Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:10 AM - Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing (Werner Schneider)
2. 02:53 AM - Re: RV10 Parts available (Richard Gurley)
3. 04:29 AM - FW: fuel flow at takeoff power (David)
4. 04:56 AM - Re: fuel flow at takeoff power (Lenny Iszak)
5. 05:20 AM - Re: FW: fuel flow at takeoff power (Jesse Saint)
6. 05:26 AM - Re: fuel flow at takeoff power (bill.peyton)
7. 05:58 AM - Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing (Kelly McMullen)
8. 06:18 AM - Re: FW: fuel flow at takeoff power (Kelly McMullen)
9. 06:48 AM - Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing (Kelly McMullen)
10. 07:28 AM - Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing (kearney)
11. 08:32 AM - Re: Champion Slick Magneto Maintenance Kits (Dan Masys)
12. 10:05 AM - Re: fuel flow at takeoff power (Bob Turner)
13. 12:56 PM - Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing (Dan Charrois)
14. 01:22 PM - Re: Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing (Dan Charrois)
15. 02:00 PM - Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Tim Olson)
16. 02:15 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Kevin Belue)
17. 02:29 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Rene)
18. 02:35 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Jesse Saint)
19. 02:39 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Tim Olson)
20. 02:41 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Kevin Belue)
21. 02:42 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Tim Olson)
22. 03:00 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Rene)
23. 03:02 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Jesse Saint)
24. 03:26 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Tim Olson)
25. 04:07 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Rob Kermanj)
26. 06:15 PM - Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter (Kelly McMullen)
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing |
Dan,
just a wild guess, but please check as well all your fuel connection for
either a loose connection or a flare which might be compromised (you
probably should see some signs of Avgas there).
We had 10 years ago an accident with an RV-9 where the engine quit,
reason were incorrect flares and over torquing of fuel connections.
A partly blocked injector on #1 might have been a factor.
Good luck in finding the reason.
Cheers Werner
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| Subject: | RV10 Parts available |
Francis -
I am sorry you were just a few minutes too late. I already have given these
parts away.
Sorry
Dick
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of gulf
Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2017 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV10 Parts available
Sounds like a good opportunity to me - what do you need me to do? Francis
Gularte, Ventura, CA #40888
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Gurley
Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2017 6:01 PM
Subject: RV10-List: RV10 Parts available
I have machined two excess static ports and a tail light adapter available
for anyone who needs them. These are machined parts that are commercially
available from Cleveland Tools - but the only payment I would need is for
shipping. Please let me know off line if you would like them.
Dick
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| Subject: | FW: fuel flow at takeoff power |
I have been adjusting the mixture control cable attempting to make the
control hit both the full rich stop and the idle cutoff stop. It appears
that the cable (AS custom with Teflon cores) is about .050 inch shorter in
the throw than expected. The result is that the adjustment is close but not
exact. Although I can adjust the rich stop within .030 and the idle cut off
stop within .010, I still wonder whether fuel flow is sufficient for takeoff
power. Current fuel flow gauge says about 24 +- .5 gph and idle cutoff
requires that the control be fully aft. Anyone have any numbers that they
use to confirm proper fuel flow for takeoff. The IO540 book seems to say
that 24-25 gph is correct. I am now determining whether to re make the hole
in the mixture control arm or order a new cable ($200); the cable cost is
not the problem but the labor (lots?) necessary to re install another cable.
I have also been told by Precision Air Motive (PAM) that sufficient fuel
flow is certain when leaning to peak at full power shows at least 100f rich
of peak is obtained. Any comments or suggestions?
David McNeill
---
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| Subject: | Re: fuel flow at takeoff power |
I had the same issue with the new cables. Another good reminder for anyone upgrading
their control cables, get them with a 1/8" longer throw.
You could check engine monitor data and compare takeoff EGTs before and after the
control cable swap.
I ended up playing with the adjustments until i got to a compromise similar to
yours. EGTs and fuel flows are the same as before.
I wouldn't be leaning anywhere close to peak EGT at full power though.
