---------------------------------------------------------- TeamGrumman-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 05/02/06: 10 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:10 AM - =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=20the=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= (TeamGrumman@aol.com) 2. 12:13 AM - =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=20the=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= (TeamGrumman@AOL.COM) 3. 03:34 AM - Re: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. (Bruce Smith) 4. 07:38 AM - Re: Slow day --- and cracks in =?iso-8859-1?Q?the=A0=A0?= horizontal. (Gil Alexander) 5. 08:12 AM - =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:__Slow_day_---_and_cracks_in___the?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0_horizontal.?= (flyv35b) 6. 11:12 AM - =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=A0=A0=20the=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= (TeamGrumman@aol.com) 7. 11:12 AM - =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=A0=A0=20the=A0=20=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= (TeamGrumman@aol.com) 8. 02:09 PM - grumman wing? (Frazier, Vincent A) 9. 05:53 PM - Re: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. (Dave) 10. 09:39 PM - Baffle cutting (Gil Alexander) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:10:57 AM PST US From: TeamGrumman@aol.com Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20TeamGrumman-List:=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=20the=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 5/1/06 11:41:07 PM, gilalex@earthlink.net writes: > >I always use the Black RTV 732.=A0=A0 It looks a lot better than the oran= ge > >stuff. >=20 > I guess it's not too hot there, and the black would definitely look > better.=A0 I'll try that this week. >=20 There is no where on the whole plane that requires the red stuff. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:13:05 AM PST US From: TeamGrumman@AOL.COM Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20TeamGrumman-List:=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=20the=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 5/1/06 11:41:07 PM, gilalex@earthlink.net writes: > Hey, somewhere for your beer can!! >=20 > Any more details on the center canopy trim.. mine's getting shot...=A0 I > think the last interior work put in foam that was too firm... >=20 I had the canopy headliner covered from side to side. I filled the low=20 spots in the U-channel with foam and then put 1/8 inch high density foam acr= oss=20 the whole thing and then covered it with material. If you do this, keep th= e=20 canopy latch cover handy to figure out how to cover around where it goes. =20= I've=20 done 6 planes like this so far. Gary ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:34:05 AM PST US From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Bruce Smith Works for me! Bruce On May 2, 2006, at 2:04 AM, TeamGrumman@aol.com wrote: > --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com > > > In a message dated 5/1/06 9:39:05 PM, gilalex@earthlink.net writes: > > >> Is it standard practice to add red RTV to seal the upper and lower >> edges of >> the oil cooler at the baffle? >> > > I always use the Black RTV 732. It looks a lot better than the > orange > stuff. > > I've seen as much as a 30 degree drop when the cylinder baffle > strap is cut > back on cyls #3 and #4. The larger exit ramps help also. > > ----- > OK, I'm doing an annual on a plane that has cracks in the vertical > supports > and the horizontal stiffener on the horizontal. Gil, I think this > one is > cracked like yours. Do you know if your plane ever had damage to > the horizontal? > This one has had the leading edge of the horizonatl replaced. > > I've hired a DER to help engineer a better fix than just replacing > the same > parts. If it works, I'm going to do an STC for it. > > There . . . . . is that a good story? > > or, how about > > a McCauley prop for a Cheetah that has been cut down to 72 inches > and pitched > to 63? New LyCon O320, ported and polished, turns 2850 at 7500 feet. > Trues at 134 knots at 7500 feet at 2700 rpm. > > or, how about > > I averaged 147 knots flying to Lancaster in my Tiger. > > or, how about > > I'm doing an STC for my larger cooling exit ramps. > > or, how about > > have you seen the one piece instrument panel I did for a Tiger > about 6 years > ago? Well, I'm going to do another one. This one will be > simialr but > 'better' in my opinion. > > or, how about > > I've eliminated all of the interior plastic except for the canopy > window > trim, the rear window trim and the forward console covers. That > includes the > center plastic piece on the canopy and the top console cover in the > front. The > top console cover is made of Carbon fiber with a cup holder! > > Gary > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:38:46 AM PST US From: Gil Alexander Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Slow day --- and cracks in =?iso-8859-1?Q?the=A0=A0?= horizontal. --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Gil Alexander > > > >I always use the Black RTV 732.=A0=A0 It looks a lot better than the oran= >ge > > >stuff. > >=20 > > I guess it's not too hot there, and the black would definitely look > > better.=A0 I'll try that this week. > >=20 > >There is no where on the whole plane that requires the red stuff. Gary, I always thought that the red stuff had a higher temperature rating... As stated in the web page.... http://www.saftlok.com/stl/rtv_silicone.htm The black 732 has a different temperature rating than the red 732..... gil in Tucson ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:12:35 AM PST US From: "flyv35b" Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_TeamGrumman-List:_Slow_day_---_and_cracks_in___the?