Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:42 AM - Re: MT prop governor (Geoff Combs)
2. 06:55 AM - Re: MT prop governor (Kelly McMullen)
3. 07:28 AM - Re: MT prop governor (John Trollinger)
4. 07:43 AM - Re: MT prop governor (Shannon Hicks)
5. 12:54 PM - Re: MT prop governor (Kelly McMullen)
6. 03:20 PM - (Stein Bruch)
7. 03:27 PM - Re: (Ed Kranz)
8. 04:48 PM - Re: MT prop governor (pilotdds)
Message 1
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| Subject: | MT prop governor |
I contacted MT about this as well and this was the response I got. They were
very quick to respond.
Just an FYI
Geoff
Hi Goeff ,
No Problem you can go on with flying , your are safe because your
manufacturing year is 2008 and not 2010 until 2013.
Thank you
Best Regards
Andreas Seperant
Engineering / Tech Support
MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
www.mt-propeller.com
Von: g.combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 22. August 2016 13:54
An: Andreas Seperant
Betreff: Re: AW: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept
2008
Andreas I do have a lightspeed ignition system on the left side and a
standard slick mag on the right. Is this something to be concerned about
Thanks Geoff
Sent from my iPhone
Geoff Combs
Aerosport Modeling & Design
On Aug 22, 2016, at 3:30 AM, Andreas Seperant <techsupport@mt-propeller.com>
wrote:
Dear Geoff ,
Thank you very much for your message and information.
Your governor P-860-3 with S/N 08G595-F is not affected from this SB.
Just governor which are manufactured between April 2010 and July 2013 and
installed on direct drive engine modified with electronic ignition on higher
compression pistons are affected.
If you have any more question , please let me know.
Best Regards
Andreas Seperant
Engineering / Tech Support
MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
www.mt-propeller.com
Von: Geoff Combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
Gesendet: Samstag, 20. August 2016 00:30
An: Andreas Seperant
Betreff: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept 2008
Tech support
I have an RV series prop Governor on my RV-10. It has a hartzell 2 blade
prop as recommended by Vans. My engine is a narrow deck D4a5 built by
Aerosport. I have
Been flying this aircraft since 10-15-2009. I have 630 hrs. I have been
following the failures on the newer units and was wondering if my unit will
be under the new
SB 31.
P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F Check off record 20800286,
manufactured 16 sept 2008
Thanks Geoff
Geoff Combs
Aerosport Modeling & Design
8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
Canal, Winchester, Ohio 43110
614-834-5227
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: MT prop governor
I actually had to call Lycoming and have them dig in to the question to get
the answer.
I don't have the info handy, but there is something that they provided for
me on their documentation that basically says the Wide deck engines other
than the
IO-390 use the .947:1, and then the IO-390 uses the .895:1. I had to
get the normal
tech support lycoming people to escalate the question though because they
too found the info hard to get. At any rate, what bugged me about it is, I
literally spent tens of hours trying to get to the bottom of it. I was
convinced that everyone else (MT/Van's/Hartzell) was wrong and PCU5000X was
right, until Lycoming finally found that info for me. Then once they did,
it went the other way.
Funny how hard it was to get accurate info...you'd think a certified engine
company would have every last detail on their engines, at least the brand
new ones.
Shocking that they didn't.
Tim
On 8/22/2016 10:21 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> Hmmm,
> The IO-390 IS a wide deck engine, just the cylinders had to use the
> narrow deck attachment to allow for the extra bore over the IO-360.
> I too thought it was a narrow deck at first until a Lyc rep explained
> it to me. You will also see on the IO-580 that it uses the P-860-5,
> for a wide deck engine. That engine is the same as the -390 with two
> more cylinders.
>
> On 8/22/2016 8:08 PM, Tim Olson wrote:
>>
>> That sounds about right based on what I found when looking for
>> something for my RV-14.
>> The RV-14 BTW, with an IO-390, would also use an .895:1 / 2420 RPM
>> governor on it's front pad, just for those who may stumble on this
>> thread.
>> I have the P-860-3 on my IO-540 Narrow Deck, which is also just fine.
>> Sure, you
>> can get it with a different head position but most of that is
>> adjustable anyway.
>> Even on my RV-14, using the Hartzell S-1-79, I had to tweak the arm,
>> and in fact buy a longer arm.
