Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:06 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Bob Leffler)
2. 03:23 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Jesse Saint)
3. 04:07 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Flysrv10)
4. 04:37 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Jesse Saint)
5. 04:54 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Linn Walters)
6. 05:04 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Bob Leffler)
7. 05:05 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Patrick Pulis)
8. 05:34 AM - Insurance (Chris Hukill)
9. 05:45 AM - Re: Insurance (David Saylor)
10. 06:20 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Carl Froehlich)
11. 06:28 AM - Re: Gust Locks (Dave Leikam)
12. 06:50 AM - Re: Insurance (Flysrv10)
13. 06:58 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Pascal)
14. 07:07 AM - Re: Insurance (Tim Olson)
15. 07:09 AM - Re: Gust Locks (bill.peyton)
16. 07:34 AM - Re: Insurance ()
17. 08:05 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Ben Westfall)
18. 08:09 AM - Re: Re: Insurance mystery (Kelly McMullen)
19. 08:26 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Flysrv10)
20. 08:28 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Flysrv10)
21. 09:09 AM - Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Dan Masys)
22. 09:34 AM - Re: Re: Lord adhesive window installation question (Flysrv10)
23. 11:45 AM - Re: Insurance (Bob Turner)
24. 12:42 PM - Re: Insurance (Linn Walters)
25. 10:43 PM - Re: Insurance mystery (Bob Turner)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in p
lace. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major h
eadache on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear
windows I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place th
at were cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. T
he angle of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't n
eed much, just enough to keep things from moving.
Sent from my iPad
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking f
or advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at
Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here abou
t it, I obtained a few tubes from him.
>
> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors ar
e off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in plac
e while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installe
d with that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen res
ts largely on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>
> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the wind
ows on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentiall
y the same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to l
aziness :-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fit
ting quite well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are
attached to the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position,
they can only help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper pos
ition. The last thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when t
he doors are on the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly
while they were curing, and the doors no longer fit properly. It would see
m to me that adhering the windows to the doors when the doors are in their c
losed position will help keep everything aligned properly, so long as the Lo
rd!
> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dan
> ---
> Dan Charrois
> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
> Phone: 780-961-2213
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
>
>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
What Bob said.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
352-427-0285
jesse@saintaviation.com
Sent from my iPad
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>
> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in place.
If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much, just
enough to keep things from moving.
>
>
>
> <image1.jpeg>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>
>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place while
they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>
>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans' would
have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached to
the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on the
floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were curing,
and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
keep everything aligned properly, so long as the Lord!
>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window tightly
to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Dan
>> ---
>> Dan Charrois
>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>> Phone: 780-961-2213
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
>
> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>
>
> </b></font></pre>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks that
develop around the windows?
Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
Thanks.
Do not archive.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> What Bob said.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>
>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in place.
If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>
>>
>>
>> <image1.jpeg>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>
>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place while
they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>
>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached to
the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were curing,
and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
keep everything aligned properly, so long as the L!
> ord!
>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window tightly
to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Dan
>>> ---
>>> Dan Charrois
>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>>
>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>
>>
>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
If you're not worried about looks, then let the cracks develop. It's not a window
separation issue, just a dissimilar material issue.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
352-427-0285
jesse@saintaviation.com
Sent from my iPad
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks that
develop around the windows?
>
> Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Do not archive.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> What Bob said.
>>
>> Jesse Saint
>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>> 352-427-0285
>> jesse@saintaviation.com
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in
place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <image1.jpeg>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>>
>>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>>
>>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached
to the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
curing, and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
keep everything aligned properly, so long as the !
> L!
>> ord!
