Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:56 AM - Re: Re: SB Nose Wheel Report (Rick Lark)
2. 07:12 AM - Re: Re: SB Nose Wheel Report (Kelly McMullen)
3. 08:30 AM - Re: Re: SB Nose Wheel Report (Gary)
4. 09:14 AM - Re: Re: SB Nose Wheel Report (Bill Watson)
5. 12:41 PM - SB nose wheel report (Terry Moushon)
6. 01:07 PM - Re: Engine removal for SB 14-08-29 (Bill Watson)
7. 01:17 PM - Re: Engine removal for SB 14-08-29 (Linn Walters)
8. 05:41 PM - Re: SB nose wheel report (Michael Kraus)
9. 05:49 PM - Re: SB nose wheel report (Kelly McMullen)
10. 06:01 PM - Re: SB nose wheel report (Carl Froehlich)
11. 06:44 PM - Re: Re: SB Nose Wheel Report (Chris)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: SB Nose Wheel Report |
Hi yeah that is exactly what we talked about. I guess it appears we all wil
l have to inspect this area on a regular basis, so maybe high temp RTV is be
st. Thx Jesse.
Rick
Sent from my iPad
> On Sep 16, 2014, at 10:20 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
> Is he referring to something like JB Weld? As Tim O mentioned, that would m
ake it very hard to remove for inspection later down the road. I think, as o
thers have said, that simply something to keep it from bouncing around as th
e tension on the elastomers is reduced over time is sufficient.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Sep 16, 2014, at 9:09 PM, Rick Lark <larkrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hey all
>> Had a fellow in my assembly facility (garage) today who suggested using e
poxy that is specifically made for metal, to bond the doubler plate to the n
ose gear plate. Has anyone else used epoxy?
>>
>> Sounds like a good idea to me.
>>
>> Opinions????
>>
>> Rick
>> #40956
>> Southampton, Ont
>>
>>> On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 3:56 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Mine came off easily, thanks to the engine oil leaks I've had over
>>> the past year. :) Thankfully no oil on the rubber elastomers
>>> though.
>>>
>>> When I reassembled, I cleaned it all up and also greased inside
>>> the cap, on the upper shaft, on the shim washers, and down to the
>>> very top of the elastomers...hoping that maybe this would
>>> at least help against further shaft wear.
>>>
>>> Tim
>>>
>>>> On 9/16/2014 2:33 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>>> Probably a good idea to grease the inside of the collar before
>>>> re-installing. I greased the washer/shim as well. Don't know that there
>>>> is much movement or corrosion risk, but why not minimize risk.
>>>
>>> ========================
===========
>>> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>>> ========================
===========
>>> FORUMS -
>>> _blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>>> ========================
===========
>>> b Site -
>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>> ========================
===========
>>
>>
>>
>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>> List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>> //forums.matronics.com
>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: SB Nose Wheel Report |
I must be missing something. I don't see that there will be any need to
remove the doubler in the future. If the doubler is undamaged and still
in place, I don't see that there would be any need to inspect the
original plate at all. I guess it depends whether you believe the
cracks were caused by the shock disks hammering on the original plate,
or the retainer hammering from the top side, or both. Obviously the key
is to ensure the shock disks are always in compression, even with the
nose wheel off the ground.
Kelly
On 9/17/2014 5:56 AM, Rick Lark wrote:
> Hi yeah that is exactly what we talked about. I guess it appears we
> all will have to inspect this area on a regular basis, so maybe high
> temp RTV is best. Thx Jesse.
> Rick
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Sep 16, 2014, at 10:20 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com
> <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>> wrote:
>
>> Is he referring to something like JB Weld? As Tim O mentioned, that
>> would make it very hard to remove for inspection later down the road.
>> I think, as others have said, that simply something to keep it from
>> bouncing around as the tension on the elastomers is reduced over time
>> is sufficient.
>>
>> Jesse Saint
>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>> 352-427-0285
>> jesse@saintaviation.com <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: SB Nose Wheel Report |
When the shock discs compress and then are released the top retaining hat hammers
on the plate. The more the discs are compressed and the quicker the release
the harder the hammering. Thus it is this builders opinion that the reinforce
ing plate needs to be secured to the old plate. Thus I am using both pro seal
and Cherrymax rivets to assure the strongest plate possible.
> On Sep 17, 2014, at 10:11 AM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>
>
> I must be missing something. I don't see that there will be any need to remove
the doubler in the future. If the doubler is undamaged and still in place, I
don't see that there would be any need to inspect the original plate at all.
I guess it depends whether you believe the cracks were caused by the shock disks
hammering on the original plate, or the retainer hammering from the top side,
or both. Obviously the key is to ensure the shock disks are always in compression,
even with the nose wheel off the ground.
> Kelly
>> On 9/17/2014 5:56 AM, Rick Lark wrote:
>> Hi yeah that is exactly what we talked about. I guess it appears we all will
have to inspect this area on a regular basis, so maybe high temp RTV is best.
Thx Jesse.
