Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:17 AM - Re: Fuel pump - replacement (Dilson)
2. 05:56 AM - Re: Re: Brake fluid seeping from master cylinders (Tim Lewis)
3. 06:02 AM - Re: Fuel pump - replacement (Tim Olson)
4. 06:43 AM - Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
5. 07:32 AM - Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Tim Olson)
6. 07:33 AM - Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Kelly McMullen)
7. 07:44 AM - Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Kelly McMullen)
8. 07:52 AM - Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Dilson)
9. 08:01 AM - Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Lenny Iszak)
10. 08:13 AM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
11. 08:31 AM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Bob Leffler)
12. 11:20 AM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
13. 11:53 AM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Tim Olson)
14. 12:09 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Rene)
15. 01:38 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
16. 01:43 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Kelly McMullen)
17. 01:52 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Kelly McMullen)
18. 01:58 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Tim Olson)
19. 02:22 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
20. 02:33 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Kelly McMullen)
21. 02:56 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
22. 03:32 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Tim Olson)
23. 03:44 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
24. 04:12 PM - Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Lenny Iszak)
25. 05:05 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
26. 05:28 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Tim Olson)
27. 06:21 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
28. 07:17 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Kelly McMullen)
29. 07:29 PM - Re: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question (Phillip Perry)
30. 07:39 PM - insurance (Marcus Cooper)
31. 09:21 PM - Re: insurance (Bob Turner)
32. 09:52 PM - Re: Re: insurance (Tim Olson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump - replacement |
Hi
It would be fantastic if I knew the safety wire trick. Despite that I
was very, very careful being sure I had the lever under the pushrod.
I had a low fuel pressure while flying to Oshkosh this year. Had to
change the pump a field.
The Emergency Repair Shop located at the south near the ultralite area,
was invaluable helping me with tools and other amenities.
Dilson
Em 11/08/2017 00:35, kboatright1@comcast.net escreveu:
>
> The safety wire trick to put the plunger in a bind and hold it in
> place is the way to go. I replaced my (O-320) pump a year or two ago,
> and it was very easy. Probably a 30 minute job once I had all of the
> parts and tools on hand...
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Tim Olson
> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2017 10:56 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel pump - replacement
>
>
> Phil,
>
> My RV14 came with a pump that ended up having an SB on it so I replaced
> it under warranty.
>
> http://www.myrv14.com/N14YT/maintenance/20170408/index.html
>
> There are some tips there for you. It's both a real pain in the butt,
> and also
> not too bad, all at the same time. You won't need to drain the oil, but
> you should have a new gasket or two on hand. It does require at least
> 10 minutes of cussing, or it isn't a project. More than 2 hours worth
> gets you extra points.
>
> Check out that link. That may be all you need. The safety wire trick was
> invaluable.
> Tim
>
>
> On 8/10/2017 9:48 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>
>> I am probably going to try installing a new (engine driven) fuel pump
>> tomorrow. Has anyone replaced theirs?
>>
>> What's he process like? I'm guessing I don't need to drain the oil
>> to swap it out?
>>
>> How much cussing does it require?
>>
>> It should be a simple process, but I could see fitting it under the
>> plunger and getting everything aligned could be a pain. Any tips
>> would help. I'd like to not fit with it for days.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Phil
>>
>>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Brake fluid seeping from master cylinders |
The 2017 update to Van's chapter 5 instructions gives a good treatment
of NPT fitting sealing:
"Because we cannot always fully tighten tapered thread fittings, and
because even after fully tightening the fitting a small spiral leak path
remains along the full length of threads, a thread sealant must be used
during assembly. Sealants appropriate for use on aircraft NPT fittings
areTite-seal, Permatex #2 and Locktite 565. Do not use RTV, Teflon tape
or Fuel Lube on NPT fittings .
When installing the fitting, be sure the threads on both parts are clean
and dry since most sealants will not tolerate any oil contamination.
First determine the clocking position by installing it finger tight and
marking the desired clocking. Remove the fitting and apply a small
amount of sealant to 2 - 3 threads of the male fitting. Leave the first
2 bare to prevent contamination inside the fluid path. Remember, this is
an interference fit so not much sealant is required.
Thread the fitting in with your fingers until you just begin to feel
resistance and then an additional 1.5 - 2 turns. This is general
guidance... you must still use judgement to not over tighten and damage
the threads, but a properly insalled fitting is quite tight. If the
installation requires a specific clocking, when approaching the correct
position you must determine whether you will be able to make another
full rotation and still be within the 1.5 - 2 turns stopping range. You
must avoid turning the fitting backwards in the loosening direction
because it will have a high probability of leaking. If you must do this,
it is best to completely remove the fitting, clean up the threads on
both parts, and try again."
Source: http://vansaircraft.com/pdf/revisions/RV-ALL_05.pdf
--
Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA)
A&P
RV-6A N47TD -- 1104 hrs - sold
RV-10 N31TD -- 960 hrs
Dan Charrois wrote on 8/7/2017 1:40 AM:
>
> Whoops - I misspoke. It wasn't Boelube I used on my pipe threads. I had the
name on the brain because I'd recently used it to lubricate the piano hinge pins
that go into the cowling.
>
> I can't recall exactly, but I think the stuff I used was EZ Turn Fuel lube (described
as a lubricant/sealant).. it's in a tube and *very* gooey and sticky
:-) ... not the Boelube that's blue, in a little jar, and oily.
>
> But with that said, it may not be the best product for the job. A thread sealant
paste like Loctite 567 or Permatex 80632 as suggested here probably would
be better suited. Just so long as it can handle brake fluid properly.
>
> Thanks, everyone!
>
> Dan
>
>> On 2017-Aug-06, at 10:10 PM, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>>
>>
>> As others said: Boelube is a lubricant. You want a pipe thread sealant. Apply
sparingly, not on the first thread. You should have used a thread sealant on
all your pipe threads (not teflon tape).
>>
>> --------
>> Bob Turner
>> RV-10 QB
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471577#471577
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ---
> Dan Charrois
> President, Syzygy Research & Technology
> Phone: 780-961-2213
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump - replacement |
I should add that this works best if you don't use the .032 safety wire, but instead
use the very fine stuff used to safety wire smaller screws and bolts.
You want something very fine. I have 3 sizes of safety wire in the hangar.
Just nice things to have when you do your own maintenance. You could probably
easily use telephone hookup wire or even a strand out of a network cable very
easily too.
