Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 09:19 AM - Re: Flight into NY airspace. (Bill Watson)
2. 09:21 AM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Bill Watson)
3. 10:15 AM - Jepp Chelton updates (DLM)
4. 11:37 AM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Curtis Groote)
5. 11:39 AM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Curtis Groote)
6. 11:41 AM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Curtis Groote)
7. 11:43 AM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Curtis Groote)
8. 12:20 PM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Jae Chang)
9. 02:41 PM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Kelly McMullen)
10. 04:06 PM - Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Bob Turner)
11. 04:43 PM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Jerry Hansen)
12. 05:58 PM - Re: Low Fuel Sensor Location (Bob Leffler)
13. 07:02 PM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Bill Watson)
14. 07:17 PM - Re: Garmin competition (davidsoutpost@comcast.net)
15. 08:02 PM - Re: Low Fuel Sensor Location (Tom Koelzer)
16. 08:05 PM - Re: Garmin competition (DLM)
17. 08:20 PM - AZ visitors (DLM)
18. 08:39 PM - Re: AZ visitors (Rick Lark)
19. 10:30 PM - Re: Garmin competition (Pascal)
20. 11:41 PM - Re: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon (Albert Gardner)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Flight into NY airspace. |
Yes, KHPN has become our favored NYC landing spot. Panorama is very
nice and friendly. Don't have an urgent need to leave on time... delays
sometimes mimic the majors.
On 5/3/2012 7:45 PM, Albert Gardner wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner"<ibspud@roadrunner.com>
>
> We spent a week in NYC after landing at Westchester Co. HPN, tied down at
> Panorama where they treated us well and took us over to White Plains to
> catch the Metro North line for a fast trip down to the city. Fly SW 12 miles
> to enter the Skyline Route at Alpine Tower for a flight down the Hudson.
> First Flight FFA at Kill Devil Hills is 300 miles south. Just a suggestion.
> :^)
> Albert Gardner
> N991RV
> Yuma, AZ
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few flights
out with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty landscape as I
understand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
Thanks
Bill Watson
On 5/3/2012 7:46 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote:
> Just changing the subject. It's all very interesting conversation.
>
> On 5/3/2012 6:36 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Bob Turner"<bobturner@alum.rpi.edu>
>>
>> re: Grand Canyon:
>>
>> I cannot say it enough, skip GCN (Grand Canyon Airport). It is expensive, 100LL
very expensive, not at all GA friendly. It caters to the tour operators.
>>
>> Instead go to Valle (40G), 25 miles or so south of GCN. Very GA friendly, reasonable
gas prices. If you want to tour the park on the ground the FBO has a
couple of reasonably priced rental cars (reserve in advance). There is an adequate
motel/restaurant within walking distance of the airport.
>>
>> The airport density altitude can be high, but no problem for an RV as long as
you're under gross.
>>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Jepp Chelton updates |
Just received my annual renewal for the Chelton DB updates; price has now
moved to $605 plus sales tax. Apparently they have a store in AZ and want to
tax; total is now $644.39. I inquired about single updates and that will be
$170 each and available within one hour of the call to Jepp. They will still
be downloaded to the Smart media card. Considering I take at most two long
IFR trips a year, this is an option I am considering.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
I've been to grand canyon airport (gcn) twice in the last year, the last bei
ng six days ago. my experience was different. they were very helpful, arra
nged a cab for us to the rim, answered questions, and gave good advice. Fuel
is relatively expensive so you preplan your fuel stops.
Curtis Groote
On May 4, 2012, at 9:19 AM, Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com> wrote:
> Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
>
> I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few flights o
ut with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty landscape as I unders
tand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
>
> Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Bill Watson
>
> On 5/3/2012 7:46 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote:
>>
>> Just changing the subject. It's all very interesting conversation.
>>
>> On 5/3/2012 6:36 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> re: Grand Canyon:
>>>
>>> I cannot say it enough, skip GCN (Grand Canyon Airport). It is expensive
, 100LL very expensive, not at all GA friendly. It caters to the tour operat
ors.
>>>
>>> Instead go to Valle (40G), 25 miles or so south of GCN. Very GA friendly
, reasonable gas prices. If you want to tour the park on the ground the FBO h
as a couple of reasonably priced rental cars (reserve in advance). There is a
n adequate motel/restaurant within walking distance of the airport.
>>>
>>> The airport density altitude can be high, but no problem for an RV as lo
ng as you're under gross.
>>>
>
>
>
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Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
I've been to grand canyon airport (gcn) twice in the last year, the last bei
ng six days ago. my experience was different. they were very helpful, arra
nged a cab for us to the rim, answered questions, and gave good advice. Fuel
is relatively expensive so you preplan your fuel stops.