--------
Lenny
N311LZ
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466273#466273
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| Subject: | Re: FW: fuel flow at takeoff power |
That fuel flow sounds to be on the low side of normal. If you can get to he f
ull rich stop and lean enough to get the engine to quit at idle, that is whe
re I would leave it.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
352-427-0285
jesse@saintaviation.com
Sent from my iPad
> On Feb 16, 2017, at 7:28 AM, David <dlm34077@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
> I have been adjusting the mixture control cable attempting to make the con
trol hit both the full rich stop and the idle cutoff stop. It appears that t
he cable (AS custom with Teflon cores) is about .050 inch shorter in the thr
ow than expected. The result is that the adjustment is close but not exact. A
lthough I can adjust the rich stop within .030 and the idle cut off stop wit
hin .010, I still wonder whether fuel flow is sufficient for takeoff power. C
urrent fuel flow gauge says about 24 +- .5 gph and idle cutoff requires that
the control be fully aft. Anyone have any numbers that they use to confirm p
roper fuel flow for takeoff. The IO540 book seems to say that 24-25 gph is c
orrect. I am now determining whether to re make the hole in the mixture cont
rol arm or order a new cable ($200); the cable cost is not the problem but t
he labor (lots?) necessary to re install another cable. I have also been tol
d by Precision Air Motive (PAM) that sufficient fuel flow is certain when le
aning to peak at full power shows at least 100f rich of peak is obtained. An
y comments or suggestions?
>
> David McNeill
>
>
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: fuel flow at takeoff power |
24-25 is what I see
--------
Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466275#466275
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing |
I'm not sure I have any good ideas of where to look, nor why some RV-10s
seem to have similar problems and others don't.
I have pretty much the same setup you do, except no gascolators, and my
fuel flow sending unit is between the servo and the flow distributor. I
have not detected any issues. I just looked at my last flight. Fuel
pressure dipped to 18.6 as full throttle was applied for takeoff without
boost pump. Immediately came back up to over 23, and for almost all of the
flight was between 25 and 26. That includes a climb to density altitude of
9500.
My takeoff fuel flow is about 22.7, with field elevation of 1240. I wish it
were another gph higher, as my EGT on some cylinders goes over 1300 on
initial climb.
I'd say your engine quit because the pressure was too low for the servo to
deliver the required fuel. It is supposed to have 15 psi minimum.
How hard would it be to take the gascolator out of the system for a test,
just on one tank, to see if it makes a difference? The other item I would
consider testing for pressure drop is the fuel flow sending unit. IIRC it
does have a measurable drop, which is one reason why it is preferable to
have it positioned after the mechanical fuel pump, either between the pump
and servo, or the servo and flow divider.
I normally would suggest verifying the fuel pressure, but your symptoms
match your reported pressures.
My other aircraft is a 200 hp Mooney with exactly the same mechanical pump
and RSA5 fuel servo. It was certified without any filter between the tanks
and the fuel servo inlet filter. It has the same Pro-sealed wet wings, no
gascolator, just a screen in the fuel selector body. Fuel pressure is very
similar to what I see on my RV-10.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 11:15 PM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>
> Hi everyone.
>
> My RV-10 has 9 hours of flight time so far with a factory new Lycoming
> IO-540 D4A5. On the last flight I did a couple of weeks ago, I tried a
> full rich climb to 10000', but ended up with my fuel pressure dropping down
> to around 11 psi when I got to 8700', at which point I turned on the boost
> pump and got the pressure back up to around 20 psi. Back down at a lower
> altitude, I tried turning off the boost pump, and the engine pump
> maintained pressure at 22 psi. But something was clearly not right, and
> since I was pretty much at the right time to do an oil and oil filter
> change anyway, thought it was a good time to do the equivalent of an
> "annual" to make sure everything was still looking good, and try and sort
> out the problem.
>
> Looking at my logs from past flights, typically my fuel pressure with the
> engine pump has been about 20-23 psi at 6000', 21 gph (full rich). I have
> typically seen higher pressures on the ground (27-29 psi) at lower RPMs and
> fuel flows.