>> There are people (PCU5000X is one of them) who mistakenly think that
>> the
>> IO-390 should use a .947:1 ratio governor. That's the primary reason
>> I didn't go with them when building...because they were the odd man
>> out in misquoting me which one to use. But then again, it was like
>> pulling teeth to get the information verified at Lycoming too.
>> Tim
>>
>>
>> On 8/22/2016 9:40 PM, Tim Lewis wrote:
>>>
>>> From the VAF thread, I see the MT Governor Installations document is
>>> at http://www.mt-propeller.com/pdf/list_gov_e-1057.pdf
>>>
>>> If I read this correctly...
>>>
>>> P-860-3 is specified for an IO-360 with gear reduction .895:1 and
>>> max RPM of 2420+/-10, head position 100 degrees (page 2)
>>>
>>> P-880-20 is specified for an IO-540 (wide deck, I presume) with gear
>>> reduction of .947:1, max rpm of 2557+/-10, head position 315 degrees
>>> (page 4)
>>>
>>> P-880-21 is specified for an IO-540 (narrow deck) with gear
>>> reduction of .895:1, max rpm of 2420+/- 10, head position 315 degrees
(page 4).
>>>
>>> I have a P-860-3 (from Van's, as I recall) on my narrow deck
>>> IO-540-C4B5. It appears from the MT document that the governor
>>> spins faster on a wide deck IO-540. I don't know if there is any
>>> internal difference between these models.
>>>
>>>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: MT prop governor |
Well, I am not comforted by that response, because Myron's engine AFAIK
does not have electronic ignition, just two Bendix 1200 mags, not sure
if he has stock or a bit higher compression. I am not convinced that
cylinder pressures from rate of combustion or compression ratio have
much to do with a governor. Maybe prop harmonics, but is there really
that much vibration transmitted internally in the gears of the engine?
Given that I don't believe MT has seen any of the recently failed
governors to analyze the failures, nor have they release a service
bulletin, I just don't think they really are certain about the extent of
the problem. My email to MT USA from Friday goes unanswered.
On 8/23/2016 6:12 AM, Geoff Combs wrote:
>
> I contacted MT about this as well and this was the response I got. They were
> very quick to respond.
> Just an FYI
>
> Geoff
>
>
> Hi Goeff ,
>
> No Problem you can go on with flying , your are safe because your
> manufacturing year is 2008 and not 2010 until 2013.
>
> Thank you
>
> Best Regards
>
> Andreas Seperant
>
> Engineering / Tech Support
> MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
> Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
> D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
> phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
> fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
> www.mt-propeller.com
>
>
> Von: g.combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
> Gesendet: Montag, 22. August 2016 13:54
> An: Andreas Seperant
> Betreff: Re: AW: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept
> 2008
>
> Andreas I do have a lightspeed ignition system on the left side and a
> standard slick mag on the right. Is this something to be concerned about
>
> Thanks Geoff
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> Geoff Combs
> Aerosport Modeling & Design
>
>
> On Aug 22, 2016, at 3:30 AM, Andreas Seperant <techsupport@mt-propeller.com>
> wrote:
> Dear Geoff ,
>
> Thank you very much for your message and information.
>
> Your governor P-860-3 with S/N 08G595-F is not affected from this SB.
>
> Just governor which are manufactured between April 2010 and July 2013 and
> installed on direct drive engine modified with electronic ignition on higher
> compression pistons are affected.
>
> If you have any more question , please let me know.
>
>
> Best Regards
>
> Andreas Seperant
>
> Engineering / Tech Support
> MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
> Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
> D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
> phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
> fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
> www.mt-propeller.com
>
>
> Von: Geoff Combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
> Gesendet: Samstag, 20. August 2016 00:30
> An: Andreas Seperant
> Betreff: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept 2008
>
> Tech support
> I have an RV series prop Governor on my RV-10. It has a hartzell 2 blade
> prop as recommended by Vans. My engine is a narrow deck D4a5 built by
> Aerosport. I have
> Been flying this aircraft since 10-15-2009. I have 630 hrs. I have been
> following the failures on the newer units and was wondering if my unit will
> be under the new
> SB 31.
