Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:44 PM - Elevator HELP! (Stein Bruch)
2. 01:57 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! ()
3. 02:06 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Phil Birkelbach)
4. 02:12 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Rob Prior)
5. 02:20 PM - SEC: UNCLASSIFIED : Elevator HELP! (Francis, David CMDR)
6. 02:23 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Mark Taylor)
7. 02:25 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Stein Bruch)
8. 02:27 PM - SEC: UNCLASSIFIED Re: Elevator HELP! (Francis, David CMDR)
9. 02:38 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Mark Taylor)
10. 02:40 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! - Solution (Stein Bruch)
11. 02:52 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Phil Birkelbach)
12. 03:20 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Cy Galley)
13. 03:36 PM - Re: UNCLASSIFIED Re: Elevator HELP! (Cy Galley)
14. 06:37 PM - Re: Elevator HELP! (Curt Hoffman)
Message 1
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"Rv6-List" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Hi Guys,
Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates (center
one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another one
from scratch.
If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: <tgreene5@cinci.rr.com>
Could you install an access cover/plate and hole in the skin to allow access
to replace this nutty nutplate?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
<rv7-list@matronics.com>; "Rv6-List" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
Why can't you just run a tap through there. If the hole is too small drill
it out with the proper drill bit. It won't be 'locking' like the others but
that is what that nut is on there for and if you dabbed a little loc-tite on
it I think it would stay put. Just my $0.02.
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
http://www.myrv7.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
<rv7-list@matronics.com>; "Rv6-List" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: Rob Prior <rv7@b4.ca>
Or run a tap through it? Presumably it's drilled, just not tapped? If
you were to run a tap through it slowly, backing all the way out after
every 1/2 or 1/4 turn forward, you could keep a shop-vac running right
at the hole and may even pick up most of the shavings instead of leaving
them inside the elevator...
-RB4
tgreene5@cinci.rr.com wrote:
> --> RV7-List message posted by: <tgreene5@cinci.rr.com>
>
> Could you install an access cover/plate and hole in the skin to allow access
> to replace this nutty nutplate?
>
>>--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>>
>>Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>>
>>Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
>>the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
>>has NO threads in it!!
Message 5
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Francis, David CMDR" <David.Francis@defence.gov.au>
Stein, try running a tap through the nutplate to thread it before
dis-assembling the whole deal. Threaded in this fashion the nutplate will
not have the self locking feature, but you will have a jam nut on the
rod-end, so no problem. The cost of the tap will be less than that of a new
elevator.
Have fun, David Francis, VH-ZEE
-----Original Message-----
From: Stein Bruch [mailto:stein@steinair.com]
Subject: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Hi Guys,
Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates (center
one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another one
from scratch.
If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Mark Taylor" <mtaylor@msxi.com>
Could you not tap out to the thread size (maybe it just missed that part
of the process)? If not, would there be enough material to take a
helicoil? I don't know what the FAA would say about a helicoil on
something like an elevator hinge though! There's not too much material
on a nutplate, so whether you'd have enough to do that could be an
issue. Of course, it'd be tough to check that it all worked out since
it's on the inside.
A bit of a pickle to say the least.
Thinking whilst writing too, as long as there is a hole somewhere to
get a nutplate in and out (might have to make one with a unibit
somewhere discrete), you could drill out the old one, shake it out of
the hole (tedious) and guide the new nutplate to the hole using some
stiff wire maybe and blind rivet the sucker in there.
Hope that help provoke some thoughts.
Mark
RV-7 QB
Fitting out Fuselage
Mark Taylor
CAD Technical Specialist
313 203 4702
>>> tgreene5@cinci.rr.com 02/17/03 04:54PM >>>
--> RV7-List message posted by: <tgreene5@cinci.rr.com>
Could you install an access cover/plate and hole in the skin to allow
access
to replace this nutty nutplate?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
<rv7-list@matronics.com>; "Rv6-List" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings
for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After
building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no
threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build
another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million
that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
Message 7
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
I asked Van's about tapping it and that idea was thrown out by more than one
experienced head!
As far as cutting a hole in the skin and patching it, that would work, but
then there would have to be a re-enforcing plate installed and without
access to the inside, making a flush patch over the newly created hole would
be difficult. To gain the required structure, the "doubler" would be
difficult to install any other way then externally (scab patch), and I won't
do that.
Thanks and keep 'em comin!
Cheers,
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
Why can't you just run a tap through there. If the hole is too small drill
it out with the proper drill bit. It won't be 'locking' like the others but
that is what that nut is on there for and if you dabbed a little loc-tite on
it I think it would stay put. Just my $0.02.
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
http://www.myrv7.com
----- Original Message -----
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
Message 8
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Francis, David CMDR" <David.Francis@defence.gov.au>
Stein, try running a tap through the nutplate to thread it before
dis-assembling the whole deal. Threaded in this fashion the nutplate will
not have the self locking feature, but you will have a jam nut on the
rod-end, so no problem. The cost of the tap will be less than that of a new
elevator.
