Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 08:08 AM - Main gear socket (USAviator1@aol.com)
2. 10:28 AM - Re: Main gear socket (Jim and Donna Clement)
3. 10:33 AM - Re: Main gear socket (USAviator1@aol.com)
4. 10:49 AM - Re: Main gear socket (Jim and Donna Clement)
5. 06:02 PM - Re: panel and fuel tank (William Bernard)
6. 06:21 PM - Re: panel and fuel tank (Rick and Cindy)
7. 06:43 PM - Re: panel and fuel tank was Re: hot steel (Eric Schlanser)
8. 07:57 PM - Re: Re: panel and fuel tank was Re: hot steel (Jim and Donna Clement)
9. 08:09 PM - Re: panel and fuel tank (Richard Lamb)
10. 08:21 PM - Strap bolts Supplier (Larry)
11. 08:21 PM - Re: panel and fuel tank (Jim and Donna Clement)
12. 08:25 PM - Re: Re: panel and fuel tank was Re: hot steel (Bill newkirk)
13. 08:51 PM - Re: Re: panel and fuel tank was Re: hot steel (Jim and Donna Clement)
14. 10:10 PM - Re: panel and fuel tank (Richard Lamb)
15. 10:18 PM - Re: floor boards - was hot steel? (Richard Lamb)
16. 11:29 PM - Re: Re: panel and fuel tank (Fred Weaver)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Main gear socket |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: USAviator1@aol.com
Jim C., I made this gear socket off of the drawings I got from you. Does it
look like it is supposed to?
Thanks,
Steve -in Michigan
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Main gear socket |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Steve, Is it the tri gear? I think that's what you are building, also is it
the RV 6A gear or the TW you are using? Don't know what yours looks like.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: <USAviator1@aol.com>
Subject: Tailwind-List: Main gear socket
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: USAviator1@aol.com
>
> Jim C., I made this gear socket off of the drawings I got from you. Does
it
> look like it is supposed to?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Steve -in Michigan
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Main gear socket |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: USAviator1@aol.com
Jim, I am building the TRI gear version. Yes, I am using the RV6A gear. Did
you get the pic I sent?
Steve
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Main gear socket |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
No pic, how did you send it?
----- Original Message -----
From: <USAviator1@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: Main gear socket
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: USAviator1@aol.com
>
> Jim, I am building the TRI gear version. Yes, I am using the RV6A gear.
Did
> you get the pic I sent?
>
> Steve
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "William Bernard" <billbernard@worldnet.att.net>
I've been following this thread with some interest, since I'm at this stage
too.
I'm planning to support the tank with 1" straps of 0.025 stainless steel
(left over from control surface construction). The forward end will be
secured to the top tube at the firewall by wrapping around the tube and
bolting through a tab. I saw in Jim Clement's photos that he welds a short
length of 3/8" tubing onto a cross tube about 2-3 inches ahead of the door
post. Myu question is, then what happens? How is the aft end of the tank
strap terminated? In the newsletter, Jim Stanton just bent over the end of
a 0.040" strap and put a bolt through it, but I would like some provision to
control the tension on the strap.
Thanks for the thoughts.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
<168x@merr.com>
>
> Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
height.
> Jim
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dallas Benham" <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> >
> > Richard and Jim:
> >
> > Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> construction.
> > Hope it helps.
> >
> > Dallas
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Rick and Cindy" <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > >
> > > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of
> fuel tank
> > > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
1/8"
> tall,
> > > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > > Rick N393RC
> > >
> > > john wrote:
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john" <frmrjohn@netonecom.net>
> > > >
> > > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel
at
> > > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
which
> > > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows
> have
> > > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2"
> above the
> > > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What
is
> > > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> Thankyou.
> > > > JohnD
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
Bill: I'll send you a couple of pics.
Rick N393RC
William Bernard wrote:
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "William Bernard" <billbernard@worldnet.att.net>
>
> I've been following this thread with some interest, since I'm at this stage
> too.
>
> I'm planning to support the tank with 1" straps of 0.025 stainless steel
> (left over from control surface construction). The forward end will be
> secured to the top tube at the firewall by wrapping around the tube and
> bolting through a tab. I saw in Jim Clement's photos that he welds a short
> length of 3/8" tubing onto a cross tube about 2-3 inches ahead of the door
> post. Myu question is, then what happens? How is the aft end of the tank
> strap terminated? In the newsletter, Jim Stanton just bent over the end of
> a 0.040" strap and put a bolt through it, but I would like some provision to
> control the tension on the strap.
>
> Thanks for the thoughts.
>
> Bill
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
> >
> > Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
> height.
> > Jim
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dallas Benham" <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> > <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> > >
> > > Richard and Jim:
> > >
> > > Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> > construction.
> > > Hope it helps.
> > >
> > > Dallas
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Rick and Cindy" <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> > <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > > >
> > > > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of
> > fuel tank
> > > > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
> 1/8"
> > tall,
> > > > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > > > Rick N393RC
> > > >
> > > > john wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john" <frmrjohn@netonecom.net>
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel
> at
> > > > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
> which
> > > > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows
> > have
> > > > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2"
> > above the
> > > > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What
> is
> > > > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> > Thankyou.
> > > > > JohnD
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: Eric Schlanser <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
Group, This thread is too good to file under "hot steel". I just needed to re-enter
it so it can be located later in an archive search under "panel and fuel
tank". Thanks. Eric
From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Richard, Fred is right on hinging, forget it. Put two screws on each side,
remove and the panel is loose. Mount the radio trays so they stay with the
panel. Curve the top of the panel at least one inch to prevent oil canning
of the top panel.
