Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:05 AM - Re: thinking about buying (Hopperdhh@AOL.com)
2. 05:39 AM - elevator (David Figgins)
3. 07:52 AM - Re: thinking about buying (Dan Checkoway)
4. 08:09 AM - Re: thinking about buying (Hopperdhh@AOL.com)
5. 10:00 AM - Re: thinking about buying (Imken)
6. 10:29 AM - RV7 List Thinking about Buying (Tony Marshall)
7. 04:01 PM - Re: thinking about buying (Charlie England)
8. 05:44 PM - Re: thinking about buying (Imken)
9. 06:41 PM - Re: thinking about buying (Charlie England)
10. 06:41 PM - Re: elevator (Brian J. Decker)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: Hopperdhh@aol.com
Ron,
The tread width of the RV7A and RV9A are the same -- 6' 8". That's less than
a Warrior. Not sure about the 172. It is enough that it is not a factor in
landing. I do know that it is very, very hard to get the finished fuselage
(with the gear on) through a 6' wide door, but it can be done!
You will be amazed at how easy the RVs are to land. I bought a Grumman AA1C
to learn how to fly a small plane with a castering nosewheel. It was good
experience, but the RV is much easier to fly and land. The RV-7A with a constant
speed prop has to be easier to slow down and land than a -9A with a fixed
pitch prop, due to the braking you get with the prop.
Don't be intimidated (at least not too intimidated) by the RVs. They are
about as easy to land as any airplane could be. It flies like a much bigger
airplane than it is.
IMHO -- do not archive.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying since July)
In a message dated 11/21/04 8:14:04 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
brown_rj@bellsouth.net writes:
> Hello all,
> I am pondering the 7A or the 9A..I'm sure you guys have some opinions and
> why you bought the 7..If you have a minute help me out...Also, what is the
> distance between the landing gear, I'm trying to compare it to my 172E. and that
> of a Warrior..
> Tks
> Ron
>
Message 2
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<vansairforce@yahoogroups.com>
--> RV7-List message posted by: "David Figgins" <2004nospam@earthlink.net>
I am just finishing the left elevator and last night bent the tabs at the
cutout where the trim tab fits, the bend does not look very good as I could
not position the wood blocks properly due to the stiffeners, the net result
is the bend is not sharp an not quite at 90 degrees to the trailing edge.
Not sure what I can do apart from buying new skin and stiffeners and
starting over. I thought about cutting this area out and making an end cap
rib and riveting it in position.
Anyone else screwed this area up and fixed it?
Strikes me this would have been easier to do first before the stiffeners
were installed and the sharp skin bend made but I was following the
directions.
Dave (irritated on last elevator waiting for wings)
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
> It flies like a much bigger
> airplane than it is.
Careful in reading into that comment. I know what Dan means and totally
agree with him, but it doesn't feel like anything "big" per se.
It's more responsive, and more obedient...which tends to highlight either
the pilot's skill or lack thereof...which in my opinion makes the RV an
*excellent* plane to fly. It makes just about any pilot better, because it
doesn't obscure bad habits like other planes do. Sloppy rudder work, you
(and your passengers) are gonna know about it. Over-controlling, you'll
know about it. It doesn't take more than about 20 minutes in flight or a
handful of takeoffs and landings to build your finesse up. It's all about a
light touch, just fingertip pressure in most phases of flight.
That said, the plane is not twitchy or unpredictable. It does what the
pilot commands it to do. Trim it up and take your hands & feet off the
controls. Very stable.
In bumps it's more susceptible to larger roll excursions being induced than,
say, a Mooney or a "bigger" plane. But like any other plane, it's usually
best not to over-control it, just let it ride the bumps and use fingertip
pressure to keep it in check (or click on the autopilot).
"Bigger" planes tend to have more control force. I use the example of the
Mooney again...at higher airspeeds, control force in a Mooney gets very
stiff. In the RV, it does stiffens up, but proportionately less -- control
break-out force is much lower than in most spam cans capable of indicating
150-160 knots in cruise. In your Cessna 172E, you probably never get fast
enough to feel the same type of effect.
"Bigger" planes also tend to feel heavier on approach and landing.
Sometimes, even when a bigger plane is trimmed, you feel like you have to
tug at the yoke -- specifically a Skylane, which produces a very heavy feel
in the flare. In some planes & conditions it's not unusual to use full
aileron inputs to counteract gusts, turbulence, what have you. In my RV,
the only time the stick has ever hit the stop in flight has been when doing
rolls or stalls (stick back). You have so much more control authority in an
RV than in a bigger plane. It gets "mushy" relatively speaking, but it
still takes less control movement than you might imagine if you've never
flown one before. Again, "obedient" is the word I use.
I tend to associate "bigger" with a heavier feel. The RV is anything but
heavy in feel.
Experience it firsthand. Go get a ride in an RV-7 and make sure the pilot
lets you do some flying! ;-)
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: Hopperdhh@aol.com
In a message dated 11/23/04 10:53:48 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
dan@rvproject.com writes:
>
> >It flies like a much bigger
> >airplane than it is.
