Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 09:10 AM - Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 Lycoming O-320 (George Nielsen)
2. 09:28 AM - Re: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 Lycoming O-320 (Stein Bruch)
3. 01:36 PM - Re: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 Lycoming O-320 (Charlie England)
4. 02:04 PM - Re: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 Lycoming O-320 (Stein Bruch)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 Lycoming |
O-320
As I possess a Van's RV-6 with a Lycoming O-320 which has never flown
aerobatics and whose fuel and lubrication systems are not adapted to
this purpose I would be grateful if you could enlighten me on the following:
* What modifications are necessary for the carburettor for aerobatics,
whether it can be modified or needs replacement
* How can a Christen oil system be installed for lubrication for
aerobatics
* Which companies in Europe can do such modifications or upgrading
* Approximately how much would such modifications/upgrading cost (just
in case you have any idea, as I can ask any qualified companies myself).
This is sent both in the RV-6 and Lycoming lists.
Thanks.
Kind regards,
George Nielsen
RV-6 PH-XGN
The Hague, the Netherlands
Message 2
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| Subject: | Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 Lycoming |
O-320
Hi George,
Having done this on RV6's several time ourselves, I can tell you it's not
too bad. Here are the details:
1) Carb - you can't use a standard "carb" unless you get a "pressure
carb". Preferred method is just to use fuel injection. Remember wither you
use a pressure carb or FI, you'll need a flop tube in one of the fuel tanks.
Vans used to have a kit for that.
2) The Christen/Raven/Clone type systems are easily installed. You
need to put a pickup in the sump, put a pickup on the vent (accessory case),
then mount the ball valve and breather can as well as route the hoses.
3) I have no idea who in Europe would do that, but I'd contact someone
in the Aerobatic community (or IAC clubs). They would know.
4) No clue on cost.
Cheers,
Stein
From: owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of George Nielsen
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2015 11:09 AM
Subject: RV6-List: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6
Lycoming O-320
As I possess a Van's RV-6 with a Lycoming O-320 which has never flown
aerobatics and whose fuel and lubrication systems are not adapted to this
purpose I would be grateful if you could enlighten me on the following:
* What modifications are necessary for the carburettor for aerobatics,
whether it can be modified or needs replacement
* How can a Christen oil system be installed for lubrication for
aerobatics
* Which companies in Europe can do such modifications or upgrading
* Approximately how much would such modifications/upgrading cost (just
in case you have any idea, as I can ask any qualified companies myself).
This is sent both in the RV-6 and Lycoming lists.
Thanks.
Kind regards,
George Nielsen
RV-6 PH-XGN
The Hague, the Netherlands
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 |
Lycoming O-320
George,
You might want to define your actual 'mission' before doing any mods to
the plane. I've flown lots of positive G acro in a Globe Swift that had
fuel injection, but no flop tube and no inverted oil system. I've also
flown lots of positive G acro in two different carburated RV-4's without
flop tubes or inverted systems. As long as you're doing 'positive'
maneuvers (inside loops, rolls, barrel rolls, wingovers, etc) you don't
really need to do any mods to the plane. The only real issue would be
that the engine will almost certainly quit (but is easily restarted) if
you do 'hammerhead' turns.
If you really want to do sustained inverted flight and/or 'outside'
(negative G) maneuvers, then you need all the stuff that Stein details.
But, most of the serious acro guys I've talked to do not consider an RV
the best platform for 'outside' stuff (non-symmetrical airfoil, -3G
rating, etc). And if you are inexperienced in acro, the RV may not be
the best learning platform; it's so 'clean' that when (not if) you mess
up and fall out of a maneuver, you can go way over VNE really quickly
before recovering. And even if you don't exceed VNE, you'll still be
going fast enough to risk breaking something during the recovery. Older
designs like the Citabria/Decathalon are dirty enough that it's harder
to go fast enough to over-stress them (but not impossible, of course).
If the rules in your country require 'full' acro equipment to legally do
any acro, then you can disregard the above (except the operational
cautions...).
FWIW,
Charlie
On 9/28/2015 11:28 AM, Stein Bruch wrote:
>
> Hi George,
>
> Having done this on RV6s several time ourselves, I can tell you its
> not too bad. Here are the details:
>
> 1)Carb you cant use a standard carb unless you get a pressure
> carb. Preferred method is just to use fuel injection. Remember wither
> you use a pressure carb or FI, youll need a flop tube in one of the
> fuel tanks. Vans used to have a kit for that.
