Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:21 AM - Re: More on aileron TE (Dean)
2. 08:12 AM - Re: Aileron oops? (Dean)
3. 08:25 AM - Re: More on aileron TE (Mike Hoover)
4. 10:02 AM - Re: Aileron oops? (Mark Schrimmer)
5. 11:34 AM - Re: Re: Aileron oops? (DThomas773@aol.com)
6. 01:57 PM - Re: Aileron oops? (Bob Kelly)
7. 03:37 PM - Re: Aileron oops? (John Oliveira)
8. 03:51 PM - Re: Aileron oops? (John Oliveira)
9. 04:01 PM - Nut torques on Rod End Bearings (Gerry Filby)
10. 05:17 PM - Re: Aileron oops? (Dale Larsen)
11. 06:21 PM - Re: Aileron oops? (DThomas773@aol.com)
12. 07:02 PM - Re: Re: Aileron oops? (Paul Eastham)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: More on aileron TE |
--> RV9-List message posted by: "Dean" <dvanwinkle@royell.net>
Paul
I missed the difference in rivet callout between the two kits and started
with the -3s and had less than satisfactory results. I had to remove
the -3s because they were giving insufficent clamp-up with the shop head. Go
with -3.5s from the beginning and you won't be sorry. I wish Van's would
correct that callout. I suggested it at the time of my problems.
Dean Van Winkle ( Retired Aero Engineer )
RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham@netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: More on aileron TE
> --> RV9-List message posted by: Paul Eastham <eastham@netapp.com>
>
> So all the double-flush trailing edges in the kit use the same 11.9
> AEX extrusion. Yet the rudder and elevator call for -3.5 rivets while
> the aileron and flaps call for -3. Makes no sense!
>
> I'm worried about the ability of my undersize shop heads to hold onto
> that skin...I'll see what Van's has to say about it, though I think
> they're all still away at SnF.
>
> Paul
>
>
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: "Dean" <dvanwinkle@royell.net>
Paul
I answered your second post before I found this one. Regarding
countersinking the AEX wedges, I built the rectangular 2x4/particleboard
frame called out under Aileron Preparations. You can see a corner of it in
Fig 7-24. I clamped the thin side of the AEX wedges even with the edges of
the particleboard and drilled the hole patterns into the particle board
before starting the countersinking. The particleboard holes accept the
countersink pilot and keep it from drifting. This edge mounting of the
wedges allows the countersink tool base to stay flat on the wedge itself.
Hope this helps.
Dean Van Winkle
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham@netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Aileron oops?
> --> RV9-List message posted by: Paul Eastham <eastham@netapp.com>
>
> Hi All,
> So I was finishing up my first aileron today, doing the trailing-edge
> double-flush rivets. "Boy, these -3 rivets sure look short for this
> hole"... But remembering the manual's advice not to go for longer rivets
> here, I forged ahead.
>
> My shop heads are really pretty small. Much smaller than on the
> rudder, where the dimples seem pretty full. Here, there is a lot of
> empty space in the dimple. They are clearly smaller than the avery
> shop-head gauge when placed over them. You can't see the edge of the
> hole, though. (poor picture...look at the right hand one:
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/images/20040415_IMG_0657.JPG )
>
> I think the problem stems from my AEX wedge location; mine is probably
> slightly further aft than it should be. I was definitely catching a
> thicker part of it than on the rudder/elevators.
>
> Anyone else have a similar experience? I'm tempted to drill them out
> and go to -3.5. I guess I could try a few first then see how they go.
>
> Paul
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
>
>
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: More on aileron TE |
--> RV9-List message posted by: "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover@sc.rr.com>
Seems like I remember somebody contacting Vans recently about this and Vans
said they are planning to change to drawings to call for 3.5's.
Mike
90709 wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dean" <dvanwinkle@royell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: More on aileron TE
> --> RV9-List message posted by: "Dean" <dvanwinkle@royell.net>
>
> Paul
>
> I missed the difference in rivet callout between the two kits and started
> with the -3s and had less than satisfactory results. I had to remove
> the -3s because they were giving insufficent clamp-up with the shop head.
Go
> with -3.5s from the beginning and you won't be sorry. I wish Van's would
> correct that callout. I suggested it at the time of my problems.
>
> Dean Van Winkle ( Retired Aero Engineer )
> RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham@netapp.com>
> To: <rv9-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RV9-List: More on aileron TE
>
>
> > --> RV9-List message posted by: Paul Eastham <eastham@netapp.com>
> >
> > So all the double-flush trailing edges in the kit use the same 11.9
> > AEX extrusion. Yet the rudder and elevator call for -3.5 rivets while
> > the aileron and flaps call for -3. Makes no sense!
> >
> > I'm worried about the ability of my undersize shop heads to hold onto
> > that skin...I'll see what Van's has to say about it, though I think
> > they're all still away at SnF.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> >
>
>
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer@pacbell.net>
Paul,
Looking at your picture, I'd say that your trailing edge rivets look like
mine. I haven't flown yet, but my trailing edges seem pretty sturdy. Please
let us know what you learn from the factory. I'd hate to have to drill out
all those trailing edge rivets!
With regards to countersinking the trailing edges, I bought some extra
pieces of AEX wedge and placed them under the AEX wedge I was trying to
countersink. This kept the wedge reasonably level and I was able to keep the
countersink cage on the wedge without any problems. I left a gap between the
pieces of AEX directly under the hole I was countersinking so the
countersink cutter could go all the way through, without bottoming out on
the pieces underneath.