>
> Careful in reading into that comment. I know what Dan means and totally
> agree with him, but it doesn't feel like anything "big" per se.
>
>
You're right Dan C. Very good explanation. What I meant to say was that it
doesn't fly like you might expect a plane its size to fly. That being twitchy
and unstable. I have only been flying about 6 years -- about 600 hours, and
found the RV7A to be very easy to learn how to fly. The 200 hp actually makes
it easier to handle, in my opinion. You don't have to wonder if you'll have
enough runway! If you rotate a little too early, let off the elevator a
little and up she goes, anyway. Now, don't flame me for flying sloppy, I'm only
speaking in relative terms here.
Dan H.
RV-7A
Message 5
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| Subject: | thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Imken" <skikrazi@CenturyTel.net>
I have flown the RV-6, the 6A, the 7 and the 9A. Every one is a dream to
fly after flying rented 172's, 182's, T-210's, V-tails, Bellanca's, Piper's
and Mooney's for years. Tail wheel vs. nose wheel? I prefer recent
technology. We've been to the moon and back since tail wheels were
invented.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dan Checkoway
Subject: Re: RV7-List: thinking about buying
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@rvproject.com>
> It flies like a much bigger
> airplane than it is.
Careful in reading into that comment. I know what Dan means and totally
agree with him, but it doesn't feel like anything "big" per se.
It's more responsive, and more obedient...which tends to highlight either
the pilot's skill or lack thereof...which in my opinion makes the RV an
*excellent* plane to fly. It makes just about any pilot better, because it
doesn't obscure bad habits like other planes do. Sloppy rudder work, you
(and your passengers) are gonna know about it. Over-controlling, you'll
know about it. It doesn't take more than about 20 minutes in flight or a
handful of takeoffs and landings to build your finesse up. It's all about a
light touch, just fingertip pressure in most phases of flight.
That said, the plane is not twitchy or unpredictable. It does what the
pilot commands it to do. Trim it up and take your hands & feet off the
controls. Very stable.
In bumps it's more susceptible to larger roll excursions being induced than,
say, a Mooney or a "bigger" plane. But like any other plane, it's usually
best not to over-control it, just let it ride the bumps and use fingertip
pressure to keep it in check (or click on the autopilot).
"Bigger" planes tend to have more control force. I use the example of the
Mooney again...at higher airspeeds, control force in a Mooney gets very
stiff. In the RV, it does stiffens up, but proportionately less -- control
break-out force is much lower than in most spam cans capable of indicating
150-160 knots in cruise. In your Cessna 172E, you probably never get fast
enough to feel the same type of effect.
"Bigger" planes also tend to feel heavier on approach and landing.
Sometimes, even when a bigger plane is trimmed, you feel like you have to
tug at the yoke -- specifically a Skylane, which produces a very heavy feel
in the flare. In some planes & conditions it's not unusual to use full
aileron inputs to counteract gusts, turbulence, what have you. In my RV,
the only time the stick has ever hit the stop in flight has been when doing
rolls or stalls (stick back). You have so much more control authority in an
RV than in a bigger plane. It gets "mushy" relatively speaking, but it
still takes less control movement than you might imagine if you've never
flown one before. Again, "obedient" is the word I use.
I tend to associate "bigger" with a heavier feel. The RV is anything but
heavy in feel.
Experience it firsthand. Go get a ride in an RV-7 and make sure the pilot
lets you do some flying! ;-)
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
Message 6
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| Subject: | RV7 List Thinking about Buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Tony Marshall" <tony@lambros.com>
Prior to purchasing an RV I owned 4 different Cessnas including a 172, 2 - 182s,
and a 170B. A few years ago I became interested in RVs and finally purchased
an already built RV6 a few months ago. It is a very nice plane with a 180HP
Lyc and a constant speed prop. At purchase time I had never piloted a low
wing plane and had about 100 hours of Cessna 170 tail dragger time. I am having
the time of my life with this new RV6. I now have about 15 or 20 hours in
it (6 of which was dual time), and while I certainly respect the plane and am
not overconfident in it, it is comfortable for me at this point.
The RV6 is at least as easy to take-off and land as any plane I have flown....probably
easier.....and frankly tail draggers are more enjoyable for me, although
I fully understand that not everyone shares that enthusiasm for them. Additionally
I like the agility, speed, cross country worthiness, and short field
performance of the RVs.
My feeling is that no matter what model of RV you decide to purchase you will enjoy
it. My only counsel would be, since you will probably move up the RV learning
curve pretty quickly....think ahead and honestly evaluate the type of flying
you enjoy so you dont have to look back and wish you had purchased more engine
and prop than you did.
Mike Robertson, at Van's homecoming, kindly gave me a ride in his 9A and that is
one VERY nice plane (thanks Mike!)....but as Dan Checkoway (I think) aptly stated,
you can fly a 7 like a 9, but not the other way around....but then you
may not need the flying characteristics of a 7...Mike's 9A was a beauty, was very
agile, and flew very nicely.
To summarize....its all up to you....and generally speaking, you wont go wrong
with an RV.