.025 is to heavy for the firewall. I like to use 28 gauge, about .015. Wicks
or Spruce have SS in about .017. If you want, 28 gauge galvanized can be
bought locally at a sheet metal shop, it works fine but not as pretty.
The alum side panels, roll the bottoms around the longerons 1 1/2" and
fasten to the lower boot cowl. Sandwich the side windows between the side
boot cowl and the top instrument panel with screws going into the instrument
top panel. I make the top panel in three pieces, the sides about six inches
wide.
1/2" tube is fine for the W/S frame but use .028 or .035. Weld tabs to screw
the W/S to. I will measure how high my panel is and distance from the floor
when I go to the airport today. Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Lamb"
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
>
> He never lets me have any fun :(
>
> I still like that cross tube tho.
> It's even a handy spot to secure a (hurrump) non-folding panel.
>
> I'll tell ya what, tho.
> Jim commented about making the tank easily removable.
> I'll take that one at face value.
> The only thing under the tank are the mount straps
> and the fuel line.
>
> I've had the front cabin side panels clecoed on.
> Trying to get a feel for how to get everything flush and
> rolled around to the bottom. That's interesting.
>
> I need a firewall material, and, of course, want stainless.
> The .025 stuff I've seem locally is twice too heavy.
> Any alternate source for .017??
>
> This weekend, I bent the windshield frame for the parasol.
> 1/2" .040 4130 tube. Came out pretty nice. I think I
> see how to form the winshield frame for the TW now.
> By comparison, that will be easy.
>
> Door skins and windows and frames, oh my!
> Especially the back window.
> I think I see now why the long pointy one is so popular!
>
>
> Fred Weaver wrote:
> >
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Fred Weaver"
> >
> > Yo Richard... You really don't need the hinged panel. Hinging the panel
is
> > just a lot more engineering and you will find out with time, that you
don't
> > need it at all. Simplify your design by screwing it together... It's
not
> > like you are loading the thing with GPS, Autopilot, Radios(plural) etc
> > etc... The stuff you install will be fairly accessible thru the top
cover
> > of the dash.
> >
> > Once the plane flies, you will be spending lots of time in the air and
you
> > won't be doinking around pivoting your panel down for maintenance.
> > Honest.....
> > Weav
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Richard Lamb
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> > >
> > > Thanks Jim.
> > >
> > > Actually, that bottom tube looks pretty handy.
> > > It's located back three inches from the door frame tube.
> > >
> > > I have moved the panel aft.
> > > The panel itself is back 5 or 6 inches from the door frame.
> > > There's no obstructions at all for the top row, and the cross
> > > tube is 8 or 9 inches (?) in front of the panel.
> > > Think that will be enough room?
> > >
> > > Some of those panel drawing I did think that lower cross tube
> > > would be exactly the right spot to hinge mount an instrument panel.
> > >
> > > The throttle at high center, and the radios in the top of the panel
> > > would have to be mounted permenately. But the rest of the panel
> > > could easily swing down. Having the pivot point back behind the
> > > panel that far lets all the gauges swing clear without hitting
> > > anything. The Tailwind panel is fairly small, and the floors
> > > fairly comfortable without a stick sticking in my back.
> > > Still, it's an intriguing idea.
> > >
> > > You know better than most people how far back behind that thing
> > > you have to go sometimes...
> > >
> > >
> > > Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > <168x@merr.com>
> > > >
> > > > Richard, Cut the bottom tube out also, then you can make the panel
to
> > your
> > > > liking. Bring it back enough to get things in with out hitting the
fuel
> > > > tank. Jim
Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
Richard and Jim:
Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind construction.
Hope it helps.
Dallas
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick and Cindy"
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
>
> JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of fuel tank
> (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8 1/8" tall,
> top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> Rick N393RC
>
> john wrote:
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john"
> >
> > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel at
> > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel, which
> > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows have
> > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2" above the
> > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What is
> > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank? Thankyou.
> > JohnD
From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank height.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dallas Benham"
Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
From: "Louis Owen"
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Louis Owen"
My floor to tank bottom was 13". I have rather big feet.
Lou Owen
---------------------------------
Message 8
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|
| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Bill, They make a strap bolt just for fuel tank straps. I buy them for about
$2-3 each from the hardware vender at OSH. Forget the name, he is the one
with lots of stuff in a big tent. Also sells cowhides. Someone here will
come up with his name, from Wichita area. It is a three inch tee bolt. you
put a hole in your strap, then bend the short end around and either weld or
rivet to itself.
Make your tank 12" from the floor and pound a sump [big dent about 1/2"
deep, 6-7" diameter] with a outlet welded in. start bending the tank
gradually up towards the inst. panel within 2-3" from the rear edge of the
sump. Reason being, if the tank is flat beyond the fuel pickup, fuel runs
towards the rear of the tank and pulls fuel out of and away from the pickup.
This happens when take off is attempted with low fuel, 6-7 gallons or so.
Make the tank same width, don't try to taper to match the fuselage
dimension. Give yourself no less than 1/2" clearance on each side, they seem
to grow during construction and welding. You might have to cut off the upper
corners in the front as the engine mount bolts may hit. Put the vent in the
filler neck. Use a short rubber hose to connect filler cap assy. to filler
neck. Fuel proof hose can be bought at NAPA store. Use a mechanical fuel
gauge sender that measures ohms to the electric guage. Mount the sender in
the top of the tank, make sure it clears the center baffle. I have had three
probe type senders and they are junk as far as I am concerned. Stainless
makes a nice fuel tank strap but another is steel strapping used to crate
things. Just about any dumpster at a manufacturing plant has lots of it.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Schlanser" <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
Subject: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Eric Schlanser <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
>
>
> Group, This thread is too good to file under "hot steel". I just needed to
re-enter it so it can be located later in an archive search under "panel and
fuel tank". Thanks. Eric
> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
>
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
<168x@merr.com>
>
> Richard, Fred is right on hinging, forget it. Put two screws on each side,
> remove and the panel is loose. Mount the radio trays so they stay with the
> panel. Curve the top of the panel at least one inch to prevent oil canning
> of the top panel.
