Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 09:06 AM - Fw: 020 empenage skins (Steve Sampson)
2. 09:59 AM - Re: Fw: 020 empenage skins (rob ray)
3. 11:02 AM - Re: Fw: 020 empenage skins (Steve Sampson)
4. 02:47 PM - Re: Fw: 020 empenage skins (Steve Schlieper)
Message 1
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| Subject: | 020 empenage skins |
--> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Rob / others - this was a really useful email in terms of what you would build
if you were doing it over. Today I got to thinking what would you do differently.
(For instance do any aspects of the U/C become loose over time and you wished
you had used taper bolts in the first place?) Just trying to make sure I get
it as near to right first time as possible.
Thanks, Steve.
#4478
----- Original Message -----
From: "rob ray" <smokyray@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 12:53 AM
Subject: Re: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
> --> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray <smokyray@yahoo.com>
>
> Steve,
> There is a reason the RV8 and beyond use .020, it's stronger. My 1500 hour RV4
has cracks in the rudder, one place I wish I had .020. The weight penalty isn't
that much and using RTV is not recommended as temperature changes can affect
it's elasticity. The .020 skins from Van's are reasonably priced and pre-bent,
just tell them what you want.
> Wish list: If I had it to do over I would have .020 tail feathers and .040 forward
fuselage skins all the way back to the 1st aft bulkhead (HRII), RV6 wing
tanks or the Hotel Whiskey tanks, hopped up 160HP by LyCon and Aerocomposites
C/S prop, shear wingtips, pre-preg cowling...etc.
> OK, mine still isn't bad like it is, stock and light, 175HP 0-320, wood/composite
FP prop and 950# lbs empty. Hindsight is always 20/20...
>
> Rob Ray
>
> Steve Sampson <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu> wrote:
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
>
> Is there any concensus as to the need for 020 skins on the empenage? I understand
it is an option, but its also weight at the back. Does RTV on the ribs solve
the problem with 016/
>
> Thanks, Steve.
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: 020 empenage skins |
--> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray <smokyray@yahoo.com>
Hi Steve,
Haven't had any issues with the u/c bolts so far. I replaced all my control
surface hardware at 1000 hours. Showed very little wear but I lubricate them
regularly with LPS 2. (sold in several places including Acft Spruce). The one
thing I do have is cracks in the lower rudder skins between the rivets, none
so far on the elevator. Rather than make a new rudder out of .020, I stopdrilled
the cracks and used HySol and a round .016 patch clamped on overnight over
the area. Once the HySol cured, it looks bulletproof. I can always make a rudder
later, too busy flying it right now...Van's sells .020 skins for the RV4 control
surfaces pre-bent...
Someday when Van's has forgotten the RV4 completely and all he sells is (trainers)
7A and 9A and 10's, (which is getting close by looking at completions),
I may try to buy the rights to the RV4 and make a pre-drilled and quickbuild
kit...just thinking out loud...
Good Luck!
RR
Steve Sampson <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu> wrote:
--> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
Rob / others - this was a really useful email in terms of what you would build
if you were doing it over. Today I got to thinking what would you do differently.
(For instance do any aspects of the U/C become loose over time and you wished
you had used taper bolts in the first place?) Just trying to make sure I get
it as near to right first time as possible.
Thanks, Steve.
#4478
----- Original Message -----
From: "rob ray"
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 12:53 AM
Subject: Re: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
> --> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray
>
> Steve,
> There is a reason the RV8 and beyond use .020, it's stronger. My 1500 hour RV4
has cracks in the rudder, one place I wish I had .020. The weight penalty isn't
that much and using RTV is not recommended as temperature changes can affect
it's elasticity. The .020 skins from Van's are reasonably priced and pre-bent,
just tell them what you want.
> Wish list: If I had it to do over I would have .020 tail feathers and .040 forward
fuselage skins all the way back to the 1st aft bulkhead (HRII), RV6 wing
tanks or the Hotel Whiskey tanks, hopped up 160HP by LyCon and Aerocomposites
C/S prop, shear wingtips, pre-preg cowling...etc.
> OK, mine still isn't bad like it is, stock and light, 175HP 0-320, wood/composite
FP prop and 950# lbs empty. Hindsight is always 20/20...
>
> Rob Ray
>
> Steve Sampson wrote:
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
>
> Is there any concensus as to the need for 020 skins on the empenage? I understand
it is an option, but its also weight at the back. Does RTV on the ribs solve
the problem with 016/
>
> Thanks, Steve.
