Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:26 AM - Alternator Issue (mhealydds)
2. 06:36 AM - Re: Alternator Issue (Kelly McMullen)
3. 08:01 AM - Re: Alternator Issue (Larry Schneider)
4. 08:30 AM - Re: Alternator Issue (Phillip Perry)
5. 09:00 AM - Re: Alternator Issue (Lenny Iszak)
6. 12:51 PM - Engine timing (Phillip Perry)
7. 01:44 PM - Re: Alternator Issue (Bob Turner)
8. 02:18 PM - Alternator Issue (John MacCallum)
9. 02:22 PM - Re: Engine timing (Kelly McMullen)
10. 02:26 PM - Re: Engine timing (Don McDonald)
11. 05:08 PM - Re: Engine timing (Kelly McMullen)
12. 06:04 PM - Re: Engine timing (Nick Leonard)
13. 08:22 PM - Re: Engine timing (Robert Jones)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Alternator Issue |
Trouble shooting question for you all...I am having some alternator issues. I have
the 60 amp PP alternator that comes with FF kit form Vans. I have about 75
hours on plane. My alternator works fine on ground and charges in 13.4 to 13.6
range, but when I am in the air in stays around 12.5 charge rate. It has has
been doing that for about last 20 hours. It had a whine with RPM increase. I
did some looking with multi meter and reading seemed to consistent throughout
system and on both EFIS screen (AF-5000). Out of pure laziness more than anything
I swapped for a brand new alternator - same result. Works fine on ground but
low charge rate in flight and sometimes with go down to 12.0 volts. I recycle
field switch and will sometimes get back up into 13s but doesn't stay. On side
note I have a back-up PP 30 amp alternator on vacuum pad that works as it
should. Any thoughts?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473795#473795
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator Issue |
Send your question to the aeroelectric-list. Many experts there.
aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
I have same alternator, and I normally get 14.3-14.4 in flight once the
battery has recovered from starter current draw.
On 10/23/2017 6:25 AM, mhealydds wrote:
>
> Trouble shooting question for you all...I am having some alternator issues. I
have the 60 amp PP alternator that comes with FF kit form Vans. I have about
75 hours on plane. My alternator works fine on ground and charges in 13.4 to 13.6
range, but when I am in the air in stays around 12.5 charge rate. It has has
been doing that for about last 20 hours. It had a whine with RPM increase.
I did some looking with multi meter and reading seemed to consistent throughout
system and on both EFIS screen (AF-5000). Out of pure laziness more than anything
I swapped for a brand new alternator - same result. Works fine on ground
but low charge rate in flight and sometimes with go down to 12.0 volts. I recycle
field switch and will sometimes get back up into 13s but doesn't stay. On
side note I have a back-up PP 30 amp alternator on vacuum pad that works as it
should. Any thoughts?
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473795#473795
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator Issue |
Be sure the belt is tight
> On Oct 23, 2017, at 6:25 AM, mhealydds <mhealydds@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Trouble shooting question for you all...I am having some alternator issues. I
have the 60 amp PP alternator that comes with FF kit form Vans. I have about
75 hours on plane. My alternator works fine on ground and charges in 13.4 to 13.6
range, but when I am in the air in stays around 12.5 charge rate. It has has
been doing that for about last 20 hours. It had a whine with RPM increase.
I did some looking with multi meter and reading seemed to consistent throughout
system and on both EFIS screen (AF-5000). Out of pure laziness more than anything
I swapped for a brand new alternator - same result. Works fine on ground
but low charge rate in flight and sometimes with go down to 12.0 volts. I recycle
field switch and will sometimes get back up into 13s but doesn't stay. On
side note I have a back-up PP 30 amp alternator on vacuum pad that works as it
should. Any thoughts?
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473795#473795
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator Issue |
On the topic of belt slipping, here's the spec and procedure to test. Mine
loosened greatly after the first 8-10 hours and required some attention.
https://www.lycoming.com/sites/default/files/SI1129D%20Alternator%20Belt%20Tension%2C%20Methods%20of%20Checking.pdf
Phil
On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 9:48 AM, Larry Schneider <lschneider39@cox.net>
wrote:
>
> Be sure the belt is tight
>
> > On Oct 23, 2017, at 6:25 AM, mhealydds <mhealydds@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Trouble shooting question for you all...I am having some alternator
> issues. I have the 60 amp PP alternator that comes with FF kit form Vans. I
> have about 75 hours on plane. My alternator works fine on ground and
> charges in 13.4 to 13.6 range, but when I am in the air in stays around
> 12.5 charge rate. It has has been doing that for about last 20 hours. It
> had a whine with RPM increase. I did some looking with multi meter and
> reading seemed to consistent throughout system and on both EFIS screen
> (AF-5000). Out of pure laziness more than anything I swapped for a brand
> new alternator - same result. Works fine on ground but low charge rate in
> flight and sometimes with go down to 12.0 volts. I recycle field switch and
> will sometimes get back up into 13s but doesn't stay. On side note I have a
> back-up PP 30 amp alternator on vacuum pad that works as it should. Any
> thoughts?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473795#473795
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator Issue |
It might be an AFS issue. I have two 5800s and one of them was giving me low voltage
alarms, getting down to 11.5 or so, the other stayed rock solid displaying
14.1. It only did it once on a longer flight, and it didnt happen again. So,
it may not be alternator related. Check the logs on both Efis screens.
