---------------------------------------------------------- RV3-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 02/09/04: 3 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:33 PM - Re: Sensenich propellors (Johnny Johnson) 2. 07:59 PM - Re: Sensenich propellors (rob ray) 3. 08:14 PM - Re: Sensenich propellors (Arvil) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:33:17 PM PST US From: "Johnny Johnson" Subject: RE: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: "Johnny Johnson" If a person is going to have a fixed-pitch prop, I would feel comfortable recommending the Sensenich... the 2600 rpm limit on the O320 prop is a bit of a bummer tho. I have not flown a wooden prop on this--or any other fast--airplane so don't know how wood compares in performance & smoothness. The prop was the standard 70 x 81 when I bought the airplane. IMHO adding 1" in pitch without trimming (or, for a bit more bite, trimming an inch and adding 2" in pitch) makes it a better match than the standard for a 160 hp RV-3 if one really wants to nit-pick. The prop as it comes is actually OK and will give a little bit better low-end performance than mine so it probably isn't worth messing with. The RV series has such a broad range between stall and redline that I believe they really ought to have a controllable prop. My prop now reaches redline about when the airframe does on the deck so for what I do most of, it is pitched about right... but I can only get 2250 static. Takeoff & climbout are still OK, but what a blast it would be to have all the HP pulling from the time you release the brakes... for that reason, I will likely be putting on an MT electric. Johnny Johnson 49MM RV-3A O320-160 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rob ray Subject: RE: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: rob ray How do you like the prop now? After years of trashing wood props in rain, I am looking at the sensy or really taking the plunge with an MT electric... RR Johnny Johnson wrote: --> RV3-List message posted by: "Johnny Johnson" It's the legal 70 x 81 cut off 1" and repitched 2", the work was done per Sensenich guidelines by a prop shop in Boise, ID. 81" was not enough pitch, and the engine was 150 hp then. 69 x 83 seems about right for 160 hp. Thanks for pointing out about the perils--very real perils--of severely repitched Piper/Cessna/et al props... that is a no-no of the most extreme nature, it is true. I should have been more specific in the original post. Johnny Johnson -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Bauer Jr Subject: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: "Fred Bauer Jr" On a recent post [JJ] describing an RV3 with a 160 HP Lycoming we notice that the Sensenich propeller was a 69 dia X 83 pitch. We do not see where Sensenich and Van's offers that combination propeller, the RV3 propeller Van's recommends is the Sensenich 70 dia X 81 pitch. If the 69X83 Sensenich is a cut down 74DM propeller or another cut down version of the Sensenich BE CAREFUL !!!!!!!!!!!!! John Thorp, the T-18 designer, went through a very detailed and complete vibration analysis after several fatal accidents with his T-18 design which involved using the cut down propellers. His conclusion was that the cut down propellers will fail! NOT IF, THEY WILL FAIL I have never had a propeller fail on me so I may not know what I am talking about but I can read and I can understand what I have read. --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:59:26 PM PST US From: rob ray Subject: RE: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: rob ray Johnny; I have flown no less than 5 different props on my 150 HP RV4. I have found in 1100 hours that all FP props are a compromise especially during high density altitude climbs.I also found I spend 30% of my flying time climbing. I get decent all round performance with my Margie Warnke claw but Jim Ayers has planted the MT bug. After seeing his RV3 at OSH I think the improvement would add performance and value. Hey it's only money... I am visiting MT props in Deland FL tomorrow to look at an MT electric.... Rob Ray Johnny Johnson wrote: --> RV3-List message posted by: "Johnny Johnson" If a person is going to have a fixed-pitch prop, I would feel comfortable recommending the Sensenich... the 2600 rpm limit on the O320 prop is a bit of a bummer tho. I have not flown a wooden prop on this--or any other fast--airplane so don't know how wood compares in performance & smoothness. The prop was the standard 70 x 81 when I bought the airplane. IMHO adding 1" in pitch without trimming (or, for a bit more bite, trimming an inch and adding 2" in pitch) makes it a better match than the standard for a 160 hp RV-3 if one really wants to nit-pick. The prop as it comes is actually OK and will give a little bit better low-end performance than mine so it probably isn't worth messing with. The RV series has such a broad range between stall and redline that I believe they really ought to have a controllable prop. My prop now reaches redline about when the airframe does on the deck so for what I do most of, it is pitched about right... but I can only get 2250 static. Takeoff & climbout are still OK, but what a blast it would be to have all the HP pulling from the time you release the brakes... for that reason, I will likely be putting on an MT electric. Johnny Johnson 49MM RV-3A O320-160 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rob ray Subject: RE: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: rob ray How do you like the prop now? After years of trashing wood props in rain, I am looking at the sensy or really taking the plunge with an MT electric... RR Johnny Johnson wrote: --> RV3-List message