Good luck.
Tony Marshall
www.lambros.com
P.O. Box 906
Polson, MT 59860
800-432-6828 Office
406-249-0835 Cell
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
We've been to the moon & back since nose wheels were invented. too. Come
to think of it, we've been to the moon & back since Lycomings were
invented. Which recent technology is powering your plane? ;-)
Actually, a trike is likely more valuable on the market & will certainly
have a larger base of potential buyers if you need to sell.
Charlie
(lazy prefer tailwheel to keep me honest & alert
but have no problem with better pilots preferring nosewheels)
Imken wrote:
>--> RV7-List message posted by: "Imken" <skikrazi@CenturyTel.net>
>
>I have flown the RV-6, the 6A, the 7 and the 9A. Every one is a dream to
>fly after flying rented 172's, 182's, T-210's, V-tails, Bellanca's, Piper's
>and Mooney's for years. Tail wheel vs. nose wheel? I prefer recent
>technology. We've been to the moon and back since tail wheels were
>invented.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dan Checkoway
>To: rv7-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV7-List: thinking about buying
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: "Imken" <skikrazi@CenturyTel.net>
Charlie's question: Which recent technology is powering your plane? ;-)
My answer: Charlie, it's an Allison Turbo-Prop. On take off, we have to use
half throttle & full right rudder. {;o)
Do not archive.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charlie England
Subject: Re: RV7-List: thinking about buying
--> RV7-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
We've been to the moon & back since nose wheels were invented. too. Come
to think of it, we've been to the moon & back since Lycomings were
invented. Which recent technology is powering your plane? ;-)
Actually, a trike is likely more valuable on the market & will certainly
have a larger base of potential buyers if you need to sell.
Charlie
(lazy prefer tailwheel to keep me honest & alert
but have no problem with better pilots preferring nosewheels)
Imken wrote:
>--> RV7-List message posted by: "Imken" <skikrazi@CenturyTel.net>
>
>I have flown the RV-6, the 6A, the 7 and the 9A. Every one is a dream to
>fly after flying rented 172's, 182's, T-210's, V-tails, Bellanca's, Piper's
>and Mooney's for years. Tail wheel vs. nose wheel? I prefer recent
>technology. We've been to the moon and back since tail wheels were
>invented.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dan Checkoway
>To: rv7-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV7-List: thinking about buying
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: thinking about buying |
--> RV7-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Way to go! I assume you've managed to perfect that new worm-hole fuel
delivery technology to get your range above 200 miles, right? (I know, I
know. It ain't an RV.)
Imken wrote:
>--> RV7-List message posted by: "Imken" <skikrazi@CenturyTel.net>
>
>Charlie's question: Which recent technology is powering your plane? ;-)
>My answer: Charlie, it's an Allison Turbo-Prop. On take off, we have to use
>half throttle & full right rudder. {;o)
>
>Do not archive.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charlie England
>To: rv7-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV7-List: thinking about buying
>
>--> RV7-List message posted by: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
>
>We've been to the moon & back since nose wheels were invented. too. Come
>to think of it, we've been to the moon & back since Lycomings were
>invented. Which recent technology is powering your plane? ;-)
>
>Actually, a trike is likely more valuable on the market & will certainly
>have a larger base of potential buyers if you need to sell.
>
>Charlie
>(lazy prefer tailwheel to keep me honest & alert
>but have no problem with better pilots preferring nosewheels)
>
>Imken wrote:
>
>
>
>>--> RV7-List message posted by: "Imken" <skikrazi@CenturyTel.net>
>>
>>I have flown the RV-6, the 6A, the 7 and the 9A. Every one is a dream to
>>fly after flying rented 172's, 182's, T-210's, V-tails, Bellanca's, Piper's
>>and Mooney's for years. Tail wheel vs. nose wheel? I prefer recent
>>technology. We've been to the moon and back since tail wheels were
>>invented.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
>>[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dan Checkoway
>>To: rv7-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: RV7-List: thinking about buying
>>
>>
Message 10
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--> RV7-List message posted by: "Brian J. Decker" <bdecker@blueroofranch.com>
I made a similar mistake on my RV-8 a couple of years ago. I wasn't happy
with the bends so I removed the "ears" and fabricated a small piece that I
could pro-seal in place. I think it looked better than the folds when I was
done.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv7-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of David Figgins
vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RV7-List: elevator
--> RV7-List message posted by: "David Figgins"
--> <2004nospam@earthlink.net>
I am just finishing the left elevator and last night bent the tabs at the
cutout where the trim tab fits, the bend does not look very good as I could
not position the wood blocks properly due to the stiffeners, the net result
is the bend is not sharp an not quite at 90 degrees to the trailing edge.
Not sure what I can do apart from buying new skin and stiffeners and
starting over. I thought about cutting this area out and making an end cap
rib and riveting it in position.
Anyone else screwed this area up and fixed it?
Strikes me this would have been easier to do first before the stiffeners
were installed and the sharp skin bend made but I was following the
directions.
Dave (irritated on last elevator waiting for wings)
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