>
>
---------------------------------
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Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: 020 empenage skins |
--> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Thanks Rob. I'll just do what the book says then. I went the 020 skins as
you advised although I have the standard forward fuse skins. I am waiting
for the XP-320 to be announced - not long now - and will put a 2 blade MT
on. It sounds as though the way the -4 bolts together is pretty well
debugged. The nosedragger -7 & 9 that is certainlty not the case. Lots of
problems with the nosewheel - both the bolting together and the design. On
soft ground its an accident waiting to happen. Boring to fly though even if
quick.
My mail was prompted by the Rocket construction notes where I saw all sorts
of assembly issues causing a problem in later life (the aeroplanes) and
thought I should enquire at this stage. I guess it is lighter and therefore
less hard on itself.
One thing which I find ugly on the -4 is the way the shoulder PAX seat belts
attach to the upper skin. The -9 and I presume 6 and 8 approach seems
better. But I am going the standard route.
A couple of questions. Do you think it is acceptable to put a little door in
the foot step F-428 to keep small loose articles in? Is this sometimes done?
Also, what is your thought about putting the PAX 5th harness point around
the flap drive. There was a picture of that on VAF last week.
Cheers, Steve.
----- Original Message -----
From: "rob ray" <smokyray@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2006 5:58 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
> --> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray <smokyray@yahoo.com>
>
> Hi Steve,
> Haven't had any issues with the u/c bolts so far. I replaced all my
> control surface hardware at 1000 hours. Showed very little wear but I
> lubricate them regularly with LPS 2. (sold in several places including
> Acft Spruce). The one thing I do have is cracks in the lower rudder skins
> between the rivets, none so far on the elevator. Rather than make a new
> rudder out of .020, I stopdrilled the cracks and used HySol and a round
> .016 patch clamped on overnight over the area. Once the HySol cured, it
> looks bulletproof. I can always make a rudder later, too busy flying it
> right now...Van's sells .020 skins for the RV4 control surfaces
> pre-bent...
> Someday when Van's has forgotten the RV4 completely and all he sells is
> (trainers) 7A and 9A and 10's, (which is getting close by looking at
> completions), I may try to buy the rights to the RV4 and make a
> pre-drilled and quickbuild kit...just thinking out loud...
> Good Luck!
>
> RR
>
> Steve Sampson <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu> wrote:
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
>
> Rob / others - this was a really useful email in terms of what you would
> build if you were doing it over. Today I got to thinking what would you do
> differently. (For instance do any aspects of the U/C become loose over
> time and you wished you had used taper bolts in the first place?) Just
> trying to make sure I get it as near to right first time as possible.
>
> Thanks, Steve.
> #4478
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "rob ray"
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 12:53 AM
> Subject: Re: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
>
>
>> --> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray
>>
>> Steve,
>> There is a reason the RV8 and beyond use .020, it's stronger. My 1500
>> hour RV4 has cracks in the rudder, one place I wish I had .020. The
>> weight penalty isn't that much and using RTV is not recommended as
>> temperature changes can affect it's elasticity. The .020 skins from Van's
>> are reasonably priced and pre-bent, just tell them what you want.
>> Wish list: If I had it to do over I would have .020 tail feathers and
>> .040 forward fuselage skins all the way back to the 1st aft bulkhead
>> (HRII), RV6 wing tanks or the Hotel Whiskey tanks, hopped up 160HP by
>> LyCon and Aerocomposites C/S prop, shear wingtips, pre-preg
>> cowling...etc.
>> OK, mine still isn't bad like it is, stock and light, 175HP 0-320,
>> wood/composite FP prop and 950# lbs empty. Hindsight is always 20/20...
>>
>> Rob Ray
>>
>> Steve Sampson wrote:
>> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
>>
>> Is there any concensus as to the need for 020 skins on the empenage? I
>> understand it is an option, but its also weight at the back. Does RTV on
>> the ribs solve the problem with 016/
>>
>> Thanks, Steve.
>>
>>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Find great deals to the top 10 hottest destinations!
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
>
> This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System
> on behalf of the London Business School community.
> For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email
> ______________________________________________________________________
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>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: 020 empenage skins |
--> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Schlieper" <splitess@suscom-maine.net>
Anyone responding to that fuel tank pick-uptube/b-nut safety wiring bulletin
on Van's website? I looked at it real hard and talked to my local A&P. He
though it was nuts. There are B-nuts all over the AC that never seem to go
bad. Plus you'll potentially do more damage to the tank lid tyring to get
the sealer and gasket off to retrofit. Try as you might to clean it up
you'll get little flecks of sealer floating in your fuel for years.
