Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:23 AM - Re: wing gap seal (Chenoweth)
2. 05:23 AM - Re: Float on landing (Chenoweth)
3. 09:16 AM - Re: wing gap seal (Michael T. Ice)
4. 09:20 AM - Re: Float on landing (Michael T. Ice)
5. 01:22 PM - Re: Float on landing (Charlie England)
6. 01:48 PM - New Realtime Spell Checker Added To Matronics Forums! (Matt Dralle)
7. 05:36 PM - Re: wing gap seal (Bill Repucci)
8. 05:36 PM - Re: ***SPAM*** Re: Float on landing (Bill Repucci)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: wing gap seal |
Mike,
I guess I'm going to wait on the strip termination technique. We'll be
a Sun n Fun again next year so I should have lots of samples to look at.
Thanks for the glue idea - from what Bill R. said I suspect I can go
without for a while or maybe just glue here and there.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Ice
To: rv9-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:45 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wing gap seal
Bill,
I can't answer how to terminate the strip but perhaps I can help with
the glue. I have used 3M contact cement (yellow) with great success when
attaching rubber parts to Cessnas in the past. Just smear a light coat
on each part, let dry, put them together and they will stick. This glue
is real messy so tape off any place you don't want to glue.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Chenoweth <chenoweth@gwi.net>
Date: Friday, September 7, 2007 3:11 pm
Subject: RV9-List: wing gap seal
To: rv9-list@matronics.com
> I'm trying to figure out how the rubber seal between the wing gap
> seal and the fuselage is terminated along the bottom of the
> fuselage. I'm building a 9 tailwheel so there is no main gear
> fairing to cover the termination.
> Do any of you tailwheel builders have suggestions on how to do
> this or perhaps a picture. Also, is it appropriate or necessary
> to glue the rubber seal to the gap seal? If so, with what?
> Thanks,
> Bill
> Albion, Maine
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
9/7/2007 4:40 PM
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Float on landing |
MessageBill,
Like John I'm also a Kitfox builder/flyer so my frame of reference is
that. When you say "back comes the power" what do you mean? In my case
I go to idle, stay high, slip to landing without flaps, and almost never
touch the power. In something over 300 hours that has worked well. I'm
using two-stroke power and consider this landing technique good practice
in case of a power failure. I'm with him on the 1.3 and then a bit less
on short final.
My assumption is that this technique (idle power and slips) will not be
appropriate with the 9, right? Also, are you three-pointing, wheel
landing, or something else. I'm using what amounts to a barely flying
three-point.
And, thanks for the gap seal info.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Repucci
To: rv9-list@matronics.com ; 'Kitfox'
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:28 PM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Float on landing
Just to repeat some of the emails John and I exchanged privately this
morning...
I've been using 65 MPH since my first flight and now with 40 hours I
have not had a problem with that speed. Abeam the numbers, back comes
the power, in goes all the flaps, and with luck, I never have to touch
the throttle again. This assumes John and my AS are calibrated the
same. YMMV. Be careful, if you are trying these lower speeds on your
own.
You can use 60 MPH but that is a bit slow, even by my standards and
the sink rate gets up there. However, in my light (990 lbs) -9 I still
have enough energy to flair. Note, if I was going to try 60 MPH with a
-9A, you might want to be ready with the throttle to help lift the nose
a little. With my tail dragger, that isn't a concern.
Bill
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
kerrjohna@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 12:33 PM
To: rv9- list; Kitfox
Subject: RV9-List: Float on landing
after a lengthy discussion on the Kitfox list regarding float on
landing and doing some testing in my kitfox to determine the efficacy of
maintaining 1.3 times stall speed on approach I decided to try the same
thing with the RV9.
I climbed to pattern altitude plus 2000 feet and configured for
landing: full flaps 1200 rpm. With this setup I practiced a variety of
manuevers that might be required in landing while maintaining 65IAS.
The RV9 was perfectly stable in all manuevers and indicated 400-450 rate
of decent.