Curtis Groote
On May 4, 2012, at 9:19 AM, Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com> wrote:
> Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
>
> I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few flights o
ut with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty landscape as I unders
tand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
>
> Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Bill Watson
>
> On 5/3/2012 7:46 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote:
>>
>> Just changing the subject. It's all very interesting conversation.
>>
>> On 5/3/2012 6:36 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> re: Grand Canyon:
>>>
>>> I cannot say it enough, skip GCN (Grand Canyon Airport). It is expensive
, 100LL very expensive, not at all GA friendly. It caters to the tour operat
ors.
>>>
>>> Instead go to Valle (40G), 25 miles or so south of GCN. Very GA friendly
, reasonable gas prices. If you want to tour the park on the ground the FBO h
as a couple of reasonably priced rental cars (reserve in advance). There is a
n adequate motel/restaurant within walking distance of the airport.
>>>
>>> The airport density altitude can be high, but no problem for an RV as lo
ng as you're under gross.
>>>
>
>
>
==========================
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==========================
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>
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Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
I've been to grand canyon airport (gcn) twice in the last year, the last bei
ng six days ago. my experience was different. they were very helpful, arra
nged a cab for us to the rim, answered questions, and gave good advice. Fuel
is relatively expensive so you preplan your fuel stops.
Curtis Groote
On May 4, 2012, at 9:19 AM, Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com> wrote:
> Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
>
> I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few flights o
ut with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty landscape as I unders
tand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
>
> Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Bill Watson
>
> On 5/3/2012 7:46 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote:
>>
>> Just changing the subject. It's all very interesting conversation.
>>
>> On 5/3/2012 6:36 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> re: Grand Canyon:
>>>
>>> I cannot say it enough, skip GCN (Grand Canyon Airport). It is expensive
, 100LL very expensive, not at all GA friendly. It caters to the tour operat
ors.
>>>
>>> Instead go to Valle (40G), 25 miles or so south of GCN. Very GA friendly
, reasonable gas prices. If you want to tour the park on the ground the FBO h
as a couple of reasonably priced rental cars (reserve in advance). There is a
n adequate motel/restaurant within walking distance of the airport.
>>>
>>> The airport density altitude can be high, but no problem for an RV as lo
ng as you're under gross.
>>>
>
>
>
==========================
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==========================
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==========================
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>
>
>
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Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
I've been to grand canyon airport (gcn) twice in the last year, the last bei
ng six days ago. my experience was different. they were very helpful, arra
nged a cab for us to the rim, answered questions, and gave good advice. Fuel
is relatively expensive so you preplan your fuel stops.
Curtis Groote
On May 4, 2012, at 9:19 AM, Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com> wrote:
> Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
>
> I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few flights o
ut with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty landscape as I unders
tand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
>
> Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Bill Watson
>
> On 5/3/2012 7:46 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote:
>>
>> Just changing the subject. It's all very interesting conversation.
>>
>> On 5/3/2012 6:36 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> re: Grand Canyon:
>>>
>>> I cannot say it enough, skip GCN (Grand Canyon Airport). It is expensive
, 100LL very expensive, not at all GA friendly. It caters to the tour operat
ors.
>>>
>>> Instead go to Valle (40G), 25 miles or so south of GCN. Very GA friendly
, reasonable gas prices. If you want to tour the park on the ground the FBO h
as a couple of reasonably priced rental cars (reserve in advance). There is a
n adequate motel/restaurant within walking distance of the airport.
>>>
>>> The airport density altitude can be high, but no problem for an RV as lo
ng as you're under gross.
>>>
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
>
>
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Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
Grand Canyon is about 3.5 hrs flight time for me. That is absolutely
on my list of places to visit, hopefully, one day soon.
I hope you can give us some good pilot reports on your trip!
Jae
On 5/4/2012 9:19 AM, Bill Watson wrote:
> Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
>
> I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few
> flights out with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty
> landscape as I understand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
>
> Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Bill Watson
--
#40533 RV-10
First flight 10/19/2011
Phase 1 Done 11/26/2011
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
If you have need or space, there are probably a few of us locals available.
I'm at Chandler, KCHD.
On Fri, May 4, 2012 at 12:19 PM, Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com> wrote:
> Good idea Lyle, thanks. And thanks to all who have commented.
>
> I'm planning to spend a week in Phoenix and trying to plan a few flights
> out with friends. Again, Sedona is on the list (pretty landscape as I
> understand it) and the Grand Canyon (double ditto).
>
> Any useful details or alternate destinations welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Bill Watson
>
>
> On 5/3/2012 7:46 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote:
>
> Just changing the subject. It's all very interesting conversation.
>
> On 5/3/2012 6:36 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>
obturner@alum.rpi.edu>
>
> re: Grand Canyon:
>
> I cannot say it enough, skip GCN (Grand Canyon Airport). It is expensive,
100LL very expensive, not at all GA friendly. It caters to the tour operat
ors.