> .025 is to heavy for the firewall. I like to use 28 gauge, about .015.
Wicks
> or Spruce have SS in about .017. If you want, 28 gauge galvanized can be
> bought locally at a sheet metal shop, it works fine but not as pretty.
> The alum side panels, roll the bottoms around the longerons 1 1/2" and
> fasten to the lower boot cowl. Sandwich the side windows between the side
> boot cowl and the top instrument panel with screws going into the
instrument
> top panel. I make the top panel in three pieces, the sides about six
inches
> wide.
> 1/2" tube is fine for the W/S frame but use .028 or .035. Weld tabs to
screw
> the W/S to. I will measure how high my panel is and distance from the
floor
> when I go to the airport today. Jim
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Lamb"
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
>
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> >
> > He never lets me have any fun :(
> >
> > I still like that cross tube tho.
> > It's even a handy spot to secure a (hurrump) non-folding panel.
> >
> > I'll tell ya what, tho.
> > Jim commented about making the tank easily removable.
> > I'll take that one at face value.
> > The only thing under the tank are the mount straps
> > and the fuel line.
> >
> > I've had the front cabin side panels clecoed on.
> > Trying to get a feel for how to get everything flush and
> > rolled around to the bottom. That's interesting.
> >
> > I need a firewall material, and, of course, want stainless.
> > The .025 stuff I've seem locally is twice too heavy.
> > Any alternate source for .017??
> >
> > This weekend, I bent the windshield frame for the parasol.
> > 1/2" .040 4130 tube. Came out pretty nice. I think I
> > see how to form the winshield frame for the TW now.
> > By comparison, that will be easy.
> >
> > Door skins and windows and frames, oh my!
> > Especially the back window.
> > I think I see now why the long pointy one is so popular!
> >
> >
> > Fred Weaver wrote:
> > >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Fred Weaver"
> > >
> > > Yo Richard... You really don't need the hinged panel. Hinging the
panel
> is
> > > just a lot more engineering and you will find out with time, that you
> don't
> > > need it at all. Simplify your design by screwing it together... It's
> not
> > > like you are loading the thing with GPS, Autopilot, Radios(plural) etc
> > > etc... The stuff you install will be fairly accessible thru the top
> cover
> > > of the dash.
> > >
> > > Once the plane flies, you will be spending lots of time in the air and
> you
> > > won't be doinking around pivoting your panel down for maintenance.
> > > Honest.....
> > > Weav
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Richard Lamb
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> > > >
> > > > Thanks Jim.
> > > >
> > > > Actually, that bottom tube looks pretty handy.
> > > > It's located back three inches from the door frame tube.
> > > >
> > > > I have moved the panel aft.
> > > > The panel itself is back 5 or 6 inches from the door frame.
> > > > There's no obstructions at all for the top row, and the cross
> > > > tube is 8 or 9 inches (?) in front of the panel.
> > > > Think that will be enough room?
> > > >
> > > > Some of those panel drawing I did think that lower cross tube
> > > > would be exactly the right spot to hinge mount an instrument panel.
> > > >
> > > > The throttle at high center, and the radios in the top of the panel
> > > > would have to be mounted permenately. But the rest of the panel
> > > > could easily swing down. Having the pivot point back behind the
> > > > panel that far lets all the gauges swing clear without hitting
> > > > anything. The Tailwind panel is fairly small, and the floors
> > > > fairly comfortable without a stick sticking in my back.
> > > > Still, it's an intriguing idea.
> > > >
> > > > You know better than most people how far back behind that thing
> > > > you have to go sometimes...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > > <168x@merr.com>
> > > > >
> > > > > Richard, Cut the bottom tube out also, then you can make the panel
> to
> > > your
> > > > > liking. Bring it back enough to get things in with out hitting the
> fuel
> > > > > tank. Jim
> Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
>
> Richard and Jim:
>
> Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
construction.
> Hope it helps.
>
> Dallas
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rick and Cindy"
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> >
> > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of
fuel tank
> > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8 1/8"
tall,
> > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > Rick N393RC
> >
> > john wrote:
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john"
> > >
> > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel at
> > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel, which
> > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows
have
> > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2" above
the
> > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What is
> > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
Thankyou.
> > > JohnD
> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
<168x@merr.com>
>
> Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
height.
> Jim
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dallas Benham"
> Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
>
> From: "Louis Owen"
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Louis Owen"
>
> My floor to tank bottom was 13". I have rather big feet.
> Lou Owen
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
Message 9
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|
| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb <lamb01@flash.net>
An aluminum tank with tight steel straps...
Somebody please tell me it's ok to pad between them?
On the other hand, seems like guys are carpeting the
tank these days. Sure looks nice, but could also be
the stap cushions...
William Bernard wrote:
>
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "William Bernard" <billbernard@worldnet.att.net>
>
> I've been following this thread with some interest, since I'm at this stage
> too.