>>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> Dan
>>>> ---
>>>> Dan Charrois
>>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>>> ===================================
>>> ===================================
>>> ===================================
>>> ===================================
>>>
>>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>>
>>>
>>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
I used the 7545 and clecoed through the window (made a 'plastic drill
bit,) into the flange instead of making clips. I did all the
windows/doors attached to the airplane .... a lot easier than chasing
the door across the bench. I ground a 'valley' around the window and
laid fiberglass tape across the edge of the window. Filled with
microbaloons and sanded. Unfortunately, I didn't crawl into the fuse to
trim the excess 7545. You need to do this! That stuff is terribly
hard. I'm still building so don't have any operational issues ...... :-(
Linn
On 4/8/2015 7:34 AM, Jesse Saint wrote:
>
> If you're not worried about looks, then let the cracks develop. It's not a window
separation issue, just a dissimilar material issue.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks
that develop around the windows?
>>
>> Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Do not archive.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> What Bob said.
>>>
>>> Jesse Saint
>>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>>> 352-427-0285
>>> jesse@saintaviation.com
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in
place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <image1.jpeg>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking
for advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at
Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>>>
>>>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>>>
>>>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached
to the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
curing, and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will
help keep everything aligned properly, so long as the!
> !
>> L!
>>> ord!
>>>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>> ---
>>>>> Dan Charrois
>>>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>>
>>>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> </b></font></pre>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
I used Lords adhesive and then glassed over the seams. It's been almost two
years since painting and no cracks yet.
I know that didn't answer your question, but it may help the OP.
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks that
develop around the windows?
Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
Thanks.
Do not archive.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> What Bob said.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>
>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in place.
If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>
>>
>>
>> <image1.jpeg>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>
>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place while
they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>
>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached to
the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were curing,
and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
keep everything aligned properly, so long as the !
L!
> ord!
>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window tightly
to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Dan
>>> ---
>>> Dan Charrois
>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>>
>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>
>>
>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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|
| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
Can a layer of cloth be placed over the window/cabin top joint to hide the crack,
or will the crack develop regardless?
I note that the Cirrus SR-20 has a thin bead of flexible sealant in the gap between
the window and cabin top.
Enquiring minds need to know please as I'm up to this step too.
Warm regards
Patrick
> On 8 Apr 2015, at 21:04, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> If you're not worried about looks, then let the cracks develop. It's not a window
separation issue, just a dissimilar material issue.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks
that develop around the windows?
>>
>> Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Do not archive.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> What Bob said.
>>>
>>> Jesse Saint
>>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>>> 352-427-0285
>>> jesse@saintaviation.com
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in
place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <image1.jpeg>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking
for advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at
Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>>>
>>>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>>>
>>>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached
to the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
curing, and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will
help keep everything aligned properly, so long as the!
> !
>> L!
>>> ord!
>>>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>> ---
>>>>> Dan Charrois
>>>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>>
>>>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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Timely discussion for me. I wish the other posters would disclose the
actual amounts that you are paying to allow us to compare our quotes. My
new airplane quote came in at $2604 /year. That=99s for $150,000
hull and $1 mil per occurance/$100,000 per passenger. This is named
pilot only (for now), and hangared.
Is this in the ballpark that others are paying?
Chris Hukill
Finally assembling
Message 9
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$1M/$100K/$5K medical
3 named pilots
$165K hull
$2072 through Skysmith. We've been with him since 2007.
--Dave
On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:32 AM, Chris Hukill <cjhukill@cox.net> wrote:
> Timely discussion for me. I wish the other posters would disclose the
> actual amounts that you are paying to allow us to compare our quotes. My
> new airplane quote came in at $2604 /year. That=99s for $150,000 h
ull and $1
> mil per occurance/$100,000 per passenger. This is named pilot only (for
> now), and hangared.
> Is this in the ballpark that others are paying?
> Chris Hukill
> Finally assembling
>
> *
>
===========
onics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>
===========
===========
om/contribution>
===========
>
> *
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Lord adhesive window installation question |
Attached photo shows the "not too tight" straps and insulating foam blocks
to attached the rear windows. After gluing I filled in the seam with micro
balloons, sanded flush, then two bids of medium weight glass over the seam,
then more micro over the fiberglass to fair in (second photo). No paint
cracks after three years.