Tim
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 7:16 AM, Dilson <dilsonfrota@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hi
>
> It would be fantastic if I knew the safety wire trick. Despite that I was very,
very careful being sure I had the lever under the pushrod.
>
> I had a low fuel pressure while flying to Oshkosh this year. Had to change the
pump a field.
>
> The Emergency Repair Shop located at the south near the ultralite area, was invaluable
helping me with tools and other amenities.
>
> Dilson
>
>
> Em 11/08/2017 00:35, kboatright1@comcast.net escreveu:
>>
>> The safety wire trick to put the plunger in a bind and hold it in place is the
way to go. I replaced my (O-320) pump a year or two ago, and it was very easy.
Probably a 30 minute job once I had all of the parts and tools on hand...
>>
>> -----Original Message----- From: Tim Olson
>> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2017 10:56 PM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel pump - replacement
>>
>>
>> Phil,
>>
>> My RV14 came with a pump that ended up having an SB on it so I replaced
>> it under warranty.
>>
>> http://www.myrv14.com/N14YT/maintenance/20170408/index.html
>>
>> There are some tips there for you. It's both a real pain in the butt,
>> and also
>> not too bad, all at the same time. You won't need to drain the oil, but
>> you should have a new gasket or two on hand. It does require at least
>> 10 minutes of cussing, or it isn't a project. More than 2 hours worth
>> gets you extra points.
>>
>> Check out that link. That may be all you need. The safety wire trick was
>> invaluable.
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 8/10/2017 9:48 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>>
>>> I am probably going to try installing a new (engine driven) fuel pump tomorrow.
Has anyone replaced theirs?
>>>
>>> What's he process like? I'm guessing I don't need to drain the oil to swap
it out?
>>>
>>> How much cussing does it require?
>>>
>>> It should be a simple process, but I could see fitting it under the plunger
and getting everything aligned could be a pain. Any tips would help. I'd like
to not fit with it for days.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Phil
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
UPS should be here with the new pump (going w/a Tempest brand) here in a
few hours.
Before I commit to putting it on the engine and buying it outright, I
thought I'd run this by the gallery.
Earlier I was having a stumble when leaning rich of peak. Come to find
out, that was a heat related issue. Re-routing a fuel line moved the line
to a cooler part of the cowling and the engine has been running like a
sewing machine ever since.
However, I continue to have fluctuating fuel pressures in flight. Never
enough to put the PSI in the yellow, but it's certainly not consistent and
(In my amateur-built opinion) it's fluctuating more than it should.
1) I don't believe I have a sensor problem. Because I can kick on my
Andair pump and it stabilizes at 26.9 to 27.0 PSI and holds steady. Shut
it off and the fluctuation restarts.
2) I suspected an air leak on the suction side of the pump. But I
tightened every fitting from the tank to the boost pump. Then pressure
tested the fuel lines forward of the boost pump. No leaks found forward
of the pump and likely not any air leaks behind it after tightening.
3) I suspected heat was an issue. So I installed a blast tube on the
engine driven pump. (Cooling shroud is on order - BTW: Don't order one in
the summer time or the lead time is around 2 months because of demand.) It
didn't make a difference.
So I'm starting to run out of options aside from replacing the pump itself.
Last night I was zipping along through the sky and I decided to grab my
phone and shoot this video showing the pace and range of the fluctuation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weSIiM96Vv4
Before I commit to replacing the pump, I wanted to see if anyone else has
experienced a similar symptom.
Why might it be the pump? Well the engine did sit for 4-5 years before I
ever got the project to the point where I could start it. So it's
possible that one of the rubber check valves dried out inside the pump
allowing some fuel to leak by.
Thanks,
Phil
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Hey Phil,
That's interesting you had a change with re-routing the
line. I'm interested in how close it was to hot stuff.
The amount of fluctuation you have is pretty high.
If it doesn't end up being the pump, I'd be saying
it could be the sensor. I'd think that unless
there were a huge air leak you wouldn't see anything
that drastic.
I also bought a blast tube shroud at one point but
it's still in the box, never installed it. I think
the fuel pump swap would be a lot harder with adding
that.
I know that doesn't help, but just interested in what you
find. If the pump swap doesn't do it, I'd try a new
sensor. Or, stick a mechanical gauge on it I suppose.
Tim
On 8/11/2017 8:42 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> UPS should be here with the new pump (going w/a Tempest brand) here in a
> few hours.
>
> Before I commit to putting it on the engine and buying it outright, I
> thought I'd run this by the gallery.
>
> Earlier I was having a stumble when leaning rich of peak. Come to find
> out, that was a heat related issue. Re-routing a fuel line moved the
> line to a cooler part of the cowling and the engine has been running
> like a sewing machine ever since.
>
> However, I continue to have fluctuating fuel pressures in flight. Never
> enough to put the PSI in the yellow, but it's certainly not consistent
> and (In my amateur-built opinion) it's fluctuating more than it should.
>
> 1) I don't believe I have a sensor problem. Because I can kick on my
> Andair pump and it stabilizes at 26.9 to 27.0 PSI and holds steady.
> Shut it off and the fluctuation restarts.
>
> 2) I suspected an air leak on the suction side of the pump. But I
> tightened every fitting from the tank to the boost pump. Then pressure
> tested the fuel lines forward of the boost pump. No leaks found
> forward of the pump and likely not any air leaks behind it after tightening.
>
> 3) I suspected heat was an issue. So I installed a blast tube on the
> engine driven pump. (Cooling shroud is on order - BTW: Don't order one
> in the summer time or the lead time is around 2 months because of
> demand.) It didn't make a difference.
>
> So I'm starting to run out of options aside from replacing the pump itself.
>
> Last night I was zipping along through the sky and I decided to grab my
> phone and shoot this video showing the pace and range of the fluctuation.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weSIiM96Vv4
>
> Before I commit to replacing the pump, I wanted to see if anyone else
> has experienced a similar symptom.
>
> Why might it be the pump? Well the engine did sit for 4-5 years before
> I ever got the project to the point where I could start it. So it's
> possible that one of the rubber check valves dried out inside the pump
> allowing some fuel to leak by.
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Variations with flight attitude are not uncommon. Fluctuations during
cruise are not normal. Hard to evaluate "in the yellow" as the actual
Lycoming specified numbers(from Operating Manual) are, for IO-540-A
series engines, 20 min. and 26 max. While the engine will run down to
around 14 psi, I'd rather not go there. I normally see 1-2 psi increase
with boost pump.
On 8/11/2017 6:42 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> UPS should be here with the new pump (going w/a Tempest brand) here in a
> few hours.
