Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:07 AM - The rising cost of GA (David Leikam)
2. 06:33 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Tim Olson)
3. 06:37 AM - no more free charts (Chris Hukill)
4. 07:41 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (John Ackerman)
5. 07:53 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Kelly McMullen)
6. 07:56 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Phillip Perry)
7. 08:43 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Kelly McMullen)
8. 10:28 AM - Re: 40720 First Flight (Jae Chang)
9. 11:23 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Bob Turner)
10. 11:27 AM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Linn Walters)
11. 02:51 PM - Re: Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens (Ralph E. Capen)
12. 02:52 PM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Bill Watson)
13. 03:15 PM - Re: Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens (Geoff Combs)
14. 03:38 PM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Rob Kermanj)
15. 04:11 PM - Re: The rising cost of GA (Linn Walters)
Message 1
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| Subject: | The rising cost of GA |
FAA TO CHARGE COMPANIES FOR ONLINE CHARTS, NO ACCESS FOR INDIVIDUALS
The days of inexpensive navigation and chart apps for your mobile
devices appear to be numbered with the FAA's announcement that it will
begin charging for downloads that were previously free starting April 5,
2012. A story in the December issue of our sister publication Aviation
Consumer says the Aeronautical Navigational Products
Directorate(Aeronav), which currently makes the latest charts and other
navigational products available online for free, says it has to recover
the costs associated with developing and hosting the products. That
means charging fees to companies for those downloads and no longer
allowing individuals access them at all. As of April 5, only those with
distribution contracts with Aeronav will be able to download the data.
The most noticeable impact will likely be on the small but increasingly
popular industry segment (like ForeFlight and WingX) that develops
flight-related apps for iPads and other consumer electronics. It will
also have an impact on websites like RunwayFinder that use the data for
their online products, some of which are currently available for free.
How much impact isn't known because the FAA hasn't announced what it
intends to charge for the data. Affected companies have been invited to
a meeting Dec. 13 in Washington to hear details of the FAA's proposal
and offer input to the final pricing structure and the distribution
contract. More...
Dave Leikam
do not archive
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Kind of makes you wonder how hard Jeppesen lobbied for that,
doesn't it?
If it were purely a money issue, they could have charged
a subscription fee to individuals. Now individuals can't
download at all...so no matter which option you go with,
you have to pay. Hopefully the cost will be small enough
to the entities that the pricing structure doesn't change
much, since the feds aren't allowed to "profit" from it.
I'd bet $10 though that Jepp had some influence in the
decision...they've been losing out on paper subscriptions
and their electronic offering is overpriced, so they
had to squeeze the cheap data somehow.
Tim
On 11/14/2011 8:02 AM, David Leikam wrote:
> *FAA TO CHARGE COMPANIES FOR ONLINE CHARTS, NO ACCESS FOR INDIVIDUALS
> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>*
> The days of inexpensive navigation and chart apps for your mobile
> devices appear to be numbered with the FAA's announcement that it will
> begin charging for downloads that were previously free starting April 5,
> 2012. A story in the December issue of our sister publication Aviation
> Consumer says theAeronautical Navigational Products Directorate
> <http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/flight_info/aeronav/>(Aeronav), which
> currently makes the latest charts and other navigational products
> available online for free, says it has to recover the costs associated
> with developing and hosting the products. That means charging fees to
> companies for those downloads and no longer allowing individuals access
> them at all. As of April 5, only those with distribution contracts with
> Aeronav will be able to download the data. The most noticeable impact
> will likely be on the small but increasingly popular industry segment
> (like ForeFlight and WingX) that develops flight-related apps for iPads
> and other consumer electronics. It will also have an impact on websites
> like RunwayFinder that use the data for their online products, some of
> which are currently available for free. How much impact isn't known
> because the FAA hasn't announced what it intends to charge for the data.
> Affected companies have been invited to a meeting Dec. 13 in Washington
> to hear details of the FAA's proposal and offer input to the final
> pricing structure and the distribution contract.More...
> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>
>
> Dave Leikam
>
> do not archive
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | no more free charts |
Here they go again. No more free charts.
http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
How much better this world would be without Jepp...
Just another corporation with a strong lobby.
On Nov 14, 2011, at 7:31 AM, Tim Olson wrote:
>
> Kind of makes you wonder how hard Jeppesen lobbied for that,
> doesn't it?
