Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:46 AM - Cleveland brake parts (David)
2. 06:55 AM - Re: Cleveland brake parts (Linn Walters)
3. 08:59 AM - Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass (rvdave)
4. 10:19 AM - Re: KOSH Parking (kearney)
5. 10:26 AM - Soundproofing (kearney)
6. 10:27 AM - Re: Re: KOSH Parking (Bob Condrey)
7. 10:49 AM - Re: Soundproofing (Danny Riggs)
8. 10:50 AM - Re: Soundproofing (Pascal)
9. 11:17 AM - Re: Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass (Ed Kranz)
10. 12:41 PM - Re: Soundproofing (kearney)
11. 12:47 PM - Re: Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass (Tim Olson)
12. 01:42 PM - Re: Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass (Kelly McMullen)
13. 03:15 PM - Re: flo scan (cjay)
14. 04:07 PM - Re: Soundproofing (Bob Turner)
15. 04:48 PM - Re: Re: Soundproofing (Les Kearney)
16. 05:07 PM - Re: Soundproofing (Bob Turner)
17. 05:19 PM - Re: Re: Soundproofing (Pascal)
18. 05:57 PM - Re: Re: Soundproofing (Jesse Saint)
19. 06:06 PM - Re: Re: Soundproofing (Miller John)
20. 06:57 PM - Re: plexiglass bond to fiberglass (rvdave)
21. 08:01 PM - Re: Cleveland brake parts (David Saylor)
22. 09:09 PM - V Speeds (kearney)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Cleveland brake parts |
I have used Cleveland brake parts; I was one of the original prototypes for
the Matco wheels and brakes, so removed and stored used brakes parts. Also
have box of pads (8?) left. Email me directly if you are interested. For new
builders, the Matco wheels and brakes are the way to go.
David
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| Subject: | Re: Cleveland brake parts |
If they're not already spoke for .....
I have a few other airplanes with Cleveland stuff ....
Linn
On 7/27/2015 8:43 AM, David wrote:
>
> I have used Cleveland brake parts; I was one of the original
> prototypes for the Matco wheels and brakes, so removed and stored used
> brakes parts. Also have box of pads (8?) left. Email me directly if
> you are interested. For new builders, the Matco wheels and brakes are
> the way to go.
>
> David
>
>
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| Subject: | Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass |
Recently I glassed around cabin rear windows after sanding with 80 and wiping with
acetone and paper towel. That was about two months ago, now sanding near
the taped edge I noticed it peeling up, testing an area showed no bond to plex.
Thinking I apparently didn't sand deep enough into plex to get a good bond.
Using West epoxy--the glass bonded excellent to the cabin top. I ended up peeling
and cutting away unbonded glass to plex for a redo. What went wrong and
what should I do for a confident bond?
--------
Dave Ford
RV6 for sale
RV10 building
Cadillac, MI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445248#445248
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| Subject: | Re: KOSH Parking |
Hi Bob
Thanks for the tip on the plywood squares. When I was parked, my wheels started
to sink almost immediately. After I rolled up on the squares the problem was
solved.
Cheers
Les
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445263#445263
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Hi
Now that I have a few hours on my -10, I am thinking about installing some soundproofing.
At KOSH I saw a demo of the Sound-Ex soundproofing at the Plane Patterns
booth. IT seemed like a very effective and light product.
Given that I don't have access to the floor wells, I was wondering if anyone can
provide guidance on where retrofitted soundproofing has proven the most effective
(ie. cabin side firewall / side panels etc, under front seats etc.
Is the Sound-Ex product effective?
Cheers
Les
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445264#445264
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| Subject: | Re: KOSH Parking |
Lesson learned over the years - I also use the same technique on my camping
trailer in Camp Scholler! Glad it all worked out for you.
Bob
On Monday, July 27, 2015, kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
> >
>
> Hi Bob
>
> Thanks for the tip on the plywood squares. When I was parked, my wheels
> started to sink almost immediately. After I rolled up on the squares the
> problem was solved.
>
> Cheers
>
> Les
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445263#445263
>
>
Message 7
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I used it in my -10 and it helped a bunch
Now that isn't saying that it's gonna be as quiet as an airliner but it hel
ps
> Subject: RV10-List: Soundproofing
> From: kearney@shaw.ca
> Date: Mon=2C 27 Jul 2015 10:23:29 -0700
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>
>
> Hi
>
> Now that I have a few hours on my -10=2C I am thinking about installing s
ome soundproofing. At KOSH I saw a demo of the Sound-Ex soundproofing at th
e Plane Patterns booth. IT seemed like a very effective and light product.