>
> Before I commit to putting it on the engine and buying it outright, I
> thought I'd run this by the gallery.
>
> Earlier I was having a stumble when leaning rich of peak. Come to find
> out, that was a heat related issue. Re-routing a fuel line moved the
> line to a cooler part of the cowling and the engine has been running
> like a sewing machine ever since.
>
> However, I continue to have fluctuating fuel pressures in flight. Never
> enough to put the PSI in the yellow, but it's certainly not consistent
> and (In my amateur-built opinion) it's fluctuating more than it should.
> 2) I suspected an air leak on the suction side of the pump. But I
> tightened every fitting from the tank to the boost pump. Then pressure
> tested the fuel lines forward of the boost pump. No leaks found
> forward of the pump and likely not any air leaks behind it after tightening.
>
> 3) I suspected heat was an issue. So I installed a blast tube on the
> engine driven pump. (Cooling shroud is on order - BTW: Don't order one
> in the summer time or the lead time is around 2 months because of
> demand.) It didn't make a difference.
>
> So I'm starting to run out of options aside from replacing the pump itself.
>
> Last night I was zipping along through the sky and I decided to grab my
> phone and shoot this video showing the pace and range of the fluctuation.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weSIiM96Vv4
>
> Before I commit to replacing the pump, I wanted to see if anyone else
> has experienced a similar symptom.
>
> Why might it be the pump? Well the engine did sit for 4-5 years before
> I ever got the project to the point where I could start it. So it's
> possible that one of the rubber check valves dried out inside the pump
> allowing some fuel to leak by.
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
I agree with Tim. I don't think you have an air leak. I'm not
convinced you don't have a sensor problem. It looks worse than it
probably is because of the digital numbers at more precision than
needed. You really should have it stay around 23-25. The dips below 20
absent a nose up prolonged climb are a bit of a concern.
Kelly
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 7:30 AM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Hey Phil,
>
> That's interesting you had a change with re-routing the
> line. I'm interested in how close it was to hot stuff.
> The amount of fluctuation you have is pretty high.
> If it doesn't end up being the pump, I'd be saying
> it could be the sensor. I'd think that unless
> there were a huge air leak you wouldn't see anything
> that drastic.
>
> On 8/11/2017 8:42 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>
>> UPS should be here with the new pump (going w/a Tempest brand) here in a
>> few hours.
>>
>> Before I commit to putting it on the engine and buying it outright, I
>> thought I'd run this by the gallery.
>>
>> Earlier I was having a stumble when leaning rich of peak. Come to find
>> out, that was a heat related issue. Re-routing a fuel line moved the line
>> to a cooler part of the cowling and the engine has been running like a
>> sewing machine ever since.
>>
>> However, I continue to have fluctuating fuel pressures in flight. Never
>> enough to put the PSI in the yellow, but it's certainly not consistent and
>> (In my amateur-built opinion) it's fluctuating more than it should.
>>
>> 1) I don't believe I have a sensor problem. Because I can kick on my
>> Andair pump and it stabilizes at 26.9 to 27.0 PSI and holds steady. Shut
>> it off and the fluctuation restarts.
>>mp? Well the engine did sit for 4-5 years before I
>> ever got the project to the point where I could start it. So it's possible
>> that one of the rubber check valves dried out inside the pump allowing some
>> fuel to leak by.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Phil
>>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Phil
Before changing my fuel pump I was experiencing about the same reading
you are having and the same kind of variation.
After the replacement, the pressure went up to around 30 PSI. But, the
fluctuating fuel pressure persist
I flew more than 40 hours now without a issue. My previous fuel pump had
just 200 hours on it
Rds
Dilson
Em 11/08/2017 10:42, Phillip Perry escreveu:
> UPS should be here with the new pump (going w/a Tempest brand) here in
> a few hours.
>
> Before I commit to putting it on the engine and buying it outright, I
> thought I'd run this by the gallery.
>
> Earlier I was having a stumble when leaning rich of peak. Come to find
> out, that was a heat related issue. Re-routing a fuel line moved the
> line to a cooler part of the cowling and the engine has been running
> like a sewing machine ever since.
>
> However, I continue to have fluctuating fuel pressures in flight.
> Never enough to put the PSI in the yellow, but it's certainly not
> consistent and (In my amateur-built opinion) it's fluctuating more
> than it should.
>
> 1) I don't believe I have a sensor problem. Because I can kick on my
> Andair pump and it stabilizes at 26.9 to 27.0 PSI and holds steady.
> Shut it off and the fluctuation restarts.
>
> 2) I suspected an air leak on the suction side of the pump. But I
> tightened every fitting from the tank to the boost pump. Then
> pressure tested the fuel lines forward of the boost pump. No leaks
> found forward of the pump and likely not any air leaks behind it after
> tightening.
>
> 3) I suspected heat was an issue. So I installed a blast tube on the
> engine driven pump. (Cooling shroud is on order - BTW: Don't order
> one in the summer time or the lead time is around 2 months because of
> demand.) It didn't make a difference.
>
> So I'm starting to run out of options aside from replacing the pump
> itself.
>
> Last night I was zipping along through the sky and I decided to grab
> my phone and shoot this video showing the pace and range of the
> fluctuation.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weSIiM96Vv4
>
> Before I commit to replacing the pump, I wanted to see if anyone else
> has experienced a similar symptom.
>
> Why might it be the pump? Well the engine did sit for 4-5 years
> before I ever got the project to the point where I could start it.
> So it's possible that one of the rubber check valves dried out inside
> the pump allowing some fuel to leak by.
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The engine
driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one. The restrictor
helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations, some don't.
--------
Lenny Iszak
Palm City, FL
2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>
>
> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The engine
driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one. The restrictor
helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations, some don't.
>
> --------
> Lenny Iszak
> Palm City, FL
> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
I'm having some fluctuations when I turn on my electric pump. In talking w
ith Don Rivera, it's because the o-ring is sticking a bit, it builds up pre
ssure then releases. I'm seeing a single high spike, then drops to normal
almost instantaneously. It was tripping an audio alert, which became quick
ly annoying.
I didn't see these before I upgraded my efis using the same sensor. So the
new efis is more responsive in measuring sensor output than the old one.
Don recommended using a flow restrictor smaller than the one Vans provided
us in the kit to dampen the spike better. I haven't found a source yet.
I don't have the size handy, but could look it up if anyone is interested.