>
> I'm planning to support the tank with 1" straps of 0.025 stainless steel
> (left over from control surface construction). The forward end will be
> secured to the top tube at the firewall by wrapping around the tube and
> bolting through a tab. I saw in Jim Clement's photos that he welds a short
> length of 3/8" tubing onto a cross tube about 2-3 inches ahead of the door
> post. Myu question is, then what happens? How is the aft end of the tank
> strap terminated? In the newsletter, Jim Stanton just bent over the end of
> a 0.040" strap and put a bolt through it, but I would like some provision to
> control the tension on the strap.
>
> Thanks for the thoughts.
>
> Bill
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
> >
> > Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
> height.
> > Jim
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dallas Benham" <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> > <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> > >
> > > Richard and Jim:
> > >
> > > Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> > construction.
> > > Hope it helps.
> > >
> > > Dallas
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Rick and Cindy" <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> > <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > > >
> > > > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of
> > fuel tank
> > > > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
> 1/8"
> > tall,
> > > > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > > > Rick N393RC
> > > >
> > > > john wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john" <frmrjohn@netonecom.net>
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel
> at
> > > > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
> which
> > > > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows
> > have
> > > > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2"
> > above the
> > > > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What
> is
> > > > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> > Thankyou.
> > > > > JohnD
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
Message 10
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|
| Subject: | Strap bolts Supplier |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Larry" <laheze@ev1.net>
Hi Jim and all,
The supplier you are talking about it B&B, I know him pretty well when we see each
other but his name has slipped my mind.
Larry Howell
laheze@ev1.net
Message 11
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|
| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Right Richard, the carpet acts like padding but also helps you forget that
it is a fuel tank with 30gal of gas right above your feet.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Lamb" <lamb01@flash.net>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb <lamb01@flash.net>
>
> An aluminum tank with tight steel straps...
> Somebody please tell me it's ok to pad between them?
>
> On the other hand, seems like guys are carpeting the
> tank these days. Sure looks nice, but could also be
> the stap cushions...
>
>
> William Bernard wrote:
> >
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "William Bernard"
<billbernard@worldnet.att.net>
> >
> > I've been following this thread with some interest, since I'm at this
stage
> > too.
> >
> > I'm planning to support the tank with 1" straps of 0.025 stainless steel
> > (left over from control surface construction). The forward end will be
> > secured to the top tube at the firewall by wrapping around the tube and
> > bolting through a tab. I saw in Jim Clement's photos that he welds a
short
> > length of 3/8" tubing onto a cross tube about 2-3 inches ahead of the
door
> > post. Myu question is, then what happens? How is the aft end of the tank
> > strap terminated? In the newsletter, Jim Stanton just bent over the end
of
> > a 0.040" strap and put a bolt through it, but I would like some
provision to
> > control the tension on the strap.
> >
> > Thanks for the thoughts.
> >
> > Bill
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > <168x@merr.com>
> > >
> > > Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
> > height.
> > > Jim
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Dallas Benham" <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> > > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> > > <dlbenham@smithville.net>
> > > >
> > > > Richard and Jim:
> > > >
> > > > Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> > > construction.
> > > > Hope it helps.
> > > >
> > > > Dallas
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Rick and Cindy" <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > > > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> > > <rcaviate@ne.infi.net>
> > > > >
> > > > > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to
bottom of
> > > fuel tank
> > > > > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
> > 1/8"
> > > tall,
> > > > > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > > > > Rick N393RC
> > > > >
> > > > > john wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john"
<frmrjohn@netonecom.net>
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements
panel
> > at
> > > > > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
> > which
> > > > > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you
fellows
> > > have
> > > > > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10
1/2"
> > > above the
> > > > > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s',
What
> > is
> > > > > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> > > Thankyou.
> > > > > > JohnD
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
Message 12
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|
| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Bill newkirk" <bilnewkirk@msn.com>
The strap 'T" bolts can also be taken from those expensive hose clamps that
they sell at hydraulic shops. They are also stainless.
Also, Jim C, what is a 'boot cowl'?
Bill Newkirk
W - 8 1/2
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
<168x@merr.com>
>
> Bill, They make a strap bolt just for fuel tank straps. I buy them for
about
> $2-3 each from the hardware vender at OSH. Forget the name, he is the one
> with lots of stuff in a big tent. Also sells cowhides. Someone here will
> come up with his name, from Wichita area. It is a three inch tee bolt. you
> put a hole in your strap, then bend the short end around and either weld
or
> rivet to itself.
> Make your tank 12" from the floor and pound a sump [big dent about 1/2"
> deep, 6-7" diameter] with a outlet welded in. start bending the tank
> gradually up towards the inst. panel within 2-3" from the rear edge of the
> sump. Reason being, if the tank is flat beyond the fuel pickup, fuel runs
> towards the rear of the tank and pulls fuel out of and away from the
pickup.
> This happens when take off is attempted with low fuel, 6-7 gallons or so.
> Make the tank same width, don't try to taper to match the fuselage
> dimension. Give yourself no less than 1/2" clearance on each side, they
seem
> to grow during construction and welding. You might have to cut off the
upper
> corners in the front as the engine mount bolts may hit. Put the vent in
the
> filler neck. Use a short rubber hose to connect filler cap assy. to filler
> neck. Fuel proof hose can be bought at NAPA store. Use a mechanical fuel
> gauge sender that measures ohms to the electric guage. Mount the sender in
> the top of the tank, make sure it clears the center baffle. I have had
three
> probe type senders and they are junk as far as I am concerned. Stainless
> makes a nice fuel tank strap but another is steel strapping used to crate
> things. Just about any dumpster at a manufacturing plant has lots of it.