>
> P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F Check off record 20800286,
> manufactured 16 sept 2008
>
> Thanks Geoff
>
>
> Geoff Combs
> Aerosport Modeling & Design
> 8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
> Canal, Winchester, Ohio 43110
> 614-834-5227
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 11:36 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: MT prop governor
>
>
> I actually had to call Lycoming and have them dig in to the question to get
> the answer.
> I don't have the info handy, but there is something that they provided for
> me on their documentation that basically says the Wide deck engines other
> than the
> IO-390 use the .947:1, and then the IO-390 uses the .895:1. I had to
> get the normal
> tech support lycoming people to escalate the question though because they
> too found the info hard to get. At any rate, what bugged me about it is, I
> literally spent tens of hours trying to get to the bottom of it. I was
> convinced that everyone else (MT/Van's/Hartzell) was wrong and PCU5000X was
> right, until Lycoming finally found that info for me. Then once they did,
> it went the other way.
> Funny how hard it was to get accurate info...you'd think a certified engine
> company would have every last detail on their engines, at least the brand
> new ones.
> Shocking that they didn't.
> Tim
>
>
> On 8/22/2016 10:21 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>
>> Hmmm,
>> The IO-390 IS a wide deck engine, just the cylinders had to use the
>> narrow deck attachment to allow for the extra bore over the IO-360.
>> I too thought it was a narrow deck at first until a Lyc rep explained
>> it to me. You will also see on the IO-580 that it uses the P-860-5,
>> for a wide deck engine. That engine is the same as the -390 with two
>> more cylinders.
>>
>> On 8/22/2016 8:08 PM, Tim Olson wrote:
>>>
>>> That sounds about right based on what I found when looking for
>>> something for my RV-14.
>>> The RV-14 BTW, with an IO-390, would also use an .895:1 / 2420 RPM
>>> governor on it's front pad, just for those who may stumble on this
>>> thread.
>>> I have the P-860-3 on my IO-540 Narrow Deck, which is also just fine.
>>> Sure, you
>>> can get it with a different head position but most of that is
>>> adjustable anyway.
>>> Even on my RV-14, using the Hartzell S-1-79, I had to tweak the arm,
>>> and in fact buy a longer arm.
>>> There are people (PCU5000X is one of them) who mistakenly think that
>>> the
>>> IO-390 should use a .947:1 ratio governor. That's the primary reason
>>> I didn't go with them when building...because they were the odd man
>>> out in misquoting me which one to use. But then again, it was like
>>> pulling teeth to get the information verified at Lycoming too.
>>> Tim
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/22/2016 9:40 PM, Tim Lewis wrote:
>>>>
>>>> From the VAF thread, I see the MT Governor Installations document is
>>>> at http://www.mt-propeller.com/pdf/list_gov_e-1057.pdf
>>>>
>>>> If I read this correctly...
>>>>
>>>> P-860-3 is specified for an IO-360 with gear reduction .895:1 and
>>>> max RPM of 2420+/-10, head position 100 degrees (page 2)
>>>>
>>>> P-880-20 is specified for an IO-540 (wide deck, I presume) with gear
>>>> reduction of .947:1, max rpm of 2557+/-10, head position 315 degrees
>>>> (page 4)
>>>>
>>>> P-880-21 is specified for an IO-540 (narrow deck) with gear
>>>> reduction of .895:1, max rpm of 2420+/- 10, head position 315 degrees
> (page 4).
>>>>
>>>> I have a P-860-3 (from Van's, as I recall) on my narrow deck
>>>> IO-540-C4B5. It appears from the MT document that the governor
>>>> spins faster on a wide deck IO-540. I don't know if there is any
>>>> internal difference between these models.
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: MT prop governor |
The responded to me really quickly (emailed Sunday night got the response
Monday morning). I agree though, not sure why the believe the issue is a
mag / compression issue.
On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 9:53 AM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>
> Well, I am not comforted by that response, because Myron's engine AFAIK
> does not have electronic ignition, just two Bendix 1200 mags, not sure if
> he has stock or a bit higher compression. I am not convinced that cylinder
> pressures from rate of combustion or compression ratio have much to do with
> a governor. Maybe prop harmonics, but is there really that much vibration
> transmitted internally in the gears of the engine?
> Given that I don't believe MT has seen any of the recently failed
> governors to analyze the failures, nor have they release a service
> bulletin, I just don't think they really are certain about the extent of
> the problem. My email to MT USA from Friday goes unanswered.