>
> My fuel system is pretty much stock Van's, except I have an Andair fuel
> selector with an extension so it's lower in the tunnel, and I have
> gascolators in the wing roots (here in Canada, we require them). The fuel
> pump, filter, and fuel flow transducer (red cube) are all in the tunnel, as
> per plans.
>
>
> But in doing my runup, after a few minutes when the engine was getting
> warm and running at relatively low RPMs, I turned the boost pump on for a
> few seconds and then back off. When I turned it off, I saw the pressure
> dropping slowly. It got down to around 13 psi. I tried advancing the
> throttle a bit to see if maybe the engine was running too slow to provide
> enough fuel pressure, and the engine promptly died. No sputtering or
> anything - just quit, like I pulled the mixture to ICO and that's what I
> wanted it to do. It's not done that before.
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: FW: fuel flow at takeoff power |
Remember that your field elevation is almost 1400 ft and your density
altitude is normally above 2000 ft. Fuel flow will decrease with altitude,
because you cannot get to 29" of MP. I see about 22.7 to maybe 23 gph, and
would like to have 24"
What is your EGT on hottest couple cylinders right after liftoff? If below
1300 you have nothing to worry about.
I got my cables from McFarlane ($$$) that are a little long, and have no
problem getting full mixture travel.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 5:28 AM, David <dlm34077@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
> I have been adjusting the mixture control cable attempting to make the
> control hit both the full rich stop and the idle cutoff stop. It appears
> that the cable (AS custom with Teflon cores) is about .050 inch shorter in
> the throw than expected. The result is that the adjustment is close but not
> exact. Although I can adjust the rich stop within .030 and the idle cut off
> stop within .010, I still wonder whether fuel flow is sufficient for
> takeoff power. Current fuel flow gauge says about 24 +- .5 gph and idle
> cutoff requires that the control be fully aft. Anyone have any numbers that
> they use to confirm proper fuel flow for takeoff. The IO540 book seems to
> say that 24-25 gph is correct. I am now determining whether to re make the
> hole in the mixture control arm or order a new cable ($200); the cable cost
> is not the problem but the labor (lots?) necessary to re install another
> cable. I have also been told by Precision Air Motive (PAM) that sufficient
> fuel flow is certain when leaning to peak at full power shows at least 100f
> rich of peak is obtained. Any comments or suggestions?
>
>
> David McNeill
>
>
> ------------------------------
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>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing |
I went back and checked. Lycoming says minimum fuel pressure required is 14
psi.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 6:57 AM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm not sure I have any good ideas of where to look, nor why some RV-10s
> seem to have similar problems and others don't.
> I have pretty much the same setup you do, except no gascolators, and my
> fuel flow sending unit is between the servo and the flow distributor. I
> have not detected any issues. I just looked at my last flight. Fuel
> pressure dipped to 18.6 as full throttle was applied for takeoff without
> boost pump. Immediately came back up to over 23, and for almost all of the
> flight was between 25 and 26. That includes a climb to density altitude of
> 9500.
> My takeoff fuel flow is about 22.7, with field elevation of 1240. I wish
> it were another gph higher, as my EGT on some cylinders goes over 1300 on
> initial climb.
> I'd say your engine quit because the pressure was too low for the servo to
> deliver the required fuel. It is supposed to have 15 psi minimum.
> How hard would it be to take the gascolator out of the system for a test,
> just on one tank, to see if it makes a difference? The other item I would
> consider testing for pressure drop is the fuel flow sending unit. IIRC it
> does have a measurable drop, which is one reason why it is preferable to
> have it positioned after the mechanical fuel pump, either between the pump
> and servo, or the servo and flow divider.
> I normally would suggest verifying the fuel pressure, but your symptoms
> match your reported pressures.
> My other aircraft is a 200 hp Mooney with exactly the same mechanical
> pump and RSA5 fuel servo. It was certified without any filter between the
> tanks and the fuel servo inlet filter. It has the same Pro-sealed wet
> wings, no gascolator, just a screen in the fuel selector body. Fuel
> pressure is very similar to what I see on my RV-10.