>
> If it were purely a money issue, they could have charged
> a subscription fee to individuals. Now individuals can't
> download at all...so no matter which option you go with,
> you have to pay. Hopefully the cost will be small enough
> to the entities that the pricing structure doesn't change
> much, since the feds aren't allowed to "profit" from it.
>
> I'd bet $10 though that Jepp had some influence in the
> decision...they've been losing out on paper subscriptions
> and their electronic offering is overpriced, so they
> had to squeeze the cheap data somehow.
> Tim
>
> On 11/14/2011 8:02 AM, David Leikam wrote:
>> *FAA TO CHARGE COMPANIES FOR ONLINE CHARTS, NO ACCESS FOR INDIVIDUALS
>> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>*
>> The days of inexpensive navigation and chart apps for your mobile
>> devices appear to be numbered with the FAA's announcement that it will
>> begin charging for downloads that were previously free starting April 5,
>> 2012. A story in the December issue of our sister publication Aviation
>> Consumer says theAeronautical Navigational Products Directorate
>> <http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/flight_info/aeronav/>(Aeronav), which
>> currently makes the latest charts and other navigational products
>> available online for free, says it has to recover the costs associated
>> with developing and hosting the products. That means charging fees to
>> companies for those downloads and no longer allowing individuals access
>> them at all. As of April 5, only those with distribution contracts with
>> Aeronav will be able to download the data. The most noticeable impact
>> will likely be on the small but increasingly popular industry segment
>> (like ForeFlight and WingX) that develops flight-related apps for iPads
>> and other consumer electronics. It will also have an impact on websites
>> like RunwayFinder that use the data for their online products, some of
>> which are currently available for free. How much impact isn't known
>> because the FAA hasn't announced what it intends to charge for the data.
>> Affected companies have been invited to a meeting Dec. 13 in Washington
>> to hear details of the FAA's proposal and offer input to the final
>> pricing structure and the distribution contract.More...
>> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>
>>
>> Dave Leikam
>>
>> do not archive
>>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Why do I suspect that Garmin's lobbyists are marching lockstep with
Jeppesen?
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 8:38 AM, John Ackerman <johnag5b@cableone.net>wrote:
>
> How much better this world would be without Jepp...
> Just another corporation with a strong lobby.
>
>
> On Nov 14, 2011, at 7:31 AM, Tim Olson wrote:
>
> >
> > Kind of makes you wonder how hard Jeppesen lobbied for that,
> > doesn't it?
> >
> > If it were purely a money issue, they could have charged
> > a subscription fee to individuals. Now individuals can't
> > download at all...so no matter which option you go with,
> > you have to pay. Hopefully the cost will be small enough
> > to the entities that the pricing structure doesn't change
> > much, since the feds aren't allowed to "profit" from it.
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Since we're subscribing to the Garmin data sets loaded into our GPS's, are
those considered legal substitutes?
According to our local FSDO, electronic charts are perfectly legal. But I
didn't ask about the data loaded into the GPS.
Phil
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 9:38 AM, John Ackerman <johnag5b@cableone.net>wrote:
>
> How much better this world would be without Jepp...
> Just another corporation with a strong lobby.
>
>
> On Nov 14, 2011, at 7:31 AM, Tim Olson wrote:
>
> >
> > Kind of makes you wonder how hard Jeppesen lobbied for that,
> > doesn't it?
> >
> > If it were purely a money issue, they could have charged
> > a subscription fee to individuals. Now individuals can't
> > download at all...so no matter which option you go with,
> > you have to pay. Hopefully the cost will be small enough
> > to the entities that the pricing structure doesn't change
> > much, since the feds aren't allowed to "profit" from it.
> >
> > I'd bet $10 though that Jepp had some influence in the
> > decision...they've been losing out on paper subscriptions
> > and their electronic offering is overpriced, so they
> > had to squeeze the cheap data somehow.
> > Tim
> >
> > On 11/14/2011 8:02 AM, David Leikam wrote:
> >> *FAA TO CHARGE COMPANIES FOR ONLINE CHARTS, NO ACCESS FOR INDIVIDUALS
> >> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>*
> >> The days of inexpensive navigation and chart apps for your mobile
> >> devices appear to be numbered with the FAA's announcement that it will
> >> begin charging for downloads that were previously free starting April 5,
> >> 2012. A story in the December issue of our sister publication Aviation
> >> Consumer says theAeronautical Navigational Products Directorate
> >> <http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/flight_info/aeronav/>(Aeronav), which
> >> currently makes the latest charts and other navigational products
> >> available online for free, says it has to recover the costs associated
> >> with developing and hosting the products. That means charging fees to
> >> companies for those downloads and no longer allowing individuals access
> >> them at all. As of April 5, only those with distribution contracts with
> >> Aeronav will be able to download the data. The most noticeable impact
> >> will likely be on the small but increasingly popular industry segment
> >> (like ForeFlight and WingX) that develops flight-related apps for iPads
> >> and other consumer electronics. It will also have an impact on websites
> >> like RunwayFinder that use the data for their online products, some of
> >> which are currently available for free. How much impact isn't known
> >> because the FAA hasn't announced what it intends to charge for the data.
