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1. 06:26 AM - Re: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters (Weston, Jim)
2. 07:48 AM - Re: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters (Don Walker)
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| Subject: | Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters |
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Weston, Jim" <Jim.Weston@delta.com>
Thanks to everyone for all of the feedback.
Don...You say that yours ran as smooth as a sewing machine until this
week. Did installing richer main jets cause it to run rough? Mine
humms along smoothly also. Wouldn't want to lose that.
I've thought several times about installing an oil cooler, since when I
run higher RPM the oil temp seems to rise first, followed by the engine
temp. Haven't gotten around to the oil cooler yet.
I've also been studying prop pitch settings, since Mykal at Stratus
recommended that I start with a 17.5 degree pitch to keep the rpm down
(I've never run it that high). Someone sent around a nice spreadsheet
with graph curves that has really helped in trying different pitch
settings and checking the performance curves as I make the changes. It
even tells you if you need to increase the pitch or decrease it to head
toward your goal. I collected this spreadsheet months ago. Does anyone
know if there is a more recent version? If accurate, it is good. It's
for a 601HDS.
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Don Walker
Subject: Re: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Don Walker" <d3dw@msn.com>
Jim, You might check your jet size compared to this report. Mine came
from Stratus with smaller main jets...162 rather than the 164 reported
here. Mine ran smooth as a sewing machine until this week when I changed
the jetting. I put in a 165 main, which seems to do well, and enriched
the mid-range two notches. Now I am going to do what you did...bring the
mid-range back up to the third notch. Also remember that some here are
getting more air flow with the Ram heads. don walker----- Original
Message -----
From: Weston, Jim<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com>
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2004 12:55 PM
Subject: RE: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Weston, Jim"
<Jim.Weston@delta.com<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com>>
So am I to take it that everyone has been finding that the jets are
too
lean at cruise, as the engine comes from Stratus? I don't have EGT
gauges. This might explain why I've never been able to run at high
RPM
for long before the temps (engine & oil) start to climb. I changed my
mid-range needle to the 3rd ring, some time back, and this helped
some.
Jim Weston
601HDS, Stratus
Concord, Ga.
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server
@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde,
Frank George (Corvallis)
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>
Subject: RE: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com<mailto:frank.hinde@hp.com>>
Your experience pretty much mirros mine Larry, the only difference is
I
ended up with a cruise EGT of 1450. The mixture were confirmed correct
by the exhaust gas analyser.
I can't remember what jets I ended up with finally.
Thanks
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server
@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry
McFarland
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland"
--> <larrymc@qconline.com<mailto:larrymc@qconline.com>>
Hi guys, (fellow Stratus EA-81 users)
I think it's time to put the experience of re-jetting Stratus-Bing
carbs
into the archives. Perhaps it'll reduce your time and expense of
"discovery". The "Bing Carburettors Aircraft Tuning & Parts Manual" is
needed to fully visualize this information. Bing can be reached at
1-800-309-2464 weekdays and it's only $8.00. (Yes, the spelling is
correct) The manual is a good parts-identifier and primer for getting
correct mixture, but you have to do the guesswork till it's right, so
for the Stratus, that's what this piece is about.
My Stratus engine with Bing carburetor's initially came with No.40
idle
mixture-jets adjusted 2-turns from closed, 164 main jets and 2.72
mid-range jets. (Note; all jets have the number stamped on each one.)
The mid-range jet-needles came with 2 scribed rings on their diameters
for identification and on the jet-needle 4 snap-ring notches, the
circlips were set at the #2 position or second notch from the top.
Ram Performance installed new S.S. valves, springs and guides. The
rework also provides more airflow, so increased jet sizes are
recommended by Ron at Ram to get a target cruise EGT of 1350-degrees.
Mykal at Stratus says 1400 to 1500 degrees is fine with an upper limit
short duration 1600-degrees.
With high EGTs, I changed to 170 main jets. EGTs came down, but were
too high for takeoff rpms. 180 main jets were tried but the engine ran
rough with these.
With 174 mains, the plane flew well. EGTs reached 1400 degrees at 4200
rpm. (Still too high for higher rpms) The mid-range jet-needle was set
higher to enrich fuel mixture by moving the circlip from #2 notch down
to the #3 notch. This made a serious difference and I could cruise at
4600 rpm all day at 1390 degrees EGT. At full 5100, the EGT would
still
slowly climb above 1450-degrees, which I felt might be high for
continuous running.