I'm not implying this has anything to do with Phil's issue. I'm just addin
g on to Lenny's comment about flow restrictors.
Bob
Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
_____________________________
From: Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com<mailto:lenard@rapiddecision.com
>>
Sent: Friday, August 11, 2017 11:13 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question
ilto:lenard@rapiddecision.com>>
Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The eng
ine driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one.
The restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations,
some don't.
--------
Lenny Iszak
Palm City, FL
2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Quick Update....
UPS dropped the pump off at 10AM. By noon I had removed the old one and
put the new one on (mostly - minus safety wire and a couple of scat tubes
that need to be replaced). The safety wire tip was a great one and
worked like a champ. The only thing I'd add is to wait to put your
fittings on the pump after the pump is in position. It just gives you a
few more inches and angles to work with. I wish I had done that, but
didn't.
I wanted to do a ground run before I took the time to safety wire it and
replace the scat tubes. Mission accomplished.
The run-up initially showed lower fuel pressures, a stumbling engine, and a
desire to idle at an RPM much lower than normal (~500 RPM). It would have
died if I let it. I tried to purge the lines as best I could with the
purge valve, but it didn't get everything apparently. After a few minutes
of rough running though, the engine was ticking right along as expected.
Most of that was air in the lines I suspect since I had an empty pump, and
lines.
As far as noticeable changes, fuel pressure has taken a 25% leap forward;
increasing from 25 PSI on the old pump (at taxi) to 33 PSI on the new pump.
Now that it appears to work, I'll head back up there in a few hours and put
the rest of it back together and hopefully fly it this evening. Then I can
report in on cruise changes. But the indicators, at this point, show a
step in the right direction.
I did all this with a 7 year old boy and a 5 year old little girl in the
hangar. I bet I heard, "Daddy I want to buy a kitten" 150 times. In
combination with, "I'm ready for our dogs to die so we can get a kitten"
another 82.
I'm glad she was there to bug me as it eclipsed my frustration with the
pump replacement. If you're going to be replacing one of these, I'd
suggest bringing a 5 year old little girl to the hangar with you. If you
have one that is determined to get a kitten, then even better.
Hopefully I can report some in-flight observations later tonight.
Phil
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 10:31 AM, Bob Leffler <bob@thelefflers.com> wrote:
> I'm having some fluctuations when I turn on my electric pump. In talking
> with Don Rivera, it's because the o-ring is sticking a bit, it builds up
> pressure then releases. I'm seeing a single high spike, then drops to
> normal almost instantaneously. It was tripping an audio alert, which
> became quickly annoying.
>
> I didn't see these before I upgraded my efis using the same sensor. So
> the new efis is more responsive in measuring sensor output than the old
> one.
>
> Don recommended using a flow restrictor smaller than the one Vans provided
> us in the kit to dampen the spike better. I haven't found a source yet.
> I don't have the size handy, but could look it up if anyone is interested.
>
> I'm not implying this has anything to do with Phil's issue. I'm just
> adding on to Lenny's comment about flow restrictors.
>
> Bob
>
> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
> _____________________________
> From: Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com>
> Sent: Friday, August 11, 2017 11:13 AM
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question
> To: <rv10-list@matronics.com>
>
>
>
> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The
> engine driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric
> one. The restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the
> fluctuations, some don't.
>
> --------
> Lenny Iszak
> Palm City, FL
> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>
>
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Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Well that's positive news. Surprised it actually makes that much
pressure. If they weren't so expensive I'd buy a Tempest just
to have on hand. I like spare parts. :)
The stuff on the kids is priceless. Hopefully you won't have to
have any dead dogs to get the kitten. That said, as a former
Cat owner and later Dog owner, I think she's going the wrong
direction. I'm sure half the list will want to beat me for this
but, Dogs rule. Try taking your cat on a flight sometime...
Looking forward to "The rest of the story". (Old Paul Harvey
reference). Geez, that dates me, doesn't it? Am I that old?
Tim
On 08/11/2017 01:19 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> Quick Update....
>
> UPS dropped the pump off at 10AM. By noon I had removed the old one
> and put the new one on (mostly - minus safety wire and a couple of scat
> tubes that need to be replaced). The safety wire tip was a great one
> and worked like a champ. The only thing I'd add is to wait to put your
> fittings on the pump after the pump is in position. It just gives you
> a few more inches and angles to work with. I wish I had done that, but
> didn't.
>
> I wanted to do a ground run before I took the time to safety wire it and
> replace the scat tubes. Mission accomplished.
>
> The run-up initially showed lower fuel pressures, a stumbling engine,
> and a desire to idle at an RPM much lower than normal (~500 RPM). It
> would have died if I let it. I tried to purge the lines as best I
> could with the purge valve, but it didn't get everything apparently.
> After a few minutes of rough running though, the engine was ticking
> right along as expected. Most of that was air in the lines I suspect
> since I had an empty pump, and lines.
>
> As far as noticeable changes, fuel pressure has taken a 25% leap
> forward; increasing from 25 PSI on the old pump (at taxi) to 33 PSI on
> the new pump.
>
> Now that it appears to work, I'll head back up there in a few hours and
> put the rest of it back together and hopefully fly it this evening.
> Then I can report in on cruise changes. But the indicators, at this
> point, show a step in the right direction.
>
> I did all this with a 7 year old boy and a 5 year old little girl in the
> hangar. I bet I heard, "Daddy I want to buy a kitten" 150 times. In
> combination with, "I'm ready for our dogs to die so we can get a kitten"
> another 82.
>
> I'm glad she was there to bug me as it eclipsed my frustration with the
> pump replacement. If you're going to be replacing one of these, I'd
> suggest bringing a 5 year old little girl to the hangar with you. If
> you have one that is determined to get a kitten, then even better.
>
> Hopefully I can report some in-flight observations later tonight.
>
> Phil
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Yes, but some of us may have you beat by at least a couple of years. Getting older
has one positive, the older you get the more senior discounts you get.
Do not archive
Because we are too old to care.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Friday, August 11, 2017 12:53 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question
Well that's positive news. Surprised it actually makes that much pressure. If
they weren't so expensive I'd buy a Tempest just to have on hand. I like spare
parts. :)
The stuff on the kids is priceless. Hopefully you won't have to have any dead
dogs to get the kitten. That said, as a former Cat owner and later Dog owner,
I think she's going the wrong direction. I'm sure half the list will want to
beat me for this but, Dogs rule. Try taking your cat on a flight sometime...