PP alternators have a whine especially at a higher load, because they have switching
regulators. If I knew that before I would have installed a B&C which has
an external linear voltage regulator, producing much less noise. Interestingly
I dont hear the noise with the Halo headset, but I do with the Bose A20.
Lenny
> On Oct 23, 2017, at 9:25 AM, mhealydds <mhealydds@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Trouble shooting question for you all...I am having some alternator issues. I
have the 60 amp PP alternator that comes with FF kit form Vans. I have about
75 hours on plane. My alternator works fine on ground and charges in 13.4 to 13.6
range, but when I am in the air in stays around 12.5 charge rate. It has has
been doing that for about last 20 hours. It had a whine with RPM increase.
I did some looking with multi meter and reading seemed to consistent throughout
system and on both EFIS screen (AF-5000). Out of pure laziness more than anything
I swapped for a brand new alternator - same result. Works fine on ground
but low charge rate in flight and sometimes with go down to 12.0 volts. I recycle
field switch and will sometimes get back up into 13s but doesn't stay. On
side note I have a back-up PP 30 amp alternator on vacuum pad that works as it
should. Any thoughts?
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473795#473795
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 6
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Does anyone know of a website or YouTube video that discusses the effects of engine
timing with piston changes.
IE: My lycoming (aerosport really) has 9:1 pistons and the data plate still shows
stock 20 timing. I have one LSE and one mag. Im considering tweaking my
mag timing for the 9:1 pistons and see if I can smooth out the engine a bit more.
But before I do, Id like to educate myself with reputable information.
Thanks,
Phil
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator Issue |
Id start by looking at the field circuit. Any chance that switch is failing in
flight? Or another connection?
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473820#473820
Message 8
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| Subject: | Alternator Issue |
Hi everyone,
If the Bus Voltage is falling to 12.5 Volts in Flight then the Battery is
not being charged at all! These Batteries
require more than 13.2 Volts to reach a full charge. The usual output
voltage is 14.1 to 14.2 volts so as to overcome
the internal resistance of the battery and to push some current through the
battery to allow charging to take place.
Yes check the belt tension as has been suggested. Check the Field connection
and the connections on the output
side.
As for the Voltage regulator the voltage regulator is a linear regulator
that is integral to the Brush Assembly.
If there is noticeable whine it could be being caused by blown diodes in the
rectifier pack. That will also
affect the output voltage.
You mention you have the PP 30 back up. If you normally leave the field
breaker/switch on that Alternator will
provide output when the bus voltage falls below 13 volts. So you might only
be looking at what is being supplied by the
PP30.
I have the same setup on my RV10 and when I first start up, I don't turn Alt
1 on until I have checked that
Alt 2 (PP30) is supplying current on the Alternator 2 input on my AFS4500
MFD. It will usually show around 6 to 8 amps of
Charging current right after starting. Once that is checked, I turn Alt 1 on
and the charging rate will then jump up
To around 20 amps on the Alt 1 sensor and Alt 2 will show zero.
Cheers
John MacCallum
VH-DUU
RV 10 # 41016
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of mhealydds
Sent: Tuesday, 24 October 2017 12:26 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Alternator Issue
Trouble shooting question for you all...I am having some alternator issues.
I have the 60 amp PP alternator that comes with FF kit form Vans. I have
about 75 hours on plane. My alternator works fine on ground and charges in
13.4 to 13.6 range, but when I am in the air in stays around 12.5 charge
rate. It has has been doing that for about last 20 hours. It had a whine
with RPM increase. I did some looking with multi meter and reading seemed to
consistent throughout system and on both EFIS screen (AF-5000). Out of pure
laziness more than anything I swapped for a brand new alternator - same
result. Works fine on ground but low charge rate in flight and sometimes
with go down to 12.0 volts. I recycle field switch and will sometimes get
back up into 13s but doesn't stay. On side note I have a back-up PP 30 amp
alternator on vacuum pad that works as it should. Any thoughts?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473795#473795
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Engine timing |
Phil, higher compression generally means faster burning of the fuel.
Thus later timing and higher octane.
I have stock 8.5:1 pistons and 25 degree timing. The highest compression
Lycoming used for non-helicopter applications was 8.7:1 and they had 20
degree timing, which is why I suspect Aerosport recommended that value.