>
> On 8/23/2016 6:12 AM, Geoff Combs wrote:
>
>> g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
>>
>> I contacted MT about this as well and this was the response I got. They
>> were
>> very quick to respond.
>> Just an FYI
>>
>> Geoff
>>
>>
>> Hi Goeff ,
>>
>> No Problem you can go on with flying , your are safe because your
>> manufacturing year is 2008 and not 2010 until 2013.
>>
>> Thank you
>>
>> Best Regards
>>
>> Andreas Seperant
>>
>> Engineering / Tech Support
>> MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
>> Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
>> D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
>> phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
>> fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
>> www.mt-propeller.com
>>
>>
>> Von: g.combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
>> Gesendet: Montag, 22. August 2016 13:54
>> An: Andreas Seperant
>> Betreff: Re: AW: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16
>> sept
>> 2008
>>
>> Andreas I do have a lightspeed ignition system on the left side and a
>> standard slick mag on the right. Is this something to be concerned about
>>
>> Thanks Geoff
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> Geoff Combs
>> Aerosport Modeling & Design
>>
>>
>>
>> On Aug 22, 2016, at 3:30 AM, Andreas Seperant <
>> techsupport@mt-propeller.com>
>> wrote:
>> Dear Geoff ,
>>
>> Thank you very much for your message and information.
>>
>> Your governor P-860-3 with S/N 08G595-F is not affected from this SB.
>>
>> Just governor which are manufactured between April 2010 and July 2013 and
>> installed on direct drive engine modified with electronic ignition on
>> higher
>> compression pistons are affected.
>>
>> If you have any more question , please let me know.
>>
>>
>> Best Regards
>>
>> Andreas Seperant
>>
>> Engineering / Tech Support
>> MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
>> Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
>> D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
>> phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
>> fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
>> www.mt-propeller.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Von: Geoff Combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
>> Gesendet: Samstag, 20. August 2016 00:30
>> An: Andreas Seperant
>> Betreff: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept 2008
>>
>> Tech support
>> I have an RV series prop Governor on my RV-10. It has a hartzell 2 blade
>> prop as recommended by Vans. My engine is a narrow deck D4a5 built by
>> Aerosport. I have
>> Been flying this aircraft since 10-15-2009. I have 630 hrs. I have been
>> following the failures on the newer units and was wondering if my unit
>> will
>> be under the new
>> SB 31.
>>
>> P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F Check off record 20800286,
>> manufactured 16 sept 2008
>>
>> Thanks Geoff
>>
>>
>> Geoff Combs
>> Aerosport Modeling & Design
>> 8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
>> Canal, Winchester, Ohio 43110
>> 614-834-5227
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
>> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 11:36 PM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: MT prop governor
>>
>>
>> I actually had to call Lycoming and have them dig in to the question to
>> get
>> the answer.
>> I don't have the info handy, but there is something that they provided for
>> me on their documentation that basically says the Wide deck engines other
>> than the
>> IO-390 use the .947:1, and then the IO-390 uses the .895:1. I had to
>> get the normal
>> tech support lycoming people to escalate the question though because they
>> too found the info hard to get. At any rate, what bugged me about it is,
>> I
>> literally spent tens of hours trying to get to the bottom of it. I was
>> convinced that everyone else (MT/Van's/Hartzell) was wrong and PCU5000X
>> was
>> right, until Lycoming finally found that info for me. Then once they did,
>> it went the other way.
>> Funny how hard it was to get accurate info...you'd think a certified
>> engine
>> company would have every last detail on their engines, at least the brand
>> new ones.
>> Shocking that they didn't.
>> Tim
>>
>>
>> On 8/22/2016 10:21 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hmmm,
>>> The IO-390 IS a wide deck engine, just the cylinders had to use the
>>> narrow deck attachment to allow for the extra bore over the IO-360.
>>> I too thought it was a narrow deck at first until a Lyc rep explained
>>> it to me. You will also see on the IO-580 that it uses the P-860-5,
>>> for a wide deck engine. That engine is the same as the -390 with two
>>> more cylinders.
>>>
>>> On 8/22/2016 8:08 PM, Tim Olson wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> That sounds about right based on what I found when looking for
>>>> something for my RV-14.