>> Rick
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Sep 16, 2014, at 10:20 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Is he referring to something like JB Weld? As Tim O mentioned, that would make
it very hard to remove for inspection later down the road. I think, as others
have said, that simply something to keep it from bouncing around as the tension
on the elastomers is reduced over time is sufficient.
>>>
>>> Jesse Saint
>>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>>> 352-427-0285
>>> jesse@saintaviation.com <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: SB Nose Wheel Report |
I have a cracked plate and now have the engine off so I can view it easily.
The way I interpret the cracking is that it is from the elastomers
pressing/striking the plate. The plate is clearly deformed by the
pressure/striking. The crack(s) seem to emanate from the hole in the
middle. The material around the hole would be in tension as it
deforms. My guess is that a knick or weak spot around that hole would
be enough to allow the cracking to start.
I'm not clear on how the retainer interacts with the plate... more
inspection required.
Bill "I never wanted to pull the engine until overhaul time" Watson
On 9/17/2014 10:11 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> I must be missing something. I don't see that there will be any need
> to remove the doubler in the future. If the doubler is undamaged and
> still in place, I don't see that there would be any need to inspect
> the original plate at all. I guess it depends whether you believe the
> cracks were caused by the shock disks hammering on the original plate,
> or the retainer hammering from the top side, or both. Obviously the
> key is to ensure the shock disks are always in compression, even with
> the nose wheel off the ground.
> Kelly
> On 9/17/2014 5:56 AM, Rick Lark wrote:
>> Hi yeah that is exactly what we talked about. I guess it appears we
>> all will have to inspect this area on a regular basis, so maybe high
>> temp RTV is best. Thx Jesse.
>> Rick
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Sep 16, 2014, at 10:20 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com
>> <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>> wrote:
>>
>>> Is he referring to something like JB Weld? As Tim O mentioned, that
>>> would make it very hard to remove for inspection later down the
>>> road. I think, as others have said, that simply something to keep it
>>> from bouncing around as the tension on the elastomers is reduced
>>> over time is sufficient.
>>>
>>> Jesse Saint
>>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>>> 352-427-0285
>>> jesse@saintaviation.com <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | SB nose wheel report |
I completed the SB for the RV10 today and have a couple observations.
Background: First, the plane is NOT flying... The engine was installed on 7-22-2014
and has had the engine weight on the nose wheel ever since. I installed
only one U-1002 isolation washer and when I put on the WD-1015 collar assembly,
it was about 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). With the right leverage, the bolt did
go in as planned...but very tight.
Today, when I took the pressure off the nose wheel....the bolt slid right out...in
fact had about .030 gap....meaning my assembly with only ONE isolation washer
was loose. I added the painted doubler and RTV and reassembled it to find
it was again 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). After a little coaxing again, it fit
just fine. So just the weight of the engine and a couple months compressed the
elastomers enough to make it loose when the weight is removed. As I am at least
12 months from flying, I plan to check it one more time just before I take
to the sky.
Terry
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Engine removal for SB 14-08-29 |
So I have removed my engine and will remove the mount this evening.
Questions for the list:
- I'm planning on replacing the engine mount elastomers. At 500 hours,
why not except for $$$. Thoughts?
- I don't know about replacing the nose wheel elastomers. Afterall,
they are already compressed and 'set'. Thoughts?
Bill
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Engine removal for SB 14-08-29 |
I would think this comes under the heading of 'if it ain't broke ....
don't fix it'.
They will continue to compress, but the rate slows down over time. They
should last for 10 years or more. I'd keep adding spacers until you see
cracks in the elastomer.
Linn
On 9/17/2014 4:06 PM, Bill Watson wrote:
>
> So I have removed my engine and will remove the mount this evening.
>
> Questions for the list:
> - I'm planning on replacing the engine mount elastomers. At 500
> hours, why not except for $$$. Thoughts?
> - I don't know about replacing the nose wheel elastomers. Afterall,
> they are already compressed and 'set'. Thoughts?
>
> Bill
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: SB nose wheel report |
Interesting.... I've been flying for 180 hours on a grass strip and with one washer
mine was still tight when I disassembled for the addition of the SB plate....
-Mike
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 17, 2014, at 3:40 PM, Terry Moushon <tmoushon@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> I completed the SB for the RV10 today and have a couple observations.
> Background: First, the plane is NOT flying... The engine was installed on 7-22-2014
and has had the engine weight on the nose wheel ever since. I installed
only one U-1002 isolation washer and when I put on the WD-1015 collar assembly,
it was about 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). With the right leverage, the bolt
did go in as planned...but very tight.
> Today, when I took the pressure off the nose wheel....the bolt slid right out...in
fact had about .030 gap....meaning my assembly with only ONE isolation washer
was loose. I added the painted doubler and RTV and reassembled it to find
it was again 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). After a little coaxing again, it fit
just fine. So just the weight of the engine and a couple months compressed
the elastomers enough to make it loose when the weight is removed. As I am at
least 12 months from flying, I plan to check it one more time just before I take
to the sky.
> Terry
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: SB nose wheel report |
While not flying yet, my engine has been mounted for about 18 months,
and nose was still plenty tight with 1 washer, and required perhaps more
than 100lbs up force on the tail to adequately compress nose to install
the top hat...more than it took to originally assemble the nose gear.
