Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 03:12 AM - Tail section (Joe Wiza)
     2. 08:32 AM - Re: Diesel Power (Jim Hosie)
     3. 08:40 AM - Re: 705 bulkhead alignment. (Gary)
     4. 08:40 AM - Re: Tail section (Gary)
     5. 09:02 AM - Re: Diesel Power (Ernest Kells)
     6. 09:58 AM - Re: Diesel Power (Dr. Leathers)
     7. 12:58 PM - Re: Aeroflash Strobe Unit (Ralph Cloud)
     8. 02:08 PM - Re: Diesel Power (Todd Houg)
     9. 02:41 PM - Re: 705 bulkhead alignment. (dean van winkle)
    10. 05:08 PM - RV-9A Elevators and Rudder (Ted Strand)
    11. 07:11 PM - Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder (Robert scott)
    12. 07:28 PM - Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder (Todd Houg)
    13. 07:42 PM - Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder (Todd Houg)
    14. 11:44 PM - Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder (Ken Moak)
 
 
 
Message 1
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  | 
      
      
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: Joe Wiza <planejoel@juno.com>
      
           Just finished the tail section, would have bet the RV6A was easier
      but then maybe I'm just remembering the easy stuff
      
      RV9A  awaiting wings.                                        Joe.
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 2
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: Diesel Power | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4@attbi.com>
      
      Todd,
      What caused the 9 to be lost?
      Jim
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "tchoug" <tchoug@micron.com>
      Subject: RE: RV9-List: Diesel Power
      
      
      > --> RV9-List message posted by: tchoug <tchoug@micron.com>
      >
      > The first factory prototype did have the O-235, I think it was the 118 HP
      > version. I flew in this airplane and the performance was excellent
      compared
      > to the Cessnas I had been flying. Take off roll was as short as advertised
      > and climb was more than adequate. A deisel should provide excellent low
      RPM
      > torque which should give good static thrust.
      >
      > Actually the protoype was lost on it's way to Sun-n-Fun after a day at the
      > Twin Cities RV forum. I was probably the last customer to fly in that
      > airplane. It departed the next day and made it as far as Arkansas before
      > getting into IMC. It had no gyros at all. R.I.P.
      >
      > Todd Houg
      > RV9A - Fuselage
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: DThomas773@aol.com [mailto:DThomas773@aol.com]
      > To: rv9-list@matronics.com
      > Subject: Re: RV9-List: Diesel Power
      >
      >
      > --> RV9-List message posted by: DThomas773@aol.com
      >
      > I think the original factory proto type RV9-A that was lost on it's way
      home
      >
      > from Sun-in-Fun was powered by a Lycoming 0235, which I think is 125 HP.
      It
      >
      > was stated to perform pretty much as expected and as called for in the
      > design
      > performance specs.
      > Dennis Thomas
      >
      > Do Not Archive
      >
      >
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 3
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: 705 bulkhead alignment. | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Gary" <rv9er@3rivers.net>
      
      I am not sure about this one, Rob.  Mine has never been upside down.  I built it
      right-side-up and so missed out on the big "roll the fuselage over" party. 
      However, yours doesn't sound right to me. 
      
      All I know is mine appears to have smooth lines finished and sitting on the gear,
      and all the holes lined up.
      
      If you had it right side up I suppose you could cleco the top skins on as a check.
      
      Gary
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Rob W M Shipley
        To: RV9-List Digest Server
        Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 12:34 AM
        Subject: RV9-List: 705 bulkhead alignment.
      
      
        --> RV9-List message posted by: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob@RobsGlass.com>
      
        Do others with their fuselages upside down and mostly assembled have a slight
      dip (approx 3/16") at the 705 bulkhead if a straight edge is placed across it
      down the longitudinal axis of the fuselage?
        I hope this is clear .........  Mine appears to have everything fitting correctly
      but this slight concavity in the bottom of the fuse at the 705 is quite obvious
      and I'm wondering why it's there.
        [The 705 is the rear spar attach / seat belt floor attach / roll bar bulkhead.]
        Input welcomed.
        Rob
        Rob W M Shipley
        RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
      
      
        ---
        Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 2/25/03
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 4
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: Tail section | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Gary" <rv9er@3rivers.net>
      
      Looks to me like the -9 tail is more work to build than the other models.......then
      there are the flaps and ailerons yet to come! 
      
      But, hey, you'll have a better airplane when you are done.
      
