---------------------------------------------------------- RV10-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 02/15/13: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:43 AM - Re: Blown out Wheel pant (nukeflyboy) 2. 12:25 PM - Gear leg stiffeners (Bruce Johnson) 3. 12:34 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Linn) 4. 01:05 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Bruce Johnson) 5. 01:06 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Carl Froehlich) 6. 01:14 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Pascal) 7. 01:32 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Linn) 8. 01:33 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Bruce Johnson) 9. 01:35 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Jayrowe) 10. 01:45 PM - Baggage Area Weight (Bob Turner) 11. 01:49 PM - The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane (Jeff Carpenter) 12. 04:42 PM - Re: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane (Kelly McMullen) 13. 04:51 PM - Re: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane (Linn) 14. 04:54 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (Lew Gallagher) 15. 05:18 PM - Re: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane (Robin Marks) 16. 08:00 PM - N880EE Exposed (Robin Marks) 17. 08:06 PM - Re: N880EE Exposed (Matt Dralle) 18. 08:07 PM - Re: N880EE Exposed (Pascal) 19. 09:48 PM - Re: Baggage Area Weight (rv10flyer) 20. 09:57 PM - Re: Gear leg stiffeners (rv10flyer) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:43:23 AM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Blown out Wheel pant From: "nukeflyboy" Sean, You are not alone. The same thing happened to me. The clearance on one side was too small, about finger thickness, and the tire grabbed it. This can happen without much notice either - I found it on a preflight. Don McDonald had cautioned me about the minimal clearance and I filed it away for a future fix. I was getting ready for my first flight and didn't want anything else in the way at the moment. Then I forgot about it. Bit me around 70 hours. I keep my mains at 42 pounds. -------- Dave Moore RV-6 flying RV-10 QB - flying Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394348#394348 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:25:48 PM PST US From: Bruce Johnson Subject: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners Does anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard about ?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until today. Ful l fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my passenger and sti ll had a shake and then landed without one. Took off again and it was just a minute shake, landed with none.-Weird-after all these take offs and l andings for it to start now. I am going to pull the fairings off and check for other things, but while I am at it I might put the stiffeners on. Thank s in advance-=0A=0ADo not archive=0ABruce Johnson ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:34:23 PM PST US From: Linn Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners You might have nosegear shimmy ..... easy for someone on the ground to see. If so, just tighten up the nose fork nut so that a spring scale reads 25-30 Lbs when pulled at the axle. You may need to add Belleville washers for more dampening. The washers 'wear in' a little after initial tightening. Linn On 2/15/2013 3:24 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: > Does anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard > about?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until > today. Full fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my > passenger and still had a shake and then landed without one. Took off > again and it was just a minute shake, landed with none. Weird after > all these take offs and landings for it to start now. I am going to > pull the fairings off and check for other things, but while I am at it > I might put the stiffeners on. Thanks in advance > > Do not archive > Bruce Johnson > * > > > * > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:05:41 PM PST US From: Bruce Johnson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners I'll double check, but it-sure-felt like it was the mains. Like I said never happened before-=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Linn =0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Friday, February 15, 2013 1:33 PM=0ASubject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners=0A =0A=0AYou might have nosegear shimmy ..... easy for someone on the ground to see.- If so, just tighten up the nose fork nut so that a spring scale reads 25-30 Lbs when pulled at the axle.- You may need to add Belleville washers for more dampening.- The washers 'wear in' a little after initial tightening.=0ALinn=0A=0A=0AOn 2/15/2013 3:24 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote:=0A =0ADoes anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard ab out?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until today. Full fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my passenger and still had a shake and then landed without one. Took off again and it was ju st a minute shake, landed with none.-Weird-after all these take offs an d landings for it to start now. I am going to pull the fairings off and che ck for other things, but while I am at it I might put the stiffeners on. Th anks in advance-=0A>=0A>=0A>Do not archive=0A>Bruce Johnson=0A>No virus f ============= ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:06:38 PM PST US From: "Carl Froehlich" Subject: RE: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners Yep - at 65 hours now and just did the third nose gear fork nut tighten. On my 8A this eventually stabilized out so I just check it at each annual. Carl From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 3:33 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners You might have nosegear shimmy ..... easy for someone on the ground to see. If so, just tighten up the nose fork nut so that a spring scale reads 25-30 Lbs when pulled at the axle. You may need to add Belleville washers for more dampening. The washers 'wear in' a little after initial tightening. Linn On 2/15/2013 3:24 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: Does anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard about?