Looking forward to "The rest of the story". (Old Paul Harvey reference). Geez,
that dates me, doesn't it? Am I that old?
Tim
On 08/11/2017 01:19 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> Quick Update....
>
> UPS dropped the pump off at 10AM. By noon I had removed the old one
> and put the new one on (mostly - minus safety wire and a couple of scat
> tubes that need to be replaced). The safety wire tip was a great one
> and worked like a champ. The only thing I'd add is to wait to put your
> fittings on the pump after the pump is in position. It just gives you
> a few more inches and angles to work with. I wish I had done that,
> but didn't.
>
> I wanted to do a ground run before I took the time to safety wire it and
> replace the scat tubes. Mission accomplished.
>
> The run-up initially showed lower fuel pressures, a stumbling engine,
> and a desire to idle at an RPM much lower than normal (~500 RPM). It
> would have died if I let it. I tried to purge the lines as best I
> could with the purge valve, but it didn't get everything apparently.
> After a few minutes of rough running though, the engine was ticking
> right along as expected. Most of that was air in the lines I suspect
> since I had an empty pump, and lines.
>
> As far as noticeable changes, fuel pressure has taken a 25% leap
> forward; increasing from 25 PSI on the old pump (at taxi) to 33 PSI on
> the new pump.
>
> Now that it appears to work, I'll head back up there in a few hours
> and put the rest of it back together and hopefully fly it this evening.
> Then I can report in on cruise changes. But the indicators, at this
> point, show a step in the right direction.
>
> I did all this with a 7 year old boy and a 5 year old little girl in
> the hangar. I bet I heard, "Daddy I want to buy a kitten" 150 times.
> In combination with, "I'm ready for our dogs to die so we can get a kitten"
> another 82.
>
> I'm glad she was there to bug me as it eclipsed my frustration with the
> pump replacement. If you're going to be replacing one of these, I'd
> suggest bringing a 5 year old little girl to the hangar with you. If
> you have one that is determined to get a kitten, then even better.
>
> Hopefully I can report some in-flight observations later tonight.
>
> Phil
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
I didn't get a Tempest after all.
I put this Tempest pump in my basket several times: Model (LW15473)
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/TEMPESTfuelpumpLYC2.php?clickkey=57512
When I did it kept changing my order to this pump (LW15473)
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/contlycfuelpump.php
I just suspected it had something to do with ACS's ordering system. When
it came in, it was in a Lycoming box....
But it's working.... (apparently) Headed back to the airport in a bit to
put it together.
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Well that's positive news. Surprised it actually makes that much
> pressure. If they weren't so expensive I'd buy a Tempest just
> to have on hand. I like spare parts. :)
>
> The stuff on the kids is priceless. Hopefully you won't have to
> have any dead dogs to get the kitten. That said, as a former
> Cat owner and later Dog owner, I think she's going the wrong
> direction. I'm sure half the list will want to beat me for this
> but, Dogs rule. Try taking your cat on a flight sometime...
> Looking forward to "The rest of the story". (Old Paul Harvey
> reference). Geez, that dates me, doesn't it? Am I that old?
> Tim
>
>
> On 08/11/2017 01:19 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>
>> Quick Update....
>>
>> UPS dropped the pump off at 10AM. By noon I had removed the old one and
>> put the new one on (mostly - minus safety wire and a couple of scat tubes
>> that need to be replaced). The safety wire tip was a great one and
>> worked like a champ. The only thing I'd add is to wait to put your
>> fittings on the pump after the pump is in position. It just gives you a
>> few more inches and angles to work with. I wish I had done that, but
>> didn't.
>>
>> I wanted to do a ground run before I took the time to safety wire it and
>> replace the scat tubes. Mission accomplished.
>>
>> The run-up initially showed lower fuel pressures, a stumbling engine, and
>> a desire to idle at an RPM much lower than normal (~500 RPM). It would
>> have died if I let it. I tried to purge the lines as best I could with
>> the purge valve, but it didn't get everything apparently. After a few
>> minutes of rough running though, the engine was ticking right along as
>> expected. Most of that was air in the lines I suspect since I had an empty
>> pump, and lines.
>>
>> As far as noticeable changes, fuel pressure has taken a 25% leap forward;
>> increasing from 25 PSI on the old pump (at taxi) to 33 PSI on the new pump.
>>
>> Now that it appears to work, I'll head back up there in a few hours and
>> put the rest of it back together and hopefully fly it this evening. Then I
>> can report in on cruise changes. But the indicators, at this point, show a
>> step in the right direction.
>>
>> I did all this with a 7 year old boy and a 5 year old little girl in the
>> hangar. I bet I heard, "Daddy I want to buy a kitten" 150 times. In
>> combination with, "I'm ready for our dogs to die so we can get a kitten"
>> another 82.
>>
>> I'm glad she was there to bug me as it eclipsed my frustration with the
>> pump replacement. If you're going to be replacing one of these, I'd
>> suggest bringing a 5 year old little girl to the hangar with you. If you
>> have one that is determined to get a kitten, then even better.
>>
>> Hopefully I can report some in-flight observations later tonight.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Hmm, restrictor's purpose is to prevent large flow if line fails, and
fuel pressure line is usually connected to the fuel servo, on opposite
side to the inlet screen. So the restrictor should be in between the
fuel pressure line connection on the engine end of the line going to the
fuel pressure sending unit. Is your fuel pressure line connected to a
fitting on the pump? You really want to know how much pressure is
internal in the fuel servo, not at the pump.
On 8/11/2017 8:12 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>
> Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The engine
driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one. The
restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations, some don't.
>>
>> --------
>> Lenny Iszak
>> Palm City, FL
>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
You got the Lycoming OEM pump at $387. The Tempest is P/N AF15473 at
$309, while Lycoming is LW15473. The page is misleading in that it shows
both Lycoming and Tempest in the same table under the Tempest label.
PMA parts always have a modification of the OEM part number, like
Superior parts will have an S in front of the Lycoming part number.
They can't sell PMA part under identical part number as OEM.
On 8/11/2017 1:35 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
> I didn't get a Tempest after all.
>
> I put this Tempest pump in my basket several times: Model (LW15473)
> https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/TEMPESTfuelpumpLYC2.php?clickkey=57512
>
> When I did it kept changing my order to this pump (LW15473)
> https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/contlycfuelpump.php
>
> I just suspected it had something to do with ACS's ordering system.
> When it came in, it was in a Lycoming box....
>
> But it's working.... (apparently) Headed back to the airport in a bit
> to put it together.