I also used Hysol for the adhesive as it had a good record with the Lancair
crowd:
http://shop.lancair.com/inventoryD.asp?item_no=9360-QT&CatId={992B7B06-E01B-
4918-BB0C-79343CDB7869}
It worked, but I suspect the other options work just as well.
Carl
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler
Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 8:02 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lord adhesive window installation question
I used Lords adhesive and then glassed over the seams. It's been almost
two years since painting and no cracks yet.
I know that didn't answer your question, but it may help the OP.
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks
that develop around the windows?
Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't
want to lose a window in the air right now.
Thanks.
Do not archive.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> What Bob said.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>
>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows
in place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a
major headache on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On
the rear windows I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in
place that were cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the
doors. The angle of the bend determines how much pressure is applied.
You don't need much, just enough to keep things from moving.
>>
>>
>>
>> <image1.jpeg>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking
for advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff
at Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here
about it, I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>
>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors
are off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in
place while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be
installed with that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the
windscreen rests largely on the nose while curing, so that should be less of
an issue too.
>>>
>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than
Vans' would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the
windows on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in
essentially the same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask
isn't due to laziness :-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose
doors ended up fitting quite well without a lot of work. And I figure that
if the windows are attached to the doors while the doors are in their proper
latched position, they can only help (slightly) to further stiffen the door
in the proper position. The last thing I want to do is to fit the windows
to the doors when the doors are on the floor, and then find that gravity
warped things slightly while they were curing, and the doors no longer fit
properly. It would seem to me that adhering the windows to the doors when
the doors are in their closed position will help keep everything aligned
properly, so long as the !
L!
> ord!
>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the
window tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Dan
>>> ---
>>> Dan Charrois
>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>>
>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>
>>
>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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|
I made an H type out of PVC and and extending pole used for paint rollers so I
can easily adjust the length. Just cut it to size and rivet PVC parts in place.
The handle of the pole end is rubber (no slip) so it just presses against
the seat base just above where the stick comes out. Then position it on the top
of the pedals so it also functions as a parking brake. The PVC pipe ends of
the H fit perfectly into holes in pedals.
Velcro strap secures it to the stick. Works very well. Very easy to make for
minimal $ and very light weight. Pretty much impossible to NOT remember to remove
before flight.
Dave Leikam
> On Apr 7, 2015, at 7:19 PM, kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>
> Hi
>
> I am interested in a gust lock and am wondering if there are any current opinions
regarding same.
>
> I am thinking that something that pins the surfaces is not what I want - I think
I would prefer something that has a little give (ie uses elastics / bungee
cords).
>
> I do have an email into Wild Blue Innovations but haven't heard back from them.
>
> I do have a couple of limitations -I have Control Approach rudder pedals and
my control sticks have covers.
>
> Cheers
>
> Les
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440398#440398
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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|
It depends on your rating, time and experience so it is hard to compare. Min
e is &1600 for $175k hull, no deductibles. Rest of the coverage is the same a
s yours.
Do not archive.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 8:32 AM, Chris Hukill <cjhukill@cox.net> wrote:
>
> Timely discussion for me. I wish the other posters would disclose the actu
al amounts that you are paying to allow us to compare our quotes. My new air
plane quote came in at $2604 /year. That=99s for $150,000 hull and $1
mil per occurance/$100,000 per passenger. This is named pilot only (for now
), and hangared.
> Is this in the ballpark that others are paying?
> Chris Hukill
> Finally assembling
>
>
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
Yes a cloth layer can and thus far no cracks where I placed it.
Pascal
-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick Pulis
Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 5:03 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lord adhesive window installation question
Can a layer of cloth be placed over the window/cabin top joint to hide the
crack, or will the crack develop regardless?
