Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:14 AM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (johngoodman)
2. 07:27 AM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Carl Froehlich)
3. 11:36 AM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Larry Rosen)
4. 12:13 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Bob Turner)
5. 12:54 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Carl Froehlich)
6. 01:20 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Deems Davis)
7. 01:21 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Deems Davis)
8. 02:40 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Larry Rosen)
9. 02:56 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Carl Froehlich)
10. 03:29 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (Deems Davis)
11. 05:04 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (AirMike)
12. 06:37 PM - Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing (dmaib@me.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
Larry,
I used a 1.75 inch scat tube from Aircraft Spruce - it works fine.
John
--------
#40572 Phase One complete in 2011
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439823#439823
Message 2
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| Subject: | Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
Larry,
I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with homebrew
reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and 1.5". I did this
as it made routing the hose much easier.
Assuming you are doing the stock Vetterman exhaust there is an amazing
amount of heat available for the cabin. Considering this, I installed a
3/4" diameter restrictor in the rear baffle heat muff hose connectors to
reduce the amount of air going to the heat muff. As I would never use that
much heat, I figured that the other 90% of flying where the heat is off I'd
rather have that air cooling the engine instead of bypassing it. Now on the
coldest days I have the rear heat half open and the front heat cracked open
or shut.
One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs being
directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump. My fix for
this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall cabin heat boxes
(holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the mat extends over the top
of the boxes and then down over the front of the boxes. The result is when
the cabin heat valves are shut, the dumped hot air is directed down toward
the bottom of the cowl, and the conductive heat from the boxes to the
firewall is reduced. This is the Koolmat product:
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261602
I'm happy with how it all worked out.
Carl
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 10:33 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing
After a very long break, I have started working on building my RV10 again.
I am working on fixing some of the things I don't like about how that came
out. One is how the rear heat scat tube is routed around my fuel valve and
over the wing spar.
I have two possible solutions.
One is to reduce to a 1 or 1-1/2" tube. Those that fly in the cold north,
do you think you would still get enough heat to the back passengers with a
1" tube?
The second is to construct a fiberglass duct to route around the problem
areas. Is the hot air from the heater valve hot enough to cause problems
with a duct constructed of glass and west epoxy?
Larry
RV10 #40356
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
>
> I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with homebrew
> reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and 1.5". I did this
> as it made routing the hose much easier.
It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations
<http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will depend if I
want to spend time or money.
> One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
> problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs being
> directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump. My fix for
> this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall cabin heat boxes
> (holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the mat extends over the top
> of the boxes and then down over the front of the boxes. The result is when
> the cabin heat valves are shut, the dumped hot air is directed down toward
> the bottom of the cowl, and the conductive heat from the boxes to the
> firewall is reduced. This is the Koolmat product:
> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261602
>
I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you using
the koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards the engine.
In this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and not insulating the fwf.
Larry
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
I visualize this as the cool mat being in an inverted U shape. One side against
the firewall for insulation; the other hanging down a few inches from the firewall
to direct the hot air down.
I did half this: put silicon baffle material under the box to insulate it from
the firewall.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439835#439835
Message 5
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| Subject: | Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
Larry,
I looked for a photo but only found one when the fuselage was upside down
(attached). So if you can visualize, the flap that is hanging down would
hang over the top of the boxes and scat hoses when upright. You can see the
round notches cut to lay over the scat hoses. The result is the dumped hot
air from the cabin heat boxes is directed down toward the cowl exhaust area.
Carl
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 2:33 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing
>
> I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with
> homebrew reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and
> 1.5". I did this as it made routing the hose much easier.
It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations
<http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will depend if I
want to spend time or money.
> One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
> problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs
> being directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump.
> My fix for this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall
> cabin heat boxes (holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the
> mat extends over the top of the boxes and then down over the front of
> the boxes. The result is when the cabin heat valves are shut, the
> dumped hot air is directed down toward the bottom of the cowl, and the
> conductive heat from the boxes to the firewall is reduced. This is the
Koolmat product:
> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261
> 602
>
I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you using the
koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards the engine.
In this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and not insulating the fwf.