> Jim
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eric Schlanser" <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
> To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
>
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Eric Schlanser
<eschlanser@yahoo.com>
> >
> >
> > Group, This thread is too good to file under "hot steel". I just needed
to
> re-enter it so it can be located later in an archive search under "panel
and
> fuel tank". Thanks. Eric
> > From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> >
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
> >
> > Richard, Fred is right on hinging, forget it. Put two screws on each
side,
> > remove and the panel is loose. Mount the radio trays so they stay with
the
> > panel. Curve the top of the panel at least one inch to prevent oil
canning
> > of the top panel.
> > .025 is to heavy for the firewall. I like to use 28 gauge, about .015.
> Wicks
> > or Spruce have SS in about .017. If you want, 28 gauge galvanized can be
> > bought locally at a sheet metal shop, it works fine but not as pretty.
> > The alum side panels, roll the bottoms around the longerons 1 1/2" and
> > fasten to the lower boot cowl. Sandwich the side windows between the
side
> > boot cowl and the top instrument panel with screws going into the
> instrument
> > top panel. I make the top panel in three pieces, the sides about six
> inches
> > wide.
> > 1/2" tube is fine for the W/S frame but use .028 or .035. Weld tabs to
> screw
> > the W/S to. I will measure how high my panel is and distance from the
> floor
> > when I go to the airport today. Jim
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Richard Lamb"
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> > >
> > > He never lets me have any fun :(
> > >
> > > I still like that cross tube tho.
> > > It's even a handy spot to secure a (hurrump) non-folding panel.
> > >
> > > I'll tell ya what, tho.
> > > Jim commented about making the tank easily removable.
> > > I'll take that one at face value.
> > > The only thing under the tank are the mount straps
> > > and the fuel line.
> > >
> > > I've had the front cabin side panels clecoed on.
> > > Trying to get a feel for how to get everything flush and
> > > rolled around to the bottom. That's interesting.
> > >
> > > I need a firewall material, and, of course, want stainless.
> > > The .025 stuff I've seem locally is twice too heavy.
> > > Any alternate source for .017??
> > >
> > > This weekend, I bent the windshield frame for the parasol.
> > > 1/2" .040 4130 tube. Came out pretty nice. I think I
> > > see how to form the winshield frame for the TW now.
> > > By comparison, that will be easy.
> > >
> > > Door skins and windows and frames, oh my!
> > > Especially the back window.
> > > I think I see now why the long pointy one is so popular!
> > >
> > >
> > > Fred Weaver wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Fred Weaver"
> > > >
> > > > Yo Richard... You really don't need the hinged panel. Hinging the
> panel
> > is
> > > > just a lot more engineering and you will find out with time, that
you
> > don't
> > > > need it at all. Simplify your design by screwing it together... It's
> > not
> > > > like you are loading the thing with GPS, Autopilot, Radios(plural)
etc
> > > > etc... The stuff you install will be fairly accessible thru the top
> > cover
> > > > of the dash.
> > > >
> > > > Once the plane flies, you will be spending lots of time in the air
and
> > you
> > > > won't be doinking around pivoting your panel down for maintenance.
> > > > Honest.....
> > > > Weav
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: Richard Lamb
> > > > To:
> > > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks Jim.
> > > > >
> > > > > Actually, that bottom tube looks pretty handy.
> > > > > It's located back three inches from the door frame tube.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have moved the panel aft.
> > > > > The panel itself is back 5 or 6 inches from the door frame.
> > > > > There's no obstructions at all for the top row, and the cross
> > > > > tube is 8 or 9 inches (?) in front of the panel.
> > > > > Think that will be enough room?
> > > > >
> > > > > Some of those panel drawing I did think that lower cross tube
> > > > > would be exactly the right spot to hinge mount an instrument
panel.
> > > > >
> > > > > The throttle at high center, and the radios in the top of the
panel
> > > > > would have to be mounted permenately. But the rest of the panel
> > > > > could easily swing down. Having the pivot point back behind the
> > > > > panel that far lets all the gauges swing clear without hitting
> > > > > anything. The Tailwind panel is fairly small, and the floors
> > > > > fairly comfortable without a stick sticking in my back.
> > > > > Still, it's an intriguing idea.
> > > > >
> > > > > You know better than most people how far back behind that thing
> > > > > you have to go sometimes...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > > > <168x@merr.com>
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Richard, Cut the bottom tube out also, then you can make the
panel
> > to
> > > > your
> > > > > > liking. Bring it back enough to get things in with out hitting
the
> > fuel
> > > > > > tank. Jim
> > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> >
> > Richard and Jim:
> >
> > Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> construction.
> > Hope it helps.
> >
> > Dallas
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Rick and Cindy"
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> > >
> > > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of
> fuel tank
> > > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
1/8"
> tall,
> > > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > > Rick N393RC
> > >
> > > john wrote:
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john"
> > > >
> > > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel
at
> > > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
which
> > > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows
> have
> > > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2"
above
> the
> > > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What is
> > > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> Thankyou.
> > > > JohnD
> > From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
> >
> > Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
> height.
> > Jim
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dallas Benham"
> > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> >
> > From: "Louis Owen"
> > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> >
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Louis Owen"
> >
> > My floor to tank bottom was 13". I have rather big feet.
> > Lou Owen
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>
Message 13
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|
| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
Panels between engine cowl and doors.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill newkirk" <bilnewkirk@msn.com>
Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Bill newkirk" <bilnewkirk@msn.com>
>
> The strap 'T" bolts can also be taken from those expensive hose clamps
that
> they sell at hydraulic shops. They are also stainless.
>
> Also, Jim C, what is a 'boot cowl'?