> >> Affected companies have been invited to a meeting Dec. 13 in Washington
> >> to hear details of the FAA's proposal and offer input to the final
> >> pricing structure and the distribution contract.More...
> >> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>
> >>
> >> Dave Leikam
> >>
> >> do not archive
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
You have a Catch 22. You only need what you can't remember. The FAR is
for preflight action to review all available information. For Part 91
there is no chart requirement, just you need to remember everything
you saw on the chart. If you have the data in you glass panel, and
you have an electronic backup, whether that is an iPad or other
device, you would seem to have all the memory refreshing tools you
need.
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 8:53 AM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
> Since we're subscribing to the Garmin data sets loaded into our GPS's, are
> those considered legal substitutes?
>
> According to our local FSDO, electronic charts are perfectly legal. But I
> didn't ask about the data loaded into the GPS.
>
> Phil
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 9:38 AM, John Ackerman <johnag5b@cableone.net>
> wrote:
>>
>>
>> How much better this world would be without Jepp...
>> Just another corporation with a strong lobby.
>>
>>
>> On Nov 14, 2011, at 7:31 AM, Tim Olson wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Kind of makes you wonder how hard Jeppesen lobbied for that,
>> > doesn't it?
>> >
>> > If it were purely a money issue, they could have charged
>> > a subscription fee to individuals. Now individuals can't
>> > download at all...so no matter which option you go with,
>> > you have to pay. Hopefully the cost will be small enough
>> > to the entities that the pricing structure doesn't change
>> > much, since the feds aren't allowed to "profit" from it.
>> >
>> > I'd bet $10 though that Jepp had some influence in the
>> > decision...they've been losing out on paper subscriptions
>> > and their electronic offering is overpriced, so they
>> > had to squeeze the cheap data somehow.
>> > Tim
>> >
>> > On 11/14/2011 8:02 AM, David Leikam wrote:
>> >> *FAA TO CHARGE COMPANIES FOR ONLINE CHARTS, NO ACCESS FOR INDIVIDUALS
>> >> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>*
>> >> The days of inexpensive navigation and chart apps for your mobile
>> >> devices appear to be numbered with the FAA's announcement that it will
>> >> begin charging for downloads that were previously free starting April
>> >> 5,
>> >> 2012. A story in the December issue of our sister publication Aviation
>> >> Consumer says theAeronautical Navigational Products Directorate
>> >> <http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/flight_info/aeronav/>(Aeronav), which
>> >> currently makes the latest charts and other navigational products
>> >> available online for free, says it has to recover the costs associated
>> >> with developing and hosting the products. That means charging fees to
>> >> companies for those downloads and no longer allowing individuals access
>> >> them at all. As of April 5, only those with distribution contracts with
>> >> Aeronav will be able to download the data. The most noticeable impact
>> >> will likely be on the small but increasingly popular industry segment
>> >> (like ForeFlight and WingX) that develops flight-related apps for iPads
>> >> and other consumer electronics. It will also have an impact on websites
>> >> like RunwayFinder that use the data for their online products, some of
>> >> which are currently available for free. How much impact isn't known
>> >> because the FAA hasn't announced what it intends to charge for the
>> >> data.
>> >> Affected companies have been invited to a meeting Dec. 13 in Washington
>> >> to hear details of the FAA's proposal and offer input to the final
>> >> pricing structure and the distribution contract.More...
>> >> <http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/2056-full.html#205722>
>> >>
>> >> Dave Leikam
>> >>
>> >> do not archive
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> ="_blank">www.aeroelectric.com
>> ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
>> et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> le, List Admin.
>> ==========
>> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> ==========
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> le, List Admin.
>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: 40720 First Flight |
hi Pascal, congratulations on your first flight too! It would be great
to compare notes for us just flying.