>>>> The RV-14 BTW, with an IO-390, would also use an .895:1 / 2420 RPM
>>>> governor on it's front pad, just for those who may stumble on this
>>>> thread.
>>>> I have the P-860-3 on my IO-540 Narrow Deck, which is also just fine.
>>>> Sure, you
>>>> can get it with a different head position but most of that is
>>>> adjustable anyway.
>>>> Even on my RV-14, using the Hartzell S-1-79, I had to tweak the arm,
>>>> and in fact buy a longer arm.
>>>> There are people (PCU5000X is one of them) who mistakenly think that
>>>> the
>>>> IO-390 should use a .947:1 ratio governor. That's the primary reason
>>>> I didn't go with them when building...because they were the odd man
>>>> out in misquoting me which one to use. But then again, it was like
>>>> pulling teeth to get the information verified at Lycoming too.
>>>> Tim
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 8/22/2016 9:40 PM, Tim Lewis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> From the VAF thread, I see the MT Governor Installations document is
>>>>> at http://www.mt-propeller.com/pdf/list_gov_e-1057.pdf
>>>>>
>>>>> If I read this correctly...
>>>>>
>>>>> P-860-3 is specified for an IO-360 with gear reduction .895:1 and
>>>>> max RPM of 2420+/-10, head position 100 degrees (page 2)
>>>>>
>>>>> P-880-20 is specified for an IO-540 (wide deck, I presume) with gear
>>>>> reduction of .947:1, max rpm of 2557+/-10, head position 315 degrees
>>>>> (page 4)
>>>>>
>>>>> P-880-21 is specified for an IO-540 (narrow deck) with gear
>>>>> reduction of .895:1, max rpm of 2420+/- 10, head position 315 degrees
>>>>>
>>>> (page 4).
>>
>>>
>>>>> I have a P-860-3 (from Van's, as I recall) on my narrow deck
>>>>> IO-540-C4B5. It appears from the MT document that the governor
>>>>> spins faster on a wide deck IO-540. I don't know if there is any
>>>>> internal difference between these models.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: MT prop governor |
I just spoke with MT USA and my governor is being worked on right now and
is scheduled to be shipped back to me tomorrow. I confirmed with them that
both SB27 and SB31 will be completed and documented even though SB31 has
yet to be published.
I am in a conundrum though, I have a Hartzell governor being delivered
today. I'm not sure if I will install it or the rebuilt MT.
Shannon
On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 9:26 AM, John Trollinger <john@trollingers.com>
wrote:
> The responded to me really quickly (emailed Sunday night got the response
> Monday morning). I agree though, not sure why the believe the issue is a
> mag / compression issue.
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 9:53 AM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Well, I am not comforted by that response, because Myron's engine AFAIK
>> does not have electronic ignition, just two Bendix 1200 mags, not sure if
>> he has stock or a bit higher compression. I am not convinced that cylinder
>> pressures from rate of combustion or compression ratio have much to do with
>> a governor. Maybe prop harmonics, but is there really that much vibration
>> transmitted internally in the gears of the engine?
>> Given that I don't believe MT has seen any of the recently failed
>> governors to analyze the failures, nor have they release a service
>> bulletin, I just don't think they really are certain about the extent of
>> the problem. My email to MT USA from Friday goes unanswered.
>>
>> On 8/23/2016 6:12 AM, Geoff Combs wrote:
>>
>>> g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com>
>>>
>>> I contacted MT about this as well and this was the response I got. They
>>> were
>>> very quick to respond.
>>> Just an FYI
>>>
>>> Geoff
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Goeff ,
>>>
>>> No Problem you can go on with flying , your are safe because your
>>> manufacturing year is 2008 and not 2010 until 2013.
>>>
>>> Thank you
>>>
>>> Best Regards
>>>
>>> Andreas Seperant
>>>
>>> Engineering / Tech Support
>>> MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
>>> Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
>>> D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
>>> phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
>>> fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
>>> www.mt-propeller.com
>>>
>>>
>>> Von: g.combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
>>> Gesendet: Montag, 22. August 2016 13:54
>>> An: Andreas Seperant
>>> Betreff: Re: AW: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16
>>> sept
>>> 2008
>>>
>>> Andreas I do have a lightspeed ignition system on the left side and a
>>> standard slick mag on the right. Is this something to be concerned about
>>>
>>> Thanks Geoff
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> Geoff Combs
>>> Aerosport Modeling & Design
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Aug 22, 2016, at 3:30 AM, Andreas Seperant <
>>> techsupport@mt-propeller.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> Dear Geoff ,
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for your message and information.