Without initially knowing, I changed out the air filters to K&N types
because of concern for the foam. This reduced air resistance into the
carburetors, provided more air, leaner mixture and increased EGTs.
Cool
weather also seemed to increase EGTs.
On a Bing phone inquiry/discussion, the technical rep was surprised I
had not yet increased mid-range jetting and suggested I replace 2.72
with 2.76 jets and lower the needles one notch to see if the
equivalent
of a one-jet change would work. 174 mains were also changed to 176
jets. A 3500-rpm run-up with brakes brought EGTs to 1400-degrees
rather
quickly. The needle jet was then raised by re-setting the circlip
down
to #3 notch and the EGTs climbed to 1290 at 3500-rpm, but no higher.
Quite a difference!
Was anxious to fly these jet and needle settings to see what happens
at
higher rpms. Today, at 40-degrees, winds at 10, I taxied to 31 and
holding short, watched pre-heated oil reach 240 until clearance was
given for takeoff. Climb out was impressive, and EGTs were slow to
climb to 1450 at 5100, so I reduced rpms to 4400 and turned south to
the
practice area and EGTs came down to 1435. Rpms were lowered to a
comfortable 4300 and EGTs stabilized at 1420. The largest change from
increasing jet sizes was the slow mid range climb through 1400 on
takeoff. I flew an hour and then returned to land on 27. All other
temps were normal throughout the flight.
Back at the hangar, the K&N type air filters were removed and replaced
with the original foam types to see if they would make a difference.
Went home for lunch. Afterward, I refueled the plane and taxied out
in
16 mph winds to lift off very quickly from 31. The EGT rise was
slower
and never got past 1420 on takeoff. After leveling the plane, I
headed
south for 15 minutes. Rpms were set back to 4350 and EGTs settled in
at
1375. There's still about a 40-degree difference from the right to
left
sides. I tried raising the rpms to 5000 and the EGTs would level out
at
1425. The old foam filters had a much greater impact on mixture than
I'd have thought. EGTs are satisfactory to this point as I can cruise
at 115 to 120 without getting much beyond a 1400-degree limit.
My Engine timing is set to 30-degrees at 4500 rpm. I haven't seen
evidence that re-timing 1 or 2 degrees either way helped it run
better.
Plugs soot up at idle and plug color doesn't offer exact information,
so
I purchased a high-compression Colortune plug from Bing. This will
permit actually seeing the mixture and rpms from idle to 4000, but no
further. Haven't used it yet as focus has been on the high end and
getting Horsepower at lower EGTs. I expect to install an O2 sensor to
confirm running mixtures when the jet settings have been flown.
EGT sensors are installed 3-1/2" from the exhaust flange in the top of
the first straight after the bend. They are a probe-type secured by a
hose-clamp that also grips a belting heat wrap on the exhaust pipes to
protect the cowling.
All engine data is displayed on a Grand Rapids Technologies E I S.
This
thing is indispensable for showing all real-time engine parameters and
immediately displaying an alarm-light while pointing out any
out-of-limit condition. It's an easy set-up too!
Earlier this season, the radiator was moved back as a P51,
to where it was and it works very well.
Please forgive the lengthy diatribe, but the archives needed specific
jet and needle setting information for this engine. That's as much as
I
know at this time. If you've been there done that, have a comment or
objection, please do, so we can all compare notes and learn from the
collective experience.
Thanks guys,
Larry McFarland - 601HDS with Stratus Subaru and Ram Performance heads
at www.macsmachine.com<http://www.macsmachine.com/>
_
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters |
Seal-Send-Time: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 09:33:57 -0600
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Don Walker" <d3dw@msn.com>
Hi Jim,
The main jet seems to be good at 165 on mine...a change from the 162. It ran
rough last week with the midrange on the bottom notch. Last weekend I moved that
up to the third, just like yours and that is working well. I also took a lot
of time balancing the carbs.
To summarize, mine ran very smoothly with the 162 but I knew it was at least
slightly lean in the mid and high ranges...particularly in cooler weather. Now
I am pleased to say the engine is running better...smoother than ever throughout
the throttle range and seems to have better power. The roughness at the
2800 rpm setting was reduced to negligible. I am beginning to think much of any
roughness in the midrange was due to a little carb imbalance. It has always
been smooth above 3800 until backing off the power. Now it is much smoother in
backing off the power throughout the range.