>
> Instead go to Valle (40G), 25 miles or so south of GCN. Very GA friendly,
reasonable gas prices. If you want to tour the park on the ground the FBO
has a couple of reasonably priced rental cars (reserve in advance). There i
s an adequate motel/restaurant within walking distance of the airport.
>
> The airport density altitude can be high, but no problem for an RV as lon
g as you're under gross.
>
>
> *
>
===========
>
===========
===========
===========
>
> *
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
I'm glad to hear things have improved - except for 100LL, which airnav reports
at $7.20 per gal.
I was there 3 (or was it 4?) years ago. No rental cars (still true, I think) and
maybe it was bad luck, but it took forever to get a cab, and that wasn't cheap.
Also, attempting to arrive or depart in the evening involved climbing a padlocked
chain link fence!
I'd still recommend Valle as an alternative. Much cheaper gas, and their rental
van was no more expensive than cab fare from KGCN. And it's only a 25 minute
or so ride from Valle to the park entrance.
Also, while you're at Valle, they have an interesting museum of old cars and a
couple of old planes.
And the local motel/restaurant is an okay place to RON.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372413#372413
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
First time there was 1974. Fuel around $1.60 per gal. Had a nice lunch.
Took off and flew (legally) down in the canyon (imprudent, yes) - the lower
you go the more impressive the scenery. Ah, the "good old days".
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Turner
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2012 4:05 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon
I'm glad to hear things have improved - except for 100LL, which airnav
reports at $7.20 per gal.
I was there 3 (or was it 4?) years ago. No rental cars (still true, I think)
and maybe it was bad luck, but it took forever to get a cab, and that wasn't
cheap.
Also, attempting to arrive or depart in the evening involved climbing a
padlocked chain link fence!
I'd still recommend Valle as an alternative. Much cheaper gas, and their
rental van was no more expensive than cab fare from KGCN. And it's only a 25
minute or so ride from Valle to the park entrance.
Also, while you're at Valle, they have an interesting museum of old cars and
a couple of old planes.
And the local motel/restaurant is an okay place to RON.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372413#372413
Message 12
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| Subject: | Low Fuel Sensor Location |
Attached is a photo that Scott Schmidt provided me several years ago. I put
mine in the same location.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Koelzer
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2012 10:00 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Low Fuel Sensor Location
Looking for information regarding where to locate low fuel sensor in inboard
tank ribs related to vertical height vs location. I am building tanks, would
like to drill and install before final assembly, have calculated a location
but would like to verify my results. Looking for fuel measurements once
installed. I have AE Fuel Guardian sensors.
Any related data would be appreciated.
Tom Koelzer
40950 Wings
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
I've started studying the airspace situation - it's worse than DC.
Seems like you must stay 2 or 3 thousand above the canyon at all times.
Will need to obtain the Grand Canyon sectional for details.
I'm assuming that flying over the area at 7 to 10 MSL is beautiful but
not thrilling which is fine. I'm thinking we may day trip it from
Phoenix. Just have to decide on a good place to stop on the ground.
Might be nice to overfly then land by the lake for lunch.
Bill
On 5/4/2012 7:42 PM, Jerry Hansen wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jerry Hansen"<jerry-hansen@cox.net>
>
> First time there was 1974. Fuel around $1.60 per gal. Had a nice lunch.
> Took off and flew (legally) down in the canyon (imprudent, yes) - the lower
> you go the more impressive the scenery. Ah, the "good old days".
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Garmin competition |
The more I look into this the better it sounds. I am about to pull the trigger
and order up my panel within the next month and had pretty much committed in my
mind to an IFR panel with an independent dual 10" Dynon system , Garmin SL30,
Garmin 430W , Garmin audio panel and mode S transponder. I have the Dynon servo's
installed but am more than willing to take a $$ hit and replace them GRT.
I wonder about the GPS updates and their availability/costs? Anyway's,,,,thanks
to bringing this up Bob,------------Now I have another decision to make!
David Clifford
RV-10 Builder
Howell, MI
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Turner" <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu>
Sent: Friday, May 4, 2012 12:30:35 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Garmin competition
Garmin has had a virtual monopoly on the IFR certified GPS market ever since they
were allowed to buy UPS (Apollo) Avionics. GRT has just announced their latest
EFIS, the HXr. But I think the real news is that GRT is also offering a remote
IFR certified GPS, for less than a G-400.
At last, some competition for Garmin!
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372382#372382
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Sensor Location |
Thanks Bob,
I'm planning to put my sensor in the same position fore and aft but probably an
inch or so lower to get warning at about 4 1/2 gal useable per my calculations.
