Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 11:14 AM - Re: Flap Controller (Tim Olson)
2. 01:25 PM - Re: Flap Controller (Thomas Mason)
3. 01:53 PM - Re: Flap Controller (Bob Turner)
4. 02:09 PM - Re: Re: Flap Controller (Tim Olson)
5. 03:59 PM - Re: Flap Controller (Bob Turner)
6. 04:21 PM - Re: Re: Flap Controller (Dave Saylor)
7. 04:33 PM - Re: Re: Flap Controller (Lenny Iszak)
8. 08:23 PM - Re: Flap Controller (Bob Turner)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
I've been meaning to reply to this one but just catching up.
I may have dated info, but, I'm pretty sure I have the Showplanes
system, and I think that *was* the Van's
system when I was building in 2004-2006. So it caught me off guard that
you are differentiating
between a Van's system and Showplanes system. Was there another
generation of systems that I
don't remember?
Mine is Showplanes, sent with my kit at the time, and does shut off when
the flaps are all the way up or down.
I know there was that other similar system that came out that I saw on
VAF a couple years ago,
and that was basically very similar with maybe an improved motor or
something. I think it was sold by
Pat Hatch if I remember right? Is that now the Van's system?
Tim
On 1/20/2023 10:02 PM, Dave Saylor wrote:
> I flew for the first few years with just the switch and some hash
> marks on the flap. Like Tim said, it's easy to look out the window.
>
> Partnership duties required I install the Showplanes system. It works
> pretty well but it's more complicated and not as reliable and for me
> it doesn't really provide any additional assistance. But the others
> like it so it'll stay. It's been there for 10+ years now and every now
> and then it indicates incorrectly and gets "stuck", usually in the
> zero position. Then you have to run it a couple times til the micro
> switch goes back to the desired position. This has happened a handful
> of times in maybe 1000 hours. So not a huge problem.
>
> The showplanes system does shut off the flap motor when the flaps are
> full up. IIRC the motor continues to run (harmlessly) with the Van's
> system. So again not a huge advantage. If I did it again I'd just
> keep the Van's system.
>
> --Dave
>
> On Fri, Jan 20, 2023 at 4:33 AM werner schneider <glastar@gmx.net> wrote:
>
>
> I need to pull the knowledge of the community ;)
>
> If you have neither a Garmin panel (GAD27), nor a VPX or an
> Advanced AFS Module, what do you use for the flaps?
>
> - visual controll via an up/down switch ?
> - the display on teh EFIS showing you position of the flaps via an
> up/down switch ?
> - a controller for fixed position via an up/down switch?
> - ???
>
> Thanks for your help
>
> Werner (finishing after a 10 yrs break)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509976#509976
>
>
> ==========
> -List" rel="noreferrer"
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> ==========
> FORUMS -
> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> WIKI -
> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ==========
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> ="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://matronics.com/contribution
> ==========
>
>
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |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Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
Tim,
By 2008 the Showplanes flap controller was an extra cost option (it may have been
available directly from Vans?). The no-extra cost system was simply a switch
which continuously ran the flaps, up or down, as selected.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510073#510073
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
Thanks Bob, that's interesting. I wasn't aware that it got that
stripped down at one point.
Tim
On 1/30/2023 3:53 PM, Bob Turner wrote:
>
> Tim,
> By 2008 the Showplanes flap controller was an extra cost option (it may have
been available directly from Vans?). The no-extra cost system was simply a switch
which continuously ran the flaps, up or down, as selected.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510073#510073
>
>
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
bwestfall wrote:
> Many people install a Ray Allen POS-12 position sensor attached somewhere on
> a flap bar to measure the extension points and report to your efis. I did
> this but cannot find a picture. The POS-12 is connected to my VP-X which
> controls flap movement. Basically I used a short piece of hinge material
> riveted to the rear spar bulkhead assembly on one end and an adel clamp
> around the flap torque tube with a small piece of angle bracket attaching to
> the other end. This is all under the passenger side flap torque tube cover
> in the rear footwell on my plane. It just barely has enough travel to work.
> It has been mostly reliable but occasionally I have to hit the down switch
> more than once to get it to move down.
>
> -Ben
> --
If you think about exactly where (in rotation) you attach the POS sensor to the
torque tube, you can maximize the sensitivity to the smallest movement (-3 to
zero flaps). Also, I've trained myself to hod the switch down for a 1/2 a second
or a bit longer. A very quick push and release is not long enough for the
flap sensor to move off the "bump" in the position sensing rigid wire. I suppose
a small electronic timer could fix this, but I don't want to add any complexity.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510076#510076
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
>
>
> I've trained myself to hod the switch down for a 1/2 a second or a bit
> longer.
Same here. I learned to do a deliberate one-count at each position.
=====
>
>
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
It=99s good to have automatic position control. At night you can
=99t see the
flaps, so you=99d be counting mississippis. :) In a takeoff emergency
you
don=99t have time to fiddle with the flaps. Best lift/drag ratio is a
round 15
degrees of flaps on the RV-10. Don=99t think you=99ll be able t
o move it
exactly there in an emergency. With a positioner one click and you=99
re there.
I bought the Showplanes version (not from Van=99s), but wasn=99
t thrilled with
the microswitch based approach. Too many points of failure for my taste. I
have an Arduino based flap controller that=99s been working great for
900+
hours.
Btw, TCW now sells a flap controller that has a positioning feature without
a position sensor and it=99s got Vfe protection too. If I was to do i
t again,
I=99d install that now.
https://www.tcwtech.com/product/intelligent-flap-controller/
Lenny
On Jan 30, 2023 at 6:58:58 PM, Bob Turner <bobturner@alum.rpi.edu> wrote:
>
>
> bwestfall wrote:
>
> Many people install a Ray Allen POS-12 position sensor attached somewhere
> on
>
> a flap bar to measure the extension points and report to your efis. I di
d
>
> this but cannot find a picture. The POS-12 is connected to my VP-X which
>
> controls flap movement. Basically I used a short piece of hinge material
>
> riveted to the rear spar bulkhead assembly on one end and an adel clamp
>
> around the flap torque tube with a small piece of angle bracket attaching
> to
>
> the other end. This is all under the passenger side flap torque tube cov
er
>
> in the rear footwell on my plane. It just barely has enough travel to
> work.
>
> It has been mostly reliable but occasionally I have to hit the down switc
h
>
> more than once to get it to move down.
>
>
> -Ben
>
> --
>
>
> If you think about exactly where (in rotation) you attach the POS sensor
> to the torque tube, you can maximize the sensitivity to the smallest
> movement (-3 to zero flaps). Also, I've trained myself to hod the switch
> down for a 1/2 a second or a bit longer. A very quick push and release is
> not long enough for the flap sensor to move off the "bump" in the positio
n
> sensing rigid wire. I suppose a small electronic timer could fix this, bu
t
> I don't want to add any complexity.
>
> --------
> Bob Turner
> RV-10 QB
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510076#510076
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flap Controller |
Lenny Iszak wrote:
> . Best lift/drag ratio is around 15 degrees of flaps on the RV-10.
> Lenny
>
Do you have a reference or data to back up this assertion? If true, we should all
be practicing engine-out best glide with flaps 15.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510079#510079
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|