Transitioning has been interesting to say the least. I stopped flying
PIC in 2006 with too much competition for my time and money. My first
PIC time since was 7/2011. Thus, these past few months have been very
busy. I am fortunate to have a great group of local builders and pilots
who have helped me with transition training. I needed much more than the
typical 5 hours and was fortunate to be able to get it locally in my own
complex airspace. Ultimately, i decided to let my baby go with a test
pilot initially. It's a personal decision for everyone but ultimately,
it would have been pretty dumb of me not to let someone with multiple
first flights and 18k total hours test fly it for me.
That brings up another great transition which was spending years
building in almost total isolation in one's garage/workshop, to finally
moving to an airport environment with so many people and personalities,
most all of whom are immersed in aviation and looking out for each
other. It's great to be in such a community.
I certainly had that surreal moment when looking out the windshield
realizing i wasn't looking at the back of the garage. Holy @#%@! This is
nuts! It's a shame more people don't get to experience that euphoria. I
never got it while flying Cessnas. ;)
You realize just how important all those little details are when flight
testing and stressing the plane you worked so hard to build. I am glad I
redid this part or that part instead of accepting good enough. 200 knots
sure sounds different than 120 in a C182. Hearing your HS buffeting when
doing stall testing, sure is a nervous moment. You don't want any doubts
while stress testing the plane.
Looking forward to meeting up with you too!
Jae
On 11/12/2011 8:24 AM, Pascal wrote:
> Jae;
> Congratulations! I know how you feel. I am about 2 weeks behind you.
> You finding that transitioning to being a pilot again is pretty easy
> in the -10? I did the transition training with Alex in June, I
> encourage everyone to get some time in a -10 before flying it alone,
> makes for a much easier first flight.
> Other than the usual high oil temps and CHT on the first couple of
> flights as the engine breaks in, the plane has been solid.
> Don McDonald has been a great mentor to me and I am so indebted to his
> patience, guidance and kindness the last couple of years, Jesse Saint
> was a great resource for avionics, Tim Olson and Deems were great in
> feedback along the early stages of building . They are just an example
> of all those who have been there to answer my questions the last 4
> years of my building. Hard to grasp that I am flying the aluminum that
> arrived at my garage back in 2007. I was self build the whole way and
> loved every step, although I sure did stress myself over every detail,
> now that is paying off for me and I am quite happy with my doing it at
> the time, because I sure dont want to deal with it NOW!!
> Enjoy the flight and scenery. My scenery is hills and mountains north
> of San Diego, actually the same area the CAP uses for SAR training, so
> I should be mountain flying qualified and dead bored of all the rocks
> when my phase 1 is over, but I sure will enjoy the flight. There is so
> much to learn about the plane. As a fellow mentor has told me, you
> will always learn something even after flying the plane for a year.
> If youre ever in SoCal, lets hook up! Thanks for the feedback on the
> Skyview rpm issue
> Group;
> Looking forward to following in Tims journeys along the country, I
> have two daughters, and a wife that wants to learn how to fly, so Im
> off to a great start! When we make the trip around the country and
> finish at Osh next summer I hope Ill meet many of you along the way.
> I plan 1 fly-in a year, it will be West Coast/Arizona but I will make
> it a point to meet and greet anyone there, just as Deems and others
> did for me along the way as a builder.
> Pascal
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jchang10
> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2011 9:58 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: 40533 First Flight
> #40533 had its first flight a few weeks ago on 10/19/11 after 5 years
> and 11
> months of building. (The slow build option added at least 2 years in my
> case.) The announcement is a bit overdue, but it sure has been a busy few
> weeks of test flying, taking panels and cowling on and off, and
> transitioning to being a pilot again.
> The plane flies straight, level, and oh so fast and has met or
> exceeded so
> many expectations. It truly is a wonderful feeling to have finally gotten
> here. Thanks go out to all those people in this wonderful community that
> have provided guidance, answered stupid questions :), and otherwise
> contributed their knowledge to the collective knowledge base over the
> years.
> I hope to meet some of you in some future fly-ins now that i have a
> means of
> getting there! :)
> Jae
> Phase 1
> Read this topic online here:
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=357535#357535
> ============
> Lists This Month --
> (And Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!) Click on about provided
> www.aeroelectric.com www.buildersbooks.com www.homebuilthelp.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution sp; -Matt
> Dralle, List Admin. ============= RV10-List Email Forum -
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List ============= sp; -
> MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - ============= sp; - List Contribution Web Site
> - sp; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution ============
> *
>
>
> *
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
I feel a little sad. There was a time (30 years ago) when Jepp offered a superior
product at a competitive price. But they failed to adapt to the changing technology,
and now they seem to have joined the many other companies that make
money buy obtaining and maintaining monopolies.