Larry
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
http://deemsrv10.com/album/Final%20Assembly/slides/DSC06932.html
On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Carl Froehlich <carl.froehlich@verizon.net
> wrote:
> Larry,
>
> I looked for a photo but only found one when the fuselage was upside down
> (attached). So if you can visualize, the flap that is hanging down would
> hang over the top of the boxes and scat hoses when upright. You can see
> the
> round notches cut to lay over the scat hoses. The result is the dumped hot
> air from the cabin heat boxes is directed down toward the cowl exhaust
> area.
>
> Carl
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
> Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 2:33 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing
>
>
>
> >
> > I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with
> > homebrew reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and
> > 1.5". I did this as it made routing the hose much easier.
> It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
>
> I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations
> <http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will depend if I
> want to spend time or money.
>
> > One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
> > problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs
> > being directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump.
> > My fix for this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall
> > cabin heat boxes (holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the
> > mat extends over the top of the boxes and then down over the front of
> > the boxes. The result is when the cabin heat valves are shut, the
> > dumped hot air is directed down toward the bottom of the cowl, and the
> > conductive heat from the boxes to the firewall is reduced. This is the
> Koolmat product:
> > http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261
> > 602
> >
> I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you using the
> koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards the engine.
> In this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and not insulating the fwf.
>
> Larry
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
http://deemsrv10.com/album/Final%20Assembly/slides/DSC07074.html
click forward for a few more pics
On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 11:33 AM, Larry Rosen <n205en@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with homebrew
>> reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and 1.5". I did
>> this
>> as it made routing the hose much easier.
>>
> It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
>
> I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations <
> http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will depend if I
> want to spend time or money.
>
> One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
>> problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs being
>> directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump. My fix
>> for
>> this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall cabin heat
>> boxes
>> (holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the mat extends over the
>> top
>> of the boxes and then down over the front of the boxes. The result is
>> when
>> the cabin heat valves are shut, the dumped hot air is directed down toward
>> the bottom of the cowl, and the conductive heat from the boxes to the
>> firewall is reduced. This is the Koolmat product:
>> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261602
>>
>> I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you using
> the koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards the engine. In
> this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and not insulating the fwf.
>
> Larry
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
Deems,
1" Scat tubing?
I take it, no issues with the fiberglass in the heater line.
Larry
On 3/24/2015 4:18 PM, Deems Davis wrote:
> http://deemsrv10.com/album/Final%20Assembly/slides/DSC07074.html
>
> click forward for a few more pics
>
> On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 11:33 AM, Larry Rosen <n205en@gmail.com
> <mailto:n205en@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> <mailto:n205en@gmail.com>>
>
>
> I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector,
> with homebrew
> reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and
> 1.5". I did this
> as it made routing the hose much easier.
>
> It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
>
> I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations
> <http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will
> depend if I want to spend time or money.
>
> One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve
> location as
> problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat
> muffs being
> directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel
> pump. My fix for
> this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall
> cabin heat boxes
> (holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the mat extends
> over the top
> of the boxes and then down over the front of the boxes. The
> result is when
> the cabin heat valves are shut, the dumped hot air is directed
> down toward
> the bottom of the cowl, and the conductive heat from the boxes
> to the
> firewall is reduced. This is the Koolmat product:
> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261602
>
> I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you
> using the koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards
> the engine. In this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and
> not insulating the fwf.
>
> Larry
>
> ===================================
> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ===================================
> FORUMS -
> _blank">http://forums.matronics.com
> ===================================
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ===================================
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 9
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| Subject: | Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
My first 2=9D-1.5=9D scat reducer was made of fiberglass.
The first time I turned on the rear heat it did off gas. I replaced it
with one made of aluminum.
Carl
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 5:37 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing
Deems,
1" Scat tubing?
I take it, no issues with the fiberglass in the heater line.
Larry
On 3/24/2015 4:18 PM, Deems Davis wrote:
http://deemsrv10.com/album/Final%20Assembly/slides/DSC07074.html
click forward for a few more pics
On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 11:33 AM, Larry Rosen <n205en@gmail.com> wrote:
I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with
homebrew
reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and 1.5". I did
this
as it made routing the hose much easier.
It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations
<http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will depend if I
want to spend time or money.
One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs
being
directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump. My fix
for
this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall cabin heat
boxes
(holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the mat extends over the
top
of the boxes and then down over the front of the boxes. The result is
when
the cabin heat valves are shut, the dumped hot air is directed down
toward
the bottom of the cowl, and the conductive heat from the boxes to the
firewall is reduced. This is the Koolmat product:
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=2616
02
I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you using
the koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards the engine.
