Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:27 AM - Re: Panel Choice (orchidman)
2. 04:47 AM - Re: Re: Panel Choice (Jim Combs)
3. 06:55 AM - Re: Panel Choice (Strasnuts)
4. 07:20 AM - Re: Panel Choice (dmaib@me.com)
5. 07:43 AM - Re: Re: Panel Choice (Tim Olson)
6. 07:43 AM - Re: Re: Panel Choice (DLM)
7. 07:49 AM - Re: Re: Panel Choice (DLM)
8. 10:00 AM - Re: Fuel Leak (John Cumins)
9. 04:30 PM - I'm back! (James Hein)
10. 05:17 PM - Re: I'm back! (Sean Stephens)
11. 05:52 PM - Re: I'm back! (Michael Kraus)
12. 06:21 PM - Re: I'm back! (Billy & Tami Britton)
13. 06:34 PM - Re: I'm back! (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
14. 06:42 PM - Re: I'm back! (James Hein)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
nukeflyboy wrote:
> I do not know the frequency of updates for the moving map in a GRT/AFS system.
Not sure about GRT but AFS, the maps are updated every 28 days.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355849#355849
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
Sean, yes to be fair we all have to pay the darn recurring fees for the data
updates. I can see the fees for XM radio, they have to pay to build, launch
and fly the satellites. But the other data is (I think) supplied by the
FAA. One can download approach plates in PDF form directly from the FAA.Gov
website for free. The other data (Airport info, tower data also is from the
FAA. So the question I have
is what is the value add from the data suppliers (Garmin, Jepp) that
warrants the large expense.
Jim C
D Not Archive
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 7:01 PM, Seano <sean@braunandco.com> wrote:
>
> I actually was adding 700$ that I believe was the cost for the XM package I
> purchased. 600$ is the g3x bundle.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 23, 2011, at 17:57, "Bob Turner" <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
> >
> > Just to add on to "apples to apples..."
> >
> > Don't forget the quoted $1300 includes xm weather (up to $600/yr
> depending on subscription). I don't think anyone else was including that
> cost in their discussion.
> >
> > OTOH: Is anyone NOT doing biennial pitot/static/transponder inspections,
> as I thought Tim was implying? To not do so would restrict you to below
> 10,000', 30 nm away from all Class B, and no Class C, areas.
> >
> > --------
> > Bob Turner
> > RV-10 QB
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355811#355811
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
I don't think anything warrants the big expense for the data but it is worth it
for me to have the G3X.
AOPA supplies the airport directory. The flight charts are geo-referenced and
are government. NAVDATA is from Jeppesen and includes N,C,and S America. Obstacles
are from Garmin (i believe). SAFETAXI is from government charts and is
geo-reference. Terrain is from Garmin and shows N, C, and S America.
I have had absolutely no issues with the G3X/GX Pilot since I wired it and installed
it. When I wish it had a certain functions, the next update bundle has
it in it plus more options. The cost of the data is high but reliability, ease
of use, company history/size and having everything from the same company "talk"
to each other is nice in the cockpit and is why I bought the G3X.
Although, I do have a separate D6 for AHRS/Magnetometer back-up.
--------
40936
RV-10 SB N801VR Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355859#355859
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
Jim Combs wrote:
> So the question I have
> is what is the value add from the data suppliers (Garmin, Jepp) that warrants
the large expense.
>
> Jim C
>
>
> [b]
Simple supply and demand. capitalism at work. So Jim hits it right on the head:
why do they get to sell, for profit, data that is generated by taxpayer dollars?
[Evil or Very Mad] Corrupted capitalism??
do not archive
--------
David Maib
RV-10 #40559
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355862#355862
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
Not that I'd EVER want to defend Jeppesen, but, the actual
programming and linking of the approaches, created from
the waypoints the feds have, is actually done by Jepp for
these navigator devices. So that's where the value add
comes in. If you just solely use Government data, all
you'll really have, in electronic form, is a bunch of
waypoints or fixes. Sure, for a VFR pilot, that's fine,
because you'll now have your airport data and some
fixes and intersections, but, it doesn't give you anything
to actually fly an approach USING your system. (i.e.
no coupled approaches) Yes, the feds do this for their
paper charts, but the programming is different for each
navigator device, so Jepp takes the data and builds
the approaches into the various devices required format.