Steve Schlieper
Topsham, Maine
N16FB at IWI
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2006 2:01 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
> <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
> Thanks Rob. I'll just do what the book says then. I went the 020 skins as
> you advised although I have the standard forward fuse skins. I am waiting
> for the XP-320 to be announced - not long now - and will put a 2 blade MT
> on. It sounds as though the way the -4 bolts together is pretty well
> debugged. The nosedragger -7 & 9 that is certainlty not the case. Lots of
> problems with the nosewheel - both the bolting together and the design. On
> soft ground its an accident waiting to happen. Boring to fly though even
> if
> quick.
>
> My mail was prompted by the Rocket construction notes where I saw all
> sorts
> of assembly issues causing a problem in later life (the aeroplanes) and
> thought I should enquire at this stage. I guess it is lighter and
> therefore
> less hard on itself.
>
> One thing which I find ugly on the -4 is the way the shoulder PAX seat
> belts
> attach to the upper skin. The -9 and I presume 6 and 8 approach seems
> better. But I am going the standard route.
>
> A couple of questions. Do you think it is acceptable to put a little door
> in
> the foot step F-428 to keep small loose articles in? Is this sometimes
> done?
> Also, what is your thought about putting the PAX 5th harness point around
> the flap drive. There was a picture of that on VAF last week.
>
> Cheers, Steve.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "rob ray" <smokyray@yahoo.com>
> To: <rv4-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2006 5:58 PM
> Subject: Re: Fw: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
>
>
>> --> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray <smokyray@yahoo.com>
>>
>> Hi Steve,
>> Haven't had any issues with the u/c bolts so far. I replaced all my
>> control surface hardware at 1000 hours. Showed very little wear but I
>> lubricate them regularly with LPS 2. (sold in several places including
>> Acft Spruce). The one thing I do have is cracks in the lower rudder skins
>> between the rivets, none so far on the elevator. Rather than make a new
>> rudder out of .020, I stopdrilled the cracks and used HySol and a round
>> .016 patch clamped on overnight over the area. Once the HySol cured, it
>> looks bulletproof. I can always make a rudder later, too busy flying it
>> right now...Van's sells .020 skins for the RV4 control surfaces
>> pre-bent...
>> Someday when Van's has forgotten the RV4 completely and all he sells
>> is
>> (trainers) 7A and 9A and 10's, (which is getting close by looking at
>> completions), I may try to buy the rights to the RV4 and make a
>> pre-drilled and quickbuild kit...just thinking out loud...
>> Good Luck!
>>
>> RR
>>
>> Steve Sampson <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu> wrote:
>> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
>>
>> Rob / others - this was a really useful email in terms of what you would
>> build if you were doing it over. Today I got to thinking what would you
>> do
>> differently. (For instance do any aspects of the U/C become loose over
>> time and you wished you had used taper bolts in the first place?) Just
>> trying to make sure I get it as near to right first time as possible.
>>
>> Thanks, Steve.
>> #4478
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "rob ray"
>> To:
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 12:53 AM
>> Subject: Re: RV4-List: 020 empenage skins
>>
>>
>>> --> RV4-List message posted by: rob ray
>>>
>>> Steve,
>>> There is a reason the RV8 and beyond use .020, it's stronger. My 1500
>>> hour RV4 has cracks in the rudder, one place I wish I had .020. The
>>> weight penalty isn't that much and using RTV is not recommended as
>>> temperature changes can affect it's elasticity. The .020 skins from
>>> Van's
>>> are reasonably priced and pre-bent, just tell them what you want.
>>> Wish list: If I had it to do over I would have .020 tail feathers and
>>> .040 forward fuselage skins all the way back to the 1st aft bulkhead
>>> (HRII), RV6 wing tanks or the Hotel Whiskey tanks, hopped up 160HP by
>>> LyCon and Aerocomposites C/S prop, shear wingtips, pre-preg
>>> cowling...etc.
>>> OK, mine still isn't bad like it is, stock and light, 175HP 0-320,
>>> wood/composite FP prop and 950# lbs empty. Hindsight is always 20/20...
>>>
>>> Rob Ray
>>>
>>> Steve Sampson wrote:
>>> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
>>>
>>> Is there any concensus as to the need for 020 skins on the empenage? I
>>> understand it is an option, but its also weight at the back. Does RTV on
>>> the ribs solve the problem with 016/
>>>
>>> Thanks, Steve.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>> Find great deals to the top 10 hottest destinations!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>
>> This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System
>> on behalf of the London Business School community.
>> For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email
>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>
>
>
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