---------------------------------------------------------- TeamGrumman-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 09/20/05: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:45 AM - Re: Wheel fairings (Bruce Smith) 2. 05:30 AM - Re: New Lyc Motors (Steven Jackson) 3. 06:43 AM - Re: New Lyc Motors (flyv35b) 4. 12:00 PM - Re: Wheel fairings (TeamGrumman@AOL.COM) 5. 12:02 PM - Re: New Lyc Motors (TeamGrumman@AOL.COM) 6. 05:53 PM - Re: TeamGrumman-List Digest: 8 Msgs - 09/19/05 (neitalibelle@AOL.COM) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:45:32 AM PST US From: "Bruce Smith" Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Bruce Smith" Would it be a pain to design, or are there no benefits from enclosing it? Bruce TeamGrumman@aol.com said the following on 9/19/2005 10:46 PM: >--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com > > >In a message dated 9/19/05 11:45:43 AM, bruce.smith@york.com writes: > > > > >>If you do decide to create Team Grumman wheel fairings, will you be >>designing a fairing to enclose the nosewheel strut? >> >> >> > >no > > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:30:15 AM PST US From: "Steven Jackson" Subject: RE: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Steven Jackson" Would they still mount on their similar size engine mounts, i.e. are these things designed to be an alternative to a stock O-360 or O-540? I'm assuming that if all they did was make the cylinder bore bigger, that the rough dimensions of the engines would be similar to the original sizes, right? --the Neighborhood I work in is on a hill in Stead. Had a great view all week for all the qualifiers and then on Thurs/Fri. When the T-Birds performed on Friday, I don't think any work got done in the whole neighborhood for about 30 minutes... Steven -----Original Message----- From: owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of TeamGrumman@aol.com Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 9/19/05 9:39:10 PM, steven.jackson@ssinternet.net writes: > Looks like they had two-an O-390 and an O-580.=A0 Talked to the marketing=20guy > and he said that they achieved the bigger displacement with a bigger bore. > Not that it helps us with certified airplanes, but thought it was > interesting that Lyc finally started thinking more (albeit still sluggish) > innovatively. > I talked to Ken Tunnell at LyCon about these engines almost a year ago. I wanted to know if the bigger barrels could be put on the parallel valve engines. Nope. Not enough room. But, he's looking into it. Gary PS. I was at Reno this weekend. It's nice to be just 2 hours away. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:43:58 AM PST US From: "flyv35b" Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "flyv35b" >> Looks like they had two-an O-390 and an O-580.=A0 Talked to the >> marketing=20guy >> and he said that they achieved the bigger displacement with a bigger >> bore. >> Not that it helps us with certified airplanes, but thought it was >> interesting that Lyc finally started thinking more (albeit still >> sluggish) >> innovatively. >> > > I talked to Ken Tunnell at LyCon about these engines almost a year ago. > I > wanted to know if the bigger barrels could be put on the parallel valve > engines. Nope. Not enough room. But, he's looking into it. > > Gary > PS. I was at Reno this weekend. It's nice to be just 2 hours away. > Guess I should have got ahold of you Gary so we could have hooked up as I was also at Reno for 4 days. I talked to the Lycoming people a bit and looked at their display engines. Right now the new 390 and 580 cubic inch engines are for experimental planes only. Lycoming has recognized that there is a lot of profit potential in that market and they are trying to be a part of it. The 390 engine will use the same crankshaft as the 360 and therefore the cylinder spacing remains the same. They are using the angle valved cylinder design with a larger bore (about 5.5") to get the 390 cu. in. This required new mounting bolt spacing and internal wrenching nuts due to tighter clearances. The compression ratio is increased to 8.7:1 as it now is on the IO-360 engines and they have designed induction tubes that are more of a tuned system than previously. The engines also use their new roller tappet cams, which will be used pretty much across the board on all the engines. Rated power of the 390 is 210 hp at 2700 rpm. Who knows of this engine will be certified in the future. Very likely after they get a couple of years of field experience with it. But it doesn't look like the existing 360 cases will be able to be modified to 390 cubic inch configuration. Cliff A&P/IA ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors > --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com > > > In a message dated 9/19/05 9:39:10 PM, steven.jackson@ssinternet.net > writes: > > >> Looks like they had two-an O-390 and an O-580.