So without Jepp doing that, your options are limited.
Now that said, the Aspen stuff I guess is all done by
Seattle avionics. They use the gov't data to build
the databases for the Aspen stuff and do the approaches
too. Can they do it for other devices? Sure, they
absolutely can. But, they won't, and that's because
they would get sued by Garmin and Jepp if they stepped
on their toes and started doing this for the Garmin
devices. They could do it for systems like the
Chelton system...they still may get sued, but they
would be at a lower risk of that, but then they
have 2 problems....1 is that they take on liability,
and 2 is that they won't make a huge profit on the
effort to make it worthwhile because there aren't that
many systems out there. It takes a certain quantity
of systems to make it worthwhile.
If an individual had the talent, and time, the government
data is available, and by taking countless hours of time,
you could script it so that you could generate an
actual Garmin db out of it if you reverse engineer
the format, but keeping up with the changes on
a 28 day cycle would make it a full time job....so
you probably couldn't do it nationwide without
dedicated staff.
So really, there is value add for people who want to
actually fly IFR, doing coupled approaches. If you
want to go VFR only, it is far less valuable, and
the economical alternative is to do an annual database
update on your EFIS, and use an iPad navigating VFR
and keeping that data current.
Tim
On 10/24/2011 9:16 AM, dmaib@me.com wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "dmaib@me.com"<dmaib@me.com>
>
>
> Jim Combs wrote:
>> So the question I have
>> is what is the value add from the data suppliers (Garmin, Jepp) that warrants
the large expense.
>>
>> Jim C
>>
>>
>> [b]
>
>
> Simple supply and demand. capitalism at work. So Jim hits it right on the head:
why do they get to sell, for profit, data that is generated by taxpayer dollars?
[Evil or Very Mad] Corrupted capitalism??
>
> do not archive
>
> --------
> David Maib
> RV-10 #40559
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355862#355862
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
IIRC flying IFR in the big birds requires three independent ways to keep the
dirty side down in IMC. I accomplished this with a Chelton system as primary
and a GRT Sport system as backup. The tie breaker is the Trutrak autopilot
that can with its own solid state gyros ignore all inputs from the EFIS
systems and fly the aircraft independently. The EFIS systems each have their
own single dependency but their dependencies are different. Obviously all
three systems must share in some fashion the primary and backup electrical
system. I buy the Jepp/Chelton updates for the Cheltons for $550 annually;
GRT updates are free and Trutrak has updated my Digiflite software without
charge several times.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Strasnuts
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 6:50 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Panel Choice
I don't think anything warrants the big expense for the data but it is worth
it for me to have the G3X.
AOPA supplies the airport directory. The flight charts are geo-referenced
and are government. NAVDATA is from Jeppesen and includes N,C,and S
America. Obstacles are from Garmin (i believe). SAFETAXI is from government
charts and is geo-reference. Terrain is from Garmin and shows N, C, and S
America.
I have had absolutely no issues with the G3X/GX Pilot since I wired it and
installed it. When I wish it had a certain functions, the next update
bundle has it in it plus more options. The cost of the data is high but
reliability, ease of use, company history/size and having everything from
the same company "talk" to each other is nice in the cockpit and is why I
bought the G3X.
Although, I do have a separate D6 for AHRS/Magnetometer back-up.
--------
40936
RV-10 SB N801VR Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355859#355859
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Choice |
As a retired IT guy, they can charge what they like to massage the data and
insert it into their hardware. Certainly someone could write something
comparable/compatible and perform the function but why go to the
effort/expense to produce and maintain same?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of dmaib@me.com
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 7:17 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Panel Choice
Jim Combs wrote:
> So the question I have
> is what is the value add from the data suppliers (Garmin, Jepp) that
warrants the large expense.
>
> Jim C
>
>
> [b]
Simple supply and demand. capitalism at work. So Jim hits it right on the
head: why do they get to sell, for profit, data that is generated by
taxpayer dollars? [Evil or Very Mad] Corrupted capitalism??
do not archive
--------
David Maib
RV-10 #40559
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355862#355862
Message 8
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Thanks Dave
40864 Winds debur Top skins frep for primer
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2011 7:25 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Leak
I'm pretty sure the tubing was 3003.