>
> Given that I don't have access to the floor wells=2C I was wondering if a
nyone can provide guidance on where retrofitted soundproofing has proven th
e most effective (ie. cabin side firewall / side panels etc=2C under front
seats etc.
>
> Is the Sound-Ex product effective?
>
> Cheers
>
> Les
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445264#445264
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
Les;
For what its worth.
The best soundproofing I have found is where I can hear it. I bought Zulu 2
headsets and the plane is as quiet as I will ever make it.
With that said. I used heat insulation and a spray on sound insulator that
dissipated the noise significantly but in the end, weight and ease wise, I
determined that the headset investment was the best route.
Pascal
-----Original Message-----
From: kearney
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2015 10:23 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Soundproofing
Hi
Now that I have a few hours on my -10, I am thinking about installing some
soundproofing. At KOSH I saw a demo of the Sound-Ex soundproofing at the
Plane Patterns booth. IT seemed like a very effective and light product.
Given that I don't have access to the floor wells, I was wondering if anyone
can provide guidance on where retrofitted soundproofing has proven the most
effective (ie. cabin side firewall / side panels etc, under front seats etc.
Is the Sound-Ex product effective?
Cheers
Les
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445264#445264
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass |
Acetone is a big no-no on plexiglass. It can cause crazing, and it kind of
melts the plexi. I've used naptha or a PPG paint reducer for all the plexi
cleaning. My guess is that the acetone remelted the areas that you sanded,
and smoothed them out and the epoxy didn't bond.
On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 10:55 AM, rvdave <rv610dave@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Recently I glassed around cabin rear windows after sanding with 80 and
> wiping with acetone and paper towel. That was about two months ago, now
> sanding near the taped edge I noticed it peeling up, testing an area showed
> no bond to plex. Thinking I apparently didn't sand deep enough into plex
> to get a good bond. Using West epoxy--the glass bonded excellent to the
> cabin top. I ended up peeling and cutting away unbonded glass to plex for
> a redo. What went wrong and what should I do for a confident bond?
>
> --------
> Dave Ford
> RV6 for sale
> RV10 building
> Cadillac, MI
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445248#445248
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
Hi
Since I posted this I started working through the VAF archives etc. I ended up
researching Abesco FP200 foam that I read about on the VAF forums.
This would seem to be a good product to install under the floor pans as it is an
expanding fire stop foam and does have some noise damping properties as well.
The lightening holes would provide installation access. When cured it is a very
light foam.
Has anyone on the list used this?
As I understand it, one limitation is that it should not be used in places where
temps normally exceed 150-200C on an ongoing basis. Does anyone have any idea
as to what the skin temps are near the exhausts?
Lastly, here is an interesting demo of the differences between fire-blocks vs fire-stops. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djB4dmfHhQk
Cheers
Les
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445271#445271
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| Subject: | Re: Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass |
Kerosene is also a good cleaner for plexi if needed.
Tim
On 7/27/2015 1:13 PM, Ed Kranz wrote:
> Acetone is a big no-no on plexiglass. It can cause crazing, and it kind
> of melts the plexi. I've used naptha or a PPG paint reducer for all the
> plexi cleaning. My guess is that the acetone remelted the areas that you
> sanded, and smoothed them out and the epoxy didn't bond.
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 10:55 AM, rvdave <rv610dave@gmail.com
> <mailto:rv610dave@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> <mailto:rv610dave@gmail.com>>
>
> Recently I glassed around cabin rear windows after sanding with 80
> and wiping with acetone and paper towel. That was about two months
> ago, now sanding near the taped edge I noticed it peeling up,
> testing an area showed no bond to plex. Thinking I apparently
> didn't sand deep enough into plex to get a good bond. Using West
> epoxy--the glass bonded excellent to the cabin top. I ended up
> peeling and cutting away unbonded glass to plex for a redo. What
> went wrong and what should I do for a confident bond?
>
> --------
> Dave Ford
> RV6 for sale
> RV10 building
> Cadillac, MI
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Bonding fiberglass to plexiglass |
Urethane paint reducer is the ticket on plexiglass. I found it in the
literature for the Lord adhesive that Geoff recommends. Does a nice job
without risk to the plexi. If I recall correctly, I think the plexi is
supposed to be sanded with 200 or 220 grit sandpaper before
epoxy/fiberglassing. While I use 80 grit to sand to shape, I generally go
over that with 220 before wiping clean and starting the glass work.
On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 12:43 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Kerosene is also a good cleaner for plexi if needed.