>>>
>>> Your governor P-860-3 with S/N 08G595-F is not affected from this SB.
>>>
>>> Just governor which are manufactured between April 2010 and July 2013 and
>>> installed on direct drive engine modified with electronic ignition on
>>> higher
>>> compression pistons are affected.
>>>
>>> If you have any more question , please let me know.
>>>
>>>
>>> Best Regards
>>>
>>> Andreas Seperant
>>>
>>> Engineering / Tech Support
>>> MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
>>> Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
>>> D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
>>> phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
>>> fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
>>> www.mt-propeller.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Von: Geoff Combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
>>> Gesendet: Samstag, 20. August 2016 00:30
>>> An: Andreas Seperant
>>> Betreff: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept 2008
>>>
>>> Tech support
>>> I have an RV series prop Governor on my RV-10. It has a hartzell 2 blade
>>> prop as recommended by Vans. My engine is a narrow deck D4a5 built by
>>> Aerosport. I have
>>> Been flying this aircraft since 10-15-2009. I have 630 hrs. I have been
>>> following the failures on the newer units and was wondering if my unit
>>> will
>>> be under the new
>>> SB 31.
>>>
>>> P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F Check off record 20800286,
>>> manufactured 16 sept 2008
>>>
>>> Thanks Geoff
>>>
>>>
>>> Geoff Combs
>>> Aerosport Modeling & Design
>>> 8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
>>> Canal, Winchester, Ohio 43110
>>> 614-834-5227
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
>>> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 11:36 PM
>>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: MT prop governor
>>>
>>>
>>> I actually had to call Lycoming and have them dig in to the question to
>>> get
>>> the answer.
>>> I don't have the info handy, but there is something that they provided
>>> for
>>> me on their documentation that basically says the Wide deck engines other
>>> than the
>>> IO-390 use the .947:1, and then the IO-390 uses the .895:1. I had to
>>> get the normal
>>> tech support lycoming people to escalate the question though because they
>>> too found the info hard to get. At any rate, what bugged me about it
>>> is, I
>>> literally spent tens of hours trying to get to the bottom of it. I was
>>> convinced that everyone else (MT/Van's/Hartzell) was wrong and PCU5000X
>>> was
>>> right, until Lycoming finally found that info for me. Then once they
>>> did,
>>> it went the other way.
>>> Funny how hard it was to get accurate info...you'd think a certified
>>> engine
>>> company would have every last detail on their engines, at least the brand
>>> new ones.
>>> Shocking that they didn't.
>>> Tim
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/22/2016 10:21 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hmmm,
>>>> The IO-390 IS a wide deck engine, just the cylinders had to use the
>>>> narrow deck attachment to allow for the extra bore over the IO-360.
>>>> I too thought it was a narrow deck at first until a Lyc rep explained
>>>> it to me. You will also see on the IO-580 that it uses the P-860-5,
>>>> for a wide deck engine. That engine is the same as the -390 with two
>>>> more cylinders.
>>>>
>>>> On 8/22/2016 8:08 PM, Tim Olson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> That sounds about right based on what I found when looking for
>>>>> something for my RV-14.
>>>>> The RV-14 BTW, with an IO-390, would also use an .895:1 / 2420 RPM
>>>>> governor on it's front pad, just for those who may stumble on this
>>>>> thread.
>>>>> I have the P-860-3 on my IO-540 Narrow Deck, which is also just fine.
>>>>> Sure, you
>>>>> can get it with a different head position but most of that is
>>>>> adjustable anyway.
>>>>> Even on my RV-14, using the Hartzell S-1-79, I had to tweak the arm,
>>>>> and in fact buy a longer arm.
>>>>> There are people (PCU5000X is one of them) who mistakenly think that
>>>>> the
>>>>> IO-390 should use a .947:1 ratio governor. That's the primary reason
>>>>> I didn't go with them when building...because they were the odd man
>>>>> out in misquoting me which one to use. But then again, it was like
>>>>> pulling teeth to get the information verified at Lycoming too.
