Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:24 AM - Re: RV3 builder (Bob Hodgson)
2. 11:33 AM - RV-3 aerobatic gross weight (Randy Lervold)
3. 05:45 PM - Re: Re: RV3 builder (tmc664@comcast.net)
Message 1
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--> RV3-List message posted by: "Bob Hodgson" <bob@hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk>
Hi Tom,
You must be THE expert on RV3s by now!
Two questions for you -
1) CG -
Where did the CG end up on your airplanes?
Mine has an 0-320, Ellison TBI, Pacesetter wooden prop,
lightweight starter, (semi-)lightweight alternator, wing tanks (plus a small
15 gal. fuselage tank if 'they' allow it). Slider canopy.
The structure has been fully primed and mostly sealed against our damp
weather.
Can't be sure before final weighing, but I suspect everything points to an
aft CG except for the big engine. May even balance out! As I'm now sorting
out strobe unit and battery mounts I would like to know whether to expect it
to be way nose or tail heavy before going any further . . .
2) Trim -
From what you say, it may not trim out at approach speeds with flap, and
OTOH may
need a lot of down trim at cruise with the full 1 deg of wing incidence and
zero on the tail.
How much incidence did you use?
How big did you make the trim tab?
( - just in case I decide to rebuild it yet again !?)
Thanks
Bob
(UK)
----- Original Message -----
>
> Time: 11:52:46 PM PST US
> From: tmc664@comcast.net
> Subject: >
> --> RV3-List message posted by: tmc664@comcast.net
>
> Hi all
> I used to frequent this list long ago but have since put almost 2000 hours
on two
> RV3s in the last 15 years. I built both of them and did a few uprades on
the
> second one. Nothing drastic but just a little customizing for the type of
> flying I do.
> RV3 #1170
> N978TM
> 0320 lyc pumped up to 170+ hp
> 10:1 pistons, ceramic coated
> Vetterman 4 single exhaust
> Tip over canopy
> Extended range wing fuel tanks (18 gal per side)
> Lamb tires and Klaus Zavier wheel pants
> One mag/ lightspeed EI
> Increased area on elevator trim tab
> Decreased wing angle incidence
> Adj horiz stab so 0 trim tab deflection @ 180 mph indicated
> Adj vert stab for 0 trim @ 180mph indicated
> Full aft trim gets me to best glide AS of 105 mph
> I've done some prop testing for Craig Catto
> Currently using a Catto race prop and a Performance cruise prop
> Have participated in 5 EAA cross country races from APV to WIA in the
160hp class,
> winng my fair share of them
> Been a participant in the RACE ( Rutan And Canard Enthusiassts)
performance trials
> Am a great listener to those who have made RVs go Really Really fast.
(Dave Anders
> RV4, Tracy Sailers RV6)
> I have opions on almost everthing about RV3s I've done and seen , both
good and
> BAD.
> Please contact me if you have any questions on building or flying RV3s.
> I do not pretend to be an expert but I've been there, done that on a lot
of issues.
> Happy Flying
> Tom
Message 2
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| Subject: | RV-3 aerobatic gross weight |
--> RV3-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" <randy@romeolima.com>
There has been some confusion about Aerobatic gross weight on the RV-3 ever since
the new B wings were introduced in 1998. I spoke with Van himself twice this
week on this issue, he in turn discussed with his staff internally, and have
now clarified it. Aerobatic gross weight for the RV-3 (all models, all wings)
is 1,050 lbs. (no confusion on this). This figure however does NOT include fuel
in WING tanks which is what was not clear. Note that any fuel in a fuselage
tank WOULD be included in the Aerobatic gross.
Interestingly, he confirmed that this method applies to any RV model. As an RV-8
builder/pilot I interpreted Van's W&B instructions to mean that fuel WAS included
in Aerobatic Category gross weight calculations as well as Utility/Normal
Category gross weight operation. In fact that is erroneous -- as long as the
fuel is in wing tanks it may be excluded from the Aerobatic calculation and
limit. Of course Van's points out that weight has other deleterious effects on
aerobatic handling and encourages pilots to use good judgement when loading their
aircraft for aerobatics.