In this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and not insulating the
fwf.
Larry
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
FORUMS -
_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
The 1" was something I had lying around the hangar. No issues with the
fiberglass and the heat.I made the reducers by carving some styrofoam and
wraping it with duct/mylar tape and then glassing over it.
On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 2:37 PM, Larry Rosen <n205en@gmail.com> wrote:
> Deems,
> 1" Scat tubing?
> I take it, no issues with the fiberglass in the heater line.
>
> Larry
>
> On 3/24/2015 4:18 PM, Deems Davis wrote:
>
> http://deemsrv10.com/album/Final%20Assembly/slides/DSC07074.html
>
> click forward for a few more pics
>
> On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 11:33 AM, Larry Rosen <n205en@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>>> I used a 1.5" hose from the fire wall to the rear connector, with
>>> homebrew
>>> reducers at each end to make the transition between 2" and 1.5". I did
>>> this
>>> as it made routing the hose much easier.
>>>
>> It sounds like 1" tubing would provide more than enough heat.
>>
>> I may homebrew or just use these reducers from planeinovations <
>> http://www.planeinnovations.com/scat-adapters.html> It will depend if I
>> want to spend time or money.
>>
>> One other point - I view the per plans cabin heat valve location as
>>> problematic. On the hottest day you have hot air off the heat muffs
>>> being
>>> directed back at the engine - right at the mechanical fuel pump. My fix
>>> for
>>> this was to install a piece of Koolmat between the firewall cabin heat
>>> boxes
>>> (holes cut out for the box air exit) such that the mat extends over the
>>> top
>>> of the boxes and then down over the front of the boxes. The result is
>>> when
>>> the cabin heat valves are shut, the dumped hot air is directed down
>>> toward
>>> the bottom of the cowl, and the conductive heat from the boxes to the
>>> firewall is reduced. This is the Koolmat product:
>>> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/koolmat.php?clickkey=261602
>>>
>>> I am having a hard time visualizing what you installed. Are you using
>> the koolmat to direct the hot air down instead of towards the engine. In
>> this case the koolmat is working as a plenum and not insulating the fwf.
>>
>> Larry
>>
>> ===================================
>> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> ===================================
>> FORUMS -
>> _blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>> ===================================
>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> ===================================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
I just followed the standard plans and crushed the large scat tube to fit the space.
After 5 years no problems with chafe or perforation. It is ugly, but it
works. Deems' installation is obviously 1st class, but a bit of extra work.
I would say two far more important issues are : 1) the cheap aluminum air distribution
boxes on the firewall supplied by Vans. I suggest using only the excellent
(after market) fire resistant stainless steel steel boxes. Could save your
life. 2) Also, if I were building again, I would improvise easier access to
the fuel system (in the tunnel) - pump and filter - for easy servicing. Servicing
the fuel filter is a real pain. Top and side access portals would facilitate
servicing.
--------
See you OSH '15
Q/B - flying 5 yrs.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439849#439849
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Rear Heat SCAT Tube Routing |
AirMike wrote:
> I just followed the standard plans and crushed the large scat tube to fit the
space. After 5 years no problems with chafe or perforation. It is ugly, but it
works. Deems' installation is obviously 1st class, but a bit of extra work.
>
> I would say two far more important issues are : 1) the cheap aluminum air distribution
boxes on the firewall supplied by Vans. I suggest using only the excellent
(after market) fire resistant stainless steel steel boxes. Could save your
life. 2) Also, if I were building again, I would improvise easier access to
the fuel system (in the tunnel) - pump and filter - for easy servicing. Servicing
the fuel filter is a real pain. Top and side access portals would facilitate
servicing.
I did the same thing with the large scat and it works fine. Coming up on 7 years
with no issues, but as Mike says, it is ugly. However, I am the only one that
looks at it! ^_^
I agree with Mike's comments about the aluminum heat distribution box and tunnel
access. I even thought about making a belly access panel, ala Piper, but that
would introduce some other engineering issues I imagine. You will thank yourself
later on if you make access to the fuel filter as easy as possible.
--------
David Maib
RV-10 #40559
New Smyrna Beach, FL
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439852#439852
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