posted by: "Johnny Johnson" It's the legal 70 x 81 cut off 1" and repitched 2", the work was done per Sensenich guidelines by a prop shop in Boise, ID. 81" was not enough pitch, and the engine was 150 hp then. 69 x 83 seems about right for 160 hp. Thanks for pointing out about the perils--very real perils--of severely repitched Piper/Cessna/et al props... that is a no-no of the most extreme nature, it is true. I should have been more specific in the original post. Johnny Johnson -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Bauer Jr Subject: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: "Fred Bauer Jr" On a recent post [JJ] describing an RV3 with a 160 HP Lycoming we notice that the Sensenich propeller was a 69 dia X 83 pitch. We do not see where Sensenich and Van's offers that combination propeller, the RV3 propeller Van's recommends is the Sensenich 70 dia X 81 pitch. If the 69X83 Sensenich is a cut down 74DM propeller or another cut down version of the Sensenich BE CAREFUL !!!!!!!!!!!!! John Thorp, the T-18 designer, went through a very detailed and complete vibration analysis after several fatal accidents with his T-18 design which involved using the cut down propellers. His conclusion was that the cut down propellers will fail! NOT IF, THEY WILL FAIL I have never had a propeller fail on me so I may not know what I am talking about but I can read and I can understand what I have read. --------------------------------- ==================================== --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:14:35 PM PST US From: Arvil Subject: Re: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors --> RV3-List message posted by: Arvil Let me know what you think of the elec. prop rob ray wrote: > --> RV3-List message posted by: rob ray > > Johnny; > > I have flown no less than 5 different props on my 150 HP RV4. I have found in 1100 hours that all FP props are a compromise especially during high density altitude climbs.I also found I spend 30% of my flying time climbing. I get decent all round performance with my Margie Warnke claw but Jim Ayers has planted the MT bug. After seeing his RV3 at OSH I think the improvement would add performance and value. Hey it's only money... > I am visiting MT props in Deland FL tomorrow to look at an MT electric.... > > Rob Ray > > Johnny Johnson wrote: > --> RV3-List message posted by: "Johnny Johnson" > > If a person is going to have a fixed-pitch prop, I would feel comfortable > recommending the Sensenich... the 2600 rpm limit on the O320 prop is a bit > of a bummer tho. I have not flown a wooden prop on this--or any other > fast--airplane so don't know how wood compares in performance & smoothness. > > The prop was the standard 70 x 81 when I bought the airplane. IMHO adding > 1" in pitch without trimming (or, for a bit more bite, trimming an inch and > adding 2" in pitch) makes it a better match than the standard for a 160 hp > RV-3 if one really wants to nit-pick. The prop as it comes is actually OK > and will give a little bit better low-end performance than mine so it > probably isn't worth messing with. > > The RV series has such a broad range between stall and redline that I > believe they really ought to have a controllable prop. My prop now reaches > redline about when the airframe does on the deck so for what I do most of, > it is pitched about right... but I can only get 2250 static. Takeoff & > climbout are still OK, but what a blast it would be to have all the HP > pulling from the time you release the brakes... for that reason, I will > likely be putting on an MT electric. > > Johnny Johnson > 49MM RV-3A O320-160 > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rob ray > To: rv3-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors > > --> RV3-List message posted by: rob ray > > How do you like the prop now? After years of trashing wood props in rain, I > am looking at the sensy or really taking the plunge with an MT electric... > > RR > > Johnny Johnson wrote: > --> RV3-List message posted by: "Johnny Johnson" > > It's the legal 70 x 81 cut off 1" and repitched 2", the work was done per > Sensenich guidelines by a prop shop in Boise, ID. 81" was not enough pitch, > and the engine was 150 hp then. 69 x 83 seems about right for 160 hp. > > Thanks for pointing out about the perils--very real perils--of severely > repitched Piper/Cessna/et al props... that is a no-no of the most extreme > nature, it is true. I should have been more specific in the original post. > > Johnny Johnson > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv3-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Bauer Jr > To: rv3-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV3-List: Sensenich propellors > > --> RV3-List message posted by: "Fred Bauer Jr" > > On a recent post [JJ] describing an RV3 with a 160 HP Lycoming we notice > that the Sensenich propeller was a 69 dia X 83 pitch. > We do not see where Sensenich and Van's offers that combination propeller, > the RV3 propeller Van's recommends is the Sensenich 70 dia X 81 pitch. > If the 69X83 Sensenich is a cut down 74DM propeller or another cut down > version of the Sensenich > BE CAREFUL !!!!!!!!!!!!! > John Thorp, the T-18 designer, went through a very detailed and complete > vibration analysis > after several fatal accidents with his T-18 design which involved using the > cut down propellers. > His conclusion was that the cut down propellers will fail! > NOT IF, > THEY WILL FAIL > I have never had a propeller fail on me so I may not know what I am talking > about but I can read and I can understand what I have read. > > --------------------------------- > > ==================================== > > --------------------------------- >