---------------------------------------------------------- Tailwind-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 04/20/05:13 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:26 AM - Re: rigging (Fred Weaver) 2. 09:32 AM - ...........just a test...........do not archive (Robert V. Hunter) 3. 10:12 AM - 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (IslPilot@aol.com) 4. 10:20 AM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (Jim Clement) 5. 06:03 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (IslPilot@aol.com) 6. 06:34 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (Jim Clement) 7. 06:35 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (Dennis Flamini) 8. 06:38 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (Mark Pensenstadler) 9. 06:41 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (IslPilot@aol.com) 10. 06:50 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (IslPilot@aol.com) 11. 06:57 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (Jim Clement) 12. 07:27 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (Jim Clement) 13. 07:58 PM - Re: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind (GORDON PARKER) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:26:00 AM PST US From: "Fred Weaver" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: rigging hAHAHAHAHAHA It all makes sense now... Man, I could not figure it out to save my life... Weav ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Flamini To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 8:35 PM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: rigging Sorry Fred, i should have explained that after i gave Paul a TW ride and he was hooked, he said his wife put a wanted photo of me on the fridge since all his spare time is working on Tailwinds. This is from a wife that is a pilot and flies a Cub and works for Southwest! Dennis in Chicago ----- Original Message ----- From: Fred Weaver To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 5:33 PM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: rigging Gotta answer this one Paul as I've seen a lot of Tailwinds not quite optimized. I found a lot of guys keeping the trailing edge too low. By raising it up so that the bottom of the airfoil on the wing blends smoothly into the Trailing Edge, you get a faster airplane and an airplane that doesn't require as much "Up" trim. This all reduces drag and contributes to the speed and climb of the airplane. I'm not really sure what Dennis was trying to say............... What with being a wanted man in someone elses refrigerator.. What was that all about? :) Weav ----- Original Message ----- From: IslPilot@aol.com To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 11:48 AM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: rigging Experts: How are you ideally setting your flaps in relation to the wing airfoil for initial rig? Results of your experimentation of various neutral positions? Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:32:58 AM PST US From: "Robert V. Hunter" Subject: Tailwind-List: ...........just a test...........do not archive --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Robert V. Hunter" ..........this is just a test to see if I can post to the list........... do not archive - Keep on keeping on, Jerry L. Mahurin - aka - Robert V. Hunter Lugoff, SC ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:12:59 AM PST US From: IslPilot@aol.com Subject: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind I had Ed Sterba build me a new prop for my W-10 this winter. My old prop needs rework and isnt the smoothest. Got it last week, and it isn't enough pitch with my various engine mods. I sent it back to him for rework, but he is telling me that he "might" be able to put 2-4 inches more pitch............ max. If anyone has interest and doesnt want to wait the 3+ months for a prop, I bet I will have to have another one carved and this one will be "For Sale." I paid $650 for it with epoxy leading edges and shipping. Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:20:46 AM PST US From: "Jim Clement" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind What pitch is it Paul, what did it static and max rpm at 2500 feet? Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: IslPilot@aol.com To: TailwindForum@yahoogroups.com ; tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:12 PM Subject: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind I had Ed Sterba build me a new prop for my W-10 this winter. My old prop needs rework and isnt the smoothest. Got it last week, and it isn't enough pitch with my various engine mods. I sent it back to him for rework, but he is telling me that he "might" be able to put 2-4 inches more pitch............ max. If anyone has interest and doesnt want to wait the 3+ months for a prop, I bet I will have to have another one carved and this one will be "For Sale." I paid $650 for it with epoxy leading edges and shipping. Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:03:12 PM PST US From: IslPilot@aol.com Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim it is supposedly a 68/74. I am getting 2400 static and 2900+ full throttle. Its smooth and super climb performance. My old vibrating prop marked 68/72 is doing 2300 static and 2800+ full throttle. I wanted to try and get 185-190 mph at 2500 rpm. I need to send my old prop in for rework to get rid of the vibration. Ed recommends having them reworked every 4-5 years. When we tried to dynamically balance it, the accelerometer was indicating there was a slight pitch difference between the two blades. It took 3+ months to carve the new one, so I didnt want to lose the speed I have for a long time waiting on getting the prop back from Ed. Ed says he will get right on it so hope he gets it right back to me. Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:34:55 PM PST US From: "Jim Clement" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Paul. The prop I am using on the new TW static's 2300 and tops out at 2800. this seems to be a good all around setup. At 2500 feet, 23" manifold pressure and 2500 rpm it cruises 187mph. At 2800 rpm, same altitude it tops out at 207 mph. The figures were taken using a gps on a fairly calm day both directions. It didn't do that when I first got it but that's another story. sounds like Ed could add a little pitch in the smooth prop and tune up the other and you will be in good shape. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: IslPilot@aol.com To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 8:02 PM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim it is supposedly a 68/74. I am getting 2400 static and 2900+ full throttle. Its smooth and super climb performance. My old vibrating prop marked 68/72 is doing 2300 static and 2800+ full throttle. I wanted to try and get 185-190 mph at 2500 rpm. I need to send my old prop in for rework to get rid of the vibration. Ed recommends having them reworked every 4-5 years. When we tried to dynamically balance it, the accelerometer was indicating there was a slight pitch difference between the two blades. It took 3+ months to carve the new one, so I didnt want to lose the speed I have for a long time waiting on getting the prop back from Ed. Ed says he will get right on it so hope he gets it right back to me. Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:21 PM PST US From: "Dennis Flamini" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Paul, This is not TW related but one of my last test flights was a Mustang II with a tired 150hp and a repitched metal prop from a Cherokee that turned 2700 static and 3300 full throttle, the acceleration was like my old TW with CS prop but hard to get used to the 3000 rpm cruise. Didn't Jim's Cafe TW turn 3180rpm full bore? Dennis in Chicago ----- Original Message ----- From: IslPilot@aol.com To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 8:02 PM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim it is supposedly a 68/74. I am getting 2400 static and 2900+ full throttle. Its smooth and super climb performance. My old vibrating prop marked 68/72 is doing 2300 static and 2800+ full throttle. I wanted to try and get 185-190 mph at 2500 rpm. I need to send my old prop in for rework to get rid of the vibration. Ed recommends having them reworked every 4-5 years. When we tried to dynamically balance it, the accelerometer was indicating there was a slight pitch difference between the two blades. It took 3+ months to carve the new one, so I didnt want to lose the speed I have for a long time waiting on getting the prop back from Ed. Ed says he will get right on it so hope he gets it right back to me. Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:38:09 PM PST US s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; b=pBTIX+kK7lHJBFl3pO5jmK4OGUUoeIHgn8fcW49A3mrZkWp/qKnamBPS3lvMWaMKzjaP0TCBqbmHWvLoKuM2TLojqgTt2QXKijVp2cIXKK09r0+HZusgKDt5F+CtVvUkxtvosyV6ns7fwIYJiigbZjBC1vcjYoJVhMwtopsadSA= ; From: Mark Pensenstadler Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind --> Tailwind-List message posted by: Mark Pensenstadler Paul, This is interesting reading about your prop differences. I wonder how many people could improve their performance with a prop reworked by Ed. I'm wondering if you might be interested in sharing your ideas and findings for the Tailwind Times newsletter? Perhaps you could write a short article on the changes you're making and the effects on performance they have? I believe others would be interested in this info! Thank you, Mark --- IslPilot@aol.com wrote: > Jim it is supposedly a 68/74. I am getting 2400 > static and 2900+ full > throttle. Its smooth and super climb performance. > My old vibrating prop marked > 68/72 is doing 2300 static and 2800+ full throttle. > I wanted to try and get > 185-190 mph at 2500 rpm. > > I need to send my old prop in for rework to get rid > of the vibration. Ed > recommends having them reworked every 4-5 years. > When we tried to dynamically > balance it, the accelerometer was indicating there > was a slight pitch difference > between the two blades. It took 3+ months to carve > the new one, so I didnt > want to lose the speed I have for a long time > waiting on getting the prop back > from Ed. Ed says he will get right on it so hope he > gets it right back to me. > > Paul > CVX > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:41:28 PM PST US From: IslPilot@aol.com Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim: Since I have to cross Lake Michigan to get the rest of the story in Baraboo, I didnt want to be pushing it too hard over Lake Michigan. but now that the water is warming up.......... Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:50:22 PM PST US From: IslPilot@aol.com Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim & Weav & Stanton probably have the most experience with the trade offs. Ed Sterba told me that in years past, his customers were not concerned with running way over red line and that now a days he is seeing more requests to bring the cruise rpm down. He said that he did not think I would see any difference in top speed, just the rpm that it required to make the same speed. This most recent prop of his doesnt seem to bare that out, even letting it wind up over 3000 rpm I am not seeing the speed that I have with the old prop. About 10 mph less. I am curious if Brian Alley has a Catto now on his plane and his experience.........Brian??? An article on my experiences would probably be humorous in "what not to do" Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:57:20 PM PST US From: "Jim Clement" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Fly the TW over. We can compare props and speed at different power settings. I have been going to fly along side Gary in 6168Y and Al in TW #1 to see how things compare but we haven't done this yet. I haven't been brave enough to fly across the lake yet. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: IslPilot@aol.com To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 8:41 PM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim: Since I have to cross Lake Michigan to get the rest of the story in Baraboo, I didnt want to be pushing it too hard over Lake Michigan. but now that the water is warming up.......... Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:09 PM PST US From: "Jim Clement" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind 2800 rpm full throttle at 2500' seems to work out good, it still does a pretty good job on takeoff on a hot day. You lose to much for take off if you want to cruise at a low cruise rpm and still go 185+. At 8000 feet I'm running 204 mph so that's a cruise speed at about 75%. What I have found with a TW, 2300 static is what works best. I use the manifold pressure gauge for cruise, not the tach. For economy I run 23"mp at all altitudes until it won't pull that anymore. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: IslPilot@aol.com To: tailwind-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 8:50 PM Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Jim & Weav & Stanton probably have the most experience with the trade offs. Ed Sterba told me that in years past, his customers were not concerned with running way over red line and that now a days he is seeing more requests to bring the cruise rpm down. He said that he did not think I would see any difference in top speed, just the rpm that it required to make the same speed. This most recent prop of his doesnt seem to bare that out, even letting it wind up over 3000 rpm I am not seeing the speed that I have with the old prop. About 10 mph less. I am curious if Brian Alley has a Catto now on his plane and his experience.........Brian??? An article on my experiences would probably be humorous in "what not to do" Paul CVX ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:58:41 PM PST US From: "GORDON PARKER" Subject: Re: Tailwind-List: 68/74 Sterba Propeller for Lycoming Powered Tailwind Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 20 Apr 2005 19:58:21 -0700 Has any one checked out Pro-Tint.Inc. Have a protective film for windshields for race cars-helicopers ect. When dirty or dinged just peel off one sheet. Also might help from having windshield blown out. Interesting web site. Just a thought-- Gordon