On 9/17/2014 5:40 PM, Michael Kraus wrote:
>
> Interesting.... I've been flying for 180 hours on a grass strip and with one
washer mine was still tight when I disassembled for the addition of the SB plate....
> -Mike
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 17, 2014, at 3:40 PM, Terry Moushon <tmoushon@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I completed the SB for the RV10 today and have a couple observations.
>> Background: First, the plane is NOT flying... The engine was installed on 7-22-2014
and has had the engine weight on the nose wheel ever since. I installed
only one U-1002 isolation washer and when I put on the WD-1015 collar assembly,
it was about 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). With the right leverage, the bolt
did go in as planned...but very tight.
>> Today, when I took the pressure off the nose wheel....the bolt slid right out...in
fact had about .030 gap....meaning my assembly with only ONE isolation
washer was loose. I added the painted doubler and RTV and reassembled it to find
it was again 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). After a little coaxing again, it fit
just fine. So just the weight of the engine and a couple months compressed
the elastomers enough to make it loose when the weight is removed. As I am at
least 12 months from flying, I plan to check it one more time just before I
take to the sky.
>> Terry
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: SB nose wheel report |
Did the SB today. No cracks. One washer was not adequate - two required a little
upward force on the tail. I had two washers in before the SB.
Carl
> On Sep 17, 2014, at 8:48 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>
>
> While not flying yet, my engine has been mounted for about 18 months, and nose
was still plenty tight with 1 washer, and required perhaps more than 100lbs
up force on the tail to adequately compress nose to install the top hat...more
than it took to originally assemble the nose gear.
>> On 9/17/2014 5:40 PM, Michael Kraus wrote:
>>
>> Interesting.... I've been flying for 180 hours on a grass strip and with one
washer mine was still tight when I disassembled for the addition of the SB plate....
>> -Mike
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Sep 17, 2014, at 3:40 PM, Terry Moushon <tmoushon@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I completed the SB for the RV10 today and have a couple observations.
>>> Background: First, the plane is NOT flying... The engine was installed on
7-22-2014 and has had the engine weight on the nose wheel ever since. I installed
only one U-1002 isolation washer and when I put on the WD-1015 collar assembly,
it was about 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). With the right leverage, the bolt
did go in as planned...but very tight.
>>> Today, when I took the pressure off the nose wheel....the bolt slid right out...in
fact had about .030 gap....meaning my assembly with only ONE isolation
washer was loose. I added the painted doubler and RTV and reassembled it to find
it was again 1/2 bolt hole off (tight). After a little coaxing again, it
fit just fine. So just the weight of the engine and a couple months compressed
the elastomers enough to make it loose when the weight is removed. As I am
at least 12 months from flying, I plan to check it one more time just before I
take to the sky.
>>> Terry
>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: SB Nose Wheel Report |
How about this thought....
I would think if the doubler does its job, (it really is just serving as
a giant) that the next problem which would be seen is a crack in the
welds on the tubes. The doubler /washer is going to transfer the load
out across the flat plate surface and now the welds could pick up more
of the cyclic load that the insufficient thickness current plate was
experiencing. The current plate most likely developed its cracks due to
the cyclic bending in its center and outward thus preventing the welds
from taking on the entire cyclic loads.
It will be interesting to see, if in many many hours on from now for the
rough field flyers, if they start to get cracks in the welds. This fix
is just transferring the problem out to the welds and tubes, which of
course if done right won't be a problem, because the load will be
transferred better to the welds and the tubes - hopefully all of those
items will have a much higher fatigue life which we will never see the
end of.
I would see no reason not to JB Weld it- if there is a problem in that
area again it will be in the welds I suspect or tubes -not likely
(hopefully).
-Chris
N919AR
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint
Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2014 10:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: SB Nose Wheel Report
Is he referring to something like JB Weld? As Tim O mentioned, that
would make it very hard to remove for inspection later down the road. I
think, as others have said, that simply something to keep it from
bouncing around as the tension on the elastomers is reduced over time is
sufficient.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
352-427-0285
jesse@saintaviation.com
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 16, 2014, at 9:09 PM, Rick Lark <larkrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey all
Had a fellow in my assembly facility (garage) today who suggested using
epoxy that is specifically made for metal, to bond the doubler plate to
the nose gear plate. Has anyone else used epoxy?
Sounds like a good idea to me.
Opinions????
Rick
#40956
Southampton, Ont
On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 3:56 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
Mine came off easily, thanks to the engine oil leaks I've had over
the past year. :) Thankfully no oil on the rubber elastomers
though.
When I reassembled, I cleaned it all up and also greased inside
the cap, on the upper shaft, on the shim washers, and down to the
very top of the elastomers...hoping that maybe this would
at least help against further shaft wear.
Tim
On 9/16/2014 2:33 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
Probably a good idea to grease the inside of the collar before
re-installing. I greased the washer/shim as well. Don't know that there
is much movement or corrosion risk, but why not minimize risk.
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
FORUMS -
_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
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//forums.matronics.com
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ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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