Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:36 AM - Re: Baffle adjustments (flyv35b)
2. 10:35 AM - Fw: lightweight starters (TeamGrumman@aol.com)
3. 10:37 AM - Re: Baffle adjustments (TeamGrumman@aol.com)
4. 01:02 PM - Re: Fw: lightweight starters (flyv35b)
5. 05:07 PM - SkyTec Starters (Steven Jackson)
6. 06:01 PM - Re: SkyTec Starters (Ned Thomas)
7. 06:13 PM - Re: Fw: lightweight starters (TeamGrumman@aol.com)
8. 07:36 PM - Re: Baffle adjustments (Geoffrey Hickey)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Baffle adjustments |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "flyv35b" <flyv35b@ashcreekwireless.com>
I'm sure Gary will have something to say about this, but 130+F variation
between the front and rear cylinders is HUGH. I've never seen a plane with
anywhere near that much variation.
I'd take a close look at the rear baffles and the parts that wrap down under
the cylinder barrel and head fins. The length of the head baffle is to long
many times after someone has replaced it and it can restrict air flow. The
head baffle should terminate at about the same location (clock position) as
the barrel baffle. Some go so far you can even install a CHT probe.
Of course there are several other areas that could be contributing to your
high CHTs. Maybe something is wrong with the forward cylinder baffling and
a lot of air is being "dumped" up at the front and thereby lowering the
pressure and flow across the rear cylinders. Best get the problem resolved
before the ambient temp gets warmer.
Cliff A&P/IA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Geoffrey Hickey" <ardri@comcast.net>
Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Baffle adjustments
> --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Geoffrey Hickey
<ardri@comcast.net>
>
> Gary,
>
> I've got a case of JPItis, now that I've been watching my EDM-700 for
> awhile.
>
> I seem to remember that awhile back you did some experiments with
> altering the baffles slightly to better cool the rear cylinders at low
> airspeeds. I can't find the post now, but I may need to do something
> like this when the weather warms up to keep my #3 and #4 cylinders under
> 450 on climbout (they are running about 430 at 90 knots on a 40 degree
> day). The front two cylinders are very well cooled during climbout, like
> below 300, so I know the baffles are capturing enough air, it just
> doesn't seem to be distributing very well.
>
> At cruise, once I lean the engine, I get very even CHTs in the 330-360
> range on all four cylinders.
>
> I can't remember the details you posted now, but if you have any
> suggestions for how to get those rear cylinders a little cooler without
> affecting the balance at cruise speeds I'd sure appreciate it.
>
> - Geoff Hickey
> Cheetah N26681
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Fwd: lightweight starters |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com
(Vircom SMTPRS 3.1.293.0) with ESMTP id <B0092213085@mailsvr-1.itexas.net> for
<TeamGrumman@aol.com>;
Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:54:18 -0600
From: Les Staples <lstaples@itexas.net>
Subject: Re: lightweight starters
Hello Gary,
I don't know why you haven't heard of it. I'll gripe at my marketing
guy, Rich Chiappe. Rich flies a Star Duster, by the way.
The 149-NL and 122-NL are certified for non-geared Lycoming
normal (right hand rotation)engines and will replace all of the old
Prestolite models without any baffle mods that we know of.
The 149-NLR starters are left-rotation units for such engines as the
LO-360, LIO-360, LIO-540 etc.
We received certification as direct replacement parts a few months ago
and have been trying to ramp up production as fast as possible. We
have shipped about 300 units so far and have a backlog of about 8
weeks.
Les
Sunday, March 14, 2004, 9:58:37 PM, you wrote:
Tac> Les, I noticed in the new EAA Sport Aviation magazine an ad
Tac> for a new (inline) lightweight starter from Sky-Tec. Is this
Tac> something available for certified aircraft? I see where it says
Tac> it's FAA-PMA approved. If so, why haven't I heard about it?
Tac> Gary
Tac> www.AuCountry.com
Tac> Home of Team Grumman
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Baffle adjustments |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com
In a message dated 03/14/04 11:42:01 PM, ardri@comcast.net writes:
> I've got a case of JPItis, now that I've been watching my EDM-700 for
> awhile.
>
> I seem to remember that awhile back you did some experiments with
> altering the baffles slightly to better cool the rear cylinders at low
> airspeeds. I can't find the post now, but I may need to do something
> like this when the weather warms up to keep my #3 and #4 cylinders under
> 450 on climbout (they are running about 430 at 90 knots on a 40 degree
> day). The front two cylinders are very well cooled during climbout, like
> below 300, so I know the baffles are capturing enough air, it just
> doesn't seem to be distributing very well.
>
Geoff, I fixed your baffles when I had them here. They are about as good as
it gets. I wish I had pics of your installation to make sure it was done
right. Baffling is very important.