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until today. Full fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my passenger and still had a shake and then landed without one. Took off again and it was just a minute shake, landed with none. Weird after all these take offs and landings for it to start now. I am going to pull the fairings off and check for other things, but while I am at it I might put the stiffeners on. Thanks in advance Do not archive Bruce Johnson No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 02/15/13 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:14:00 PM PST US From: "Pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners Bruce; I just had the same situation last week. I added some air to the front tire and verified the torque was right on the fork nut, but for some reason the plane shakes at a certain speed when I taxi now. I thought it was the taxiway, but than it occurred to me that I have been over the same taxiway in the past without an issue, so I don=99t know why it does it now, no issue on takeoff or landing, only when I do a taxi at a job pace. From: Bruce Johnson Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 1:04 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners I'll double check, but it sure felt like it was the mains. Like I said never happened before ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- From: Linn Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 1:33 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners You might have nosegear shimmy ..... easy for someone on the ground to see. If so, just tighten up the nose fork nut so that a spring scale reads 25-30 Lbs when pulled at the axle. You may need to add Belleville washers for more dampening. The washers 'wear in' a little after initial tightening. Linn On 2/15/2013 3:24 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: Does anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard about?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until today. Full fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my passenger and still had a shake and then landed without one. Took off again and it was just a minute shake, landed with none. Weird after all these take offs and landings for it to start now. I am going to pull the fairings off and check for other things, but while I am at it I might put the stiffeners on. Thanks in advance Do not archive Bruce Johnson No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 02/15/13 < font> ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 01:32:49 PM PST US From: Linn Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners If you have nose gear shimmy and add air over your normal pressure, you're setting yourself up for tire wear in the center treads. When I was a baby pilot my mentor said to air up the tire so the outside tread just lifts off the pavement. You don't have to measure the pressure. It stands to reason that one tire pressure won't fit a plane that weighs lots Vs. one that weighs little. This filling method has worked for me. If you have a problem with vibration on the ground, get an observer to watch and see what's going on. Mains can have tracking problems, nose can shimmy and both will suffer from out-of-balance conditions. You really can't tell what's out of whack because both nose and mains transmit their vibration to the fuselage .... and then to your butt. Linn On 2/15/2013 4:13 PM, Pascal wrote: > Bruce; > I just had the same situation last week. I added some air to the front > tire and verified the torque was right on the fork nut, but for some > reason the plane shakes at a certain speed when I taxi now. I thought > it was the taxiway, but than it occurred to me that I have been over > the same taxiway in the past without an issue, so I don=99t know why it > does it now, no issue on takeoff or landing, only when I do a taxi at > a job pace. > *From:* Bruce Johnson > *Sent:* Friday, February 15, 2013 1:04 PM > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners > I'll double check, but it surefelt like it was the mains. Like I said > never happened before > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- - > *From:* Linn > *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Friday, February 15, 2013 1:33 PM > *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners > You might have nosegear shimmy ..... easy for someone on the ground to > see. If so, just tighten up the nose fork nut so that a spring scale > reads 25-30 Lbs when pulled at the axle. You may need to add > Belleville washers for more dampening. The washers 'wear in' a little > after initial tightening. > Linn > > > On 2/15/2013 3:24 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: >> Does anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard >> about?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until >> today. Full fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my >> passenger and still had a shake and then landed without one. Took off >> again and it was just a minute shake, landed with none. Weirdafter >> all these take offs and landings for it to start now. I am going to >> pull the fairings off and check for other things, but while I am at >> it I might put the stiffeners on. Thanks in advance >> >> Do not archive >> Bruce Johnson >> * >> >> >> * >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> 02/15/13 > > *< font>* > > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matron ics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com /c > * > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > * > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 13 > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 01:33:18 PM PST US From: Bruce