=A0 Talked to the >> marketing=20guy >> and he said that they achieved the bigger displacement with a bigger >> bore. >> Not that it helps us with certified airplanes, but thought it was >> interesting that Lyc finally started thinking more (albeit still >> sluggish) >> innovatively. >> > > I talked to Ken Tunnell at LyCon about these engines almost a year ago. > I > wanted to know if the bigger barrels could be put on the parallel valve > engines. Nope. Not enough room. But, he's looking into it. > > Gary > PS. I was at Reno this weekend. It's nice to be just 2 hours away. > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:00:45 PM PST US From: TeamGrumman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 9/20/05 4:46:01 AM, bruce.smith@york.com writes: > Would it be a pain to design, or are there no benefits from enclosing it? > > There isn't anything wrong with the nose strut having the little v fairing. Anytime you start wrapping things in things, it traps moisture and causes corrosion. The current nose strut/fairing is simple. We want simple. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:02:22 PM PST US From: TeamGrumman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 9/20/05 5:30:54 AM, steven.jackson@ssinternet.net writes: > Would they still mount on their similar size engine mounts, i.e.=A0 are these > things designed to be an alternative to a stock O-360 or O-540?=A0 I'm > assuming that if all they did was make the cylinder bore bigger, that the > rough dimensions of the engines would be similar to the original sizes, > right? > It's an angle valve engine like the IO360C1C. Still the same (basically) block. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:53:57 PM PST US From: neitalibelle@AOL.COM Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Re: TeamGrumman-List Digest: 8 Msgs - 09/19/05 HTML_OBFUSCATE_10_20@roxy.matronics.com, BODY:, Message@roxy.matronics.com, is@roxy.matronics.com, to@roxy.matronics.com, HTML@roxy.matronics.com, obfuscation@roxy.matronics.com --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: neitalibelle@aol.com Bob, did talk to the Lycoming folks and sure would have liked to have put that display engine in my Tiger, but not willing to go Experimental. Hope to see you at the AYA fly-in, Santa Clara, end of October to see the Grumman C-1A and visit the aviation museum. Neita Montague, AYA Area Coordinator Tiger 311TA at Reno, NV -----Original Message----- From: TeamGrumman-List Digest Server Subject: TeamGrumman-List Digest: 8 Msgs - 09/19/05 * ================================================== Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================== Today's complete TeamGrumman-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the TeamGrumman-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/teamgrumman-list/Digest.TeamGrumman-List.2005-09-19.html Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/teamgrumman-list/Digest.TeamGrumman-List.2005-09-19.txt ================================================ EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================ TeamGrumman-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 09/19/05: 8 Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 11:07 AM - last annual (TeamGrumman@aol.com) 2. 11:39 AM - Wheel fairings (Bruce Smith) 3. 03:12 PM - Re: Wheel fairings (Anna3003@AOL.COM) 4. 06:45 PM - Re: Wheel fairings (linn walters) 5. 07:46 PM - Re: Wheel fairings (TeamGrumman@AOL.COM) 6. 09:38 PM - New Lyc Motors (Steven Jackson) 7. 11:13 PM - Re: Wheel fairings (Steve Roberts) 8. 11:16 PM - Re: New Lyc Motors (TeamGrumman@AOL.COM) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 11:07:33 AM PST US From: TeamGrumman@aol.com Subject: TeamGrumman-List: last annual --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com no, not THE last annual. I just finished an annual on a 92 Tiger. New mags had been installed a few weeks earlier. New harness too. The harness was installed upside down. Now, I have seen a LOT of really LAZY workmanship, but this was just plain stupid. All of the top plugs had the bottom wires, etc. The big problem was, the wires were stretched so tight and routed to so poorly, that it chafed through the new harness for #2 & #4 bottom plugs so that they were not even firing. Plus, the timing was at least 35 BTDC. That aside, ..... Lots of really bad design decisions in the AG5B. Gary ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:39:59 AM PST US From: "Bruce Smith" Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Bruce Smith" Gary, If you do decide to create Team Grumman wheel fairings, will you be designing a fairing to enclose the nosewheel strut? Bruce Smith ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:12:50 PM PST US From: Anna3003@AOL.COM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Anna3003@aol.com Gary, if you do design wheel fairings, PLEASE make it simple to inflate the tires without removing them. I can't be the only person whho has problems with this ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:45:16 PM PST US From: linn walters Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: linn walters