With regained confidence I returned to the pattern a proceded to make
a couple of landings. Again holding 65IAS as precisely as possible I
had two of the best landings in a long time. Gone was the hunting for
the ground while excess speed bled off.
Flying can really be a Zen experience.
John Kerr
Logan UT
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV9-List">http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?RV9-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
9/7/2007 4:40 PM
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: wing gap seal |
Bill,
I agree. Doesn't seem to be a big area for concern. Bill R. Has done it and is
flying, good on him. He likes Goop and has used it a lot, I have more experience
with the 3M weather strip adhesive. Both probably do the same thing equally
well.
I do like the fact that Bill R., you and I are build 9's. Some day we might all
get together at a 9 convention. A conventional geared 9 convention.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Chenoweth
To: rv9-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 3:30 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wing gap seal
Mike,
I guess I'm going to wait on the strip termination technique. We'll be a Sun
n Fun again next year so I should have lots of samples to look at. Thanks for
the glue idea - from what Bill R. said I suspect I can go without for a while
or maybe just glue here and there.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Ice
To: rv9-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:45 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wing gap seal
Bill,
I can't answer how to terminate the strip but perhaps I can help with the glue.
I have used 3M contact cement (yellow) with great success when attaching
rubber parts to Cessnas in the past. Just smear a light coat on each part, let
dry, put them together and they will stick. This glue is real messy so tape off
any place you don't want to glue.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Chenoweth <chenoweth@gwi.net>
Date: Friday, September 7, 2007 3:11 pm
Subject: RV9-List: wing gap seal
To: rv9-list@matronics.com
> I'm trying to figure out how the rubber seal between the wing gap
> seal and the fuselage is terminated along the bottom of the
> fuselage. I'm building a 9 tailwheel so there is no main gear
> fairing to cover the termination.
> Do any of you tailwheel builders have suggestions on how to do
> this or perhaps a picture. Also, is it appropriate or necessary
> to glue the rubber seal to the gap seal? If so, with what?
> Thanks,
> Bill
> Albion, Maine
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 9/7/2007 4:40 PM
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Float on landing |
MessageBill,
Abeam the numbers, what throttle setting are you using? How many RPM's.
Do you know how many RPM's it is that simulates "zero thrust" in the 9?
Have you done any "wheel landings" yet?
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Repucci
To: rv9-list@matronics.com ; 'Kitfox'
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:28 PM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Float on landing
Just to repeat some of the emails John and I exchanged privately this morning...
I've been using 65 MPH since my first flight and now with 40 hours I have not
had a problem with that speed. Abeam the numbers, back comes the power, in goes
all the flaps, and with luck, I never have to touch the throttle again. This
assumes John and my AS are calibrated the same. YMMV. Be careful, if you
are trying these lower speeds on your own.
You can use 60 MPH but that is a bit slow, even by my standards and the sink
rate gets up there. However, in my light (990 lbs) -9 I still have enough energy
to flair. Note, if I was going to try 60 MPH with a -9A, you might want to
be ready with the throttle to help lift the nose a little. With my tail dragger,
that isn't a concern.
Bill
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kerrjohna@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 12:33 PM
To: rv9- list; Kitfox
Subject: RV9-List: Float on landing
after a lengthy discussion on the Kitfox list regarding float on landing and
doing some testing in my kitfox to determine the efficacy of maintaining 1.3 times
stall speed on approach I decided to try the same thing with the RV9.
I climbed to pattern altitude plus 2000 feet and configured for landing: full
flaps 1200 rpm. With this setup I practiced a variety of manuevers that might
be required in landing while maintaining 65IAS. The RV9 was perfectly stable
in all manuevers and indicated 400-450 rate of decent.
With regained confidence I returned to the pattern a proceded to make a couple
of landings. Again holding 65IAS as precisely as possible I had two of the
best landings in a long time. Gone was the hunting for the ground while excess
speed bled off.
Flying can really be a Zen experience.