      Gary
      
      do not archive.
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Joe Wiza
        To: rv9-list@matronics.com
        Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 3:57 AM
        Subject: RV9-List: Tail section
      
      
        --> RV9-List message posted by: Joe Wiza <planejoel@juno.com>
      
             Just finished the tail section, would have bet the RV6A was easier
        but then maybe I'm just remembering the easy stuff
      
        RV9A  awaiting wings.                                        Joe.
      
      
        ---
        Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 2/25/03
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 5
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: Diesel Power | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells@sympatico.ca>
      
      > What caused the 9 to be lost?
      
      I believe that the two very experienced pilots (with extensive RV
      experience)  just "pushed on" during a long  and tiring flight, even though
      weather was deteriating.   They flew into IMC conditions over primitive
      land - hilly, tree-covered, low population, etc., etc.  They possibly would
      have been okay - but they needed to land due to very low gas.
      
      I felt bad about it.  I believe that I was the first RV-9A builder planning
      an O-235 N2C engine (kit #90030).  As such I had a lot of questions.  Bill
      Benedict was very knowledgeable and very helpful. Had better information
      about the RV-9A/O-235 at that time than the current Support group does now.
      Ernest Kells - RV-9A  O235-N2C,  Wood Prop
       Finish Kit 95% Complete
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 6
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: Diesel Power | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Dr. Leathers" <DrLeathers@822heal.com>
      
      CFIT
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4@attbi.com>
      Subject: Re: RV9-List: Diesel Power
      
      
      > --> RV9-List message posted by: "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4@attbi.com>
      >
      > Todd,
      > What caused the 9 to be lost?
      > Jim
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "tchoug" <tchoug@micron.com>
      > To: <rv9-list@matronics.com>
      > Subject: RE: RV9-List: Diesel Power
      >
      >
      > > --> RV9-List message posted by: tchoug <tchoug@micron.com>
      > >
      > > The first factory prototype did have the O-235, I think it was the 118
      HP
      > > version. I flew in this airplane and the performance was excellent
      > compared
      > > to the Cessnas I had been flying. Take off roll was as short as
      advertised
      > > and climb was more than adequate. A deisel should provide excellent low
      > RPM
      > > torque which should give good static thrust.
      > >
      > > Actually the protoype was lost on it's way to Sun-n-Fun after a day at
      the
      > > Twin Cities RV forum. I was probably the last customer to fly in that
      > > airplane. It departed the next day and made it as far as Arkansas before
      > > getting into IMC. It had no gyros at all. R.I.P.
      > >
      > > Todd Houg
      > > RV9A - Fuselage
      > >
      > > -----Original Message-----
      > > From: DThomas773@aol.com [mailto:DThomas773@aol.com]
      > > To: rv9-list@matronics.com
      > > Subject: Re: RV9-List: Diesel Power
      > >
      > >
      > > --> RV9-List message posted by: DThomas773@aol.com
      > >
      > > I think the original factory proto type RV9-A that was lost on it's way
      > home
      > >
      > > from Sun-in-Fun was powered by a Lycoming 0235, which I think is 125 HP.
      > It
      > >
      > > was stated to perform pretty much as expected and as called for in the
      > > design
      > > performance specs.
      > > Dennis Thomas
      > >
      > > Do Not Archive
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 7
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Aeroflash Strobe Unit | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ralph Cloud" <ercouper@flash.net>
      
      
      While you're on the topic of tail lights & strobes. The tail position light
      is required to be visible on a 110 degree arc, when combined witht he strobe
      it is usually in the middle with a metal collar with a "V" notch to control
      the arc of visibility. make sure the arc is in a horizontal plane. I have
      seen some installed with it in the verticle plane... even on certified
      aircraft. (Take a walk around the ramp parking sometime and check out some
      tail)
      
      Ralph
      Livermore, CA
      wings kinda
      do not archive
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 8
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  | 
      
      
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: Todd Houg <thoug@attglobal.net>
      
      Jim,
      
      Ernest pretty well summed it up, except I don't believe fuel was an issue. Bill
      and his son Jeremy were both experienced RV pilots. Bill told me the day before
      that he let Jeremy fly most of the long cross country legs. They pushed it
      too far and got into IMC conditions over the hills of Arkansas. Witnesses on the
      ground reported hearing the airplane circling prior to the crash leading one
      to infer that they were possibly in a death spiral with no gyros. It was a very
      firey crash indicating there was plenty of fuel on board.
      