[that's not a typo, I meant "buy", not "by"; as in, lobbying and lawyers]
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=357845#357845
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Kelly, whazt you say is true, legally. My problem with this move is
that it compromises safety when we (GA) refuse to pay higher rates to
the one or two 'sources' for charts or chart data (moving map) and fly
with outdated info. It's the same scenario with user fees.
If we already have subscriptions to chart data (foreflight, GPS data
etc.) then I see a big problem as they won't be able to compete with the
two probable companies (Garmin and Jepp) leaving a big monopoly with no
competition or price controls. I only see spiraling operating costs for
us (the consumer) since the already high subscription price will only go
higher due to the companies passing on the cost to us, the consumers.
I wrote AOPA Safety explaining my position and asked for contact info
for the members of the congressional aviation subcommittee.
I think it's a good idea for everyone else to do the same. If this
can't be killed, I see a proportionate rise in the accident rate in our
future.
Linn
On 11/14/2011 11:39 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen<apilot2@gmail.com>
>
> You have a Catch 22. You only need what you can't remember. The FAR is
> for preflight action to review all available information. For Part 91
> there is no chart requirement, just you need to remember everything
> you saw on the chart. If you have the data in you glass panel, and
> you have an electronic backup, whether that is an iPad or other
> device, you would seem to have all the memory refreshing tools you
> need.
snip!
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens |
Geoff,
How 'bout a picture? Maybe a before and after.....
"Enquiring minds"
Ralph
-----Original Message-----
>From: aerosport1 <g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
>Sent: Nov 13, 2011 9:53 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RV10-List: Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens
>
>
>Got my panel upgraded with the new AFS 5500 screens. The new screens
>are awesome. A little learning curve from the 4500S screens. Rob has done a great
job with the new screens. The user interface is really nice.
>It takes playing with them and understanding the layout. Once you understand them
it is really easy and well organized. The more I played with them the more
I like them. I decided to stay with the same size screens as the 4500S. The 5600
would be wonderful but did not feel like
>redoing the entire panel at this time.
>
>They have some great features and upgrades. Here are a couple pictures.
>I only have about 30 minutes flying them because of really bad winds here in Ohio
the last 2 days. Another thing is the AFS support is fantastic.
>
>Geoff
>
>--------
>Geoff Combs
> RV-10 QB N829GW
>Flying
>40033
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=357787#357787
>
>
>Attachments:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com//files/5500_2_142.jpg
>http://forums.matronics.com//files/5500_1_172.jpg
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Please, no disparagement here. Remember, corporations have the same
rights as individuals to influence .gov, the Supreme Court said so.
Bill "coming on board just as the free ride comes to an end" Watson
On 11/14/2011 10:50 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
> Why do I suspect that Garmin's lobbyists are marching lockstep with
> Jeppesen?
>
> On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 8:38 AM, John Ackerman <johnag5b@cableone.net
> <mailto:johnag5b@cableone.net>> wrote:
>
> <johnag5b@cableone.net <mailto:johnag5b@cableone.net>>
>
> How much better this world would be without Jepp...
> Just another corporation with a strong lobby.
>
>
> On Nov 14, 2011, at 7:31 AM, Tim Olson wrote:
>
> <mailto:Tim@myrv10.com>>
> >
> > Kind of makes you wonder how hard Jeppesen lobbied for that,
> > doesn't it?
> >
> > If it were purely a money issue, they could have charged
> > a subscription fee to individuals. Now individuals can't
> > download at all...so no matter which option you go with,
> > you have to pay. Hopefully the cost will be small enough
> > to the entities that the pricing structure doesn't change
> > much, since the feds aren't allowed to "profit" from it.
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 13
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| Subject: | Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens |
It is at the bottom of the page
Geoff Combs
President
614-834-5227p
614-834-5230f
www.aerosportmodeling.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph E. Capen
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens
--> <recapen@earthlink.net>
Geoff,
How 'bout a picture? Maybe a before and after.....
"Enquiring minds"
Ralph
-----Original Message-----
>From: aerosport1 <g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
>Sent: Nov 13, 2011 9:53 PM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RV10-List: Panel Upgrade AFS 5500S screens
>
>--> <g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
>
>Got my panel upgraded with the new AFS 5500 screens. The new screens
>are awesome. A little learning curve from the 4500S screens. Rob has done a
great job with the new screens. The user interface is really nice.
>It takes playing with them and understanding the layout. Once you
>understand them it is really easy and well organized. The more I played
with them the more I like them. I decided to stay with the same size screens
as the 4500S. The 5600 would be wonderful but did not feel like redoing the
entire panel at this time.
>
>They have some great features and upgrades. Here are a couple pictures.
>I only have about 30 minutes flying them because of really bad winds here
in Ohio the last 2 days. Another thing is the AFS support is fantastic.
>
>Geoff
>
>--------
>Geoff Combs
> RV-10 QB N829GW
>Flying
>40033
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=357787#357787
>
>
>Attachments:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com//files/5500_2_142.jpg
>http://forums.matronics.com//files/5500_1_172.jpg
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Can you share you names when you get them.
Rob Kermanj
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 14, 2011, at 2:24 PM, Linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> Kelly, whazt you say is true, legally. My problem with this move is that it
compromises safety when we (GA) refuse to pay higher rates to the one or two 'sources'
for charts or chart data (moving map) and fly with outdated info. It's
the same scenario with user fees.
>
> If we already have subscriptions to chart data (foreflight, GPS data etc.) then
I see a big problem as they won't be able to compete with the two probable
companies (Garmin and Jepp) leaving a big monopoly with no competition or price
controls. I only see spiraling operating costs for us (the consumer) since
the already high subscription price will only go higher due to the companies passing
on the cost to us, the consumers.
>
> I wrote AOPA Safety explaining my position and asked for contact info for the
members of the congressional aviation subcommittee.
> I think it's a good idea for everyone else to do the same. If this can't be
killed, I see a proportionate rise in the accident rate in our future.
> Linn
>
>
> On 11/14/2011 11:39 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen<apilot2@gmail.com>
>>
>> You have a Catch 22. You only need what you can't remember. The FAR is
>> for preflight action to review all available information. For Part 91
>> there is no chart requirement, just you need to remember everything
>> you saw on the chart. If you have the data in you glass panel, and
>> you have an electronic backup, whether that is an iPad or other
>> device, you would seem to have all the memory refreshing tools you
>> need.
> snip!
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: The rising cost of GA |
Sometimes I get frustrated with the people that keep asking me for
help!!! Here's the answer I got from AOPA:
Linn,
Thank you for contacting the Pilot Information Center. AOPA will be investigating
this issue in the near term, initially to gather all the details, and then
decide on a course of action that may include a request for members to contact
their elected representatives. You may find all House and Senate aviation committee
members and contact information through their respective web sites - house.gov
and senate.gov.
Craig Brown
Sr. Technical Specialist
Government Affairs - Pilot Information Center
ATP/A&P/CFI
800-USA-AOPA
Basically a 'go find it yourself'. :-(
My reply was that they should be a little more responsive with a canned list.
Since they're too busy to send me a list maybe I'm too busy to send the subcommittee
an email!
Linn
On 11/14/2011 6:31 PM, Rob Kermanj wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Rob Kermanj<flysrv10@gmail.com>
>
> Can you share you names when you get them.
>
> Rob Kermanj
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Nov 14, 2011, at 2:24 PM, Linn Walters<pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Linn Walters<pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
>>
>> Kelly, whazt you say is true, legally. My problem with this move is that it
compromises safety when we (GA) refuse to pay higher rates to the one or two
'sources' for charts or chart data (moving map) and fly with outdated info. It's
the same scenario with user fees.
>>
>> If we already have subscriptions to chart data (foreflight, GPS data etc.) then
I see a big problem as they won't be able to compete with the two probable
companies (Garmin and Jepp) leaving a big monopoly with no competition or price
controls. I only see spiraling operating costs for us (the consumer) since
the already high subscription price will only go higher due to the companies
passing on the cost to us, the consumers.
>>
>> I wrote AOPA Safety explaining my position and asked for contact info for the
members of the congressional aviation subcommittee.
>> I think it's a good idea for everyone else to do the same. If this can't be
killed, I see a proportionate rise in the accident rate in our future.
>> Linn
>>
>>
>> On 11/14/2011 11:39 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen<apilot2@gmail.com>
>>>
>>> You have a Catch 22. You only need what you can't remember. The FAR is
>>> for preflight action to review all available information. For Part 91
>>> there is no chart requirement, just you need to remember everything
>>> you saw on the chart. If you have the data in you glass panel, and
>>> you have an electronic backup, whether that is an iPad or other
>>> device, you would seem to have all the memory refreshing tools you
>>> need.
>> snip!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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