Gary
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Fwd: lightweight starters |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "flyv35b" <flyv35b@ashcreekwireless.com>
> I don't know why you haven't heard of it. I'll gripe at my marketing
> guy, Rich Chiappe. Rich flies a Star Duster, by the way.
>
> The 149-NL and 122-NL are certified for non-geared Lycoming
> normal (right hand rotation)engines and will replace all of the old
> Prestolite models without any baffle mods that we know of.
>
> The 149-NLR starters are left-rotation units for such engines as the
> LO-360, LIO-360, LIO-540 etc.
>
> We received certification as direct replacement parts a few months ago
> and have been trying to ramp up production as fast as possible. We
> have shipped about 300 units so far and have a backlog of about 8
> weeks.
Gary's not the only one who hasn't heard of the new models. I haven't
either and I read a good share of the aviation publications.
Do you have any sales brochures printed about the new models and what they
are approved on?
Cliff A&P/IA
----- Original Message -----
From: <TeamGrumman@aol.com>
Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Fwd: lightweight starters
> --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com
>
>
> (Vircom SMTPRS 3.1.293.0) with ESMTP id
<B0092213085@mailsvr-1.itexas.net> for <TeamGrumman@aol.com>;
> Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:54:18 -0600
> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:52:23 -0600
> From: Les Staples <lstaples@itexas.net>
> To: TeamGrumman@aol.com
> Subject: Re: lightweight starters
>
> Hello Gary,
>
> I don't know why you haven't heard of it. I'll gripe at my marketing
> guy, Rich Chiappe. Rich flies a Star Duster, by the way.
>
> The 149-NL and 122-NL are certified for non-geared Lycoming
> normal (right hand rotation)engines and will replace all of the old
> Prestolite models without any baffle mods that we know of.
>
> The 149-NLR starters are left-rotation units for such engines as the
> LO-360, LIO-360, LIO-540 etc.
>
> We received certification as direct replacement parts a few months ago
> and have been trying to ramp up production as fast as possible. We
> have shipped about 300 units so far and have a backlog of about 8
> weeks.
>
> Les
>
> Sunday, March 14, 2004, 9:58:37 PM, you wrote:
>
> Tac> Les, I noticed in the new EAA Sport Aviation magazine an ad
> Tac> for a new (inline) lightweight starter from Sky-Tec. Is this
> Tac> something available for certified aircraft? I see where it says
> Tac> it's FAA-PMA approved. If so, why haven't I heard about it?
>
>
> Tac> Gary
> Tac> www.AuCountry.com
> Tac> Home of Team Grumman
>
>
Message 5
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--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Steven Jackson" <steven.jackson14@adelphia.net>
Can someone tell me the advantage (other than not having to modify the
baffling) of the inline SkyTec over the older version with the solenoid on
the side?
Steven Jackson
'75 AA-1B
N1434R
L22
Yucca Valley, CA
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: SkyTec Starters |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Ned Thomas" <315@cox.net>
Steven,
The main advantage as I understand it is that the amperage required by the
starter is much less than the PM motors, I have heard something on the order
of 10 amps less. I have the PM starter on my Tiger and have never had any
problems related to its current draw or otherwise. It is lighter than the
field wound motors. In any event you can't go wrong with a Skytec. Excellent
product and customer support.
Ned
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Jackson" <steven.jackson14@adelphia.net>
Subject: TeamGrumman-List: SkyTec Starters
> --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Steven Jackson"
<steven.jackson14@adelphia.net>
>
> Can someone tell me the advantage (other than not having to modify the
> baffling) of the inline SkyTec over the older version with the solenoid on
> the side?
>
> Steven Jackson
> '75 AA-1B
> N1434R
> L22
> Yucca Valley, CA
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Fwd: lightweight starters |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com
In a message dated 03/15/04 01:06:01 PM, flyv35b@ashcreekwireless.com writes:
> Do you have any sales brochures printed about the new models and what they
> are approved on?
>
I got a reply from Les Staples. He says that they are approved as a
replacement on Lycomings.
Look in the Sport Aviation magazine this month.
Gary
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Baffle adjustments |
--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Geoffrey Hickey <ardri@comcast.net>
flyv35b wrote:
>--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "flyv35b" <flyv35b@ashcreekwireless.com>
>
>I'm sure Gary will have something to say about this, but 130+F variation
>between the front and rear cylinders is HUGH. I've never seen a plane with
>anywhere near that much variation.
>
>
>
Oops... The original posting should have said that the cooler cylinders
run below 350 on climbout, not below 300. (Typing error on my part). I
don't think the difference between the cold and hot cylinders ever
exceeds 100 degrees. But I think that is still more than I should expect.
Gary restored these baffles a couple of months ago, so I'm going to look
for an installation problem, since they were installed by someone else.
I'll start with the front baffle seals and make sure there's no major
hole there. If that doesn't work I'll try your other suggestions.
Thanks Cliff,
- Geoff Hickey
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