      For this reason, I believe all VFR only aircraft should have minimal gyros (Vacuum,
      electric, solid state or whatever).
      
              Todd Houg
              RV9A - Fuselage
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From:        Ernest Kells [SMTP:ernest.kells@sympatico.ca]
      Subject:        Re: RV9-List: Diesel Power
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells@sympatico.ca>
      
      > What caused the 9 to be lost?
      
      I believe that the two very experienced pilots (with extensive RV
      experience)  just "pushed on" during a long  and tiring flight, even though
      weather was deteriating.   They flew into IMC conditions over primitive
      land - hilly, tree-covered, low population, etc., etc.  They possibly would
      have been okay - but they needed to land due to very low gas.
      
      I felt bad about it.  I believe that I was the first RV-9A builder planning
      an O-235 N2C engine (kit #90030).  As such I had a lot of questions.  Bill
      Benedict was very knowledgeable and very helpful. Had better information
      about the RV-9A/O-235 at that time than the current Support group does now.
      Ernest Kells - RV-9A  O235-N2C,  Wood Prop
       Finish Kit 95% Complete
      
      
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Message 9
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: 705 bulkhead alignment. | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "dean van winkle" <dvanwinkle@royell.net>
      
      Rob
      
      Your message implies that you have the tip-up canopy and I have the slider
      which should make absolutely no difference. Mine is upside down and has the
      same dip as yours.  Please note that the center line flat bottom surface of
      the baggage compartment transitions to match the wing bottom airfoil contour
      just forward of the 705 bulkhead. The baggage ribs are 700 series and appear
      to be common to the -7 and -9 aircraft while the seat ribs are 900 series
      specific to the -9 only.  I suspect that this dip appears only on the -9
      because of the different airfoil used and should be of no concern either
      structurally or aerodynamically. Hope this helps.
      
      Dean Van Winkle
      Retired Aero Engineer
      90095  Fuselage
      Finish kit in transit
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob@RobsGlass.com>
      Subject: RV9-List: 705 bulkhead alignment.
      
      
      > --> RV9-List message posted by: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob@RobsGlass.com>
      >
      > Do others with their fuselages upside down and mostly assembled have a
      slight dip (approx 3/16") at the 705 bulkhead if a straight edge is placed
      across it down the longitudinal axis of the fuselage?
      > I hope this is clear .........  Mine appears to have everything fitting
      correctly but this slight concavity in the bottom of the fuse at the 705 is
      quite obvious and I'm wondering why it's there.
      > [The 705 is the rear spar attach / seat belt floor attach / roll bar
      bulkhead.]
      > Input welcomed.
      > Rob
      > Rob W M Shipley
      > RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
      >
      >
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 10
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | RV-9A Elevators and Rudder | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ted Strand" <tstrand@strandcentral.com>
      
      I have a question that hopefully someone can answer.  I am currently
      finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
      
      1)  I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators.  I
      see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin.  Do they
      just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
      length?  Is the Rudder the same?
      
      2)  I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
      backordered).  Is there a trick to making them fit properly?  Looks like
      they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in some
      places.
      
      Thanks in advance!!!
      
      -Ted Strand-
      N371N
      Finishing Empennage
      (Wing Kit in Storage)
      Clearwater, FL
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 11
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Robert scott" <rscott@johnsonmfginc.com>
      
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Ted Strand" <tstrand@strandcentral.com>
      Subject: RV9-List: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder
      
      
      > --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ted Strand" <tstrand@strandcentral.com>
      >
      > I have a question that hopefully someone can answer.  I am currently
      > finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
      >
      > 1)  I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators.  I
      > see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin.  Do they
      > just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
      > length?  Is the Rudder the same?
      
      The idea is to proseal the entire length, cleco to a piece of angle angle
      iron and let it setup. Then remove clecos and instal the rivets.  The
      proseal will hold everything in place as you rivet.
      Yes, the rudder is the same.
      
      
      > 2)  I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
      > backordered).  Is there a trick to making them fit properly?  Looks like
      > they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in some
      > places.
      
      If you look closely you will notice a line that runs around the permiter
      edge. If you trim to this line you will be very close to having a good fit.
      