John Kerr
Logan UT
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV9-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV9-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Float on landing |
Chenoweth wrote:
> Bill,
> Like John I'm also a Kitfox builder/flyer so my frame of reference is
> that. When you say "back comes the power" what do you mean? In my case
> I go to idle, stay high, slip to landing without flaps, and almost never
> touch the power. In something over 300 hours that has worked well. I'm
> using two-stroke power and consider this landing technique good practice
> in case of a power failure. I'm with him on the 1.3 and then a bit less
> on short final.
>
> My assumption is that this technique (idle power and slips) will not be
> appropriate with the 9, right? Also, are you three-pointing, wheel
> landing, or something else. I'm using what amounts to a barely flying
> three-point.
>
> And, thanks for the gap seal info.
> Bill
>
Can't speak for the -9, but it works for Luscombe 8A, Globe/Temco Swift,
C-150 taildragger, Thorp T-18, RV-4, BD-4...And it works works with or
without flaps on the planes that have flaps. (There are a few certified
planes that placard against slips with full flaps.) My biggest gripe
about the -4 is that the rudder is too small to get a decent slip. (I
learned to fly in the Luscombe.) :-)
My experience with the -4 & fixed pitch prop is that anything over an
idle setting (with idle speed set below 700rpm) will result in almost
endless float. The -4 will fly until you run out of gas at around
1500rpm. Anything over ~70mph/60kts results in long rides above the
runway, even at idle power. I'd expect the -9 to be much worse at those
speeds.
*A constant speed prop changes everything.*
Charlie
Message 6
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| Subject: | New Realtime Spell Checker Added To Matronics Forums! |
Dear Listers,
Today 9/8/2007 I have added a new real-time spell checker function to all of the
BBS Forums at Matronics. When you reply or create a new message on the Forums,
you will notice that misspelled words will be high-lighted in yellow. If
you left-click on the word, you will be prompted with a drop-down list of suggested
spellings.
http://forums.matronics.com
Enjoy!
Matt Dralle
Matornics Email List and Forum Administrator
Message 7
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Mike,
You have it lucky up there, your summer time temps are as hot as ours
here in the Carolinas. The Goop trim adhesive seems to hold, regardless
of the OAT's and it remains flexible. That's why I recommend. I'm sure
the 3M product is equally as good.
I'm game to get the -9's together.
On our return from the beach we stopped at a local airport for cheep
fuel ($3.75/gal) and they had a big fly-in (Sky raider, P-51, DC-3, and
a bunch of home builts.) We pulled up to the pumps, filled up, and left
but in that time I was asked if my -9 was an RV-4, 6, 7, or 8, Swift,
and a few others. One guy asked why I put a new cowling on my plane.
He looked dumbfounded when I told him it was to match the new plane it
was attached to. I don't think he understood even after I mentioned
that I just finished building it. :D
Keep pounding those rivets guys, this -9 is one VERY nice flying bird!
Bill
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael T. Ice
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 12:16 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wing gap seal
Bill,
I agree. Doesn't seem to be a big area for concern. Bill R. Has done it
and is flying, good on him. He likes Goop and has used it a lot, I have
more experience with the 3M weather strip adhesive. Both probably do the
same thing equally well.
I do like the fact that Bill R., you and I are build 9's. Some day we
might all get together at a 9 convention. A conventional geared 9
convention.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Chenoweth <mailto:chenoweth@gwi.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 3:30 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wing gap seal
Mike,
I guess I'm going to wait on the strip termination technique. We'll be
a Sun n Fun again next year so I should have lots of samples to look at.
Thanks for the glue idea - from what Bill R. said I suspect I can go
without for a while or maybe just glue here and there.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Ice <mailto:aurbo@ak.net>
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:45 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wing gap seal
Bill,
I can't answer how to terminate the strip but perhaps I can help with
the glue. I have used 3M contact cement (yellow) with great success when
attaching rubber parts to Cessnas in the past. Just smear a light coat
on each part, let dry, put them together and they will stick. This glue
is real messy so tape off any place you don't want to glue.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Chenoweth <chenoweth@gwi.net>
Subject: RV9-List: wing gap seal
> I'm trying to figure out how the rubber seal between the wing gap
> seal and the fuselage is terminated along the bottom of the
> fuselage. I'm building a 9 tailwheel so there is no main gear
> fairing to cover the termination.