>
> -sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
>
> On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 11:15 PM, Dan Charrois <dan@syz.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi everyone.
>>
>> My RV-10 has 9 hours of flight time so far with a factory new Lycoming
>> IO-540 D4A5. On the last flight I did a couple of weeks ago, I tried a
>> full rich climb to 10000', but ended up with my fuel pressure dropping down
>> to around 11 psi when I got to 8700', at which point I turned on the boost
>> pump and got the pressure back up to around 20 psi. Back down at a lower
>> altitude, I tried turning off the boost pump, and the engine pump
>> maintained pressure at 22 psi. But something was clearly not right, and
>> since I was pretty much at the right time to do an oil and oil filter
>> change anyway, thought it was a good time to do the equivalent of an
>> "annual" to make sure everything was still looking good, and try and sort
>> out the problem.
>>
>> Looking at my logs from past flights, typically my fuel pressure with the
>> engine pump has been about 20-23 psi at 6000', 21 gph (full rich). I have
>> typically seen higher pressures on the ground (27-29 psi) at lower RPMs and
>> fuel flows.
>>
>> My fuel system is pretty much stock Van's, except I have an Andair fuel
>> selector with an extension so it's lower in the tunnel, and I have
>> gascolators in the wing roots (here in Canada, we require them). The fuel
>> pump, filter, and fuel flow transducer (red cube) are all in the tunnel, as
>> per plans.
>>
>>
>> But in doing my runup, after a few minutes when the engine was getting
>> warm and running at relatively low RPMs, I turned the boost pump on for a
>> few seconds and then back off. When I turned it off, I saw the pressure
>> dropping slowly. It got down to around 13 psi. I tried advancing the
>> throttle a bit to see if maybe the engine was running too slow to provide
>> enough fuel pressure, and the engine promptly died. No sputtering or
>> anything - just quit, like I pulled the mixture to ICO and that's what I
>> wanted it to do. It's not done that before.
>>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing |
Hi Dan
I would go back to first principles.
The first thing I would do would be to break the fuel line after the mechanical
fuel pump and measure the fuel flow with just the electric pump. I did this using
a 25l jerry and timed how long it would take to fill. If the fuel flow is
too low, that would suggest the problem is between the tank and the pump. I think
I was getting a free flow of 50-60 GPH.
If the flow is ok, I would also check the fuel pressure transducer and see if it
is reading correctly. Given that the fuel pressure line has an inline reducer,
I would also see if there is any small debris blocking the reducer.
Did you use the USHER gascolator. I did use these and found that they were not
a problem.
As far as cable throws are concerned, there should be a bit of "bounce" in the
cables where the cables hit the stops BEFORE the cable is all the way in at the
control panel (say about 1/8"). This ensures complete travel.
Cheers
Les
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466281#466281
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| Subject: | Re: Champion Slick Magneto Maintenance Kits |
I purchased that Champion Slick Magneto Maintenance kit but ended up not
using it when I got a chance to visit the closest magneto specialty shop and
watched how they do inspections and rebuilds. The major deal is not the
rebuilding, but the subsequent testing of the mags, which they do in a
special oven running the mag at a variety of speeds and, for turbo engine
mags, reduced air pressures. That specialized test equipment is quite
expensive, out of the reach of homebuilders, but it makes a big difference
in knowing that a IRAN'd or rebuilt mag is up to the task.
Just had a 500 hr. Slick 6393 mag inspection done by Aircraft Electrical
Components in Redding, CA (FAA licensed repair station for lots of
electrical stuff on airplanes) and they turned it around quickly for $275.
Better than expected...
-Dan Masys
RV-10 N104LD 960 hrs.
_______________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 02:13:27 PM PST US
From: Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com>
Subject: RV10-List: Champion Slick Magneto Maintenance Kits - new to me
I was in the process of buying a couple of rebuilt (not overhauled) Slick
Mags to replace my 800+ hour Mags. Aircraft Spruce carries them (along with
new and overhauled).