Johnson Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners Mine is about 45 mph on take off and landing, taxi is fine. And it shakes, I almost aborted my take off this morning. When I first started flying it I had heard about the slow leaks of the Van's tire and tried putting slime i n them, that was fun. About 35 to 50 it gave a very interesting ride, needl ess to say taking the slime out was way harder than putting it in. Lesson l earned=C2-=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Pascal =0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Friday, February 15, 2013 2:13 PM=0ASubject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners=0A =0A=0ABruce; =0AI just had the same situation last week. I added some air to the front t ire =0Aand verified the torque was right on the fork nut, but for some reas on the plane =0Ashakes at a certain speed when I taxi now. I thought it was the taxiway, but =0Athan it occurred to me that I have been over the same taxiway in the past =0Awithout an issue, so I don=99t know why it doe s it now, no issue on takeoff or =0Alanding, only when I do a taxi at a job pace.=0A=C2-=C2-=0AFrom: Bruce Johnson =0ASent: Friday, February 15, 2 013 1:04 PM=0ATo: rv10-list@matronics.com =0ASubject: Re: RV10-List: Gear l eg stiffeners=0A=C2- I'll double check, but it surefelt =0Alike it was th e mains. Like I said never happened before =0A=C2-=0A=0A_________________ _______________=0A From: Linn =0A=0ATo: rv10-list@ma tronics.com =0ASent: Friday, February 15, 2013 1:33 =0APM=0ASubject: Re: RV 10-List: Gear =0Aleg stiffeners=0A=0A=C2-=0AYou might have nosegear shimm y ..... easy =0Afor someone on the ground to see.=C2- If so, just tighten up the nose fork nut =0Aso that a spring scale reads 25-30 Lbs when pulled at the axle.=C2- You may =0Aneed to add Belleville washers for more damp ening.=C2- The washers 'wear in' a =0Alittle after initial tightening.=0A Linn=0A=0A=0AOn 2/15/2013 3:24 PM, Bruce =0AJohnson wrote:=0A=0ADoes anybo dy have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard about?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until today. Full fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my passenger and still had a shake and then landed without one. Took off again and it was just a minut e shake, landed with none. Weirdafter all these take offs and landings fo r it to start now. I am going to pull the fairings off and check for other things, but while I am at it I might put the stiffeners on. Thanks in adv ance =0A>=0A>=0A>Do not archive=0A>Bruce Johnson=0A>No virus found in thi s message.=0A>Checked =0A by AVG - www.avg.com=0A>02/15/13=0A=0A< font>=0A =0A=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matr onics.com/Navigator?RV10-List=0Ahref="http://forums.matronics.com">http:/ /forums.matronics.com=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http ==================== ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:35:43 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: Gear leg stiffeners From: Jayrowe Bruce: Make sure it's not the nose wheel. I have 360 hours and roughly ever y 100 hours I get a hard shimmy. And each time the lateral torgue on the nos e wheel castor had dropped to about 10lbs. Increasing it back to the require d 25lbs cured the shimmy completely. Jay Rowe Sent from my iPhone On Feb 15, 2013, at 12:24 PM, Bruce Johnson wrot e: > Does anybody have a picture handy of the wood stiffeners I have heard abou t?? I have got 87 hrs on 151BJ and have never had a problem until today. Ful l fuel, two 200lb guys and wow what a shake. I dropped my passenger and stil l had a shake and then landed without one. Took off again and it was just a m inute shake, landed with none. Weird after all these take offs and landings f or it to start now. I am going to pull the fairings off and check for other t hings, but while I am at it I might put the stiffeners on. Thanks in advance > > Do not archive > Bruce Johnson > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:45:56 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Baggage Area Weight From: "Bob Turner" The paperwork from Vans that came with my final kit recommended a maximum of 150 lbs in the baggage area. But I see Vans' web site now says 100 lbs maximum. Anyone know when this change happened? Or why? Bob -------- Bob Turner RV-10 QB Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394373#394373 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:49:14 PM PST US From: Jeff Carpenter Subject: RV10-List: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane ... now on sale for 162.99 Disclaimer clearly states "not for aircraft use" I'll take my chances. Jeff Carpenter 40304 Do not archive ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 04:42:44 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV10-List: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane From: Kelly McMullen So only use it to pick up engines, not aircraft. ;-) On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 2:48 PM, Jeff Carpenter wrote: > ... now on sale for 162.99 > > Disclaimer clearly states "not for aircraft use" > > > I'll take my chances. > > > Jeff Carpenter > 40304 > > Do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 04:51:46 PM PST US From: Linn Subject: Re: RV10-List: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane The lawyers are taking over. I buy paint stripper .... brand name 'Aircraft Stripper'. The small print: 'Not for use on aircraft'. So sad. Linn On 2/15/2013 7:41 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > So only use it to pick up engines, not aircraft. ;-) > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 2:48 PM, Jeff Carpenter > > wrote: > > ... now on sale for 162.99 > > Disclaimer clearly states "not for aircraft use" > > > I'll take my chances. > > > Jeff Carpenter > 40304 > > Do not archive > > > * > > > * > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:54:15 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Gear leg stiffeners From: "Lew Gallagher" Hey RV10flyer, Another thought on your slow taxi