Have fun, David Francis, VH-ZEE
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Hi Guys,
Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates (center
one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
Message 9
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Mark Taylor" <mtaylor@msxi.com>
I mentioned the unibit hole in a previous note... You could do this in
and end rib, not the skin, so cosmetically it'd look ok still. Maybe
enlarge a tooling hole in the end rib or something. If you felt the need
to patch it for strength, you could do so, but I don't think you'd lose
that much really by enlarging a hole.
Mark Taylor
CAD Technical Specialist
313 203 4702
>>> stein@steinair.com 02/17/03 05:28PM >>>
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
I asked Van's about tapping it and that idea was thrown out by more
than one
experienced head!
As far as cutting a hole in the skin and patching it, that would work,
but
then there would have to be a re-enforcing plate installed and without
access to the inside, making a flush patch over the newly created hole
would
be difficult. To gain the required structure, the "doubler" would be
difficult to install any other way then externally (scab patch), and I
won't
do that.
Thanks and keep 'em comin!
Cheers,
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
Why can't you just run a tap through there. If the hole is too small
drill
it out with the proper drill bit. It won't be 'locking' like the
others but
that is what that nut is on there for and if you dabbed a little
loc-tite on
it I think it would stay put. Just my $0.02.
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
http://www.myrv7.com
----- Original Message -----
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings
for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After
building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no
threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build
another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million
that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Elevator HELP! - Solution |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Ok Guys,
Here's the official "Stein" solution. I'm going to drill out the old one,
shake it out the end of the elevator, and "fish" a new one in with a piece
of safety wire and use cherries to rivet in place. Probably will be lots of
uncouth words in my garage during the process, but I'll get it done!
Thanks for the advice,
Stein Bruch,
Minneapolis
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
What reasons did they give for 'throwing it out'? I would like to know so
that I can add the experience to my head. :-)
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
http://www.myrv7.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> I asked Van's about tapping it and that idea was thrown out by more than
one
> experienced head!
>
> As far as cutting a hole in the skin and patching it, that would work, but
> then there would have to be a re-enforcing plate installed and without
> access to the inside, making a flush patch over the newly created hole
would
> be difficult. To gain the required structure, the "doubler" would be
> difficult to install any other way then externally (scab patch), and I
won't
> do that.
>
> Thanks and keep 'em comin!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
>
> Why can't you just run a tap through there. If the hole is too small
drill
> it out with the proper drill bit. It won't be 'locking' like the others
but
> that is what that nut is on there for and if you dabbed a little loc-tite
on
> it I think it would stay put. Just my $0.02.
>
> Godspeed,
>
> Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
> RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
> http://www.myrv7.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> > --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
> >
> > Hi Guys,
> >
> > Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
> >
> > Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings
for
> > the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
> (center
> > one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
> >
> > Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> > that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building
3
> > tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
> > Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> > dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another
> one
> > from scratch.
> >
> > If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
> >
> > Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
> > doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Stein Bruch
> > RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> > RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
> >
> >
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
So run a tap thru it. You can always use Loctite to hold the screw, or it
you can reach the barrel from the back, give it a little squeeze.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley@qcbc.org or experimenter@eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
<rv7-list@matronics.com>; "Rv6-List" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
If you don't run the tap clean thru but stop before the threads are fully
formed, one would have the locking feature. The metal isn't hardened and on
the cowl of the Cessna I learned to fly in, I took a tap thru the nutplates
when they became almost impossible to run a screw in or out. Didn't really
think about the locking feature at that time. No, we didn't lose screws nor
the cowl.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley@qcbc.org or experimenter@eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Francis, David CMDR" <David.Francis@defence.gov.au>
Subject: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED RE: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Francis, David CMDR"
<David.Francis@defence.gov.au>
>
> Stein, try running a tap through the nutplate to thread it before
> dis-assembling the whole deal. Threaded in this fashion the nutplate will
> not have the self locking feature, but you will have a jam nut on the
> rod-end, so no problem. The cost of the tap will be less than that of a
new
> elevator.
>
> Have fun, David Francis, VH-ZEE
>
>
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator HELP! |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9@cinci.rr.com>
wow. I thought I had the only platenut with no threads. Fortunately I was
able to drill mine out when I couldn't get a bolt in it. I have started
checking them all now.
No good ideas for you though if you can't get at it other than trying to run
a tap into it and see if it works. You don't have much to lose.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
<rv7-list@matronics.com>; "Rv6-List" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RV7-List: Elevator HELP!
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein@steinair.com>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> Looking for any GOOD suggestions. Here's the problem...
>
> Just finished my RV7 tail kit and was installing the rod end bearings for
> the right elevator, when to my surprise I found one of the nutplates
(center
> one on the right elevator) has NO threads in it!!
>
> Please don't tell me I should have checked them - I already heard
> that...from Van's! Who'd a thunk to check those things. After building 3
> tail kits, and 1 flying RV6, I've never seen a nutplate with no threads.
> Anyway, Van's is still searching for some other answer short of
> dissasembling the elevator. If that's the case I'll just build another
one
> from scratch.
>
> If you have any bright ideas, feel free to let me know!
>
> Just my typical luck, if there is one nutplate in every 2 million that
> doesn't get threaded, I'll end up with it!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6/N664SB 90+hrs
> RV7/N174SB Trying to finish the tail!
>
>
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