However, my last search in ACS turned up Champion Slick Magneto Maintenance
Kits as shown here:
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/slickmagmaintkit.php?clickkey
=4368
http://www.championaerospace.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/FINAL-Magneto-Ki
t-Flyer.pdf
The hadn't noticed this as an option before but looks very attractive.
I've already fooled around with mine to comply with an earlier Service
Directive and would love to do the work myself if I can bring the Mags back
up to the rebuilt standard.
Is anyone familiar with these kits? Do they contain what is needed to bring
used mags up to the rebuilt standard? All input welcome.
Bill "Ready for FIKI season to end" Watson
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: fuel flow at takeoff power |
Are undrilled mixture control arms available? That might be the easiest solution.
You might also look at re-clocking that arm. If the arm is currently perpendicular
to the cable at mid-setting, that will take the most control throw to
get the desired rotation. If you remove the arm, rotate it, re-install, you may
make up the small length you need to go stop to stop. Of course don't go over-center.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=466284#466284
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing |
> On 2017-Feb-16, at 6:57 AM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I'm not sure I have any good ideas of where to look, nor why some RV-10s seem
to have similar problems and others don't.
> I have pretty much the same setup you do, except no gascolators, and my fuel
flow sending unit is between the servo and the flow distributor. I have not detected
any issues. I just looked at my last flight. Fuel pressure dipped to 18.6
as full throttle was applied for takeoff without boost pump. Immediately came
back up to over 23, and for almost all of the flight was between 25 and 26.
That includes a climb to density altitude of 9500.
> My takeoff fuel flow is about 22.7, with field elevation of 1240. I wish it were
another gph higher, as my EGT on some cylinders goes over 1300 on initial
climb.
> I'd say your engine quit because the pressure was too low for the servo to deliver
the required fuel. It is supposed to have 15 psi minimum.
> How hard would it be to take the gascolator out of the system for a test, just
on one tank, to see if it makes a difference?
Not terribly hard - I could pull the gascolator in one of the wings and make a
little "patch" fuel line between the tank and the line currently connected to
the output of the gascolator. If I can't find the problem elsewhere, that's a
great idea of something to try.
> The other item I would consider testing for pressure drop is the fuel flow sending
unit. IIRC it does have a measurable drop, which is one reason why it is
preferable to have it positioned after the mechanical fuel pump, either between
the pump and servo, or the servo and flow divider.
I wish I would have put it there in the first place - even if it's not the primary
source of the problems I'm having, it's notoriously inaccurate when the boost
pump is running. I've been avoiding moving it if the only problem is inaccurate
readings of fuel flow when the boost pump is running, but if it's a contributing
factor to the fuel pressure problems, I may have to bite the bullet.
> I normally would suggest verifying the fuel pressure, but your symptoms match
your reported pressures.
Yes... when I was flying and it got down to 11 psi momentarily and the engine kept
running, I thought it's possible the pressure sender was at fault. However,
yesterday during my runup when the engine quit when it got to around 13 psi,
that pretty much exonerated the pressure sender to be at fault.
Thanks for your suggestions!
Dan
---
Dan Charrois
President, Syzygy Research & Technology
Phone: 780-961-2213
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure problems continuing |
> Hi Dan
>
> I would go back to first principles.
>
> The first thing I would do would be to break the fuel line after the mechanical
fuel pump and measure the fuel flow with just the electric pump. I did this
using a 25l jerry and timed how long it would take to fill. If the fuel flow
is too low, that would suggest the problem is between the tank and the pump. I
think I was getting a free flow of 50-60 GPH.
Hey Les. Yes, I've done a fuel flow test with the electrical pump right before
my last runup where the engine quit, measuring the flow into a jerry can right
before it goes into the throttle body. I tested the flow from both tanks, and
in each case it was around 53 gph. So that's working OK (and the electric
pump has successfully brought the pressures back into the 20+ range every time
I've used it when the engine pump on its own was getting critically low).