--Dave
On Oct 21, 2011, at 16:54, "John Cumins" <jcumins@jcis.net> wrote:
Dave
One question on the tubing. Was it the 3002 tube van supplies
that=99s real soft, for was it 5052 standard certified aircraft
tubing.
I have seen the 3000 series tubes leak over time way more so than the
5052 type.
Also, I think you are dead on with the plugging of the holes on the flap
motor. Great idea. I will for sure do that on mine when I get to that
point.
Thanks for all the great information that you pass on the list as you
become aware of it.
<image001.jpg>
John Cumins
President
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2011 1:50 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Leak
I have an Andair valve with an AN fitting screwed into the bottom of it.
The leak was between the AN fitting and the flared tube that I fabbed
when I upgraded to the Andair about three years ago.
I replaced the leaky flared tube with a flexible teflon hose.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
On Fri, Oct 21, 2011 at 1:22 PM, Roger Standley <taildragon@msn.com>
wrote:
Dave,
Just curious, which fuel valve did you use? Was the leak fixed by
tightening or tube replacement?
Roger
_____
From: dave.saylor.aircrafters@gmail.com
Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Leak
Listers,
The other day on preflight I noticed a faint fuel smell in the cockpit.
I talked myself into thinking it was nothing, and the next day it was
stronger. Time to investigate.
I found a pretty good drip coming from the flare at the bottom of the
fuel valve. There was some staining and a little dampness on the bottom
of the tunnel, easily fixed with a flex hose.
It got me thinking again about the flap motor as an ignition source.
To date there have been at least three RV-10 cockpit fires. Now of
course keeping the fuel where it should be is key, but once it gets out,
keeping it from igniting seems like a good defense.
The flap motor in my RV-10 is described on the attached data sheet.
There are four 6-32 threaded holes in each end of the motor. Two are
used for mounting, one is blocked by the gearbox, leaving five that
expose the brushes to the tunnel atmosphere.
I wiped a little blob of silicone into the unused hole on the bottom of
the motor, and put AN515-6R4s and split lock-washers in the top holes.
The motor works fine, no issues with clearance. There's a picture of
the motor with the outer case taken off, which I wouldn't recommend
doing. Now I realize it's not necessary. I just included it to
identify which hole was plugged with silicone. Putting the brushes and
shims back together wasn't much fun.
I kind of doubt that this makes the motor officially "explosion proof"
but I don't see how it hurts and hopefully it's a tiny bit safer.
Fixing the leak was the best solution.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
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_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Message 9
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Finally!
After a failed partial knee replacement, then a revision, and other
bumps along the way the past one and a half years.......
I am finally getting back to building!
Now for the shame:
RV# 40384 ( I got a lot of catching up to do! )
Let's see, 20,000 unread emails.... What did I miss?
Have fun!
-Jim
Message 10
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#40303 here and I'm not even on the finishing kit yet. Started in the
fall of 2004, still chugging along. I'm the tortoise in the race.
Hopefully you won't pass me up too. :)
Keep pounding... or in my case crimping...
-Sean #40303 (wiring panel)
On 10/24/11 6:25 PM, James Hein wrote:
>
> Finally!
> After a failed partial knee replacement, then a revision, and
> other bumps along the way the past one and a half years.......
>
> I am finally getting back to building!
>
> Now for the shame:
> RV# 40384 ( I got a lot of catching up to do! )
>
> Let's see, 20,000 unread emails.... What did I miss?
>
> Have fun!
> -Jim
>
>
Message 11
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I had 40013, purchased the first hour on the first day.... First flight in May
this year. So y'all aren't too slow....
-Mike Kraus
Do not archive
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 24, 2011, at 8:13 PM, Sean Stephens <sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>
> #40303 here and I'm not even on the finishing kit yet. Started in the fall of
2004, still chugging along. I'm the tortoise in the race. Hopefully you won't
pass me up too. :)
>
> Keep pounding... or in my case crimping...
>
> -Sean #40303 (wiring panel)
>
> On 10/24/11 6:25 PM, James Hein wrote:
>>
>> Finally!
>> After a failed partial knee replacement, then a revision, and other bumps
along the way the past one and a half years.......
