 2011, at 5:16 PM, "Bob Turner" <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
> Just a reminder to all that gps altitude (True altitude) and our barometric altimeter
will not agree, except on the ground or on a "standard day" (which of
course almost never exists).
>
> I find it interesting to see by how much they can sometimes differ. It's a reminder
to give oneself a good cushion if using baro altitude for terrain avoidance.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
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> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336569#336569
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