>
> If the flow is ok, I would also check the fuel pressure transducer and see if
it is reading correctly. Given that the fuel pressure line has an inline reducer,
I would also see if there is any small debris blocking the reducer.
I'd thought it might be an instrumentation problem, until my engine quit unexpectedly
during the runup when I saw the fuel pressure get down to around 13 psi
on the engine pump. Unless the engine quit for some other reason coincidentally,
it seems to me the low pressure indication is a real problem.
>
> Did you use the USHER gascolator. I did use these and found that they were not
a problem.
Yes - two Usher gascolators, one in each wing root. And the low pressure indication
seems independent on which tank I'm on.
>
> As far as cable throws are concerned, there should be a bit of "bounce" in the
cables where the cables hit the stops BEFORE the cable is all the way in at
the control panel (say about 1/8"). This ensures complete travel.
I'm not sure how much bounce I have in the cables, but I know when they hit the
stops at the throttle body in either direction, they can grab and hold onto a
piece of paper between the mechanism and the stop, so I think the travel is pretty
much where it should be.
Over the next few days, the plan is to pull out the seats, centre console, throttle
quadrant, etc. to get into the tunnel under the panel and pull out the fuel
pump, filter, and flow transducer out of there to see if I can find anything
not getting along.
I know in the past when people have tried replacing their mechanical fuel pumps
to solve similar issues, it's usually not been the culprit. With that said,
I have to say that with everything I've tried so far, it's starting to look more
and more guilty. Particularly during my last runup - I was at around 23 psi
on the engine pump, turned on the boost pump for a few seconds which brought
it up to about 26, and then when I turned off the boost pump, the pressure dropped
steadily down to 13 psi at which point the engine quit. I suppose another
possibility might be the electric pump bypass one way valve sticking? At any
rate, I'll hopefully learn something useful when I pull things out of the tunnel.
Thanks for the suggestions!
Dan
---
Dan Charrois
President, Syzygy Research & Technology
Phone: 780-961-2213
Message 15
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| Subject: | Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
right now.
Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
swap starters its not going to fit well because of
some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
and just order one.
Tim
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Tim,
I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2
PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery must
help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits just fine
and has much more torque. I don't have any problems now starting on one
PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
Kevin Belue
On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
What is the ~price on the NL? How much weight does it add? I do not
have a problem with the starter working with the 925 batter, but I think
I am developing a dead (weak) spot and will be replacing my starter this
annual..unless the problem goes away when it gets
warmer and I fly more.
Rene'
801-721-6080
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Belue
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
Tim,
I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2
PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery
must help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits
just fine and has much more torque. I don't have any problems now
starting on one PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
Kevin Belue
On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com
<mailto:Tim@myrv10.com> > wrote:
<mailto:Tim@MyRV10.com> >
Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
right now.
Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
swap starters its not going to fit well because of
some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
and just order one.
Tim
-List" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
FORUMS -
_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
WIKI -
lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
I have never seen a fit issue.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
C: 352-427-0285
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 16, 2017, at 4:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Thanks Kevin,
I just hit "place order". Should have one next Wednesday.
I haven't heard any negatives in all my reading so I'm going to
go with it. My PC925 does work for the IO-540, but getting past
that first prop blade sometimes takes a 2nd try. But once
you start it spinning it does an OK job. I'm sure the NL
will be better.
I have an issue with my RV-14 starter not always cranking,b
but when it cranks its great. It's an LS. I was hoping to
pull my RV-10 starter and use it while I send that one in,
but it's a PM and not an LS, and I don't think the cable
lengths will work out. Oh well.
Tim
On 2/16/2017 4:14 PM, Kevin Belue wrote:
> Tim,
>
> I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2
> PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery
> must help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits
> just fine and has much more torque. I don't have any problems now
> starting on one PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
>
> Kevin Belue
>
> On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com
> <mailto:Tim@myrv10.com>> wrote:
>
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
> ===================================
> -List" target="_blank"
> rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ===================================
> FORUMS -
> _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
> ===================================
> WIKI -
> lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ===================================
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ===================================
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
The Skytec NL starter weighs 9.3 lbs and costs $436 at Aircraft Spruce.