>
> On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com
> <mailto:Tim@myrv10.com>> wrote:
>
>
> Well that's positive news. Surprised it actually makes that much
> pressure. If they weren't so expensive I'd buy a Tempest just
> to have on hand. I like spare parts. :)
>
> The stuff on the kids is priceless. Hopefully you won't have to
> have any dead dogs to get the kitten. That said, as a former
> Cat owner and later Dog owner, I think she's going the wrong
> direction. I'm sure half the list will want to beat me for this
> but, Dogs rule. Try taking your cat on a flight sometime...
> Looking forward to "The rest of the story". (Old Paul Harvey
> reference). Geez, that dates me, doesn't it? Am I that old?
> Tim
>
>
>
>
> On 08/11/2017 01:19 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>
> Quick Update....
>
> UPS dropped the pump off at 10AM. By noon I had removed the
> old one and put the new one on (mostly - minus safety wire and a
> couple of scat tubes that need to be replaced). The safety
> wire tip was a great one and worked like a champ. The only
> thing I'd add is to wait to put your fittings on the pump after
> the pump is in position. It just gives you a few more inches
> and angles to work with. I wish I had done that, but didn't.
>
> I wanted to do a ground run before I took the time to safety
> wire it and replace the scat tubes. Mission accomplished.
>
> The run-up initially showed lower fuel pressures, a stumbling
> engine, and a desire to idle at an RPM much lower than normal
> (~500 RPM). It would have died if I let it. I tried to purge
> the lines as best I could with the purge valve, but it didn't
> get everything apparently. After a few minutes of rough
> running though, the engine was ticking right along as expected.
> Most of that was air in the lines I suspect since I had an empty
> pump, and lines.
>
> As far as noticeable changes, fuel pressure has taken a 25% leap
> forward; increasing from 25 PSI on the old pump (at taxi) to 33
> PSI on the new pump.
>
> Now that it appears to work, I'll head back up there in a few
> hours and put the rest of it back together and hopefully fly it
> this evening. Then I can report in on cruise changes. But the
> indicators, at this point, show a step in the right direction.
>
> I did all this with a 7 year old boy and a 5 year old little
> girl in the hangar. I bet I heard, "Daddy I want to buy a
> kitten" 150 times. In combination with, "I'm ready for our dogs
> to die so we can get a kitten" another 82.
>
> I'm glad she was there to bug me as it eclipsed my frustration
> with the pump replacement. If you're going to be replacing one
> of these, I'd suggest bringing a 5 year old little girl to the
> hangar with you. If you have one that is determined to get a
> kitten, then even better.
>
> Hopefully I can report some in-flight observations later tonight.
>
> Phil
>
>
> ===================================
> -List" rel="noreferrer"
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ===================================
> FORUMS -
> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
> ===================================
> WIKI -
> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ===================================
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ===================================
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
In that case, it's probably worth checking real quick to make sure that the L
ycoming pump is not covered by that service bulletin that caused me to repla
ce mine. They had some non-conforming parts. Lycoming was not very aggressiv
e at getting them replaced. I had to ask. I highly doubt that yours will be a
ffected,but it maybe worth looking up the serial number quick. The service b
ulletins old enough that I bet that aircraft Spruce would have checked them a
ll already.
Tim
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 3:35 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I didn't get a Tempest after all.
>
> I put this Tempest pump in my basket several times: Model (LW15473)
> https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/TEMPESTfuelpumpLYC2.php?cli
ckkey=57512
>
> When I did it kept changing my order to this pump (LW15473)
> https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/contlycfuelpump.php
>
> I just suspected it had something to do with ACS's ordering system. Whe
n it came in, it was in a Lycoming box....
>
> But it's working.... (apparently) Headed back to the airport in a bit to p
ut it together.
>
>> On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>>
>> Well that's positive news. Surprised it actually makes that much
>> pressure. If they weren't so expensive I'd buy a Tempest just
>> to have on hand. I like spare parts. :)
>>
>> The stuff on the kids is priceless. Hopefully you won't have to
>> have any dead dogs to get the kitten. That said, as a former
>> Cat owner and later Dog owner, I think she's going the wrong
>> direction. I'm sure half the list will want to beat me for this
>> but, Dogs rule. Try taking your cat on a flight sometime...
>> Looking forward to "The rest of the story". (Old Paul Harvey
>> reference). Geez, that dates me, doesn't it? Am I that old?
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 08/11/2017 01:19 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>> Quick Update....
>>>
>>> UPS dropped the pump off at 10AM. By noon I had removed the old one an
d put the new one on (mostly - minus safety wire and a couple of scat tubes t
hat need to be replaced). The safety wire tip was a great one and worked l
ike a champ. The only thing I'd add is to wait to put your fittings on the p
ump after the pump is in position. It just gives you a few more inches and
angles to work with. I wish I had done that, but didn't.
>>>
>>> I wanted to do a ground run before I took the time to safety wire it and
replace the scat tubes. Mission accomplished.
>>>
>>> The run-up initially showed lower fuel pressures, a stumbling engine, an
d a desire to idle at an RPM much lower than normal (~500 RPM). It would ha
ve died if I let it. I tried to purge the lines as best I could with the p
urge valve, but it didn't get everything apparently. After a few minutes o
f rough running though, the engine was ticking right along as expected. Mos
t of that was air in the lines I suspect since I had an empty pump, and line
s.
>>>
>>> As far as noticeable changes, fuel pressure has taken a 25% leap forward
; increasing from 25 PSI on the old pump (at taxi) to 33 PSI on the new pump
.
>>>
>>> Now that it appears to work, I'll head back up there in a few hours and p
ut the rest of it back together and hopefully fly it this evening. Then I c
an report in on cruise changes. But the indicators, at this point, show a s
tep in the right direction.
>>>
>>> I did all this with a 7 year old boy and a 5 year old little girl in the
hangar. I bet I heard, "Daddy I want to buy a kitten" 150 times. In combi
nation with, "I'm ready for our dogs to die so we can get a kitten" another 8
2.
>>>
>>> I'm glad she was there to bug me as it eclipsed my frustration with the p
ump replacement. If you're going to be replacing one of these, I'd suggest
bringing a 5 year old little girl to the hangar with you. If you have one t
hat is determined to get a kitten, then even better.
>>>
>>> Hopefully I can report some in-flight observations later tonight.