Mark
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: DThomas773@aol.com
Hi Paul,
This is an issue that has come up several times in the past couple years and
I believe Van's will tell you to go to 3.5 rivets. That is what I did and
they came out fine.
Dennis Thomas
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: Bob Kelly <mmpi@missionmedia.org>
Paul,
I know not many people have one, but a small lathe or milling machine really
speeds things up. I did the right elevator trailing edge in about 15-20
minutes and the results were great. You can pick up a Taig lathe with a
milling adapter for about $300 and I would think a ShopSmith could be
adapted. I have a picture at www.missionmedia.org/RV-9A.html Click on the
"Emp Tips" button. There is a wood block in the jaws (not visible) that
holds the proper angle and allows a slip fit for the wedge.
Bob Kelly, Wings
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: "John Oliveira" <oliveira@frontiernet.net>
Mine look the same as the ones one the elevator and rudder. No problem.
Wait until you get to the flaps. It is really satisfying when you get that
almost 7 foot long trailing edge done and it is actually true!
John Oliveira
Working on Fuselage N909RV reserved
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham@netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Aileron oops?
> --> RV9-List message posted by: Paul Eastham <eastham@netapp.com>
>
> Hi All,
> So I was finishing up my first aileron today, doing the trailing-edge
> double-flush rivets. "Boy, these -3 rivets sure look short for this
> hole"... But remembering the manual's advice not to go for longer rivets
> here, I forged ahead.
>
> My shop heads are really pretty small. Much smaller than on the
> rudder, where the dimples seem pretty full. Here, there is a lot of
> empty space in the dimple. They are clearly smaller than the avery
> shop-head gauge when placed over them. You can't see the edge of the
> hole, though. (poor picture...look at the right hand one:
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/images/20040415_IMG_0657.JPG )
>
> I think the problem stems from my AEX wedge location; mine is probably
> slightly further aft than it should be. I was definitely catching a
> thicker part of it than on the rudder/elevators.
>
> Anyone else have a similar experience? I'm tempted to drill them out
> and go to -3.5. I guess I could try a few first then see how they go.
>
> Paul
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
>
>
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: "John Oliveira" <oliveira@frontiernet.net>
I hate to admit this with all you guys coming up with all these fixtures and
fancy ways of doing the counter sinking. I just did mine with air drill and
counter sink tool, hand holding. Results look great. Message is, don't
kill yourself being too precise. It is not necessary.
John Oliveira
N909RV reserved
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Kelly" <mmpi@missionmedia.org>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aileron oops?
> --> RV9-List message posted by: Bob Kelly <mmpi@missionmedia.org>
>
> Paul,
>
> I know not many people have one, but a small lathe or milling machine
really
> speeds things up. I did the right elevator trailing edge in about 15-20
> minutes and the results were great. You can pick up a Taig lathe with a
> milling adapter for about $300 and I would think a ShopSmith could be
> adapted. I have a picture at www.missionmedia.org/RV-9A.html Click on
the
> "Emp Tips" button. There is a wood block in the jaws (not visible) that
> holds the proper angle and allows a slip fit for the wedge.
>
> Bob Kelly, Wings
>
>
> > PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> > been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> > keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> > 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
>
>
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Nut torques on Rod End Bearings |
--> RV9-List message posted by: Gerry Filby <gerf@gerf.com>
Folks,
I'm installing the rod end bearings into the rudder and
elevators and wondering what to torque down the locking nuts to
- its probably under my nose in the Standard Aircraft Handbook
but its eluding me at the moment.
Thx
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf@gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: "Dale Larsen" <slickrock@been-there.com>
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
If you place another piece of AEX wedge below the one you're drilling, in
the opposite orientation, the top surface now becomes flat. Now you can use
a drill press to get perfect countersinks. You can cleco the two aileron
wedges together (since hole spacing is the same) and countersink one side,
then the other. Seperate them, turn them over and do the other sides.
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: DThomas773@aol.com
As Van's once said top me,don't worry about it. You'r just building an
airplane".
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
--> RV9-List message posted by: Paul Eastham <eastham@netapp.com>
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 10:04:01AM -0700, Mark Schrimmer wrote:
> --> RV9-List message posted by: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer@pacbell.net>
>
> Paul,
>
> Looking at your picture, I'd say that your trailing edge rivets look like
> mine. I haven't flown yet, but my trailing edges seem pretty sturdy. Please
> let us know what you learn from the factory. I'd hate to have to drill out
> all those trailing edge rivets!
After staring at it for a long while, I realized:
- I wasn't going to feel safe with it as it is, regardless of what the
factory says (still haven't heard back from them)
- With all the time spent emailing and staring at the darn thing, I
could have fixed it by now!
So I drilled them all out. This may have been unwise, because about 5
of the shop heads grabbed the bottom skin and caused the skin to
explode outward as I punched out the head (despite using a backing
block). FORTUNATELY, a couple whacks with the mushroom set and they
popped right back in to place. (This is with a prosealed wedge -- might
have been worse without)
Now re-riveted with 3.5's, the shop heads look somewhat better but due to
hole expansion and whatnot are still not as good as my rudder and elevators.
But passable, I think.
I will send out what Van's says when they get back to me...
I will also yell at them for not revising the plans! :) Sounds like people
have been reporting this problem to them for a while.
Paul
>
> With regards to countersinking the trailing edges, I bought some extra
> pieces of AEX wedge and placed them under the AEX wedge I was trying to
> countersink. This kept the wedge reasonably level and I was able to keep the
> countersink cage on the wedge without any problems. I left a gap between the
> pieces of AEX directly under the hole I was countersinking so the
> countersink cutter could go all the way through, without bottoming out on
> the pieces underneath.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
>
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|