>
> Bill Newkirk
> W - 8 1/2
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
>
>
> > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
> >
> > Bill, They make a strap bolt just for fuel tank straps. I buy them for
> about
> > $2-3 each from the hardware vender at OSH. Forget the name, he is the
one
> > with lots of stuff in a big tent. Also sells cowhides. Someone here will
> > come up with his name, from Wichita area. It is a three inch tee bolt.
you
> > put a hole in your strap, then bend the short end around and either weld
> or
> > rivet to itself.
> > Make your tank 12" from the floor and pound a sump [big dent about 1/2"
> > deep, 6-7" diameter] with a outlet welded in. start bending the tank
> > gradually up towards the inst. panel within 2-3" from the rear edge of
the
> > sump. Reason being, if the tank is flat beyond the fuel pickup, fuel
runs
> > towards the rear of the tank and pulls fuel out of and away from the
> pickup.
> > This happens when take off is attempted with low fuel, 6-7 gallons or
so.
> > Make the tank same width, don't try to taper to match the fuselage
> > dimension. Give yourself no less than 1/2" clearance on each side, they
> seem
> > to grow during construction and welding. You might have to cut off the
> upper
> > corners in the front as the engine mount bolts may hit. Put the vent in
> the
> > filler neck. Use a short rubber hose to connect filler cap assy. to
filler
> > neck. Fuel proof hose can be bought at NAPA store. Use a mechanical fuel
> > gauge sender that measures ohms to the electric guage. Mount the sender
in
> > the top of the tank, make sure it clears the center baffle. I have had
> three
> > probe type senders and they are junk as far as I am concerned. Stainless
> > makes a nice fuel tank strap but another is steel strapping used to
crate
> > things. Just about any dumpster at a manufacturing plant has lots of it.
> > Jim
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Eric Schlanser" <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
> > To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
> >
> >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Eric Schlanser
> <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
> > >
> > >
> > > Group, This thread is too good to file under "hot steel". I just
needed
> to
> > re-enter it so it can be located later in an archive search under "panel
> and
> > fuel tank". Thanks. Eric
> > > From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> > >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > <168x@merr.com>
> > >
> > > Richard, Fred is right on hinging, forget it. Put two screws on each
> side,
> > > remove and the panel is loose. Mount the radio trays so they stay with
> the
> > > panel. Curve the top of the panel at least one inch to prevent oil
> canning
> > > of the top panel.
> > > .025 is to heavy for the firewall. I like to use 28 gauge, about .015.
> > Wicks
> > > or Spruce have SS in about .017. If you want, 28 gauge galvanized can
be
> > > bought locally at a sheet metal shop, it works fine but not as pretty.
> > > The alum side panels, roll the bottoms around the longerons 1 1/2" and
> > > fasten to the lower boot cowl. Sandwich the side windows between the
> side
> > > boot cowl and the top instrument panel with screws going into the
> > instrument
> > > top panel. I make the top panel in three pieces, the sides about six
> > inches
> > > wide.
> > > 1/2" tube is fine for the W/S frame but use .028 or .035. Weld tabs to
> > screw
> > > the W/S to. I will measure how high my panel is and distance from the
> > floor
> > > when I go to the airport today. Jim
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Richard Lamb"
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> > > >
> > > > He never lets me have any fun :(
> > > >
> > > > I still like that cross tube tho.
> > > > It's even a handy spot to secure a (hurrump) non-folding panel.
> > > >
> > > > I'll tell ya what, tho.
> > > > Jim commented about making the tank easily removable.
> > > > I'll take that one at face value.
> > > > The only thing under the tank are the mount straps
> > > > and the fuel line.
> > > >
> > > > I've had the front cabin side panels clecoed on.
> > > > Trying to get a feel for how to get everything flush and
> > > > rolled around to the bottom. That's interesting.
> > > >
> > > > I need a firewall material, and, of course, want stainless.
> > > > The .025 stuff I've seem locally is twice too heavy.
> > > > Any alternate source for .017??
> > > >
> > > > This weekend, I bent the windshield frame for the parasol.
> > > > 1/2" .040 4130 tube. Came out pretty nice. I think I
> > > > see how to form the winshield frame for the TW now.
> > > > By comparison, that will be easy.
> > > >
> > > > Door skins and windows and frames, oh my!
> > > > Especially the back window.
> > > > I think I see now why the long pointy one is so popular!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Fred Weaver wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Fred Weaver"
> > > > >
> > > > > Yo Richard... You really don't need the hinged panel. Hinging the
> > panel
> > > is
> > > > > just a lot more engineering and you will find out with time, that
> you
> > > don't
> > > > > need it at all. Simplify your design by screwing it together...
It's
> > > not
> > > > > like you are loading the thing with GPS, Autopilot, Radios(plural)
> etc
> > > > > etc... The stuff you install will be fairly accessible thru the
top
> > > cover
> > > > > of the dash.
> > > > >
> > > > > Once the plane flies, you will be spending lots of time in the air
> and
> > > you
> > > > > won't be doinking around pivoting your panel down for maintenance.
> > > > > Honest.....
> > > > > Weav
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: Richard Lamb
> > > > > To:
> > > > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
> > > > >
> > > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks Jim.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Actually, that bottom tube looks pretty handy.
> > > > > > It's located back three inches from the door frame tube.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have moved the panel aft.
> > > > > > The panel itself is back 5 or 6 inches from the door frame.
> > > > > > There's no obstructions at all for the top row, and the cross
> > > > > > tube is 8 or 9 inches (?) in front of the panel.