Do you know what fuel level corresponds to the sensor location in the picture
you attached?
Tom
Message 16
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| Subject: | Garmin competition |
Remember the key is the DB updates as they go on forever.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
davidsoutpost@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2012 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Garmin competition
The more I look into this the better it sounds. I am about to pull the
trigger and order up my panel within the next month and had pretty much
committed in my mind to an IFR panel with an independent dual 10" Dynon
system , Garmin SL30, Garmin 430W , Garmin audio panel and mode S
transponder. I have the Dynon servo's installed but am more than willing to
take a $$ hit and replace them GRT. I wonder about the GPS updates and
their availability/costs? Anyway's,,,,thanks to bringing this up
Bob,------------Now I have another decision to make!
David Clifford
RV-10 Builder
Howell, MI
_____
From: "Bob Turner" <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu>
Sent: Friday, May 4, 2012 12:30:35 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Garmin competition
Garmin has had a virtual monopoly on the IFR certified GPS market ever since
they were allowed to buy UPS (Apollo) Avionics. GRT has just announced their
latest EFIS, the HXr. But I think the real news is that GRT is also offering
a remote IFR certified GPS, for less than a G-400.
At last, some competition for Garmin!
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372382#372382= -
List Contribution Web Site ; &nb=====================
Message 17
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For persons visiting AZ, you might want to consider La Posada either for a
meal or a night's stay in Winslow (KINW). The link for La Posada is
http://www.laposada.org/ . All the movie stars of the 1940s stayed there on
there train trips to/from California. Also I believe the Eagles were
"standin on the corner in Winslow Arizona"
Message 18
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"Also I believe the Eagles were =93standin on the corner in Winslow Arizona
=94
Good one Dave. One of my all time favorite bands. Now I know where that
phrase came from.....
Rick
#40956
Southampton, Ont
Fuse in progress
Do not archive
On Fri, May 4, 2012 at 11:19 PM, DLM <dlm34077@q.com> wrote:
> ** **
>
> For persons visiting AZ, you might want to consider La Posada either for
a
> meal or a night=92s stay in Winslow (KINW). The link for La Posada is
> http://www.laposada.org/ . All the movie stars of the 1940s stayed there
> on there train trips to/from ****California****. Also I believe the
> Eagles were =93standin on the corner in Winslow Arizona=94****
>
> *
>
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> *
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Garmin competition |
I have dual Dynons and they have been great! good company and they
address issues that develop. I would get on the Dynon forum and let them
know, as others have commented on the GRT as well
http://dynonavionics.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1332975573 let
Dynon know you are ready to drop the servos and go GRT if they
don=99t step up and keep up wih the GRT. Many have asked for IFR
however and Dynon has clearly stated they don=99t plan to go that
route.
Pascal
From: davidsoutpost@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2012 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Garmin competition
The more I look into this the better it sounds. I am about to pull the
trigger and order up my panel within the next month and had pretty much
committed in my mind to an IFR panel with an independent dual 10" Dynon
system , Garmin SL30, Garmin 430W , Garmin audio panel and mode S
transponder. I have the Dynon servo's installed but am more than
willing to take a $$ hit and replace them GRT. I wonder about the GPS
updates and their availability/costs? Anyway's,,,,thanks to bringing
this up Bob,------------Now I have another decision to make!
David Clifford
RV-10 Builder
Howell, MI
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
From: "Bob Turner" <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu>
Sent: Friday, May 4, 2012 12:30:35 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Garmin competition
Garmin has had a virtual monopoly on the IFR certified GPS market ever
since they were allowed to buy UPS (Apollo) Avionics. GRT has just
announced their latest EFIS, the HXr. But I think the real news is that
GRT is also offering a remote IFR certified GPS, for less than a G-400.
At last, some competition for Garmin!
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372382#372382=
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| Subject: | Re: Flight over Grand Canyon |
Grand Canyon is 9 and above depending on region. On the other hand no F-16's
will come and check you out but plenty of air tour operators to/from Vegas
and St George. Monitor the chart freqs and you will have no problem. You
will get some excellent pics overflying the canyon at the required altitudes
though. If you land at any of the area strips low level flight in the
vicinity of the airport is authorized. On the other hand, there are plenty
of tree huggers down there to complain.
Albert Gardner
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Watson
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2012 7:00 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Flight over Grand Canyon
I've started studying the airspace situation - it's worse than DC.
Seems like you must stay 2 or 3 thousand above the canyon at all times.
Will need to obtain the Grand Canyon sectional for details.
I'm assuming that flying over the area at 7 to 10 MSL is beautiful but not
thrilling which is fine. I'm thinking we may day trip it from Phoenix.
Just have to decide on a good place to stop on the ground.
Might be nice to overfly then land by the lake for lunch.
Bill
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