Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:26 AM - Re: Door Incident (DLM)
2. 06:19 AM - Re: Door Incident (Strasnuts)
3. 11:11 AM - Re: Door Incident (woxofswa)
4. 01:37 PM - Re: Re: Door Incident (Pascal)
5. 02:11 PM - Schroth seatbelts (Michael Wellenzohn)
6. 06:34 PM - Re: Re: Door Incident (John Cox)
7. 06:50 PM - Re: Door Incident (bill.peyton)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Door Incident |
agreed on pin length; I requested longer pins from Vans; insertion
varies on how accurately gear box is located in the door. Vans indicated
they had only fixed length pins so we made our own from 6061 stock. they
were intentionally made excessively long and then gradually cut back
until just fitting. Our beveled pins have a full circumference through
the door aluminum frame. After looking at various incidents it seems
that loosing the door in a pitch up attitude invites the door to go over
the airframe, but a level attitude invites a horizontal stabilizer
strike. Just wondering whether the tail cone was bent like 416EC. See
http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id 071024X01649&key=
1.
Also I do not have the pins covered by facade. I "feel" the pins when
loaded and before takeoff but did not install any warning or extra latch
system..
----- Original Message -----
From: John Gonzalez
To: RV 10 group
Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2011 10:39 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Door Incident
I hate to say this, but until the directions in the plans are re
written on how far the pins should penetrate into the aluminum fuselage
members, how the fiberglass return on the cabin top should be so snug
that a business card can't penetrate between the locked door and the
cabin top return, pilots will keep losing doors even with the stupid,
ugly, drag inducing latch.
Having a big gap with a compressible seal leaves one guessing at to
whether the door is actually closed. A block of foam in the center of
the door laminating the two halves in more places would go a long way to
preventing the low pressure on the outside of the door during flight
from bowing the door.
Vans also needs to provide more length to the pins so when installed
correctly they go at least 3/4 to 1 inch into the aluminum fuse door
opening.
At least there is another door on the opposite side to look at.
Just thinking out loud.
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Door Incident
> From: robertbrunk@me.com
> Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 21:36:28 -0500
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>
<robertbrunk@me.com>
>
> My door was replaced by Stephan Breier at Fazar fbo at Ft.Worth
Mecham. He did a great job.
>
>
> Robert Brunkenhoefer
> Sent from my Apple iPad
>
> On May 4, 2011, at 8:04 PM, "dhsa@mac.com" <dhsa@mac.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > I had an incident in the Dallas Texas area last week when the
pilot door of my RV-10 flew off the aircraft at 3000 feet. =C2 I was
lucky enough to land at McKinney, Texas without injury. =C2 The plane
sustained damage to the stabilator, area surrounding the door and rear
pilot side window. =C2 We believe the door is in a lake and
unrecoverable. =C2 The NTSB and FAA are investigating. =C2 Due to this
investigation I will not comment any further as to the cause of the
incident until their analysis is complete. =C2 =C2 I will advise ALL
RV-10 owners that the Vans safety latch was installed and did not
function as designed.
> >
> > I am out of the Atlanta area and my plane is in McKinney Texas at
Aero Country. =C2 I am in desperate need of someone with RV experience
in the Dallas area to do the repair work. =C2 Any suggestions,
recommendations or contacts would be appreciated.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338944#338944
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Door Incident |
One of the easiest and simplest solutions is to have the handle go 180. Anyone
with a standard kit can accomplish this. Even if you don't want to buy the
middle cam or install Vans solution. If new builders would cut the handle gear
racks in half, instead of per vans instructions, it would add considerable pin
length. 180 degrees of travel equals TWO inches of pin travel. Now you can
still close a 180 degree handle and have one of the aft pins hanging out the
door and still have the door come off. The key ingredient is making sure the
pins go INTO the guides and through the fuselage structure. Another good reason
to have the magnetic or mechanical proximity switches installed. I truly
believe the intention of Vans' latch is to make sure the pins go into the guides
NOT hold the door in if you forget to rotate the handle all the way. (I'm
not insinuating this happened to you) That goes for my solution too. The cam
pulls the door in so the pins have to go into the guides. I made mine so it was
a one hand operation to open the door, especially in a situation like Ted just
had. Anyone installing these doors should make sure they are easy to close
and the pin extension goes through the structure.