On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 4:28 PM, Rene <rene@felker.com> wrote:
> What is the ~price on the NL? How much weight does it add? I do not hav
e
> a problem with the starter working with the 925 batter, but I think I am
> developing a dead (weak) spot and will be replacing my starter this
> annual..unless the problem goes away when it gets warme
r and I fly more.
>
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080 <(801)%20721-6080>
>
>
> *From:* owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-
> server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Kevin Belue
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:15 PM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
>
>
> Tim,
>
>
> I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2
> PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery must
> help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits just fine
> and has much more torque. I don't have any problems now starting on one
> PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
>
>
> Kevin Belue
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
> ========================
===========
> -List" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.
> matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ========================
===========
> FORUMS -
> _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> WIKI -
> lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ==========
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contributio
n
> ========================
===========
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
I had 2 choices. One was $499 from Sky-Tec and then trade mine in for
a $154 credit, and the 2nd choice was $436 from ACS. I chose the
latter. It looks like 1lb more than my PM starter. All the better
for my CG when I load it up.
Tim
On 2/16/2017 4:28 PM, Rene wrote:
> What is the ~price on the NL? How much weight does it add? I do not
> have a problem with the starter working with the 925 batter, but I think
> I am developing a dead (weak) spot and will be replacing my starter this
> annual..unless the problem goes away when it gets warmer and I fly more.
>
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080
>
>
> *From:*owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Kevin Belue
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:15 PM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
>
>
> Tim,
>
>
> I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2
> PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery
> must help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits
> just fine and has much more torque. I don't have any problems now
> starting on one PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
>
>
> Kevin Belue
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com
> <mailto:Tim@myrv10.com>> wrote:
>
> <mailto:Tim@MyRV10.com>>
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
> ===================================
> -List" target="_blank"
> rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ===================================
> FORUMS -
> _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> WIKI -
> lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ==========
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ===================================
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Thanks Tim, I am the same on the CG. I added a 680 on the firewall, almost 100%
for CG reasons. Big battery, O2, and APRS all behind the rear bulkhead or in
the tail.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:42 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
I had 2 choices. One was $499 from Sky-Tec and then trade mine in for a $154 credit,
and the 2nd choice was $436 from ACS. I chose the latter. It looks like
1lb more than my PM starter. All the better for my CG when I load it up.
Tim
On 2/16/2017 4:28 PM, Rene wrote:
> What is the ~price on the NL? How much weight does it add? I do not
> have a problem with the starter working with the 925 batter, but I think
> I am developing a dead (weak) spot and will be replacing my starter this
> annual..unless the problem goes away when it gets warmer and I fly more.
>
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080
>
>
> *From:*owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Kevin Belue
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:15 PM
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
>
>
> Tim,
>
>
> I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2
> PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery
> must help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits
> just fine and has much more torque. I don't have any problems now
> starting on one PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
>
>
> Kevin Belue
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com
> <mailto:Tim@myrv10.com>> wrote:
>
> <mailto:Tim@MyRV10.com>>
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
> ===================================
> -List" target="_blank"
> rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ===================================
> FORUMS -
> _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> WIKI -
> lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ==========
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ===================================
>
>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Skytec has an option where you can send your starter to them for "rebuild" a
nd get a different model back. Cheaper than buying a new one. I think the "r
ebuilt" is just a new unit.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse@saintaviation.com
C: 352-427-0285
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 16, 2017, at 5:28 PM, Rene <rene@felker.com> wrote:
>
> What is the ~price on the NL? How much weight does it add? I do not have
a problem with the starter working with the 925 batter, but I think I am de
veloping a dead (weak) spot and will be replacing my starter this annual
..unless the problem goes away when it gets warmer and I fly mor
e.