shake ... have you checked to see if one of your brake pads is dragging? Warped rotor? Flat spot on tire (landed with brake on)? I found that sometimes the right brake pedal on the co-pilot's side wasn't totally releasing, causing that brake to drag (others have solved this with springs or re-drilling the brake pedal hinge rod holes to free it up). To test, you have to jack it up and spin it by hand. It just takes a tiny bit of the pedal not returning to cause this since there is a release bypass in the last bit of piston travel. Later, - Lew [quote="rv10flyer(at)live.com"]Bruce; I just had the same situation last week. I added some air to the front tire and verified the torque was right on the fork nut, but for some reason the plane shakes at a certain speed when I taxi now. I thought it was the taxiway, but than it occurred to me that I have been over the same taxiway in the past without an issue, so I dont know why it does it now, no issue on takeoff or landing, only when I do a taxi at a job pace. -------- non-pilot crazy about building NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 Fly off completed ! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394378#394378 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:18:41 PM PST US From: Robin Marks Subject: RE: RV10-List: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane I wrote three different a cheeky replies to this email and deleted them all . My restraint is improving! Robin Do Not Archive From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 4:51 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: The Harbor Freight 2 Ton Shop Crane The lawyers are taking over. I buy paint stripper .... brand name 'Aircraf t Stripper'. The small print: 'Not for use on aircraft'. So sad. Linn On 2/15/2013 7:41 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: So only use it to pick up engines, not aircraft. ;-) On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 2:48 PM, Jeff Carpenter > wrote: ... now on sale for 162.99 Disclaimer clearly states "not for aircraft use" I'll take my chances. Jeff Carpenter 40304 Do not archive No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 02/15/13 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:00:30 PM PST US From: Robin Marks Subject: RV10-List: N880EE Exposed RV List I recently posted a First Flight on the Vans site and VAF. I thought I woul d share it with those on this list that didn't already know about 85. Robin http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=744277 http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/first-flights.htm More photos can be seen at: http://www.painttheweb.com/painttheweb/RV-8A/ HD Video can be seen at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ912gZyQ0U&feature=share&list=UU33RvU l-OACUdX3XIljn26w ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:06:46 PM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: RV10-List: Re: N880EE Exposed At 07:59 PM 2/15/2013 Friday, Robin Marks wrote: >RV List >I recently posted a First Flight on the Vans site and VAF. I thought I would share it with those on this list that didnt already know about 85. >Robin > > >http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=744277 > >http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/first-flights.htm > > >More photos can be seen at: >http://www.painttheweb.com/painttheweb/RV-8A/ > >HD Video can be seen at: >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ912gZyQ0U&feature=share&list=UU33RvUl-OACUdX3XIljn26w > VERY nice, Robin! Your workmanship is exquisite thorough out. Love the instrument panel! The paint-job quality looks absolutely fantastic. Who did the paint and airbrush work? Well done! - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen" http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap... RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer" http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log Status: 140+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 08:07:57 PM PST US From: "Pascal" Subject: Re: RV10-List: N880EE Exposed nice job with the plane Robin! look forward to seeing it in person soon! Pascal From: Robin Marks Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 7:59 PM Subject: RV10-List: N880EE Exposed RV List I recently posted a First Flight on the Vans site and VAF. I thought I would share it with those on this list that didn=99t already know about 85. Robin http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=744277 http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/first-flights.htm More photos can be seen at: http://www.painttheweb.com/painttheweb/RV-8A/ HD Video can be seen at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ912gZyQ0U&feature=share&list=UU33R vUl-OACUdX3XIljn26w ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 09:48:32 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Baggage Area Weight From: "rv10flyer" Mine is 100 lbs. Finished 12/1/11. I would go past aft limit anyway with my aux battery PC680 and main 925L in the back. No idea on when the change occurred. -------- Wayne G. SB 12/01/2009-12/01/2011 TT= 97.6 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394397#394397 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 09:57:50 PM PST US Subject: RV10-List: Re: Gear leg stiffeners From: "rv10flyer" Occasionally I get a nose wheel fore-aft shimmy around 15 kts GS. If my plane sits in one place more than 10 days, Van's tires get flat spots which can induce resonance in the round gear legs. I know my tires are out of round by 1/4" and have Desser retreads in stock when I get a few more hours on these. Fly more. -------- Wayne G. SB 12/01/2009-12/01/2011 TT= 97.6 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394398#394398 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message rv10-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV10-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/rv10-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv10-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.