>
> Tim
>
> On 7/27/2015 1:13 PM, Ed Kranz wrote:
>
>> Acetone is a big no-no on plexiglass. It can cause crazing, and it kind
>> of melts the plexi. I've used naptha or a PPG paint reducer for all the
>> plexi cleaning. My guess is that the acetone remelted the areas that you
>> sanded, and smoothed them out and the epoxy didn't bond.
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 10:55 AM, rvdave <rv610dave@gmail.com
>> <mailto:rv610dave@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> <mailto:rv610dave@gmail.com>>
>>
>> Recently I glassed around cabin rear windows after sanding with 80
>> and wiping with acetone and paper towel. That was about two months
>> ago, now sanding near the taped edge I noticed it peeling up,
>> testing an area showed no bond to plex. Thinking I apparently
>> didn't sand deep enough into plex to get a good bond. Using West
>> epoxy--the glass bonded excellent to the cabin top. I ended up
>> peeling and cutting away unbonded glass to plex for a redo. What
>> went wrong and what should I do for a confident bond?
>>
>> --------
>> Dave Ford
>> RV6 for sale
>> RV10 building
>> Cadillac, MI
>>
>>
>
>
Message 13
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I guess I could try this, but the problem doesn't show up until flight, so this
would take a lot of flight testing, but maybe I could do it on the gnd.
jesse(at)saintaviation.co wrote:
> I've heard recently of another EIS doing this exact same thing. Disconnect the
auxin puts and plug one back in at a time to see which one introduces the problem.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> jesse@saintaviation.com
> C: 352-427-0285
> F: 815-377-3694
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> > On Jul 25, 2015, at 1:09 PM, cjay wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Anyone ever have a flo scan transducer fail on them?
> >
> > A search has brought lots of discussion on location, but no discussion on
how long they last.
> >
> > I've been having problems with my EIS 6000 and having a hard time tracking
down the problem. Basically it works on and off, when not working the screen
goes berserk before it shuts down. GRT even bench tested it and said it was
fine, that maybe the problem was one of the sensors was putting more than 5volts
into one an Aux channel. Right now it's show my fuel flow is not working so
I was going to try replacing it. Before I buy one I thought I'd ask the group
to see if anyone had any other ideas?
> >
> > cjay
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445186#445186
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445279#445279
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
I'm with RV10Flyer; the best sound reduction/pound is from a good headset.
Start there, then decide if you need more. (My personal answer was "no".)
However, I did have to do something about the draft in the back; passengers in
the back had cold heads and hot feet.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445282#445282
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
Bob
What did you do for the back pax?
Cheers
Les
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jul 27, 2015, at 17:04, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
>
> I'm with RV10Flyer; the best sound reduction/pound is from a good headset.
> Start there, then decide if you need more. (My personal answer was "no".)
>
> However, I did have to do something about the draft in the back; passengers in
the back had cold heads and hot feet.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445282#445282
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
kearney wrote:
> Bob
>
> What did you do for the back pax?
>
> Cheers
>
> Les
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> > On Jul 27, 2015, at 17:04, Bob Turner wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm with RV10Flyer; the best sound reduction/pound is from a good headset.
> > Start there, then decide if you need more. (My personal answer was "no".)
> >
> > However, I did have to do something about the draft in the back; passengers
in the back had cold heads and hot feet.
> >
> > --------
> > Bob Turner
> > RV-10 QB
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Well, mostly I turned the pilot's intercom volume down so I don't have to hear
the complaints!! ha ha. Seriously, I stuffed some insulation into all the corregations
in the aft baggage bulkhead. That helped some. As a test, I have taped
some cardboard in front of the rear heat outlets, taped on 3 sides but canted
at 45 degrees up, to encourage the heat to go up instead of out to their feet.
That helped some. So do wool hats. Since the side walls and baggage bulkhead
are not insulated, they are going to be cold when in flight, if it's cold outside.
I suspect that a small amount of stick-on insulation, on those side walls
and baggage bulkhead, would fix the problem more permanently, but I haven't
been motivated enough yet to try it. Oddly the front seat occupants don't seem
to have the same complaint of hot feet, cold head.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445285#445285
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
If you mean headsets? same for back Pax
if you mean hot feet and cold heads?, the answer lies on the vent doors on
the firewall-
http://www.planeinnovations.com/product/heater-bypass-valves-hbv-03/
I was blessed to be given the chance to help design them. They have tabs
that totally block any heat from entering and are stainless/stiff so doors
dont warp when opening and closing. result-no hot tunnel and two young
daughters (one very temperature sensitive) that have been quite happy with
no hot feet (during summer) and warm in winter- I used a PVC 45 degree pipe
on the back holes to force the heat up versus right to feet.
Pascal
-----Original Message-----
From: Les Kearney
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2015 4:43 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Soundproofing
Bob
What did you do for the back pax?