There is a rather simple solution to the 'wheel pant problem'. However, it comes with some caveats. First caveat: The tube must have a 90 degree stem. .... this points the stem parallel to the axle. Second caveat: The wheel pant must have a hole drilled in it. Third caveat: You must be precise when you put in the hole, or the hole grows in size as you make IT fit. IT? IT is a stem extender, commonly used on dual tire setups. Place a paint line on the tire to help you align the stem with the hole. After all that, it's really easy: line up the mark (however you want that to be) and screw on the extender. Fill the tire. Remove the extender and put the cap back on. Go fly. Linn do not archive Anna3003@aol.com wrote: >--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Anna3003@aol.com > >Gary, if you do design wheel fairings, PLEASE make it simple to inflate the >tires without removing them. I can't be the only person whho has problems with > this > > > > -- ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:46:51 PM PST US From: TeamGrumman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 9/19/05 11:45:43 AM, bruce.smith@york.com writes: > If you do decide to create Team Grumman wheel fairings, will you be > designing a fairing to enclose the nosewheel strut? > no ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:38:31 PM PST US From: "Steven Jackson" Subject: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Steven Jackson" Did anyone take a look at the new Lycoming experimental motors this weekend at Reno? Looks like they had two-an O-390 and an O-580. Talked to the marketing guy and he said that they achieved the bigger displacement with a bigger bore. Not that it helps us with certified airplanes, but thought it was interesting that Lyc finally started thinking more (albeit still sluggish) innovatively. Steven Jackson '75 AA-1B (O-320) B08 Fernley, NV ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:13:16 PM PST US From: "Steve Roberts" Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Wheel fairings --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Steve Roberts" I have the DMA pants. The holes were already there and the stems on the mains are not 90 degrees. I put an extention on my airhose for my airtank like they have at the truck stops. I can reach in pretty well to the stem. When I bought the plane the stems had a plastic cap on the valve. It took some time to get the caps off with needle nose pliers. So once off I pitched them as I knew getting them back on would be impossible short of removing the wheel pant. As for marking the tires, I 1st had marked the outside of the tire when the stem was aligned with the hole. I then realized the mark really needs to be on the inside as that is the side of the tire you can see when pulling the plane by the prop. So now I have a white dot painted on the tire both sides for when the stem is aligned with the hole. It really helps. On the nose wheel I put the mark on as well indicating the alignment of the stem. The stem is of the 90 degree type here and the same airhose extention works as well. BTW I use an air gauge with the same long head on it for pressure checking. I am able to reach in and put the cap on and off with the 90 degree stem here though. It's not the plastic type but a metal one that is no knurled but hex shaped so I can put a socket & extention on it and finger tight comes right on and off. unless you've made other plans, have a great day... Steve Roberts AA-1B N9664L @ ILG There is a rather simple solution to the 'wheel pant problem'. However, it comes with some caveats. First caveat: The tube must have a 90 degree stem. .... this points the stem parallel to the axle. Second caveat: The wheel pant must have a hole drilled in it. Third caveat: You must be precise when you put in the hole, or the hole grows in size as you make IT fit. IT? IT is a stem extender, commonly used on dual tire setups. Place a paint line on the tire to help you align the stem with the hole. After all that, it's really easy: line up the mark (however you want that to be) and screw on the extender. Fill the tire. Remove the extender and put the cap back on. Go fly. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:16:00 PM PST US From: TeamGrumman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: New Lyc Motors --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 9/19/05 9:39:10 PM, steven.jackson@ssinternet.net writes: > Looks like they had two-an O-390 and an O-580.=A0 Talked to the marketing=20guy > and he said that they achieved the bigger displacement with a bigger bore. > Not that it helps us with certified airplanes, but thought it was > interesting that Lyc finally started thinking more (albeit still sluggish) > innovatively. > I talked to Ken Tunnell at LyCon about these engines almost a year ago. I wanted to know if the bigger barrels could be put on the parallel valve engines. Nope. Not enough room. But, he's looking into it. Gary PS. I was at Reno this weekend. It's nice to be just 2 hours away.