>>
>> I am finally getting back to building!
>>
>> Now for the shame:
>> RV# 40384 ( I got a lot of catching up to do! )
>>
>> Let's see, 20,000 unread emails.... What did I miss?
>>
>> Have fun!
>> -Jim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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40137 bought second hand in Winter '05. Still very slowly working on slow
build wings (hopefully finish this winter).
don't feel too bad!!!
Bill Britton
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Michael Kraus" <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: I'm back!
> <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
>
> I had 40013, purchased the first hour on the first day.... First flight
> in May this year. So y'all aren't too slow....
> -Mike Kraus
>
> Do not archive
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 24, 2011, at 8:13 PM, Sean Stephens <sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> #40303 here and I'm not even on the finishing kit yet. Started in the
>> fall of 2004, still chugging along. I'm the tortoise in the race.
>> Hopefully you won't pass me up too. :)
>>
>> Keep pounding... or in my case crimping...
>>
>> -Sean #40303 (wiring panel)
>>
>> On 10/24/11 6:25 PM, James Hein wrote:
>>>
>>> Finally!
>>> After a failed partial knee replacement, then a revision, and other
>>> bumps along the way the past one and a half years.......
>>>
>>> I am finally getting back to building!
>>>
>>> Now for the shame:
>>> RV# 40384 ( I got a lot of catching up to do! )
>>>
>>> Let's see, 20,000 unread emails.... What did I miss?
>>>
>>> Have fun!
>>> -Jim
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 13
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40352 and no comment. :)
Michael
Sent from my iPad2
On Oct 24, 2011, at 7:26 PM, "Sean Stephens" <sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>
> #40303 here and I'm not even on the finishing kit yet. Started in the fall of
2004, still chugging along. I'm the tortoise in the race. Hopefully you won't
pass me up too. :)
>
> Keep pounding... or in my case crimping...
>
> -Sean #40303 (wiring panel)
>
> On 10/24/11 6:25 PM, James Hein wrote:
>>
>> Finally!
>> After a failed partial knee replacement, then a revision, and other bumps
along the way the past one and a half years.......
>>
>> I am finally getting back to building!
>>
>> Now for the shame:
>> RV# 40384 ( I got a lot of catching up to do! )
>>
>> Let's see, 20,000 unread emails.... What did I miss?
>>
>> Have fun!
>> -Jim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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Thanks for the support guys!
The real surprise is that the AME that is helping me get my medical back
already has an RV-10 and is on this list, even though before today I did
not know either. I also have a thyroid problem which, for some strange
reason - is disqualifying! So I need a special issuance as well.
Isn't it spooky sometimes how things fall into place?
The last year has been a year of hell, but everything's looking up now!
-Jim 40384
On 10/24/2011 9:18 PM, Billy & Tami Britton wrote:
> <william@gbta.net>
>
> 40137 bought second hand in Winter '05. Still very slowly working on
> slow build wings (hopefully finish this winter).
>
> don't feel too bad!!!
>
> Bill Britton
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Michael Kraus" <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 7:48 PM
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: I'm back!
>
>> <n223rv@wolflakeairport.net>
>>
>> I had 40013, purchased the first hour on the first day.... First
>> flight in May this year. So y'all aren't too slow....
>> -Mike Kraus
>>
>> Do not archive
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Oct 24, 2011, at 8:13 PM, Sean Stephens <sean@stephensville.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> #40303 here and I'm not even on the finishing kit yet. Started in
>>> the fall of 2004, still chugging along. I'm the tortoise in the
>>> race. Hopefully you won't pass me up too. :)
>>>
>>> Keep pounding... or in my case crimping...
>>>
>>> -Sean #40303 (wiring panel)
>>>
>>> On 10/24/11 6:25 PM, James Hein wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Finally!
>>>> After a failed partial knee replacement, then a revision, and
>>>> other bumps along the way the past one and a half years.......
>>>>
>>>> I am finally getting back to building!
>>>>
>>>> Now for the shame:
>>>> RV# 40384 ( I got a lot of catching up to do! )
>>>>
>>>> Let's see, 20,000 unread emails.... What did I miss?
>>>>
>>>> Have fun!
>>>> -Jim
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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