>
> 2)The Christen/Raven/Clone type systems are easily installed. You
> need to put a pickup in the sump, put a pickup on the vent (accessory
> case), then mount the ball valve and breather can as well as route the
> hoses.
>
> 3)I have no idea who in Europe would do that, but Id contact someone
> in the Aerobatic community (or IAC clubs). They would know.
>
> 4)No clue on cost
>
> Cheers,
>
> Stein
>
> *From:*owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *George Nielsen
> *Sent:* Monday, September 28, 2015 11:09 AM
> *To:* rv6-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RV6-List: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for
> RV-6 Lycoming O-320
>
> As I possess a Van's RV-6 with a Lycoming O-320 which has never flown
> aerobatics and whose fuel and lubrication systems are not adapted to
> this purpose I would be grateful if you could enlighten me on the
> following:
>
> * What modifications are necessary for the carburettor for
> aerobatics, whether it can be modified or needs replacement
> * How can a Christen oil system be installed for lubrication for
> aerobatics
> * Which companies in Europe can do such modifications or upgrading
> * Approximately how much would such modifications/upgrading cost
> (just in case you have any idea, as I can ask any qualified
> companies myself).
>
> This is sent both in the RV-6 and Lycoming lists.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Kind regards,
> George Nielsen
> RV-6 PH-XGN
> The Hague, the Netherlands
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6 |
Lycoming O-320
Good point.and perhaps the most valuable - the RV6 seatbelt geometry is poor
for negative G work unless you put in a 2nd set of lap belts (ratcheting
hookers or similar) along with a very beefy 5th/7th point crotch strap (not
a simple bracket between two seat ribs). Otherwise you'll learn what it's
like to fly with your head smashed sideways against he canopy - no matter
how tight you suck down the belts.
Just my 2 cents as usual!
Cheers,
Stein
From: owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie England
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2015 3:39 PM
Subject: Re: RV6-List: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for
RV-6 Lycoming O-320
George,
You might want to define your actual 'mission' before doing any mods to the
plane. I've flown lots of positive G acro in a Globe Swift that had fuel
injection, but no flop tube and no inverted oil system. I've also flown lots
of positive G acro in two different carburated RV-4's without flop tubes or
inverted systems. As long as you're doing 'positive' maneuvers (inside
loops, rolls, barrel rolls, wingovers, etc) you don't really need to do any
mods to the plane. The only real issue would be that the engine will almost
certainly quit (but is easily restarted) if you do 'hammerhead' turns.
If you really want to do sustained inverted flight and/or 'outside'
(negative G) maneuvers, then you need all the stuff that Stein details. But,
most of the serious acro guys I've talked to do not consider an RV the best
platform for 'outside' stuff (non-symmetrical airfoil, -3G rating, etc). And
if you are inexperienced in acro, the RV may not be the best learning
platform; it's so 'clean' that when (not if) you mess up and fall out of a
maneuver, you can go way over VNE really quickly before recovering. And even
if you don't exceed VNE, you'll still be going fast enough to risk breaking
something during the recovery. Older designs like the Citabria/Decathalon
are dirty enough that it's harder to go fast enough to over-stress them (but
not impossible, of course).
If the rules in your country require 'full' acro equipment to legally do any
acro, then you can disregard the above (except the operational cautions...).
FWIW,
Charlie
From: owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-rv6-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of George Nielsen
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2015 11:09 AM
Subject: RV6-List: Inverted Fuel and Christen Lubrication System for RV-6
Lycoming O-320
As I possess a Van's RV-6 with a Lycoming O-320 which has never flown
aerobatics and whose fuel and lubrication systems are not adapted to this
purpose I would be grateful if you could enlighten me on the following:
* What modifications are necessary for the carburettor for aerobatics,
whether it can be modified or needs replacement
* How can a Christen oil system be installed for lubrication for
aerobatics
* Which companies in Europe can do such modifications or upgrading
* Approximately how much would such modifications/upgrading cost (just
in case you have any idea, as I can ask any qualified companies myself).
This is sent both in the RV-6 and Lycoming lists.
Thanks.
Kind regards,
George Nielsen
RV-6 PH-XGN
The Hague, the Netherlands
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