> > > > > > Think that will be enough room?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Some of those panel drawing I did think that lower cross tube
> > > > > > would be exactly the right spot to hinge mount an instrument
> panel.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The throttle at high center, and the radios in the top of the
> panel
> > > > > > would have to be mounted permenately. But the rest of the panel
> > > > > > could easily swing down. Having the pivot point back behind the
> > > > > > panel that far lets all the gauges swing clear without hitting
> > > > > > anything. The Tailwind panel is fairly small, and the floors
> > > > > > fairly comfortable without a stick sticking in my back.
> > > > > > Still, it's an intriguing idea.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You know better than most people how far back behind that thing
> > > > > > you have to go sometimes...
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > > > > <168x@merr.com>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Richard, Cut the bottom tube out also, then you can make the
> panel
> > > to
> > > > > your
> > > > > > > liking. Bring it back enough to get things in with out hitting
> the
> > > fuel
> > > > > > > tank. Jim
> > > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> > >
> > > Richard and Jim:
> > >
> > > Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> > construction.
> > > Hope it helps.
> > >
> > > Dallas
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Rick and Cindy"
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
> > > >
> > > > JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom
of
> > fuel tank
> > > > (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
> 1/8"
> > tall,
> > > > top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
> > > > Rick N393RC
> > > >
> > > > john wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john"
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel
> at
> > > > > Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
> which
> > > > > leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you
fellows
> > have
> > > > > come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2"
> above
> > the
> > > > > floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What
is
> > > > > everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> > Thankyou.
> > > > > JohnD
> > > From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> > <168x@merr.com>
> > >
> > > Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
> > height.
> > > Jim
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Dallas Benham"
> > > Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
> > >
> > > From: "Louis Owen"
> > > Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
> > >
> > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Louis Owen"
> > >
> > > My floor to tank bottom was 13". I have rather big feet.
> > > Lou Owen
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb <lamb01@flash.net>
Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
>
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
>
> Right Richard, the carpet acts like padding but also helps you forget that
> it is a fuel tank with 30gal of gas right above your feet.
>
A little "finish" there instead of the bare facts hanging out?
Yeah. Surprising how comforting that really is tho...
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: floor boards - was hot steel? |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb <lamb01@flash.net>
I've got a piece of wall paneling roughed out for a floor right now.
I can see where I'll need tabs. No problem there.
But I don't quite know what to do up front around the rudder pedals
and torque tube.
I have a welded bushing on the right end of the assembly and a nylon
pillow block on the left end. Makes the rudder pedal assembly removable.
There's just not much room to run the floor the tube, and with the
complications underneath on the left side, it looks like I need a big
hole there....
Any notions?
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: panel and fuel tank |
--> Tailwind-List message posted by: Fred Weaver <Mytyweav@flash.net>
"Just about any dumpster at a manufacturing plant has lots of it." You
crack me up Jim.... hahahahaha.... But I'm sure it would work fine.
Weav
On Tuesday, December 17, 2002, at 07:57 PM, Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
>
> Bill, They make a strap bolt just for fuel tank straps. I buy them for
> about
> $2-3 each from the hardware vender at OSH. Forget the name, he is the
> one
> with lots of stuff in a big tent. Also sells cowhides. Someone here will
> come up with his name, from Wichita area. It is a three inch tee bolt.
> you
> put a hole in your strap, then bend the short end around and either
> weld or
> rivet to itself.
> Make your tank 12" from the floor and pound a sump [big dent about 1/2"
> deep, 6-7" diameter] with a outlet welded in. start bending the tank
> gradually up towards the inst. panel within 2-3" from the rear edge of
> the
> sump. Reason being, if the tank is flat beyond the fuel pickup, fuel
> runs
> towards the rear of the tank and pulls fuel out of and away from the
> pickup.
> This happens when take off is attempted with low fuel, 6-7 gallons or
> so.
> Make the tank same width, don't try to taper to match the fuselage
> dimension. Give yourself no less than 1/2" clearance on each side, they
> seem
> to grow during construction and welding. You might have to cut off the
> upper
> corners in the front as the engine mount bolts may hit. Put the vent in
> the
> filler neck. Use a short rubber hose to connect filler cap assy. to
> filler
> neck. Fuel proof hose can be bought at NAPA store. Use a mechanical fuel
> gauge sender that measures ohms to the electric guage. Mount the sender
> in
> the top of the tank, make sure it clears the center baffle. I have had
> three
> probe type senders and they are junk as far as I am concerned. Stainless
> makes a nice fuel tank strap but another is steel strapping used to
> crate
> things. Just about any dumpster at a manufacturing plant has lots of it.
> Jim
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eric Schlanser" <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
> To: <tailwind-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Tailwind-List: Re: panel and fuel tank was re: hot steel
>
>
>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Eric Schlanser
>> <eschlanser@yahoo.com>
>>
>>
>> Group, This thread is too good to file under "hot steel". I just
>> needed to
> re-enter it so it can be located later in an archive search under
> "panel and
> fuel tank". Thanks. Eric
>> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
>> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
>>
>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
>>
>> Richard, Fred is right on hinging, forget it. Put two screws on each
>> side,
>> remove and the panel is loose. Mount the radio trays so they stay with
>> the
>> panel. Curve the top of the panel at least one inch to prevent oil
>> canning
>> of the top panel.
>> .025 is to heavy for the firewall. I like to use 28 gauge, about .015.
> Wicks
>> or Spruce have SS in about .017. If you want, 28 gauge galvanized can
>> be
>> bought locally at a sheet metal shop, it works fine but not as pretty.