>>>
>>> Phil
>>>
>>>
>>
>> =========================
>> -List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navi
gator?RV10-List
>> =========================
>> FORUMS -
>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>> =========================
>> WIKI -
>> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
>> =========================
>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contributio
n
>> =========================
>>
>>
>>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Mine is installed like Vans plans suggest. Photo attached.
Coming out of the pump there is a T. One leg goes forward to the servo.
The other leg has a restrictor fitting and the hose goes on up to the firewa
ll manifold where the pressure sensor is located.
Phil
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 3:42 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hmm, restrictor's purpose is to prevent large flow if line fails, and fuel
pressure line is usually connected to the fuel servo, on opposite side to t
he inlet screen. So the restrictor should be in between the fuel pressure li
ne connection on the engine end of the line going to the fuel pressure sendi
ng unit. Is your fuel pressure line connected to a fitting on the pump? You r
eally want to know how much pressure is internal in the fuel servo, not at t
he pump.
>
>> On 8/11/2017 8:12 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>> Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wro
te:
>>>
>
>>>
>>> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The e
ngine driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one.
The restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations,
some don't.
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Lenny Iszak
>>> Palm City, FL
>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
That could account for some of the fluctuation. Production planes
connect at the servo. I have to keep switching mind between factory
planes I've worked on and Van's somewhat different way of doing
things.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
> Mine is installed like Vans plans suggest. Photo attached.
>
> Coming out of the pump there is a T. One leg goes forward to the servo.
>
> The other leg has a restrictor fitting and the hose goes on up to the firewall
manifold where the pressure sensor is located.
>
> Phil
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 3:42 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hmm, restrictor's purpose is to prevent large flow if line fails, and fuel pressure
line is usually connected to the fuel servo, on opposite side to the inlet
screen. So the restrictor should be in between the fuel pressure line connection
on the engine end of the line going to the fuel pressure sending unit.
Is your fuel pressure line connected to a fitting on the pump? You really want
to know how much pressure is internal in the fuel servo, not at the pump.
>>
>>> On 8/11/2017 8:12 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>> Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The engine
driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one. The
restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations, some
don't.
>>>>
>>>> --------
>>>> Lenny Iszak
>>>> Palm City, FL
>>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>
>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
>>
>>
>>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
I am up here working on it now and while safety wiring this thing, I might h
ave found another possible source of fluctuation.... it escaped my eye unti
l now.
Photo attached.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 4:32 PM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> That could account for some of the fluctuation. Production planes
> connect at the servo. I have to keep switching mind between factory
> planes I've worked on and Van's somewhat different way of doing
> things.
> -sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
>
>
>> On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wro
te:
>> Mine is installed like Vans plans suggest. Photo attached.
>>
>> Coming out of the pump there is a T. One leg goes forward to the servo.
>>
>> The other leg has a restrictor fitting and the hose goes on up to the fir
ewall manifold where the pressure sensor is located.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 3:42 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hmm, restrictor's purpose is to prevent large flow if line fails, and fu
el pressure line is usually connected to the fuel servo, on opposite side to
the inlet screen. So the restrictor should be in between the fuel pressure l
ine connection on the engine end of the line going to the fuel pressure send
ing unit. Is your fuel pressure line connected to a fitting on the pump? You
really want to know how much pressure is internal in the fuel servo, not at
the pump.
>>>
>>>> On 8/11/2017 8:12 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>>> Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> w
rote:
>>>>>
om>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? Th
e engine driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric o
ne. The restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuatio
ns, some don't.
>>>>>
>>>>> --------
>>>>> Lenny Iszak
>>>>> Palm City, FL
>>>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> =========================
>> =========================
>> =========================
>> =========================
>> =========================
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
>
>
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
There you go...an air bubble up high by the sensor. That could be it!
Tim
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 4:54 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I am up here working on it now and while safety wiring this thing, I might have
found another possible source of fluctuation.... it escaped my eye until now.
>
> Photo attached.
>
> <image1.JPG>
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 4:32 PM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> That could account for some of the fluctuation. Production planes
>> connect at the servo. I have to keep switching mind between factory
>> planes I've worked on and Van's somewhat different way of doing
>> things.
>> -sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
>>
>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Mine is installed like Vans plans suggest. Photo attached.
>>>
>>> Coming out of the pump there is a T. One leg goes forward to the servo.
>>>
>>> The other leg has a restrictor fitting and the hose goes on up to the firewall
manifold where the pressure sensor is located.
>>>
>>> Phil
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 3:42 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hmm, restrictor's purpose is to prevent large flow if line fails, and fuel
pressure line is usually connected to the fuel servo, on opposite side to the
inlet screen. So the restrictor should be in between the fuel pressure line connection
on the engine end of the line going to the fuel pressure sending unit.
Is your fuel pressure line connected to a fitting on the pump? You really want
to know how much pressure is internal in the fuel servo, not at the pump.
>>>>
>>>>> On 8/11/2017 8:12 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>>>> Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The
engine driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one.
The restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations, some
don't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --------
>>>>>> Lenny Iszak
>>>>>> Palm City, FL
>>>>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>> =========================>> =========================>> =========================>>
=========================>> =========================>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
>>
>>
>>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
If that's it, and probably is, I'm not telling my wife......
If any of you tell my wife, I'm going to call you a liar. :)
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 5:32 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote:
>
>
> There you go...an air bubble up high by the sensor. That could be it!
> Tim
>
>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 4:54 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I am up here working on it now and while safety wiring this thing, I might have
found another possible source of fluctuation.... it escaped my eye until
now.
>>
>> Photo attached.
>>
>> <image1.JPG>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 4:32 PM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> That could account for some of the fluctuation. Production planes
>>> connect at the servo. I have to keep switching mind between factory
>>> planes I've worked on and Van's somewhat different way of doing
>>> things.
>>> -sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Mine is installed like Vans plans suggest. Photo attached.
>>>>
>>>> Coming out of the pump there is a T. One leg goes forward to the servo.
>>>>
>>>> The other leg has a restrictor fitting and the hose goes on up to the firewall
manifold where the pressure sensor is located.
>>>>
>>>> Phil
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 3:42 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hmm, restrictor's purpose is to prevent large flow if line fails, and fuel
pressure line is usually connected to the fuel servo, on opposite side to the
inlet screen. So the restrictor should be in between the fuel pressure line
connection on the engine end of the line going to the fuel pressure sending unit.
Is your fuel pressure line connected to a fitting on the pump? You really
want to know how much pressure is internal in the fuel servo, not at the pump.
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/11/2017 8:12 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>>>>>> Yes. Restrictor installed at the pump.