> Do any of you tailwheel builders have suggestions on how to do
> this or perhaps a picture. Also, is it appropriate or necessary
> to glue the rubber seal to the gap seal? If so, with what?
> Thanks,
> Bill
> Albion, Maine
_____
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Float on landing |
Mike,
Abeam the numbers I'm at 1000 AGL, throttle to idle, drop all the flaps
in and trim it for 65.
Originally I tried 10 degrees abeam the numbers, 20 on base, and 30 on
final but I found this works better. It also keeps my patterns very
close and tight.
My preferred landing is a three point but I am starting to wheel land
this thing. Wheel landings are probably best but I still need to work
on them.
The airport I fly out of is 2300 feet long by 30 feet wide. Last night
I wheel landed it on, touched down at about 300 feet, held the tail up
until there was no more up elevator, my roll was probably close to 1000
feet, maybe less. No brakes were used and never really are, except to
turn around.
Last weekend I took a guy for a ride who owns a Citabria and I was going
to let him take off until I realized he couldn't hold a straight line
while taxing on grass. The VS and rudder on the -9 is VERY effective
but not touchy, IMHO. It will do well in a cross wind.
BTW, I regularly do full deflection slips at 65 MPH. Another nice thing
about the airport I fly out of are the beautiful trees at each end.
The -9 really, really, really likes to float so speed control seems to
be everything!
Today I did an approach at 60 MPH. I don't recommend that as you are
right on the edge of a high sink rate or stall. You would be much
better holding 60 w/ power and fly it down behind the power curve to a
landing. Mike, with the tundra tires you are going to install on your
-9, you can give that a try.
Here is some incentive for those you who are still building...
Nora and I flew the -9 down to North Myrtle Beach (CRE) for lunch. It
took less than an hour each way. By 11 we had our feet in the ocean,
lunch at 1, back in the plane at 2:30 and enjoying the Charlotte Greek
Festival with friends by 5. She is currently looking at maps to find
other places we can fly to.
Bill
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael T. Ice
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 12:20 PM
Subject: ***SPAM*** Re: RV9-List: Float on landing
Bill,
Abeam the numbers, what throttle setting are you using? How many RPM's.
Do you know how many RPM's it is that simulates "zero thrust" in the 9?
Have you done any "wheel landings" yet?
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Repucci <mailto:bill@repucci.com>
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:28 PM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Float on landing
Just to repeat some of the emails John and I exchanged privately this
morning...
I've been using 65 MPH since my first flight and now with 40 hours I
have not had a problem with that speed. Abeam the numbers, back comes
the power, in goes all the flaps, and with luck, I never have to touch
the throttle again. This assumes John and my AS are calibrated the
same. YMMV. Be careful, if you are trying these lower speeds on your
own.
You can use 60 MPH but that is a bit slow, even by my standards and the
sink rate gets up there. However, in my light (990 lbs) -9 I still have
enough energy to flair. Note, if I was going to try 60 MPH with a -9A,
you might want to be ready with the throttle to help lift the nose a
little. With my tail dragger, that isn't a concern.
Bill
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
kerrjohna@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 12:33 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Float on landing
after a lengthy discussion on the Kitfox list regarding float on landing
and doing some testing in my kitfox to determine the efficacy of
maintaining 1.3 times stall speed on approach I decided to try the same
thing with the RV9.
I climbed to pattern altitude plus 2000 feet and configured for landing:
full flaps 1200 rpm. With this setup I practiced a variety of manuevers
that might be required in landing while maintaining 65IAS. The RV9 was
perfectly stable in all manuevers and indicated 400-450 rate of decent.
With regained confidence I returned to the pattern a proceded to make a
couple of landings. Again holding 65IAS as precisely as possible I had
two of the best landings in a long time. Gone was the hunting for the
ground while excess speed bled off.
Flying can really be a Zen experience.
John Kerr
Logan UT
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV9-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV9-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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