Regarding oil temps...I hear many running oil temps higher. Just a note...with
a heat muff and an adjustable door in front of my oil pan, my oil temps never
exceed 190 even in the hot summer, though the head will get up to 215 in a
climb. don
----- Original Message -----
From: Weston, Jim<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com>
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2004 8:26 AM
Subject: RE: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Weston, Jim" <Jim.Weston@delta.com<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com>>
Thanks to everyone for all of the feedback.
Don...You say that yours ran as smooth as a sewing machine until this
week. Did installing richer main jets cause it to run rough? Mine
humms along smoothly also. Wouldn't want to lose that.
I've thought several times about installing an oil cooler, since when I
run higher RPM the oil temp seems to rise first, followed by the engine
temp. Haven't gotten around to the oil cooler yet.
I've also been studying prop pitch settings, since Mykal at Stratus
recommended that I start with a 17.5 degree pitch to keep the rpm down
(I've never run it that high). Someone sent around a nice spreadsheet
with graph curves that has really helped in trying different pitch
settings and checking the performance curves as I make the changes. It
even tells you if you need to increase the pitch or decrease it to head
toward your goal. I collected this spreadsheet months ago. Does anyone
know if there is a more recent version? If accurate, it is good. It's
for a 601HDS.
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Don Walker
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Re: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Don Walker" <d3dw@msn.com<mailto:d3dw@msn.com>>
Jim, You might check your jet size compared to this report. Mine came
from Stratus with smaller main jets...162 rather than the 164 reported
here. Mine ran smooth as a sewing machine until this week when I changed
the jetting. I put in a 165 main, which seems to do well, and enriched
the mid-range two notches. Now I am going to do what you did...bring the
mid-range back up to the third notch. Also remember that some here are
getting more air flow with the Ram heads. don walker----- Original
Message -----
From: Weston, Jim<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com>>
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>>
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2004 12:55 PM
Subject: RE: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Weston, Jim"
<Jim.Weston@delta.com<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com<mailto:Jim.Weston@deltacom<mailto:Jim.Weston@delta.com>>>
So am I to take it that everyone has been finding that the jets are
too
lean at cruise, as the engine comes from Stratus? I don't have EGT
gauges. This might explain why I've never been able to run at high
RPM
for long before the temps (engine & oil) start to climb. I changed my
mid-range needle to the 3rd ring, some time back, and this helped
some.
Jim Weston
601HDS, Stratus
Concord, Ga.
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server>
@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde,
Frank George (Corvallis)
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>>
Subject: RE: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
--> <frank.hinde@hp.com<mailto:frank.hinde@hp.com<mailto:frank.hinde@hp.com<mailto:frank.hinde@hp.com>>>
Your experience pretty much mirros mine Larry, the only difference is
I
ended up with a cruise EGT of 1450. The mixture were confirmed correct
by the exhaust gas analyser.
I can't remember what jets I ended up with finally.
Thanks
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-stratus-list-server>
@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-stratus-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry
McFarland
To: stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com<mailto:stratus-list@matronics.com>>
Subject: Stratus-List: Jetting Stratus Bing Carbureters
--> Stratus-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland"
--> <larrymc@qconline.com<mailto:larrymc@qconline.com<mailto:larrymc@qconlinecom<mailto:larrymc@qconline.com>>>
Hi guys, (fellow Stratus EA-81 users)
I think it's time to put the experience of re-jetting Stratus-Bing
carbs
into the archives. Perhaps it'll reduce your time and expense of
"discovery". The "Bing Carburettors Aircraft Tuning & Parts Manual" is
needed to fully visualize this information. Bing can be reached at
1-800-309-2464 weekdays and it's only $8.00. (Yes, the spelling is
correct) The manual is a good parts-identifier and primer for getting
correct mixture, but you have to do the guesswork till it's right, so
for the Stratus, that's what this piece is about.
My Stratus engine with Bing carburetor's initially came with No.40
idle
mixture-jets adjusted 2-turns from closed, 164 main jets and 2.72
mid-range jets. (Note; all jets have the number stamped on each one.)
The mid-range jet-needles came with 2 scribed rings on their diameters
for identification and on the jet-needle 4 snap-ring notches, the
circlips were set at the #2 position or second notch from the top.
Ram Performance installed new S.S. valves, springs and guides. The
rework also provides more airflow, so increased jet sizes are
recommended by Ron at Ram to get a target cruise EGT of 1350-degrees.