>> The alum side panels, roll the bottoms around the longerons 1 1/2" and
>> fasten to the lower boot cowl. Sandwich the side windows between the
>> side
>> boot cowl and the top instrument panel with screws going into the
> instrument
>> top panel. I make the top panel in three pieces, the sides about six
> inches
>> wide.
>> 1/2" tube is fine for the W/S frame but use .028 or .035. Weld tabs to
> screw
>> the W/S to. I will measure how high my panel is and distance from the
> floor
>> when I go to the airport today. Jim
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Richard Lamb"
>> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
>>
>>
>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
>>>
>>> He never lets me have any fun :(
>>>
>>> I still like that cross tube tho.
>>> It's even a handy spot to secure a (hurrump) non-folding panel.
>>>
>>> I'll tell ya what, tho.
>>> Jim commented about making the tank easily removable.
>>> I'll take that one at face value.
>>> The only thing under the tank are the mount straps
>>> and the fuel line.
>>>
>>> I've had the front cabin side panels clecoed on.
>>> Trying to get a feel for how to get everything flush and
>>> rolled around to the bottom. That's interesting.
>>>
>>> I need a firewall material, and, of course, want stainless.
>>> The .025 stuff I've seem locally is twice too heavy.
>>> Any alternate source for .017??
>>>
>>> This weekend, I bent the windshield frame for the parasol.
>>> 1/2" .040 4130 tube. Came out pretty nice. I think I
>>> see how to form the winshield frame for the TW now.
>>> By comparison, that will be easy.
>>>
>>> Door skins and windows and frames, oh my!
>>> Especially the back window.
>>> I think I see now why the long pointy one is so popular!
>>>
>>>
>>> Fred Weaver wrote:
>>>>
>>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Fred Weaver"
>>>>
>>>> Yo Richard... You really don't need the hinged panel. Hinging the
> panel
>> is
>>>> just a lot more engineering and you will find out with time, that you
>> don't
>>>> need it at all. Simplify your design by screwing it together... It's
>> not
>>>> like you are loading the thing with GPS, Autopilot, Radios(plural)
>>>> etc
>>>> etc... The stuff you install will be fairly accessible thru the top
>> cover
>>>> of the dash.
>>>>
>>>> Once the plane flies, you will be spending lots of time in the air
>>>> and
>> you
>>>> won't be doinking around pivoting your panel down for maintenance.
>>>> Honest.....
>>>> Weav
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: Richard Lamb
>>>> To:
>>>> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: hot steel
>>>>
>>>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Richard Lamb
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Jim.
>>>>>
>>>>> Actually, that bottom tube looks pretty handy.
>>>>> It's located back three inches from the door frame tube.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have moved the panel aft.
>>>>> The panel itself is back 5 or 6 inches from the door frame.
>>>>> There's no obstructions at all for the top row, and the cross
>>>>> tube is 8 or 9 inches (?) in front of the panel.
>>>>> Think that will be enough room?
>>>>>
>>>>> Some of those panel drawing I did think that lower cross tube
>>>>> would be exactly the right spot to hinge mount an instrument panel.
>>>>>
>>>>> The throttle at high center, and the radios in the top of the panel
>>>>> would have to be mounted permenately. But the rest of the panel
>>>>> could easily swing down. Having the pivot point back behind the
>>>>> panel that far lets all the gauges swing clear without hitting
>>>>> anything. The Tailwind panel is fairly small, and the floors
>>>>> fairly comfortable without a stick sticking in my back.
>>>>> Still, it's an intriguing idea.
>>>>>
>>>>> You know better than most people how far back behind that thing
>>>>> you have to go sometimes...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Jim and Donna Clement wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
>>>> <168x@merr.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Richard, Cut the bottom tube out also, then you can make the panel
>> to
>>>> your
>>>>>> liking. Bring it back enough to get things in with out hitting the
>> fuel
>>>>>> tank. Jim
>> Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>>
>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
>>
>> Richard and Jim:
>>
>> Below is from my files on previous conversations about Tailwind
> construction.
>> Hope it helps.
>>
>> Dallas
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Rick and Cindy"
>> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>>
>>
>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Rick and Cindy
>>>
>>> JohnD: Made some measurements of N393RC, floor (1/4" ply) to bottom of
> fuel tank
>>> (29.8 gal) is 12", floor to bottom of panel is 20 3/4", panel is 8
>>> 1/8"
> tall,
>>> top of panel to bottom of front spar carry through is 8 3/8".
>>> Rick N393RC
>>>
>>> john wrote:
>>>
>>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "john"
>>>>
>>>> I'm looking for some input on the panel. I measured Clements panel at
>>>> Oshkosh and it measured 19 1/2" to the bottom, 10 1/2" of panel,
>>>> which
>>>> leaves 7" from the top of the panel, is this about what you fellows
> have
>>>> come up with in your W-10s'? Clements fuel tank measured 10 1/2"
>>>> above
> the
>>>> floor. I must have big feet because my shoes measure 12"s', What is
>>>> everyone doing about the distance from the floor to the tank?
> Thankyou.
>>>> JohnD
>> From: "Jim and Donna Clement" <168x@merr.com>
>> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>>
>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Jim and Donna Clement"
> <168x@merr.com>
>>
>> Looks about right, for sure go with the 12" floor to bottom of tank
> height.
>> Jim
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Dallas Benham"
>> Subject: Fw: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>>
>>
>>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Dallas Benham"
>>
>> From: "Louis Owen"
>> Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: panel and fuel tank
>>
>> --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Louis Owen"
>>
>> My floor to tank bottom was 13". I have rather big feet.
>> Lou Owen
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>>
>>
>
>
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