I have updated the summary of all RV-3 weight & balance data and issues on my web
site...
http://www.romeolima.com/RV3works/Resources/resources.htm#WeightBalanceIssues
Informationally,
Randy Lervold
www.rv-3.com
Message 3
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--> RV3-List message posted by: tmc664@comcast.net
My RV sounds alot like yours w&b wise. I don't have the fusekage tank. My Battery
(23 lbs) is mounted right behind the firewall and my strobe power supply is
in the aft fuselage just ahead of the horizontal tail spar. Everything else
is prety much stock. Empty was 801 with paint and upholstery. The CG came in
just fine, a little fwd biased but not much. As I recall I can put 50+ lbs in
the baggage compartment and be right at aft CG with 8 gals fuel and a 170 lb
pilot.
I extended my trim tab one stiffener out in the elevator. One thing I did'nt like
about my first RV was the lack of trim range. My airplane is real happy @
180 mph indicated so I had a fellow RV fly side by side with me to monitor my
trim tab position @ 180 mph. Dont remember how much I had to chane the incidence
but a thick washer seems about right. The vertical was adjusted for feet off at
180mph in cruise. I had to offset the leading edge a lot more from center than
I thought I would. 3/16 to 1/4 inch at the leading edge as I recall. FYI.,
if you change the pitch of your fixed pi tch propelor or change to a 3 bladed
fixed prop it will change a little. Most interesting. As a new pilot to
your RV you won't notice a lot of minor things till you get dialed in with the
a/c. Thats why you'll always be changing something.
Have fun
Tom
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Bob Hodgson" <bob@hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk>
> --> RV3-List message posted by: "Bob Hodgson"
>
> Hi Tom,
> You must be THE expert on RV3s by now!
> Two questions for you -
>
> 1) CG -
> Where did the CG end up on your airplanes?
> Mine has an 0-320, Ellison TBI, Pacesetter wooden prop,
> lightweight starter, (semi-)lightweight alternator, wing tanks (plus a small
> 15 gal. fuselage tank if 'they' allow it). Slider canopy.
> The structure has been fully primed and mostly sealed against our damp
> weather.
>
> Can't be sure before final weighing, but I suspect everything points to an
> aft CG except for the big engine. May even balance out! As I'm now sorting
> out strobe unit and battery mounts I would like to know whether to expect it
> to be way nose or tail heavy before going any further . . .
>
> 2) Trim -
> From what you say, it may not trim out at approach speeds with flap, and
> OTOH may
> need a lot of down trim at cruise with the full 1 deg of wing incidence and
> zero on the tail.
> How much incidence did you use?
> How big did you make the trim tab?
> ( - just in case I decide to rebuild it yet again !?)
>
> Thanks
>
> Bob
>
> (UK)
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> >
> > Time: 11:52:46 PM PST US
> > From: tmc664@comcast.net
> > Subject: >
> > --> RV3-List message posted by: tmc664@comcast.net
> >
> > Hi all
> > I used to frequent this list long ago but have since put almost 2000 hours
> on two
> > RV3s in the last 15 years. I built both of them and did a few uprades on
> the
> > second one. Nothing drastic but just a little customizing for the type of
> > flying I do.
> > RV3 #1170
> > N978TM
> > 0320 lyc pumped up to 170+ hp
> > 10:1 pistons, ceramic coated
> > Vetterman 4 single exhaust
> > Tip over canopy
> > Extended range wing fuel tanks (18 gal per side)
> > Lamb tires and Klaus Zavier wheel pants
> > One mag/ lightspeed EI
> > Increased area on elevator trim tab
> > Decreased wing angle incidence
> > Adj horiz stab so 0 trim tab deflection @ 180 mph indicated
> > Adj vert stab for 0 trim @ 180mph indicated
> > Full aft trim gets me to best glide AS of 105 mph
> > I've done some prop testing for Craig Catto
> > Currently using a Catto race prop and a Performance cruise prop
> > Have participated in 5 EAA cross country races from APV to WIA in the
> 160hp class,
> > winng my fair share of them
> > Been a participant in the RACE ( Rutan And Canard Enthusiassts)
> performance trials
> > Am a great listener to those who have made RVs go Really Really fast.
> (Dave Anders
> > RV4, Tracy Sailers RV6)
> > I have opions on almost everthing about RV3s I've done and seen , both
> good and
> > BAD.