Mykal at Stratus says 1400 to 1500 degrees is fine with an upper limit
short duration 1600-degrees.
With high EGTs, I changed to 170 main jets. EGTs came down, but were
too high for takeoff rpms. 180 main jets were tried but the engine ran
rough with these.
With 174 mains, the plane flew well. EGTs reached 1400 degrees at 4200
rpm. (Still too high for higher rpms) The mid-range jet-needle was set
higher to enrich fuel mixture by moving the circlip from #2 notch down
to the #3 notch. This made a serious difference and I could cruise at
4600 rpm all day at 1390 degrees EGT. At full 5100, the EGT would
still
slowly climb above 1450-degrees, which I felt might be high for
continuous running.
Without initially knowing, I changed out the air filters to K&N types
because of concern for the foam. This reduced air resistance into the
carburetors, provided more air, leaner mixture and increased EGTs.
Cool
weather also seemed to increase EGTs.
On a Bing phone inquiry/discussion, the technical rep was surprised I
had not yet increased mid-range jetting and suggested I replace 2.72
with 2.76 jets and lower the needles one notch to see if the
equivalent
of a one-jet change would work. 174 mains were also changed to 176
jets. A 3500-rpm run-up with brakes brought EGTs to 1400-degrees
rather
quickly. The needle jet was then raised by re-setting the circlip
down
to #3 notch and the EGTs climbed to 1290 at 3500-rpm, but no higher.
Quite a difference!
Was anxious to fly these jet and needle settings to see what happens
at
higher rpms. Today, at 40-degrees, winds at 10, I taxied to 31 and
holding short, watched pre-heated oil reach 240 until clearance was
given for takeoff. Climb out was impressive, and EGTs were slow to
climb to 1450 at 5100, so I reduced rpms to 4400 and turned south to
the
practice area and EGTs came down to 1435. Rpms were lowered to a
comfortable 4300 and EGTs stabilized at 1420. The largest change from
increasing jet sizes was the slow mid range climb through 1400 on
takeoff. I flew an hour and then returned to land on 27. All other
temps were normal throughout the flight.
Back at the hangar, the K&N type air filters were removed and replaced
with the original foam types to see if they would make a difference.
Went home for lunch. Afterward, I refueled the plane and taxied out
in
16 mph winds to lift off very quickly from 31. The EGT rise was
slower
and never got past 1420 on takeoff. After leveling the plane, I
headed
south for 15 minutes. Rpms were set back to 4350 and EGTs settled in
at
1375. There's still about a 40-degree difference from the right to
left
sides. I tried raising the rpms to 5000 and the EGTs would level out
at
1425. The old foam filters had a much greater impact on mixture than
I'd have thought. EGTs are satisfactory to this point as I can cruise
at 115 to 120 without getting much beyond a 1400-degree limit.
My Engine timing is set to 30-degrees at 4500 rpm. I haven't seen
evidence that re-timing 1 or 2 degrees either way helped it run
better.
Plugs soot up at idle and plug color doesn't offer exact information,
so
I purchased a high-compression Colortune plug from Bing. This will
permit actually seeing the mixture and rpms from idle to 4000, but no
further. Haven't used it yet as focus has been on the high end and
getting Horsepower at lower EGTs. I expect to install an O2 sensor to
confirm running mixtures when the jet settings have been flown.
EGT sensors are installed 3-1/2" from the exhaust flange in the top of
the first straight after the bend. They are a probe-type secured by a
hose-clamp that also grips a belting heat wrap on the exhaust pipes to
protect the cowling.
All engine data is displayed on a Grand Rapids Technologies E I S.
This
thing is indispensable for showing all real-time engine parameters and
immediately displaying an alarm-light while pointing out any
out-of-limit condition. It's an easy set-up too!
Earlier this season, the radiator was moved back as a P51,
to where it was and it works very well.
Please forgive the lengthy diatribe, but the archives needed specific
jet and needle setting information for this engine. That's as much as
I
know at this time. If you've been there done that, have a comment or
objection, please do, so we can all compare notes and learn from the
collective experience.
Thanks guys,
Larry McFarland - 601HDS with Stratus Subaru and Ram Performance heads
at www.macsmachine.com<http://www.macsmachine.com/<http://www.macsmachine.com<http://www.macsmachine.com/>>
_
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