A phone call to Aerosport should verify.
Once you are above a certain rpm the LSE will begin advancing timing,
depending on manifold pressure, rpm and CHT.
I would suspect either plugs or fuel injectors if engine isn't as smooth
as you think it should be. You should be able to verify by doing in
flight mag check to see if EGT rise on single mag is greater on any one
cylinder.
On 10/23/2017 12:50 PM, Phillip Perry wrote:
>
> Does anyone know of a website or YouTube video that discusses the effects of
engine timing with piston changes.
>
> IE: My lycoming (aerosport really) has 9:1 pistons and the data plate still shows
stock 20 timing. I have one LSE and one mag. Im considering tweaking my
mag timing for the 9:1 pistons and see if I can smooth out the engine a bit
more.
>
> But before I do, Id like to educate myself with reputable information.
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Engine timing |
Although 9:1 isn't really that much higher compression, what I can tell you
is that with an increase in timing, 25 degrees, you will have higher cht's
.Don McDonald
From: Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com>
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 3:02 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Engine timing
Does anyone know of a website or YouTube video that discusses the effects o
f engine timing with piston changes.=C2-
IE: My lycoming (aerosport really) has 9:1 pistons and the data plate still
shows stock 20=C2=B0 timing.=C2- I have one LSE and one mag.=C2- I
=99m considering tweaking my mag timing for the 9:1 pistons and see if I
can smooth out the engine a bit more.
But before I do, I=99d like to educate myself with reputable informat
ion.
Thanks,
Phil
S -
WIKI -
-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Engine timing |
Yes, advancing timing would be the wrong way to go. Would run hotter and
have less detonation margin. If anything, it might take backing off to
perhaps 18 degrees.
On 10/23/2017 2:20 PM, Don McDonald wrote:
> Although 9:1 isn't really that much higher compression, what I can tell
> you is that with an increase in timing, 25 degrees, you will have higher
> cht's.
> Don McDonald
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com>
> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
> *Sent:* Monday, October 23, 2017 3:02 PM
> *Subject:* RV10-List: Engine timing
>
> <mailto:philperry9@gmail.com>>
>
> Does anyone know of a website or YouTube video that discusses the
> effects of engine timing with piston changes.
>
> IE: My lycoming (aerosport really) has 9:1 pistons and the data plate
> still shows stock 20 timing. I have one LSE and one mag. Im
> considering tweaking my mag timing for the 9:1 pistons and see if I can
> smooth out the engine a bit more.
>
> But before I do, Id like to educate myself with reputable information.
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> http://wiki.matronics.com
> http://www.matron==
>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Engine timing |
If you want to learn about how to properly run your engine (ROP, LOP, TIming, the
Red Box, etc) check out the people at GAMI and their Advanced Pilot seminars.
They have a weekend class that is amazing but most of the information is covered
in their on-line seminar.
AdvancedPilot.com
It's well worth the price of admission if you truly want to know the facts (and
fallacies) about managing EGT, CHT, timing, and electronic ignitions.
Highly recommended.
Nick
--------
Nick Leonard
RV-10 (40015) Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=473830#473830
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Engine timing |
I am no expert on this issue, but the people that built my engine are and have
been producing reliable high performance engines for years. Barrett Precision
Engines built my engine with their own cold air induction system, 9-1 pistons,
Airflow Performance FM300 throttle body, Superior bearings and cylinders. and
Bendix mags. They dataplate they put on it specifies timing at 25 degrees before
top dead center. It came in at 288hp on the dyno. I have no idea what the
Lycoming Manual says about this, but then it is no longer a stock Lycoming
Robert Jones
> On Oct 23, 2017, at 17:06, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote:
>
>
> Yes, advancing timing would be the wrong way to go. Would run hotter and have
less detonation margin. If anything, it might take backing off to perhaps 18
degrees.
>
>> On 10/23/2017 2:20 PM, Don McDonald wrote:
>> Although 9:1 isn't really that much higher compression, what I can tell you
is that with an increase in timing, 25 degrees, you will have higher cht's.
>> Don McDonald
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> *From:* Phillip Perry <philperry9@gmail.com>
>> *To:* rv10-list@matronics.com
>> *Sent:* Monday, October 23, 2017 3:02 PM
>> *Subject:* RV10-List: Engine timing
>> Does anyone know of a website or YouTube video that discusses the effects of
engine timing with piston changes.
>> IE: My lycoming (aerosport really) has 9:1 pistons and the data plate still
shows stock 20 timing. I have one LSE and one mag. Im considering tweaking my
mag timing for the 9:1 pistons and see if I can smooth out the engine a bit
more.
>> But before I do, Id like to educate myself with reputable information.
>> Thanks,
>> Phil
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> http://wiki.matronics.com
>> http://www.matron==
>
>
>
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