>
> Rene'
> 801-721-6080
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@
matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Belue
> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:15 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
>
> Tim,
>
> I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I have 2 P
C680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger battery must hel
p there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great. It fits just fine and h
as much more torque. I don't have any problems now starting on one PC680. I t
hink it's the best starter for the RV10.
>
> Kevin Belue
>
> On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
> =========================
> -List" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?RV10-List
> =========================
> FORUMS -
> _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> WIKI -
> lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ==========
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> =========================
>
>
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Maybe I'll try that. If I send them my PM for a rebuild, I can get
it back as an NL, and throw an NL on both airplanes.
That would be nice.
Tim
On 2/16/2017 5:02 PM, Jesse Saint wrote:
> Skytec has an option where you can send your starter to them for
> "rebuild" and get a different model back. Cheaper than buying a new
> one. I think the "rebuilt" is just a new unit.
>
> Jesse Saint
> Saint Aviation, Inc.
> jesse@saintaviation.com <mailto:jesse@saintaviation.com>
> C: 352-427-0285
> F: 815-377-3694
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 16, 2017, at 5:28 PM, Rene <rene@felker.com
> <mailto:rene@felker.com>> wrote:
>
>> What is the ~price on the NL? How much weight does it add? I do not
>> have a problem with the starter working with the 925 batter, but I
>> think I am developing a dead (weak) spot and will be replacing my
>> starter this annual..unless the problem goes away when it gets
>> warmer and I fly more.
>>
>> Rene'
>>
>> 801-721-6080
>>
>> *From:*owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>> <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Kevin Belue
>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:15 PM
>> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com <mailto:rv10-list@matronics.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter
>>
>> Tim,
>>
>> I had the 149-12PM on my RV10 and it would hardly turn it over. I
>> have 2 PC680 batteries, but that's hardly enough power. Your larger
>> battery must help there. I changed to the NL starter and it's great.
>> It fits just fine and has much more torque. I don't have any problems
>> now starting on one PC680. I think it's the best starter for the RV10.
>>
>> Kevin Belue
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com
>> <mailto:Tim@myrv10.com>> wrote:
>>
>> <mailto:Tim@MyRV10.com>>
>>
>> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
>> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
>> right now.
>>
>> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
>> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
>> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
>> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
>> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
>> and just order one.
>>
>> Tim
>> ===================================
>> -List" target="_blank"
>> rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> ===================================
>> FORUMS -
>> _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> WIKI -
>> lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> target="_blank"
>> rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> ===================================
>>
>>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
Tim,
If the NL is the long version with planetary gear, I have one and have no issues
with the standard installation. I have a narrow deck 540.
Do not archive
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 16, 2017, at 4:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
> right now.
>
> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
> and just order one.
>
> Tim
>
>
>
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Re: Sky-Tec NL vs LS starter |
I chose a Hartzell (orig Kelly) ERZ-8011. I like it a lot. A bit more
torque and slower rpm than the Nline Skytec. However, when I made the
choice it was close to the Skytec in price. Since Hartzell took over, it
now is priced at a $200 premium. No way I would pay that much extra now.
One other advantage it had was a clutch to protect against kick backs. I
understand that Skytec has since adopted that feature, instead of the
shear pins they originally had. I was not a fan of having to remove a
starter just to replace a shear pin. Didn't I read about Hartzell buying
out both Skytec and Plane Power recently? Hard to say what that means in
the long run.
On 2/16/2017 5:02 PM, Rob Kermanj wrote:
>
> Tim,
>
> If the NL is the long version with planetary gear, I have one and have no issues
with the standard installation. I have a narrow deck 540.
>
> Do not archive
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Feb 16, 2017, at 4:59 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hey all, I'm thinking of replacing my starter on my RV-10
>> with the NL starter. I think mine is the 149-12PM
>> right now.
>>
>> Can anyone who's either swapped for an NL or has an NL
>> comment on the fit of the starter in relation to all the
>> other stuff... i.e. is there any realistic chance that if I
>> swap starters its not going to fit well because of
>> some interference somewhere else? If not, I'll go ahead
>> and just order one.
>>
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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