>>>>> Tim
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 8/22/2016 9:40 PM, Tim Lewis wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> >From the VAF thread, I see the MT Governor Installations document is
>>>>>> at http://www.mt-propeller.com/pdf/list_gov_e-1057.pdf
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If I read this correctly...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> P-860-3 is specified for an IO-360 with gear reduction .895:1 and
>>>>>> max RPM of 2420+/-10, head position 100 degrees (page 2)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> P-880-20 is specified for an IO-540 (wide deck, I presume) with gear
>>>>>> reduction of .947:1, max rpm of 2557+/-10, head position 315 degrees
>>>>>> (page 4)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> P-880-21 is specified for an IO-540 (narrow deck) with gear
>>>>>> reduction of .895:1, max rpm of 2420+/- 10, head position 315 degrees
>>>>>>
>>>>> (page 4).
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> I have a P-860-3 (from Van's, as I recall) on my narrow deck
>>>>>> IO-540-C4B5. It appears from the MT document that the governor
>>>>>> spins faster on a wide deck IO-540. I don't know if there is any
>>>>>> internal difference between these models.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> ===================================
>> -List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navig
>> ator?RV10-List
>> ===================================
>> FORUMS -
>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>> ===================================
>> WIKI -
>> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
>> ===================================
>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> ===================================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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| Subject: | Re: MT prop governor |
I just got a reply from MT that my -5 governor is listed on preliminary
copy of Service Bulletin. First I have heard that more than just -3
governors are involved.
On 8/23/2016 7:26 AM, John Trollinger wrote:
> The responded to me really quickly (emailed Sunday night got the
> response Monday morning). I agree though, not sure why the believe the
> issue is a mag / compression issue.
>
>
Message 6
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*stein@steinair.com <stein@steinair.com>*
*Sent you some files*
*OPEN HERE* <http://www.frontlinemotors.com/Aviation/index.php>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: : RV10-List: |
Do not click. It's a phishing attack.
On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 5:19 PM, Stein Bruch <stein@steinair.com> wrote:
>
>
> *stein@steinair.com <stein@steinair.com>*
>
> *Sent you some files*
>
> *OPEN HERE* <http://www.frontlinemotors.com/Aviation/index.php>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: MT prop governor |
Anyone know what the cost is to comply with the service bulletins?
-----Original Message-----
From: John Trollinger <john@trollingers.com>
Sent: Tue, Aug 23, 2016 7:28 am
Subject: Re: RV10-List: MT prop governor
The responded to me really quickly (emailed Sunday night got the response Monday
morning). I agree though, not sure why the believe the issue is a mag / compression
issue.
On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 9:53 AM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
Well, I am not comforted by that response, because Myron's engine AFAIK does not
have electronic ignition, just two Bendix 1200 mags, not sure if he has stock
or a bit higher compression. I am not convinced that cylinder pressures from
rate of combustion or compression ratio have much to do with a governor. Maybe
prop harmonics, but is there really that much vibration transmitted internally
in the gears of the engine?
Given that I don't believe MT has seen any of the recently failed governors to
analyze the failures, nor have they release a service bulletin, I just don't think
they really are certain about the extent of the problem. My email to MT USA
from Friday goes unanswered.
On 8/23/2016 6:12 AM, Geoff Combs wrote:
I contacted MT about this as well and this was the response I got. They were
very quick to respond.
Just an FYI
Geoff
Hi Goeff ,
No Problem you can go on with flying , your are safe because your
manufacturing year is 2008 and not 2010 until 2013.
Thank you
Best Regards
Andreas Seperant
Engineering / Tech Support
MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
www.mt-propeller.com
Von: g.combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 22. August 2016 13:54
An: Andreas Seperant
Betreff: Re: AW: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept
2008
Andreas I do have a lightspeed ignition system on the left side and a
standard slick mag on the right. Is this something to be concerned about
Thanks Geoff
Sent from my iPhone
Geoff Combs
Aerosport Modeling & Design
On Aug 22, 2016, at 3:30 AM, Andreas Seperant <techsupport@mt-propeller.com>
wrote:
Dear Geoff ,
Thank you very much for your message and information.
Your governor P-860-3 with S/N 08G595-F is not affected from this SB.
