Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:29 AM - EFIS & IFR (Noel & Yoshie Simmons)
2. 11:58 AM - Re: EFIS & IFR (Mark Taylor)
3. 12:02 PM - Re: EFIS & IFR (Hedrington, Bret)
4. 01:39 PM - Re: EFIS & IFR (Gkb5577@AOL.com)
5. 02:41 PM - Re: EFIS & IFR (Dana Overall)
6. 07:01 PM - Re: EFIS & IFR ()
Message 1
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"Rv9-List@Matronics. Com" <rv9-list@matronics.com>,
"Rv8-List@Matronics. Com" <rv8-list@matronics.com>,
"Rv7-List@Matronics. Com" <rv7-list@matronics.com>,
"Rv6-List@Matronics. Com" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel@blueskyaviation.net>
It appears that these FAA regs alone are not enough. My FAA representative
and our FAA DAR (who is a homebuilder, too!) has told me that it is not
sufficient to follow all the rules; instead, an FAA rep or DAR needs to
positively approve it. If the instrument avionics are not TSO'ed or
equivalent, then they will not sign off on it. Period. Without the FAA
positive approval, even if you do not violate any FAA regs, you cannot fly
IFR.
I think the FAA inspectors/DAR do not want to risk their jobs, and there is
no specific instruction to them that non TSO'ed instruments are ok in
experimentals, so they just refuse. If you can find one FAA inspector/DAR
who is willing to sign off e.g., a bluemountainavionics EFIS for IFR use,
then please let me know.
Sincerely,
Noel Simmons
Message 2
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Mark Taylor" <mtaylor@msxi.com>
Noel,
I think your statement is not necessarily correct...
Here's something worth a read...
http://www.bluemountainavionics.com/discus/messages/1/54.html?1057508911
I'd like to hope the guys at BMA have been unbiased in their research
on the subject.
Mark
RV-7 QB
(With an EFIS 1!)
Mark Taylor
CAD Technical Specialist
(248) 829-5322
>>> noel@blueskyaviation.net 09/25/03 01:28PM >>>
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Noel & Yoshie Simmons"
<noel@blueskyaviation.net>
It appears that these FAA regs alone are not enough. My FAA
representative
and our FAA DAR (who is a homebuilder, too!) has told me that it is
not
sufficient to follow all the rules; instead, an FAA rep or DAR needs
to
positively approve it. If the instrument avionics are not TSO'ed or
equivalent, then they will not sign off on it. Period. Without the
FAA
positive approval, even if you do not violate any FAA regs, you cannot
fly
IFR.
I think the FAA inspectors/DAR do not want to risk their jobs, and
there is
no specific instruction to them that non TSO'ed instruments are ok in
experimentals, so they just refuse. If you can find one FAA
inspector/DAR
who is willing to sign off e.g., a bluemountainavionics EFIS for IFR
use,
then please let me know.
Sincerely,
Noel Simmons
http://www.matronics.com/trouble-report
Message 3
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Hedrington, Bret" <bhedrington@PowerSentry.com>
I've been looking at this issue...Want Glass cockpit...
If anyone finds a DAR that will sign off...I'd fly them up here...
What I've been faced with is like Cirrus did in their IFR birds...Place the meatballs
in the dash as a backup for the glass..
You then have the regular gyros there and the FAA/DAR can him and haw about the
other stuff all they want. But the panel meets the requirement without the Glass
and should be able to go IFR...
Only problem...Is $'s....It is not cheap to do this...And room on the dash is another
possible concern.
Bret
N997RV
-----Original Message-----
From: Noel & Yoshie Simmons [mailto:noel@blueskyaviation.net]
Com; Rv7-List@Matronics. Com; Rv6-List@Matronics. Com
Subject: RV7-List: EFIS & IFR
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel@blueskyaviation.net>
It appears that these FAA regs alone are not enough. My FAA representative
and our FAA DAR (who is a homebuilder, too!) has told me that it is not
sufficient to follow all the rules; instead, an FAA rep or DAR needs to
positively approve it. If the instrument avionics are not TSO'ed or
equivalent, then they will not sign off on it. Period. Without the FAA
positive approval, even if you do not violate any FAA regs, you cannot fly
IFR.
I think the FAA inspectors/DAR do not want to risk their jobs, and there is
no specific instruction to them that non TSO'ed instruments are ok in
experimentals, so they just refuse. If you can find one FAA inspector/DAR
who is willing to sign off e.g., a bluemountainavionics EFIS for IFR use,
then please let me know.
Sincerely,
Noel Simmons
Message 4
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--> RV7-List message posted by: Gkb5577@aol.com
I have heard the same story many times, guys. Basically the FAA wants to
see the 'tried and true used thru and thru'. - - - - However, there are a few
solid state items readily at hand thru ACS that have been certified for IFR
use, look thru the catalog. Also, start checking out the general info on the
AGATE program and you'll probably conclude like I have that the
electro-mechanical gyros are going to be relics quite soon: because sooo many Co.s
are getting
into the Solid state groove ( and trying to make a good buck at the front
corner as this technology seeps into the main). Feedback AO? Similar
topic: anyone know how/where I can get hold of a basic primer on gyroscope
repair(s)?????With lots of time and cash shortage there have GOT to be a lot of
gyros that we can return to active ( and reliable ) service. Col Geoff
Message 5
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Dana Overall" <bo124rs@hotmail.com>
I have to say the notion that any non TSO'd instrumentation precludes one
from legally flying IFR is nonsense. I am not saying you are wrong, I am
only saying the information you have been provided is extremely suspect.
The regs state what is required equipment onboard. The regs furthur state
that one must have equipment on board appropriate for the ground facilities
to be used for IFR operations. In the case of IFR, a certified IFR GPS and
certified nav head are the appropriate units for the ground facilities.
Van's instruments do not appear to be TSO'd units. I have certainly not be
able to find any documentation which dictates non ground facility equipment
be TSO'd equipment. It sound like you have talked with someone shooting off
the hip.
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
RV-7 slider/fuselage, Imron black, "Black Magic"
Finish kit ordered!! Buying Instruments. Hangar flying my Dynon.
http://rvflying.tripod.com
do not archive
Message 6
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--> RV7-List message posted by: <tgreene5@cinci.rr.com>
Bull shit!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel@blueskyaviation.net>
Com" <rv9-list@matronics.com>; "Rv8-List@Matronics. Com"
<rv8-list@matronics.com>; "Rv7-List@Matronics. Com"
<rv7-list@matronics.com>; "Rv6-List@Matronics. Com" <rv6-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RV7-List: EFIS & IFR
> --> RV7-List message posted by: "Noel & Yoshie Simmons"
<noel@blueskyaviation.net>
>
> It appears that these FAA regs alone are not enough. My FAA
representative
> and our FAA DAR (who is a homebuilder, too!) has told me that it is not
> sufficient to follow all the rules; instead, an FAA rep or DAR needs to
> positively approve it. If the instrument avionics are not TSO'ed or
> equivalent, then they will not sign off on it. Period. Without the FAA
> positive approval, even if you do not violate any FAA regs, you cannot fly
> IFR.
>
> I think the FAA inspectors/DAR do not want to risk their jobs, and there
is
> no specific instruction to them that non TSO'ed instruments are ok in
> experimentals, so they just refuse. If you can find one FAA inspector/DAR
> who is willing to sign off e.g., a bluemountainavionics EFIS for IFR use,
> then please let me know.
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Noel Simmons
>
>
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