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0_horizontal.?= --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "flyv35b" It does. Gary is just saying that the black is sufficient to work anywhere you need it to seal baffles, etc. But I don't think the red is very much more expensive so that is not an issue. Cliff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gil Alexander" Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 7:37 AM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. > --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Gil Alexander > > > >> >> > >I always use the Black RTV 732.=A0=A0 It looks a lot better than the >> > >oran= >>ge >> > >stuff. >> >=20 >> > I guess it's not too hot there, and the black would definitely look >> > better.=A0 I'll try that this week. >> >=20 >> >>There is no where on the whole plane that requires the red stuff. > > Gary, > > I always thought that the red stuff had a higher temperature rating... > > As stated in the web page.... > > http://www.saftlok.com/stl/rtv_silicone.htm > > The black 732 has a different temperature rating than the red 732..... > > gil in Tucson > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:12:09 AM PST US From: TeamGrumman@aol.com Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20TeamGrumman-List:=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=A0=A0=20the=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 5/2/06 7:39:42 AM, gilalex@earthlink.net writes: > I always thought that the red stuff had a higher temperature rating... > > OK, and, if it does have a higher temp rating .... then what? You aren't going to put it on the exhaust because it will burn off in about 2 minutes. Anywhere else would not be subjected to any more than 250 degrees. And the orange stuff is ugly. If the engine catches on fire, the last thing you'll ever care about is whether or not the silicone on your baffles is going to melt. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:12:09 AM PST US From: TeamGrumman@aol.com Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:=20TeamGrumman-List:=20Slow=20day=20---=20and=20?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?cracks=20in=A0=A0=20the=A0=20=A0=A0=20horizontal.?= --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: TeamGrumman@aol.com In a message dated 5/2/06 8:14:06 AM, flyv35b@ashcreekwireless.com writes: > It does.=A0 Gary is just saying that the black is sufficient to work anywh= ere > you need it to seal baffles, etc.=A0 But I don't think the red is very muc= h > more expensive so that is not an issue. >=20 besides, pretty is always faster. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:09:55 PM PST US Subject: TeamGrumman-List: grumman wing? From: "Frazier, Vincent A" --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Frazier, Vincent A" Sorry for the spam but someone on the list might need this. =20 I have a part of what appears to be a Grumman wing. Yankee type. Might be useful to someone for something. Shipping would be a problem, but if there's anyone near SW Indiana, it could be picked up. Pics on the URL below. I'll send more details to interested persons. Please reply off list if interested. http://vincesrocket.com/airplane%20junk.html =20 do not archive Thanks, Vince Frazier 3965 Caborn Road Mount Vernon, IN 47620 812-464-1839 work M-F 812-985-7309 home ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:53:36 PM PST US From: "Dave" Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Dave" Sealing the oil cooler to baffle sounds like a good idea, how much should the cylinder baffle straps be trimmed back?? Dave Tiger N880DM ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gil Alexander" Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 2:39 AM Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. > --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Gil Alexander > > > >> >> > >> >>I always use the Black RTV 732. It looks a lot better than the orange >>stuff. > > I guess it's not too hot there, and the black would definitely look > better. I'll try that this week. > > >>I've seen as much as a 30 degree drop when the cylinder baffle strap is >>cut >>back on cyls #3 and #4. The larger exit ramps help also. > > It definitely helped.. but I can't read numbers on the GEM 602.... bummer, > I like numbers... > > I did discover keeping your 1800 rpm run-up short helped... if yoou start > the take-off with cooler cylinders, they stay cooler much longer.. hot > cylinders take a long while to cool, even when you reach cruise....and the > new Horizon digital tach made the mag checks easier and quicker... > > >>----- >>OK, I'm doing an annual on a plane that has cracks in the vertical >>supports >>and the horizontal stiffener on the horizontal. Gil, I think this one is >>cracked like yours. Do you know if your plane ever had damage to the >>horizontal? >> This one has had the leading edge of the horizonatl replaced. > > Yes... mine had hangar rash on the horizontal, a dent was on the left > leading edge as far out as possible, with some attempt at straightening. > Also some rash on the elevators trailing edges. > > If you go for the inertia theory (wing stops, tail doesn't), there was > also > a fairly large dent on the wing leading edge on the left just short of the > tip. > > >>I've hired a DER to help engineer a better fix than just replacing the >>same >>parts. If it