I note that the Cirrus SR-20 has a thin bead of flexible sealant in the gap
between the window and cabin top.
Enquiring minds need to know please as I'm up to this step too.
Warm regards
Patrick
> On 8 Apr 2015, at 21:04, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> If you're not worried about looks, then let the cracks develop. It's not a
> window separation issue, just a dissimilar material issue.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline
>> cracks that develop around the windows?
>>
>> Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't
>> want to lose a window in the air right now.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Do not archive.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> What Bob said.
>>>
>>> Jesse Saint
>>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>>> 352-427-0285
>>> jesse@saintaviation.com
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows
>>>> in place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have
>>>> a major headache on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat.
>>>> On the rear windows I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the
>>>> pieces in place that were cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do
>>>> the same on the doors. The angle of the bend determines how much
>>>> pressure is applied. You don't need much, just enough to keep things
>>>> from moving.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <image1.jpeg>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am
>>>>> looking for advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive
>>>>> sold by Geoff at Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive
>>>>> comments from here about it, I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>>>
>>>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the
>>>>> doors are off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help
>>>>> hold them in place while they are being cured. Of course, the rear
>>>>> windows can't be installed with that luxury, but they're smaller and
>>>>> lighter. And the windscreen rests largely on the nose while curing,
>>>>> so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>>>
>>>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than
>>>>> Vans' would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could
>>>>> install the windows on the doors while the doors are closed and on the
>>>>> plane - in essentially the same orientation as the rear windows? The
>>>>> reason I ask isn't due to laziness :-) But instead, I'm one of the
>>>>> lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite well without a lot of
>>>>> work. And I figure that if the windows are attached to the doors
>>>>> while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
>>>>> help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position.
>>>>> The last thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when
>>>>> the doors are on the floor, and then find that gravity warped things
>>>>> slightly while they were curing, and the doors no longer fit properly.
>>>>> It would seem to me that adhering the windows to the doors when the
>>>>> doors are in their closed position will help keep everything aligned
>>>>> properly, so long as th!
e!
> !
>> L!
>>> ord!
>>>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the
>>>>> window tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>> ---
>>>>> Dan Charrois
>>>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>>
>>>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
Message 14
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I agree, hardly worth comparing. The more time I put on, the
more the rates came down. I'm at about 50% of the cost
that I started with, now that I've put on over 1000 hours.
For a new airplane, be prepared to pay more than $3000 and
sometimes more than $4000 for the first cycle at least.
Get an instrument rating and that helps a bit too.
Tim
On 4/8/2015 8:48 AM, Flysrv10 wrote:
> It depends on your rating, time and experience so it is hard to compare.
> Mine is &1600 for $175k hull, no deductibles. Rest of the coverage is
> the same as yours.
>
> Do not archive.
>
>
Message 15
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Make your own. Less than $20 from Lowes. I have been using this for almost three
years.
--------
Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440447#440447
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2857_147.jpg
Message 16
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I have had the same experience as Tim.
$1723 with $150,000 hull and standard other coverages. 1200 hours RVs, 550
hours in 10. 13,500 total ATP.
Nationair/Global
Dick Sipp
Message 17
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| Subject: | Lord adhesive window installation question |
I did not use the Lord adhesive as I copied Dave Saylor's method using
Silpruf instead. Silpruf almost has a proseal consistency so it might be
less viscous which lends itself to this process a bit better maybe?
I glued the door windows in while attached to the plane. I used several tie
down straps and blocking to apply even, light pressure to the windows as
well as duct tape to keep them from moving. I did this for both the door
window transparencies and the fuselage ones. I think they came out ok but
the only air time my project has seen is dust falling on it in the garage so
YMMV.
See pictures.
Ben W
Portland, OR
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dan Charrois
Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2015 10:43 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Lord adhesive window installation question
Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at
Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about
it, I obtained a few tubes from him.
The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed
with that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests
largely on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the
windows on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in
essentially the same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask
isn't due to laziness :-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose
doors ended up fitting quite well without a lot of work. And I figure that
if the windows are attached to the doors while the doors are in their proper
latched position, they can only help (slightly) to further stiffen the door
in the proper position. The last thing I want to do is to fit the windows
to the doors when the doors are on the floor, and then find that gravity
warped things slightly while they were curing, and the doors no longer fit
properly. It would seem to me that adhering the windows to the doors when
the doors are in their closed position will help keep everything aligned
properly, so long as the Lord!
adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
Thanks!
Dan
---
Dan Charrois
President, Syzygy Research & Technology
Phone: 780-961-2213
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Insurance mystery |
I don't recall if they had a relationship with EAA. They were for years the
insurer of choice of AOPA. that ended around 25 yrs ago. They were one of
the few that would write coverage for planes based in Alaska, but then only
south of the Arctic Circle. I used them for a long time when I was based
there. Once I moved to lower 48 I found other brokers/underwriters offered
better coverage at less money.
On Tue, Apr 7, 2015 at 10:24 PM, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
> > Isn't Avemco promoted by EAA? Or are they just a big advertiser? I
> would think that EAA wouldn't want to be associated with a company that
> does such a poor job with homebuilders.
> > Tim
> >
>
>
> EAA and AVEMCO used to have some sort of official relationship, but had a
> friendly divorce some years ago.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440420#440420
>
>
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
Thanks. Good to know. And you are pretty sure about that? Just worrying.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:34 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> If you're not worried about looks, then let the cracks develop. It's not a window
separation issue, just a dissimilar material issue.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks
that develop around the windows?
>>
>> Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Do not archive.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> What Bob said.
>>>
>>> Jesse Saint
>>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>>> 352-427-0285
>>> jesse@saintaviation.com
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in
place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <image1.jpeg>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking
for advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at
Aerosport Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>>>
>>>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>>>
>>>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached
to the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
curing, and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will
help keep everything aligned properly, so long as the!
> !
>> L!
>>> ord!
>>>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>> ---
>>>>> Dan Charrois
>>>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>> ===================================
>>>>
>>>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: Lord adhesive window installation question |
I built a plastic plane and should have know that a layer of thin fiberglass would
be good insurance against cracks.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 8:02 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>
>
> I used Lords adhesive and then glassed over the seams. It's been almost two
years since painting and no cracks yet.
>
> I know that didn't answer your question, but it may help the OP.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 7:05 AM, Flysrv10 <flysrv10@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> This is a little off topic but how are people repairing the hairline cracks that
develop around the windows?
>
> Looking for an easy fix and not too worried about the looks. I just don't want
to lose a window in the air right now.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Do not archive.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 6:20 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> What Bob said.
>>
>> Jesse Saint
>> Saint Aviation, Inc.
>> 352-427-0285
>> jesse@saintaviation.com
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 5:03 AM, Bob Leffler <rv@thelefflers.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The short answer is no. You need minimal pressure to hold the windows in
place. If gravity causes any movement at all, you're going to have a major headache
on your hands to resolve. I did my doors laying flat. On the rear windows
I made fingers out of scrap aluminum to hold the pieces in place that were
cleco'd to the cabin cover. You could do the same on the doors. The angle
of the bend determines how much pressure is applied. You don't need much,
just enough to keep things from moving.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <image1.jpeg>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Apr 8, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it,
I obtained a few tubes from him.
>>>>
>>>> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>>>>
>>>> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows
on the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness
:-) But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached
to the doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on
the floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
curing, and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering
the windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
keep everything aligned properly, so long as the !
> L!
>> ord!
>>>> adhesive is sticky enough before fully cured that it will hold the window
tightly to the door and in place while it is curing.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> Dan
>>>> ---
>>>> Dan Charrois
>>>> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
>>>> Phone: 780-961-2213
>>> ===================================
>>> ===================================
>>> ===================================
>>> ===================================
>>>
>>> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
>>>
>>>
>>> </b></font></pre>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | RE: Lord adhesive window installation question |
Since my RV-10 seems to be the poster child for bad decisions made with
respect to window adhesives, I'll update the story. I used a composite
adhesive back in 2007 (no longer on the market) that Glasair builders were
asserting was much better than Weld-on 10. In 2011 at about 450 flight
hours, I had a rear window blow out in high, cold conditions (15K feet, -12
C outside, inside heaters blasting). It was a big surprise and caused a lot
of noise in the back seat and some turbulent air in the cockpit:
http://faculty.washington.edu/dmasys/RV10/RV10_lostwind_rearview.jpg
I replaced the rear window using Weld-on 10 as recommended by Vans.
Fast forward to 2014, with 750 flight hours. Climbing through 12K feet to
get over buildups near Eugene, OR, the entire pilot side door window
shattered and departed the plane. Most of the window fragments hit the VS
and HS, making a variety of dents in the leading edges. But some of them
came in the cockpit at high velocity. Luckily I had the Rosen visor swung
to the left, providing an extra layer of protection. A window fragment
shattered the Rosen visor; I got a small neck lump from the impact, but
nothing drew blood. So we continued on and made it back to base.
(Performance observation: an RV-10 that does 170kts with all of its windows
intact will still do 150kts at same power setting with the pilot side door
window absent, but it is awfully windy inside).
Suffice it to say, I removed and reattached the remaining windows with
Weld-on 10.
Moral of the story: make sure you have a compelling justification for
deviating from Van's directions on mounting the RV-10 windows.
-Dan Masys
N104LD
Time: 10:46:51 PM PST US
Subject: RV10-List: Lord adhesive window installation question
From: Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com>
Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
advice
on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it, I
obtained
a few tubes from him.
The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
off
and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
while
they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
that
luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
would
have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows on
the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
same
orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness :-)
But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
well
without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached to the
doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
help
(slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
thing
I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on the
floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
curing,
and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering the
windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
keep
everything aligned properly, so long as the Lord adhesive is sticky enough
before fully cured that it will hold the window tightly to the door and in
place
while it is curing.
Thanks!
Dan
---
Dan Charrois
President, Syzygy Research & Technology
Phone: 780-961-2213
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Lord adhesive window installation question |
Wow! Glad all is well now.
Do not archive.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 8, 2015, at 12:05 PM, Dan Masys <dmasys@u.washington.edu> wrote:
>
>
> Since my RV-10 seems to be the poster child for bad decisions made with
> respect to window adhesives, I'll update the story. I used a composite
> adhesive back in 2007 (no longer on the market) that Glasair builders were
> asserting was much better than Weld-on 10. In 2011 at about 450 flight
> hours, I had a rear window blow out in high, cold conditions (15K feet, -12
> C outside, inside heaters blasting). It was a big surprise and caused a lot
> of noise in the back seat and some turbulent air in the cockpit:
> http://faculty.washington.edu/dmasys/RV10/RV10_lostwind_rearview.jpg
>
> I replaced the rear window using Weld-on 10 as recommended by Vans.
>
> Fast forward to 2014, with 750 flight hours. Climbing through 12K feet to
> get over buildups near Eugene, OR, the entire pilot side door window
> shattered and departed the plane. Most of the window fragments hit the VS
> and HS, making a variety of dents in the leading edges. But some of them
> came in the cockpit at high velocity. Luckily I had the Rosen visor swung
> to the left, providing an extra layer of protection. A window fragment
> shattered the Rosen visor; I got a small neck lump from the impact, but
> nothing drew blood. So we continued on and made it back to base.
> (Performance observation: an RV-10 that does 170kts with all of its windows
> intact will still do 150kts at same power setting with the pilot side door
> window absent, but it is awfully windy inside).
>
> Suffice it to say, I removed and reattached the remaining windows with
> Weld-on 10.
>
> Moral of the story: make sure you have a compelling justification for
> deviating from Van's directions on mounting the RV-10 windows.
>
> -Dan Masys
> N104LD
>
> Time: 10:46:51 PM PST US
> Subject: RV10-List: Lord adhesive window installation question
> From: Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com>
>
>
> Hi everyone. I'm ready to attach the windows in my RV-10 and am looking for
> advice
> on those who have used the Lord 7545 A/E adhesive sold by Geoff at Aerosport
> Products. After reading lots of positive comments from here about it, I
> obtained
> a few tubes from him.
>
> The plans call for installing the windows onto the doors when the doors are
> off
> and laying flat, presumably to allow gravity to help hold them in place
> while
> they are being cured. Of course, the rear windows can't be installed with
> that
> luxury, but they're smaller and lighter. And the windscreen rests largely
> on the nose while curing, so that should be less of an issue too.
>
> But my question is, considering that Lord Adhesive is different than Vans'
> would
> have us use anyway, is it sticky enough that I could install the windows on
> the doors while the doors are closed and on the plane - in essentially the
> same
> orientation as the rear windows? The reason I ask isn't due to laziness :-)
> But instead, I'm one of the lucky ones whose doors ended up fitting quite
> well
> without a lot of work. And I figure that if the windows are attached to the
> doors while the doors are in their proper latched position, they can only
> help
> (slightly) to further stiffen the door in the proper position. The last
> thing
> I want to do is to fit the windows to the doors when the doors are on the
> floor, and then find that gravity warped things slightly while they were
> curing,
> and the doors no longer fit properly. It would seem to me that adhering the
> windows to the doors when the doors are in their closed position will help
> keep
> everything aligned properly, so long as the Lord adhesive is sticky enough
> before fully cured that it will hold the window tightly to the door and in
> place
> while it is curing.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dan
> ---
> Dan Charrois
> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
> Phone: 780-961-2213
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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I'm paying $2K (as of 10 months ago) for about the same coverage.
Another factor they look at is your annual flying. Too much and your exposure is
high; too little and you don't stay current. You want to be somewhere in the
middle but I have no idea what the actual number desired is.
Tim is right, expect higher rates until you have 100 hours in type. And some minimum
total. A year ago it was very expensive with less than 200 TT.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440460#440460
Message 24
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This is why it's hard to compare policies. Hull, liability limits,
deductibles etc. can change a little and make significant changes in
cost. The best you can do is contact their broker and get a quote with
your numbers. Your broker will poll the available insurance companies
still doing aircraft insurance. There are other factors ..... how long
have you been with this company and do you have more than one aircraft
insured. The little things create a minefield that make comparisons
really difficult.
Linn
I'm with Aircraft & Marine, and the insurance company is U.S. Specialty
Insurance Company. I only have liability on my planes so the comparison
isn't worth anything.
Linn
On 4/8/2015 8:32 AM, Chris Hukill wrote:
> Timely discussion for me. I wish the other posters would disclose the
> actual amounts that you are paying to allow us to compare our quotes.
> My new airplane quote came in at $2604 /year. Thats for $150,000 hull
> and $1 mil per occurance/$100,000 per passenger. This is named pilot
> only (for now), and hangared.
> Is this in the ballpark that others are paying?
> Chris Hukill
> Finally assembling
> *
>
>
> *
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Insurance mystery |
Tim Olson wrote:
> Sounds like Avemco to me. Worthless.
> When I get their envelopes in the mail, I open them, stuff the contents in the
prepaid return mailer and write on them with a marker saying "too expensive".
> Then it at least costs them more to try to peddle their BS at twice the price.
> Tim
> Do not archive
> ]
I just got a follow up letter from Avemco, wanting me to send them the okay for
their twice as expensive insurance.
I like your idea, "It's too expensive" is going onto their pre-paid envelope!
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440477#440477
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