---------------------------------------------------------- RV8-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 10/18/10: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:46 AM - Re: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... (Michael Kraus) 2. 06:45 AM - Re: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... (Richard Martin) 3. 07:01 AM - Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... (Chris Stone) 4. 09:22 AM - AW: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... (Stephan Servatius) 5. 04:36 PM - Re: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... (Carl Froehlich) 6. 05:56 PM - Re: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... (Larry Bowen) 7. 08:26 PM - Re: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking (Speedy11@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:46:13 AM PST US Subject: Re: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... From: Michael Kraus Are you sure the oil cooler is not hitting the engine mount? From the Picts, it sure looks close.... Sent from my iPhone On Oct 17, 2010, at 10:10 PM, Matt Dralle wrote: > > Dear Listers, > > I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about the 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major issue. The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked off. The outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, the upper part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no signs of cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where the left rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted to. No oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my Cell Phone. > > So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to have to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". > > What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to prevent it? > > Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that it seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. > > Thoughts? > > > - > Matt Dralle > RV-8 #82880 N998RV > http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's RV-8 Construction Blog > http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel > Status: 112+ Hours TTSN! > <2010.10.17 - RV-8 - IO-390 Oil Cooler Mount Cracking (1).jpg> > <2010.10.17 - RV-8 - IO-390 Oil Cooler Mount Cracking (2).jpg> ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:45:49 AM PST US Subject: Re: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... From: Richard Martin Mat, call me @920 619 6968. I experienced the same problem 2500 hours ago when I first flew my RV8 (serial no. 2). I can explain in detail how and what to do. Dick Martin RV8 N233M the fast one On Sun, Oct 17, 2010 at 9:10 PM, Matt Dralle wrote: > > Dear Listers, > > I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about > the 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major > issue. The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked > off. The outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, > the upper part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no > signs of cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where > the left rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted > to. No oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my > Cell Phone. > > So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown > (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like > rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to have > to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). > But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". > > What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to > prevent it? > > Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a > bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. > There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its > not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that it > seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of > "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. > > Thoughts? > > > - > Matt Dralle > RV-8 #82880 N998RV > http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's RV-8 Construction Blog > http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel > Status: 112+ Hours TTSN! ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:01:59 AM PST US From: Chris Stone Subject: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... Dick... I am about to install an oil cooler on my RV-8. I would be interested in your experiences and solutions to the cracking problem. I am under the impression that this list is for the sharing and dissemination of experience and information,. If it is used as message board for offline communications then the benefits of this forum are lost. Chris Stone RV-8 Newberg, OR Mat, call me @920 619 6968. I experienced the same problem 2500 hours ago when I first flew my RV8 (serial no. 2). I can explain in detail how and what to do. Dick Martin RV8 N233M the fast one On Sun, Oct 17, 2010 at 9:10 PM, Matt Dralle wrote: Dear Listers, I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about the 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major issue. The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked off. The outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, the upper part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no signs of cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where the left rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted to. No oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my Cell Phone. So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to have to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to prevent it? Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that it seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. Thoughts? - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's RV-8 Construction Blog http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 112+ Hours TTSN! ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:22:52 AM PST US From: "Stephan Servatius" Subject: AW: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... Hi Dick, I am here in Germany but as well would like to know what you guys are discussing. May I call you as well or can you place some words in the net? Best Regards Stephan Servatius 2nd RV8 Von: owner-rv8-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv8-list-server@matronics.com] Im Auftrag von Richard Martin Gesendet: Montag, 18. Oktober 2010 15:43 An: rv8-list@matronics.com Betreff: Re: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... Mat, call me @920 619 6968. I experienced the same problem 2500 hours ago when I first flew my RV8 (serial no. 2). I can explain in detail how and what to do. Dick Martin RV8 N233M the fast one On Sun, Oct 17, 2010 at 9:10 PM, Matt Dralle wrote: Dear Listers, I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about the 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major issue. The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked off. The outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, the upper part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no signs of cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where the left rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted to. No oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my Cell Phone. So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to have to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to prevent it? Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that it seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. Thoughts? - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's RV-8 Construction Blog http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 112+ Hours TTSN! ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:36:43 PM PST US From: "Carl Froehlich" Subject: RE: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... Matt, Some thoughts; - As others have pointed out, the moment arm of a cantilevered baffle mounted oil cooler is significant. If you really want to mount it there you will need to add some hefty baffle structural support. I have my oil cooler on the firewall in the 8A (600 hrs) and will do so in the 10 as well (but not the poor Van's design for the 10). The firewall mount also simplifies the oil cooler air butterfly valve install. - I can't tell from the photos which is oil in and oil out of the cooler. For any cooler where one inlet is higher than the other, always put the input on the bottom and output on the top. This helps eliminate air getting trapped in the cooler. - I recommend grounding your engine at the starter (most starters have a grounding lug). Remember that all the current you are pumping into the starter has to get back to the battery. A ground path through the engine is less than optimal. While you are at it run a short #6 jumper from the starter ground lug to the alternator mounting bolt as well. Carl Froehlich -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv8-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv8-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle Sent: Sunday, October 17, 2010 10:11 PM Subject: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... Dear Listers, I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about the 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major issue. The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked off. The outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, the upper part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no signs of cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where the left rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted to. No oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my Cell Phone. So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to have to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to prevent it? Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that it seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. Thoughts? - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's RV-8 Construction Blog http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 112+ Hours TTSN! ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:56:22 PM PST US Subject: Re: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... From: Larry Bowen What don't you like about the RV-10 cooler design? I'm planning on using it for my RV-7. It's going to be a tight fit, but doable. -- Larry Bowen Larry@BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 7:30 PM, Carl Froehlich wrote: > carl.froehlich@verizon.net> > > Matt, > > Some thoughts; > - As others have pointed out, the moment arm of a cantilevered baffle > mounted oil cooler is significant. If you really want to mount it there > you > will need to add some hefty baffle structural support. I have my oil > cooler > on the firewall in the 8A (600 hrs) and will do so in the 10 as well (but > not the poor Van's design for the 10). The firewall mount also simplifies > the oil cooler air butterfly valve install. > - I can't tell from the photos which is oil in and oil out of the cooler. > For any cooler where one inlet is higher than the other, always put the > input on the bottom and output on the top. This helps eliminate air > getting > trapped in the cooler. > - I recommend grounding your engine at the starter (most starters have a > grounding lug). Remember that all the current you are pumping into the > starter has to get back to the battery. A ground path through the engine > is > less than optimal. While you are at it run a short #6 jumper from the > starter ground lug to the alternator mounting bolt as well. > > Carl Froehlich > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv8-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv8-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle > Sent: Sunday, October 17, 2010 10:11 PM > To: rv-list@matronics.com; rv8-list@matronics.com; rv7-list@matronics.com > Subject: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking... > > > Dear Listers, > > I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about > the > 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major > issue. > The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked off. > The > outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, the upper > part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no signs of > cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where the left > rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted to. No > oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my Cell > Phone. > > So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown > (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like > rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to > have > to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). > But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". > > What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to > prevent it? > > Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a > bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. > There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its > not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that > it > seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of > "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. > > Thoughts? > > > - > Matt Dralle > RV-8 #82880 N998RV > http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's RV-8 Construction Blog > http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel > Status: 112+ Hours TTSN! > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:26:00 PM PST US From: Speedy11@aol.com Subject: RV8-List: Re: Oil Cooler Mount Cracking Matt, My engine shakes a lot, too. Especially during start and shutdown. I have cracking in the baffles and one exhaust pipe was hitting the engine mount. I don't have any oil cooler issues because I remote mounted it, but I've heard that most guys who mount the cooler on the rear of baffles have continuous problems with cracked mounts. It seems like Dick Martin came up with a good mount for the baffles that doesn't crack and has improved air flow. He moved it aft and tilted it downward. Maybe he will see your post and offer advice. Stan Sutterfield I took the cowling off the 'ol RV-8 today to have a look around at about the 112 TTSN hour mark. Most everything looked okay except for one major issue. The outside, lower back mount on the oil cooler is totally cracked off. The outside, lower front mount also has a long crack. At this point, the upper part of the mount seems alright. Also the inside mounts show no signs of cracks. The rear flange on the baffling has a small crack where the left rear part rivets to the back baffle that the oil cooler is bolted to. No oil leaks of any kind at this point. See attached pictures from my Cell Phone. So what the heck? The engine shakes quite a bit on startup and shutdown (smooth as glass during normal ops), but this doesn't really seem like rotational shake damage. Although, it must be. Obviously I'm going to have to remove the oil cooler and have it repaired (that can be done, right?). But just "fixing" the mounting flanges isn't going to solve the "problem". What are lister's opinion on what's going on here and what could be done to prevent it? Interestingly, I noted that the #4 grounding cable that is attached to a bolt hole right underneath the oil cooler also had the lug sheered off. There is "service loop" on the cable, but #4 isn't really flexible so its not particular effective. Guess I need more. The point though, is, that it seems like the engine shook pretty hard. I don't see any other signs of "issues" related. The mounts and bolts seem solid and tight. 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