Cheers
Les
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jul 27, 2015, at 17:04, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
>
> I'm with RV10Flyer; the best sound reduction/pound is from a good headset.
> Start there, then decide if you need more. (My personal answer was "no".)
>
> However, I did have to do something about the draft in the back;
> passengers in the back had cold heads and hot feet.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445282#445282
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
Back passengers get cold if the doors aren't well sealed. The air in the cabin
is sucked out around the door hinges and is replaced from tailcone air through
the corregations in the rear baggage wall. If you have this problem, try sealing
around the hinges better.
Regarding noise, door seals hugely reduce the noise level in the cabin. A plane
I worked on with inflatable door seals went from the loudest -10 to probably
the quietest -10 I have flown when the door seals were finished and inflated.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
352-427-0285
jesse@saintaviation.com
Sent from my iPad
> On Jul 27, 2015, at 7:43 PM, Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>
> Bob
>
> What did you do for the back pax?
>
> Cheers
>
> Les
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jul 27, 2015, at 17:04, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I'm with RV10Flyer; the best sound reduction/pound is from a good headset.
>> Start there, then decide if you need more. (My personal answer was "no".)
>>
>> However, I did have to do something about the draft in the back; passengers
in the back had cold heads and hot feet.
>>
>> --------
>> Bob Turner
>> RV-10 QB
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445282#445282
>
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Soundproofing |
It also helps to seal and insulate the aft bulkhead in the baggage compartment.
As Jesse said, lots of air comes forward into the cabin from the tailcone.
grumpy
N184JM
do not archive
> On Jul 27, 2015, at 7:53 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse@saintaviation.com> wrote:
>
>
> Back passengers get cold if the doors aren't well sealed. The air in the cabin
is sucked out around the door hinges and is replaced from tailcone air through
the corregations in the rear baggage wall. If you have this problem, try sealing
around the hinges better.
>
> Regarding noise, door seals hugely reduce the noise level in the cabin. A plane
I worked on with inflatable door seals went from the loudest -10 to probably
the quietest -10 I have flown when the door seals were finished and inflated.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> 352-427-0285
> jesse@saintaviation.com
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Jul 27, 2015, at 7:43 PM, Les Kearney <kearney@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Bob
>>
>> What did you do for the back pax?
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Les
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jul 27, 2015, at 17:04, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm with RV10Flyer; the best sound reduction/pound is from a good headset.
>>> Start there, then decide if you need more. (My personal answer was "no".)
>>>
>>> However, I did have to do something about the draft in the back; passengers
in the back had cold heads and hot feet.
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Bob Turner
>>> RV-10 QB
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=445282#445282
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: plexiglass bond to fiberglass |
Maybe I wasn't clear about not bonding the plex to the fiberglass top but using
fiberglass cloth and epoxy over the plex/fiberglass joint to perhaps eliminate
cracking around the window joint. I will try the urethane cleaner for cleaning
after sanding to make deeper grooves in the plex, maybe that is the solution.
--------
Dave Ford
RV6 for sale
RV10 building
Cadillac, MI
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| Subject: | Re: Cleveland brake parts |
Thanks David, I'm well set for pads and all but the discs seem to be in
good shape. I plan to replace the discs with some heavy duty replacements,
so if you have those, drop me a line.
I practiced the techniques discussed earlier on the way from OSH to
NorCal. It's kinda fun. A little throttle brings the tail right around
with full rudder.
Thanks again,
Dave Saylor
831-750-0284
On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 5:43 AM, David <dlm34077@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
> I have used Cleveland brake parts; I was one of the original prototypes
> for the Matco wheels and brakes, so removed and stored used brakes parts.
> Also have box of pads (8?) left. Email me directly if you are interested.
> For new builders, the Matco wheels and brakes are the way to go.
>
>
> David
>
>
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Hi
At KOSH I had a spirited discussion with a group of South Africans regarding flutter, IAS and TAS. The end result was a revisited Van's article on flutter that I had read many, many moons ago. (See http://vansaircraft.com/pdf/hp_limts.pdf)
I also reviewed the RV-10 v-speeds published by Vans in the flight test doc after
reading he flutter document. In particular I was surprised to note that the
Vne published by Vans of 230 mph / 200 Kts was TAS and not IAS. Many of the
POH docs available on line quote a 200 KIAS value for Vne which, at higher altitudes,
could lead to a reduced flutter safety margin.
I am assuming that all the other V speeds should be KIAS and not KTAS not that
there would be much of a difference except perhaps for the max maneuvering speed
/ max structural cruise speed.
Is this correct or am I missing something here?
Cheers
Les
Inquiring minds really need to know.
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