works, I'm going to do an STC for it. > > That would be good.... I'd like to find out if any repaired ones get > buckled again, then we might find out what actually does it... > > >>There . . . . . is that a good story? > > Pretty good.... > > >>or, how about >> >>a McCauley prop for a Cheetah that has been cut down to 72 inches and >>pitched >>to 63? New LyCon O320, ported and polished, turns 2850 at 7500 feet. >>Trues at 134 knots at 7500 feet at 2700 rpm. >> >>or, how about >> >>I averaged 147 knots flying to Lancaster in my Tiger. >> >>or, how about >> >>I'm doing an STC for my larger cooling exit ramps. >> >>or, how about >> >>have you seen the one piece instrument panel I did for a Tiger about 6 >>years >>ago? Well, I'm going to do another one. This one will be simialr but >>'better' in my opinion. >> >>or, how about >> >>I've eliminated all of the interior plastic except for the canopy window >>trim, the rear window trim and the forward console covers. That >>includes the >>center plastic piece on the canopy and the top console cover in the >>front. The >>top console cover is made of Carbon fiber with a cup holder! > > Hey, somewhere for your beer can!! > > Any more details on the center canopy trim.. mine's getting shot... I > think the last interior work put in foam that was too firm... > > gil in tucson > > >>Gary >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:49 PM PST US From: Gil Alexander Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Baffle cutting --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Gil Alexander Dave, I made the baffle distance equal to the distance to the inter-cylinder baffle when measured from the bayonet CHT sensor hole, and copied the 45 degree cutoff that was already there. Home Depot had some nice springs (part # SP9600 near the screen door hardware section) which seemed to be just right to keep the cut baffle in place. It replaced the twisted wire I previously had - and the parts manual even shows springs..... gil in Tucson At 05:52 PM 5/2/2006, you wrote: >--> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: "Dave" > >Sealing the oil cooler to baffle sounds like a good idea, how much should >the cylinder baffle straps be trimmed back?? > >Dave >Tiger N880DM >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Gil Alexander" >To: >Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 2:39 AM >Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Slow day --- and cracks in the horizontal. > > > > --> TeamGrumman-List message posted by: Gil Alexander > > > > > > > >> > >> > > >> > >>I always use the Black RTV 732. It looks a lot better than the orange > >>stuff. > > > > I guess it's not too hot there, and the black would definitely look > > better. I'll try that this week. > > > > > > > >>I've seen as much as a 30 degree drop when the cylinder baffle strap is > >>cut > >>back on cyls #3 and #4. The larger exit ramps help also. > > > > It definitely helped.. but I can't read numbers on the GEM 602.... bummer, > > I like numbers... > > > > I did discover keeping your 1800 rpm run-up short helped... if yoou start > > the take-off with cooler cylinders, they stay cooler much longer.. hot > > cylinders take a long while to cool, even when you reach cruise....and the > > new Horizon digital tach made the mag checks easier and quicker... > > > > > > > >>----- > >>OK, I'm doing an annual on a plane that has cracks in the vertical > >>supports > >>and the horizontal stiffener on the horizontal. Gil, I think this one is > >>cracked like yours. Do you know if your plane ever had damage to the > >>horizontal? > >> This one has had the leading edge of the horizonatl replaced. > > > > Yes... mine had hangar rash on the horizontal, a dent was on the left > > leading edge as far out as possible, with some attempt at straightening. > > Also some rash on the elevators trailing edges. > > > > If you go for the inertia theory (wing stops, tail doesn't), there was > > also > > a fairly large dent on the wing leading edge on the left just short of the > > tip. > > > > > > > >>I've hired a DER to help engineer a better fix than just replacing the > >>same > >>parts. If it works, I'm going to do an STC for it. > > > > That would be good.... I'd like to find out if any repaired ones get > > buckled again, then we might find out what actually does it... > > > > > > > >>There . . . . . is that a good story? > > > > Pretty good.... > > > > > > > >>or, how about > >> > >>a McCauley prop for a Cheetah that has been cut down to 72 inches and > >>pitched > >>to 63? New LyCon O320, ported and polished, turns 2850 at 7500 feet. > >>Trues at 134 knots at 7500 feet at 2700 rpm. > >> > >>or, how about > >> > >>I averaged 147 knots flying to Lancaster in my Tiger. > >> > >>or, how about > >> > >>I'm doing an STC for my larger cooling exit ramps. > >> > >>or, how about > >> > >>have you seen the one piece instrument panel I did for a Tiger about 6 > >>years > >>ago? Well, I'm going to do another one. This one will be simialr but > >>'better' in my opinion. > >> > >>or, how about > >> > >>I've eliminated all of the interior plastic except for the canopy window > >>trim, the rear window trim and the forward console covers. That > >>includes the > >>center plastic piece on the canopy and the top console cover in the > >>front. The > >>top console cover is made of Carbon fiber with a cup holder! > > > > Hey, somewhere for your beer can!! > > > > Any more details on the center canopy trim.. mine's getting shot... I > > think the last interior work put in foam that was too firm... > > > > gil in tucson > > > > > > > >>Gary > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >