Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:12 AM - Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals (Robin Marks)
2. 04:06 AM - Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals (Bill Watson)
3. 04:34 AM - Re: Turboprop RV10 (tahoe9813)
4. 04:36 AM - Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals (bob-tcw)
5. 05:36 AM - Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals (jkreidler)
6. 06:34 AM - Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals (hotwheels)
7. 07:39 AM - Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals (johngoodman)
8. 01:29 PM - Re: Re: Turboprop RV10 (Robin Marks)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Door Gutter and McMaster Seals |
We were the first to use the McM seal. We started a grinder and added a spa
cer for even reveal. Seemed to work out well on the old top.
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Sean Stephens
Sent: Monday, April 09, 2012 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals
Ivan's pictures were a big help. After looking at them and the video it se
ems like the following rough steps can be taken.
- Once the doors are trimmed to fit, mark the interior edge of the gutter f
or a consistent gap (less than 3/8 for the bulb)
- Sand down the radius to marks on interior edge of gutter and trim/sand gu
tter width to dimensions at various locations given by Ivan
- Fill/sand to achieve necessary gutter thickness of 1/4 inch for attaching
seal
Thanks for pointing me to Ivan's pictures.
-Sean
On 4/9/12 9:27 PM, Bob Leffler wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Bob Leffler<rv@thelefflers.com>
>
> Be careful on ordering the trim. If I remember Les's doc, the picture sh
owed a version of the seal with the barb on the exterior. You'll want the
version that has the barb on the inside of the door frame. You don't want t
he barb to add thickness to the seal into between the free and the door.
>
> Go to Ivan Kristense's phanfare.com photo site. In the middle o f his d
oor photos, there is a video showing in detail how to trim the door gutter.
>
> I cut off the full radius and my doors are very tight fitting with the se
als on. I have a pink top.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Apr 9, 2012, at 8:48 PM, Sean Stephens<sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean
>> --> Stephens<sean@stephensville.com>
>>
>> I've read Les' document on using McMaster Carr door seals. He trimmed o
ff the entire radius on the door gutter. I ordered the same 1/4 inch with
3/8 inch bulb seals he used.
>>
>> I have yet to trim off the full radius as he did, but it seems that if I
do, there will me no way the 3/8 inch bulb will be enough to actually touc
h and seal against the door. Seems the gap between the gutter and the door
would be too large.
>>
>> His doc showed the older green canopy instead of the pink. Is there a d
ifference there? Did others using the McMaster seals trim off the full rad
ius on the gutter and have it work with the 3/8 inch bulb?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> -Sean #40303 (very dim light at the end of the tunnel)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals |
That all sounds about right. Getting the barb on the right side helps.
Two other things:
If you plan any sort of fabric covering for the door, you have to account for that
in the bulb gap. Flightline's interior would be an example
Don't trim for final length until you are absolutely finished with the gap work.
Any gap work increases the length of seal. You can patch it, or better yet
just buy the full 50/100 foot length so you can do it 2 or 3 times, then sell
extra to a friend. DAHIK
Bill
Sent from my iPad
On Apr 10, 2012, at 12:15 AM, Sean Stephens <sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>
> Ivan's pictures were a big help. After looking at them and the video it seems
like the following rough steps can be taken.
>
> - Once the doors are trimmed to fit, mark the interior edge of the gutter for
a consistent gap (less than 3/8 for the bulb)
> - Sand down the radius to marks on interior edge of gutter and trim/sand gutter
width to dimensions at various locations given by Ivan
> - Fill/sand to achieve necessary gutter thickness of 1/4 inch for attaching seal
>
> Thanks for pointing me to Ivan's pictures.
>
> -Sean
>
> On 4/9/12 9:27 PM, Bob Leffler wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Bob Leffler<rv@thelefflers.com>
>>
>> Be careful on ordering the trim. If I remember Les's doc, the picture showed
a version of the seal with the barb on the exterior. You'll want the version
that has the barb on the inside of the door frame. You don't want the barb to
add thickness to the seal into between the free and the door.
>>
>> Go to Ivan Kristense's phanfare.com photo site. In the middle o f his door
photos, there is a video showing in detail how to trim the door gutter.
>>
>> I cut off the full radius and my doors are very tight fitting with the seals
on. I have a pink top.
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Apr 9, 2012, at 8:48 PM, Sean Stephens<sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>>
>>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens<sean@stephensville.com>
>>>
>>> I've read Les' document on using McMaster Carr door seals. He trimmed off
the entire radius on the door gutter. I ordered the same 1/4 inch with 3/8 inch
bulb seals he used.
>>>
>>> I have yet to trim off the full radius as he did, but it seems that if I do,
there will me no way the 3/8 inch bulb will be enough to actually touch and
seal against the door. Seems the gap between the gutter and the door would be
too large.
>>>
>>> His doc showed the older green canopy instead of the pink. Is there a difference
there? Did others using the McMaster seals trim off the full radius on
the gutter and have it work with the 3/8 inch bulb?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> -Sean #40303 (very dim light at the end of the tunnel)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Turboprop RV10 |
I saw it at SnF. It was pretty impressive, and there was a ton of room around the
engine--especially the back.
I would love to have one, but I think it might be a bit pricey.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370430#370430
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals |
I used the McMaster seals as well, but did the following:
After grinding the gutter lip down, I took a scrap piece of door seal about
3 foot long and filled it (about 50% full) with epoxy/structural filler mix
and applied it to the door frame. When cured I had the perfect mating
detail for the door seal as part of the cabin top. Step and repeat
around the door frame opening then discard the scrap seal and use new seal
for the final installation.
The following album has the details, seal pictures start about 1/3 of
the way into the album.
https://picasaweb.google.com/aviator1964/DoorsLatchesSeals?authuser=0&feat=directlink
Bob Newman
N541RV flying
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Watson
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 7:04 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals
That all sounds about right. Getting the barb on the right side helps.
Two other things:
If you plan any sort of fabric covering for the door, you have to account
for that in the bulb gap. Flightline's interior would be an example
Don't trim for final length until you are absolutely finished with the gap
work. Any gap work increases the length of seal. You can patch it, or
better yet just buy the full 50/100 foot length so you can do it 2 or 3
times, then sell extra to a friend. DAHIK
Bill
Sent from my iPad
On Apr 10, 2012, at 12:15 AM, Sean Stephens <sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>
> Ivan's pictures were a big help. After looking at them and the video it
> seems like the following rough steps can be taken.
>
> - Once the doors are trimmed to fit, mark the interior edge of the gutter
> for a consistent gap (less than 3/8 for the bulb)
> - Sand down the radius to marks on interior edge of gutter and trim/sand
> gutter width to dimensions at various locations given by Ivan
> - Fill/sand to achieve necessary gutter thickness of 1/4 inch for
> attaching seal
>
> Thanks for pointing me to Ivan's pictures.
>
> -Sean
>
> On 4/9/12 9:27 PM, Bob Leffler wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Bob Leffler<rv@thelefflers.com>
>>
>> Be careful on ordering the trim. If I remember Les's doc, the picture
>> showed a version of the seal with the barb on the exterior. You'll want
>> the version that has the barb on the inside of the door frame. You don't
>> want the barb to add thickness to the seal into between the free and the
>> door.
>>
>> Go to Ivan Kristense's phanfare.com photo site. In the middle o f his
>> door photos, there is a video showing in detail how to trim the door
>> gutter.
>>
>> I cut off the full radius and my doors are very tight fitting with the
>> seals on. I have a pink top.
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Apr 9, 2012, at 8:48 PM, Sean Stephens<sean@stephensville.com> wrote:
>>
>>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens<sean@stephensville.com>
>>>
>>> I've read Les' document on using McMaster Carr door seals. He trimmed
>>> off the entire radius on the door gutter. I ordered the same 1/4 inch
>>> with 3/8 inch bulb seals he used.
>>>
>>> I have yet to trim off the full radius as he did, but it seems that if I
>>> do, there will me no way the 3/8 inch bulb will be enough to actually
>>> touch and seal against the door. Seems the gap between the gutter and
>>> the door would be too large.
>>>
>>> His doc showed the older green canopy instead of the pink. Is there a
>>> difference there? Did others using the McMaster seals trim off the full
>>> radius on the gutter and have it work with the 3/8 inch bulb?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> -Sean #40303 (very dim light at the end of the tunnel)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals |
We each build our own airplanes and make our own decisions please dont take this
as criticism just food for thought. I had a conversation with Ken K. regarding
drilling holes in the gutter in order to add sun visors the cabin top, specifically
the cabin top posts. Ken indicated that one of the challenges in the
design was getting the cabin top to pass the inverted drop test. He was visibly
uncomfortable with the idea of drilling any holes in the gutter to mount
visors, for those who have had conversations with Ken K. in person you may know
the wince he gives.
By removing the entire inside radius of the gutter in order to install the McMaster
Carr style seal you are significantly changing the section modulus of the
cabin top post and COULD be significantly increasing the likelihood of a cabin
top failure in a roll over type accident. Just something to consider as you
make what may seem to be a harmless improvement to the design.
Again, these are your decisions I am only trying to provide an alternate perspective
to the decision.
Thanks Jason
--------
Jason Kreidler
4 Partner Build - Sheboygan Falls, WI
Tony Kolar, Kyle Hokel, Wayne Elser, Jason Kreidler
N44YH - Flying - #40617
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370434#370434
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals |
Maybe it's obvious, but maybe not... After cutting the door edges flush and sanding,
I used an ~18" section of door seal as a mold. Filling each section with
structural epoxy made for a really tight fit and minimal additional prep work
to get the seal right. Just add cosmetic filler to blend into the cabin top and
door edges. I bought lots more edge than required as it tends to get tired
and look wavy after fitting lots of times (you can see some of that in the photos).
Save the good stuff for the end.
Regards,
Jay
finishing up
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370436#370436
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Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Door Gutter and McMaster Seals |
I ran into the same problem with fabric covering the door - I didn't account for
it and ended up with the door seal too tight, so I had to trim the fabric short.
As a side note, everyone please try to size down your photos before posting, it
takes too much side scrolling to read the message. All it takes is one huge photo.
John
--------
#40572 Phase One complete and flying.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370444#370444
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Turboprop RV10 |
And thirsty too... I seem to recall ~17 GPH of JetA. I have a long taxi at 2.3
GPH. 17 GPH would not be very economical.
Robin
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of tahoe9813
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 4:34 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Turboprop RV10
I saw it at SnF. It was pretty impressive, and there was a ton of room around the
engine--especially the back.
I would love to have one, but I think it might be a bit pricey.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370430#370430
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