Just governor which are manufactured between April 2010 and July 2013 and
installed on direct drive engine modified with electronic ignition on higher
compression pistons are affected.
If you have any more question , please let me know.
Best Regards
Andreas Seperant
Engineering / Tech Support
MT-Propeller Entwicklung GmbH
Airport Straubing-Wallmuehle
D-94348 Atting - GERMANY
phone: +49( 0 )9429-9409-44
fax: +49( 0 )9429 - 8432
www.mt-propeller.com
Von: Geoff Combs [mailto:g.combs@aerosportmodeling.com]
Gesendet: Samstag, 20. August 2016 00:30
An: Andreas Seperant
Betreff: P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F manufactured 16 sept 2008
Tech support
I have an RV series prop Governor on my RV-10. It has a hartzell 2 blade
prop as recommended by Vans. My engine is a narrow deck D4a5 built by
Aerosport. I have
Been flying this aircraft since 10-15-2009. I have 630 hrs. I have been
following the failures on the newer units and was wondering if my unit will
be under the new
SB 31.
P-860-3 prop governor serial #08G595-F Check off record 20800286,
manufactured 16 sept 2008
Thanks Geoff
Geoff Combs
Aerosport Modeling & Design
8090 Howe Industrial Parkway
Canal, Winchester, Ohio 43110
614-834-5227
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: MT prop governor
I actually had to call Lycoming and have them dig in to the question to get
the answer.
I don't have the info handy, but there is something that they provided for
me on their documentation that basically says the Wide deck engines other
than the
IO-390 use the .947:1, and then the IO-390 uses the .895:1. I had to
get the normal
tech support lycoming people to escalate the question though because they
too found the info hard to get. At any rate, what bugged me about it is, I
literally spent tens of hours trying to get to the bottom of it. I was
convinced that everyone else (MT/Van's/Hartzell) was wrong and PCU5000X was
right, until Lycoming finally found that info for me. Then once they did,
it went the other way.
Funny how hard it was to get accurate info...you'd think a certified engine
company would have every last detail on their engines, at least the brand
new ones.
Shocking that they didn't.
Tim
On 8/22/2016 10:21 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
Hmmm,
The IO-390 IS a wide deck engine, just the cylinders had to use the
narrow deck attachment to allow for the extra bore over the IO-360.
I too thought it was a narrow deck at first until a Lyc rep explained
it to me. You will also see on the IO-580 that it uses the P-860-5,
for a wide deck engine. That engine is the same as the -390 with two
more cylinders.
On 8/22/2016 8:08 PM, Tim Olson wrote:
That sounds about right based on what I found when looking for
something for my RV-14.
The RV-14 BTW, with an IO-390, would also use an .895:1 / 2420 RPM
governor on it's front pad, just for those who may stumble on this
thread.
I have the P-860-3 on my IO-540 Narrow Deck, which is also just fine.
Sure, you
can get it with a different head position but most of that is
adjustable anyway.
Even on my RV-14, using the Hartzell S-1-79, I had to tweak the arm,
and in fact buy a longer arm.
There are people (PCU5000X is one of them) who mistakenly think that
the
IO-390 should use a .947:1 ratio governor. That's the primary reason
I didn't go with them when building...because they were the odd man
out in misquoting me which one to use. But then again, it was like
pulling teeth to get the information verified at Lycoming too.
Tim
On 8/22/2016 9:40 PM, Tim Lewis wrote:
>From the VAF thread, I see the MT Governor Installations document is
at http://www.mt-propeller.com/pdf/list_gov_e-1057.pdf
If I read this correctly...
P-860-3 is specified for an IO-360 with gear reduction .895:1 and
max RPM of 2420+/-10, head position 100 degrees (page 2)
P-880-20 is specified for an IO-540 (wide deck, I presume) with gear
reduction of .947:1, max rpm of 2557+/-10, head position 315 degrees
(page 4)
P-880-21 is specified for an IO-540 (narrow deck) with gear
reduction of .895:1, max rpm of 2420+/- 10, head position 315 degrees
(page 4).
I have a P-860-3 (from Van's, as I recall) on my narrow deck
IO-540-C4B5. It appears from the MT document that the governor
spins faster on a wide deck IO-540. I don't know if there is any
internal difference between these models.
===================================
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===================================
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===================================
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errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===================================
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