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 10:00 AM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Do you have a flow restrictor in your fuel pressure sensor fitting? The
engine driven pump puts out "heavier" pressure pulses than that electric one.
The restrictor helps dampen those. Some EFISs average out the fluctuations, some
don't.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --------
>>>>>>> Lenny Iszak
>>>>>>> Palm City, FL
>>>>>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471748#471748
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> =========================>> =========================>> =========================>>
=========================>> =========================>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>> ===================================
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
The problem is that if you fix that leak now you will never know if it was the
pump or the leak causing the fluctuation :)
--------
Lenny Iszak
Palm City, FL
2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471766#471766
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
I know! I decided to fix both for two reasons.
1) There was a known leak and there's really no reason to leave a known leak in
the airplane.
2) Because I will never know which fixed it and it helps me justify that pump!
I do think my pump was under performing though. This new one has a lot more pressure
than the original.
Phil
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>
>
> The problem is that if you fix that leak now you will never know if it was the
pump or the leak causing the fluctuation :)
>
> --------
> Lenny Iszak
> Palm City, FL
> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471766#471766
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Look at it this way. It's an emergency spare for you or someone who comes across
you. Never hurts to have spares.
Tim
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 7:04 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> I know! I decided to fix both for two reasons.
>
> 1) There was a known leak and there's really no reason to leave a known leak
in the airplane.
>
> 2) Because I will never know which fixed it and it helps me justify that pump!
>
> I do think my pump was under performing though. This new one has a lot more
pressure than the original.
>
> Phil
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> The problem is that if you fix that leak now you will never know if it was the
pump or the leak causing the fluctuation :)
>>
>> --------
>> Lenny Iszak
>> Palm City, FL
>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471766#471766
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 27
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
I wish I could offer a better report, but my data is very limited tonight.
I no more than took off and the guy who is hangared behind me was coming
in to land and reported a cabin fire in his Cheetah. So turned right back
around and landed to help him. Turned out being an electrical fire and
non-event other than the excitement.
A couple of observations.
1) The fuel pressure has increase tremendously. I was seeing 33 PSI. The
fluctuation was still there between 31 and 33.
2) The engine went from running like a sewing machine over the last 8 hours
to running like a Model A. It's now got a stumble it that is pretty
persistent. Thinking it might be related to the fuel pump, I turned the
boost on..... No change.
So I put it away for the night to read and think about the problem. Two
things have changed 1) The pump and 2) the PSI.
I suppose it's possible that some trash was in the new pump and found its
way down stream... I'm thinking a full fuel system flush and injector
inspection is in order. Anyone know if there are any screens in the AFP
system that I need to open up and inspect?
My enthusiasm for this thing has slipped from a 10 last night to a 2
tonight. Seems like a never ending chase.
Phil
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 7:28 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Look at it this way. It's an emergency spare for you or someone who comes
> across you. Never hurts to have spares.
> Tim
>
> > On Aug 11, 2017, at 7:04 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I know! I decided to fix both for two reasons.
> >
> > 1) There was a known leak and there's really no reason to leave a known
> leak in the airplane.
> >
> > 2) Because I will never know which fixed it and it helps me justify that
> pump!
> >
> > I do think my pump was under performing though. This new one has a lot
> more pressure than the original.
> >
> > Phil
> >
> >
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Aug 11, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> lenard@rapiddecision.com>
> >>
> >> The problem is that if you fix that leak now you will never know if it
> was the pump or the leak causing the fluctuation :)
> >>
> >> --------
> >> Lenny Iszak
> >> Palm City, FL
> >> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Read this topic online here:
> >>
> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471766#471766
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
Unfortunately, usually a fuel pump purchase requires returning a core.
If not...sure, keep as spare.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 5:28 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>
> Look at it this way. It's an emergency spare for you or someone who comes across
you. Never hurts to have spares.
> Tim
>
>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 7:04 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I know! I decided to fix both for two reasons.
>>
>> 1) There was a known leak and there's really no reason to leave a known leak
in the airplane.
>>
>> 2) Because I will never know which fixed it and it helps me justify that pump!
>>
>> I do think my pump was under performing though. This new one has a lot more
pressure than the original.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> The problem is that if you fix that leak now you will never know if it was
the pump or the leak causing the fluctuation :)
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Lenny Iszak
>>> Palm City, FL
>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471766#471766
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Re: Before the fuel pump exchange - one last question |
The plan is to get it overhauled with fresh guts for sure. Then I'll make a
decision between selling it or shelving it.
I am like Tim. I like having spares on the shelf to pull off. But I'm not opposed
to selling it after I've had it overhauled and know it's good.
Phil
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 9:17 PM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Unfortunately, usually a fuel pump purchase requires returning a core.
> If not...sure, keep as spare.
> -sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
>
>
>> On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 5:28 PM, Tim Olson <Tim@myrv10.com> wrote:
>>
>> Look at it this way. It's an emergency spare for you or someone who comes across
you. Never hurts to have spares.
>> Tim
>>
>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 7:04 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I know! I decided to fix both for two reasons.
>>>
>>> 1) There was a known leak and there's really no reason to leave a known leak
in the airplane.
>>>
>>> 2) Because I will never know which fixed it and it helps me justify that pump!
>>>
>>> I do think my pump was under performing though. This new one has a lot more
pressure than the original.
>>>
>>> Phil
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On Aug 11, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Lenny Iszak <lenard@rapiddecision.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The problem is that if you fix that leak now you will never know if it was
the pump or the leak causing the fluctuation :)
>>>>
>>>> --------
>>>> Lenny Iszak
>>>> Palm City, FL
>>>> 2014 RV-10, N311LZ - 300 hrs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>
>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471766#471766
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 30
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|
I know this has been covered extensively but I'm under a bit of a time crunc
h. My insurance is up for renewal this week and the company I'm with has mad
e me a bit uncomfortable. I'll hold off on details for now, but just wonderi
ng what the latest recommendations are on who to go with. I'll well exceed a
ny experience requirement needs in both model and total time.
Thanks,
Marcus
Message 31
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|
I've been happy with Jenny and crew at Gallagher. Of course they're an agency not
an insurance company. But I think you can trust their recommendations.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471776#471776
Message 32
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|
That's what I was going to say exactly. Jenny never steers me wrong.
Tim
> On Aug 11, 2017, at 11:21 PM, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
>
> I've been happy with Jenny and crew at Gallagher. Of course they're an agency
not an insurance company. But I think you can trust their recommendations.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=471776#471776
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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