> > Please contact me if you have any questions on building or flying RV3s.
> > I do not pretend to be an expert but I've been there, done that on a lot
> of issues.
> > Happy Flying
> > Tom
>
>
>
>
>
>
My RV sounds alot like yours wb wise. I don't have the fusekage tank. My Battery
(23 lbs) is mounted right behind the firewall and my strobe power supply is
in the aft fuselage just ahead of the horizontal tail spar. Everything else is
prety much stock. Empty was 801 with paint and upholstery. The CG came in just
fine, a little fwd biased but not much. As I recall I can put 50+ lbs in the
baggage compartment and be right at aft CG with 8 gals fuel and a 170 lb pilot.
I extended my trim tab one stiffener out in the elevator. One thing I did'nt like
about my first RV was the lack of trim range. My airplane is real happy @ 180
mph indicated so I had a fellow RV fly side by side with me to monitor my trim
tab position @ 180 mph. Dont remember how much I had to chane the incidence
but a thick washer seems about right. The vertical was adjusted for feet off at
180mph in cruise. I had to offset the leading edge a lot more from center than
I thought I would. 3/16 to 1/4 inch at the leading edge as I recall. FYI., if
you change the pitch of your fixed pi tchpropelor or change to a 3 bladed fixed
prop it will change a little. Most interesting. As a new pilot to your RV
you won't notice a lot of minor things till you get dialed in with the a/c. Thats
why you'll always be changing something.
Have fun
Tom
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Bob Hodgson" bob@hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk
-- RV3-List message posted by: "Bob Hodgson" <BOB@HODGSON252.FREESERVE.CO.UK>
Hi Tom,
You must be THE expert on RV3s by now!
Two questions for you -
1) CG -
Where did the CG end up on your airplanes?
Mine has an 0-320, Ellison TBI, Pacesetter wooden prop,
lightweight starter, (semi-)lightweight alternator, wing tanks (plus a small
15 gal. fuselage tank if 'they' allow it). Slider canopy.
The structure has been fully primed and mostly sealed against our damp
weather.
Can't be sure before final weighing, but I suspect everything points to an
aft CG except for the big engine. May even balance out! As I'm now sorting
out strobe
unit and battery mounts I would like to know whether to expect it
to be way nose or tail heavy before going any further . . .
2) Trim -
From what you say, it may not trim out at approach speeds with flap, and
OTOH may
need a lot of down trim at cruise with the full 1 deg of wing incidence and
zero on the tail.
How much incidence did you use?
How big did you make the trim tab?
( - just in case I decide to rebuild it yet again !?)
Thanks
Bob
(UK)
----- Original Message -----
Time: 11:52:46 PM PST US
From: tmc664@comcast.net
Subject:
-- RV3-List message posted by: tmc664@comcast.net
Hi all
I used to frequent this list long ago but have since put almost 2000 hours
on two
>
; RV3s in the last 15 years. I built both of them and did a few uprades on
the
second one. Nothing drastic but just a little customizing for the type of
flying I do.
RV3 #1170
N978TM
0320 lyc pumped up to 170+ hp
10:1 pistons, ceramic coated
Vetterman 4 single exhaust
Tip over canopy
Extended range wing fuel tanks (18 gal per side)
Lamb tires and Klaus Zavier wheel pants
One mag/ lightspeed EI
Increased area on elevator trim tab
Decreased wing angle incidence
Adj horiz stab so 0 trim tab deflection @ 180 mph indicated
Adj vert stab for 0 trim @ 180mph indicated
Full aft trim gets me to best glide AS of 105 mph
I've done some prop testing for Craig Catto
Currently using a Catto race prop and a Performance cruise prop <B
R> Have participated in 5 EAA cross country races from APV to WIA in the
160hp class,
winng my fair share of them
Been a participant in the RACE ( Rutan And Canard Enthusiassts)
performance trials
Am a great listener to those who have made RVs go Really Really fast.
(Dave Anders
RV4, Tracy Sailers RV6)
I have opions on almost everthing about RV3s I've done and seen , both
good and
BAD.
Please contact me if you have any questions on building or flying RV3s.
I do not pretend to be an expert but I've been there, done that on a lot
of issues.
Happy Flying
Tom
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