      Robert scott
      
      
      > Thanks in advance!!!
      >
      > -Ted Strand-
      > N371N
      > Finishing Empennage
      > (Wing Kit in Storage)
      > Clearwater, FL
      >
      >
      
      
      
      
      
      
Message 12
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | RV-9A Elevators and Rudder | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: Todd Houg <thoug@attglobal.net>
      
      Ted,
      
      When I built my empennage the plans/directions specified using pro-seal at the
      corners only. I'm not sure if the directions have changed since. I know some people
      do put pro-seal along the entire edge. It's useful on the coreners to prevent
      getting a corner folded up when you inadvertantly snag it on a towel or
      shirt sleeve. While pro-sealing the entire edge certainly doesn't hurt, I'm nut
      sure that there is any real benefit.
      
      You can check out how I did my trailing edges at http://www.toddhoug.com.
      
      The fiberglass tips aren't difficult. The lines in the gelcoat are pretty close.
      If you take a few measurements to confirm, you can likely cut to the lines and
      then do some final trimming where needed.
      
              Todd Houg
              90196 - Fuselage
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From:        Ted Strand [SMTP:tstrand@strandcentral.com]
      Subject:        RV9-List: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ted Strand" <tstrand@strandcentral.com>
      
      I have a question that hopefully someone can answer.  I am currently
      finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
      
      1)  I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators.  I
      see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin.  Do they
      just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
      length?  Is the Rudder the same?
      
      2)  I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
      backordered).  Is there a trick to making them fit properly?  Looks like
      they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in some
      places.
      
      Thanks in advance!!!
      
      -Ted Strand-
      N371N
      Finishing Empennage
      (Wing Kit in Storage)
      Clearwater, FL
      
      
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Message 13
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | RV-9A Elevators and Rudder | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: Todd Houg <thoug@attglobal.net>
      
      >> 1)  I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators.  I
      >> see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin.  Do they
      >> just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
      >> length?  Is the Rudder the same?
      
      >The idea is to proseal the entire length, cleco to a piece of angle angle
      >iron and let it setup. Then remove clecos and instal the rivets.  The
      >proseal will hold everything in place as you rivet.
      >Yes, the rudder is the same.
      
      Robert,
      
      Does the latest plans or assembly instructions call for this? I know my older instructions
      circa 2000 do not specifiy this. They specify use only on the corners,
      have there been updates? I thought that this approach was one that a creative
      builder came up with and it has caught on with a few others. While it sounds
      like people get good results with it, it certainly isn't necessary. I got
      great results on the rudder, elevator, flaps and ailerons just clamping to a long
      piece of angle iron and riveting. The less I have to deal with proseal the
      better!
      
      I guess it's really up to the builder, that's what makes these experimental right?
      
              Todd Houg
              RV9A - Fuselage (still)
      
      
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Message 14
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  | 
      
      
| Subject:  | Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder | 
      
      --> RV9-List message posted by: Ken Moak <ken_moak@yahoo.com>
      
      I used the structural epoxy (T88) the plans called for
      rather than proseal on the rudder.
      
      I used the elevator spar and cekoed the rudder to it
      for a few days while it set.  The spar is the same
      hole pattern as the from trailing edge of the rudder
      (left the plastic on to keep glue from setting on the
      spar) sounds like you are too far along and will have
      to drill.
      
      I have not closed the elevators yet, still waiting on
      a Tech Advisor (4 weeks, 3 advisors still no shows).
      
      Ken
      90608
      About to start the wings.
      
      
      --- Ted Strand <tstrand@strandcentral.com> wrote:
      > --> RV9-List message posted by: "Ted Strand"
      > <tstrand@strandcentral.com>
      > 
      > I have a question that hopefully someone can answer.
      >  I am currently
      > finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two
      > things remaining.
      > 
      > 1)  I need to finish the trailing edges of the
      > Rudder and elevators.  I
      > see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of
      > the skin.  Do they
      > just want this in the corners, or do they want us to
      > put it the whole
      > length?  Is the Rudder the same?
      > 
      > 2)  I just received my fiberglass tips for the
      > empennage (they were
      > backordered).  Is there a trick to making them fit
      > properly?  Looks like
      > they want to hang up on rivets that have already
      > been installed in some
      > places.
      > 
      > Thanks in advance!!!
      > 
      > -Ted Strand-
      > N371N
      > Finishing Empennage
      > (Wing Kit in Storage)
      > Clearwater, FL
      > 
      > 
      >
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