Another situation has been the stock hollow stock pins cutting into the stock plastic
guides. I have heard of one incident where the pin lodged into the guide
and held the door there until airborne. The relative wind opened the door
and it departed the aircraft. Prox. switches would help this scenario as well
as solid ended pins.
My 2 cents
--------
40936
RV-10 SB N801VR Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338994#338994
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Door Incident |
+1 for Sean.
I have his cam and tips and have no worries for door integrity as it solves several
issues. His kit should be supplied stock by Van's. I'm going to visit the
factory next week on a PDX RON and tell them that.
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done, finishing
kit in progress.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339027#339027
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Door Incident |
Let them know specifically that their anchor does not resolve the issue and
the SB 10-14 should be removed and replaced with a working solution (aka
Sean's).
Thx
-----Original Message-----
From: woxofswa
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 11:07 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Door Incident
+1 for Sean.
I have his cam and tips and have no worries for door integrity as it solves
several issues. His kit should be supplied stock by Van's. I'm going to
visit the factory next week on a PDX RON and tell them that.
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done,
finishing kit in progress.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339027#339027
Message 5
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| Subject: | Schroth seatbelts |
Hi there,
I saw 2009 at Osh an RV-10 (I guess it was Rob Hickmans) with Schroth seatbelts
and rotary buckle.
Does anyone have information about price, length or other features to be aware
of or points to consider when ordering?
Regards
Michael
http://www.schroth.com/download/990071.pdf
--------
RV-10 builder (interior,avionics, wiring)
#511
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339040#339040
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/schrothgurte_109.pdf
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Door Incident |
For many the Vans SB 10-14 is enough. For some of those the phrase so
often mentioned by Ken at VANS is "Just Build it". For others who are
true manufacturer's and experimenter in the tradition of the EAA. Let's
research the possibilities, shout at the moon there must be better ideas
and encourage those who have already walked this path to shine the light
on the road traveled. I continue to marvel at the talent of this group.
There is always a better solution ahead when you view the path laid out
by those before us.
Don't ever buy the mantra "Just Built It". Know why, know the
alternatives...... choose wisely.
John
#40600
PS and Thanks Tim for documenting so many of those footsteps.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 1:27 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Door Incident
Let them know specifically that their anchor does not resolve the issue
and
the SB 10-14 should be removed and replaced with a working solution (aka
Sean's).
Thx
-----Original Message-----
From: woxofswa
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 11:07 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Door Incident
+1 for Sean.
I have his cam and tips and have no worries for door integrity as it
solves
several issues. His kit should be supplied stock by Van's. I'm going to
visit the factory next week on a PDX RON and tell them that.
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done,
finishing kit in progress.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339027#339027
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Door Incident |
I have installed Seans kit and see no way the door could ever come unlatched in
flight. The key is proper and significant penetration into the fuse structure.
One addition I plan on making is to use a drift pin through the threaded rod
ends to assure that they can't unscrew in flight from constant vibration.
This is in addition to the locktight on the threads.
What I would really like to see is someone re-design the door similar to the Cirrus
door with the hinge at the foward edge. Then the door opening in flight
is a non-issue just like most other comparative aircraft. This is a poorly designed
door from many perspectives. Dealing with it on a windy day is not going
to be fun, just hope the wind does not rip it off the hinges. It is just too
bad that Vans won't do the research and spend the money to improve some of
the deficiences with this model. (Don't get me going on the list!)
Bill
--------
Bill Peyton
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339067#339067
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