Today's Message Index:
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1. 07:09 AM - Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (george.mueller@aurora.org)
2. 07:55 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (Hosler, John)
3. 08:34 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (red_horse@mchsi.com)
4. 09:19 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (FCoon77901@aol.com)
5. 10:42 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (923te)
6. 10:49 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (Hosler, John)
7. 11:11 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (923te)
8. 11:35 AM - Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers (teamgrumman@AOL.COM)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
Can anyone tell me what kind of cruise speeds the 160 hp Travelers get?
And the 160 hp Cheetahs? I am in the market for a Grumman but I am trying
to figure out which one would give me the best bang for the buck. I would
like a Tiger but there still seems to be price premium on those even in
this market.
George C. Mueller
Message 2
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| Subject: | Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
Cheetahs are a lot faster than travelers regardless of engine. Cheetah
has very good speed and excellent range. Climb performance is lack
luster when high and hot (a two seater under such conditions).
John
________________________________
From: owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
george.mueller@aurora.org
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 10:07 AM
Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers
Can anyone tell me what kind of cruise speeds the 160 hp Travelers get?
And the 160 hp Cheetahs? I am in the market for a Grumman but I am
trying to figure out which one would give me the best bang for the buck.
I would like a Tiger but there still seems to be price premium on those
even in this market.
George C. Mueller
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
I get 133 kts at 2000 ft PA, 2750 RPM, out of my 160 hp STC'd cheetah with ft
pegs installed.
George
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: george.mueller@aurora.org
Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers
This is a multipart message in MIME format.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
I have a 1976 Cheetah with the Precision Engine HC STC. the STC was don
e
at overhaul along with "Flo-Matching" (Porting & Poloshing) and the
matching sensininch Prop STC. I Flight plan for 128 kts @ 8000 ft. This
plane
set the coast-to Coast speed record in 2003 at 159+ MPH, Santa Anna, Ca
to
KittyHawk, NC Borh NCAA and FAI records.
This plane is for sale as I have lost Medical Has 2230 Hrs and 320 SMOH
Call from more info...
Fred Coon CFII PFPI
Victoria, Texas
361 575 4663
In a message dated 6/10/2009 9:10:47 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
george.mueller@aurora.org writes:
Can anyone tell me what kind of cruise speeds the 160 hp Travelers get?
And the 160 hp Cheetahs? I am in the market for a Grumman but I am tryin
g
to figure out which one would give me the best bang for the buck. I woul
d
like a Tiger but there still seems to be price premium on those even in
this
market.
**************Dell Inspiron 15 Laptop: Now in 6 vibrant colors! Shop Dell
=99s
full line of laptops.
=http:%2F%2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215566094%3B3786435
8%3Bv)
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
John, You Think the O360 powered Traveler is slower than a Cheetah? I
think you might be quite surprised
ned
Cheetahs are a lot faster than travelers regardless of engine.
Cheetah has very good speed and excellent range. Climb performance is
lack luster when high and hot (a two seater under such conditions).
John
Message 6
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| Subject: | Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
Within reason.
________________________________
From: owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 923te
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 1:37 PM
Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers
John, You Think the O360 powered Traveler is slower than a Cheetah? I
think you might be quite surprised
ned
Cheetahs are a lot faster than travelers regardless of engine.
Cheetah has very good speed and excellent range. Climb performance is
lack luster when high and hot (a two seater under such conditions).
John
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
There is an STC for the O360 in a Traveler and there are a few flying
out there..better make sure before you have a race;) I hear they are
faster than Tigers..and that makes sense seeing how they have les
drag...having smaller tail surface area
The O360 Traveler may be the best 4 place grumman for racing
ned
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers |
My first plane, a 1977 Cheetah was the first plane I began
experimenting on to make go faster. With ported and polished
cylinders, high compression pistons, no steps, buried antennas, one
radio, one panel mounted Trimble 2000 GPS, transponder, no intercom, no
nothing extra, (the plane's empty weight was 1328 lbs) it would true
out at 140 knots under most conditions.
A friend of mines 1977 Cheetah trues at 137 knots with steps and
antennas. (Lycon prepped engine. Dynoed at 188 hp)
Another Traveler I know of, a 1975 with the Cheetah nose, trues as 137
knots.
A friends former 1974 Traveler trued at 135 knots with steps and one
buried antenna.
Another Cheetah I know of, a 1976 that is basically stock with HC
pistons, Sensenich prop, trues at 135 knots
Bottom line is, look at a top speed (TAS) somewhere in the 135 knot
range.
Regarding the Traveler with the O360. I flew alongside this plane in
my Cheetah in about 1988. Sounds like a long time ago now. He could
out climb me big time. Even though my Cheetah, with standard range
tanks, was lighter. There is no substitution for horsepower and
torque. Straight and level, we were about even, within a knot.
I've done about everything I can to make a TIger go faster. Bottom
line, given 180 to 200 hp, the plane is a true 145 knot machine with
not too radical of aerodynamics cleanup. The limit on twisting a
prop
for speed is about 68 inches. Too many tradeoffs after 65 inches. A
65 inch pitch prop with a really strong engine turning over redline is
good for 150 knots on a very clean plane. The answer is more
horsepower.
For what it's worth, the wings on my plane are not very straight. Many
dents. The gap seals between the wing sections don't lay flat. The
Right outboard wing section was replaced by the previous owner with a
new part. HOWEVER, who ever packed it crushed the top section. You
can't see it looking at it, but you can feel it. My guess is that
there is another few knots in my plane just making it straight. PLUS,
until recently, one plastic wheel pant was partially hanging out into
the wind; coming apart as it were. I left it like that for over a
year. (new wheel pants this annual).
I've got a potential partner in making an IO360 Tiger. Yes, I know
it's been done many times. But, not with a 180 hp IO360. I can use
all of the existing parts from the O360 and not have to fabricate new
baffles, engine mount, airbox, etc. I'll be certifying it, IF it
happens, with a new scimitar Hartzell prop. All it takes is money.
-----Original Message-----
From: 923te <923te@att.net>
Sent: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 10:37 am
Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Cruise speeds for 160hp Travelers
John, You Think the O360 power
ed Traveler is
slower than a Cheetah? I think you might be quite surprised
ned
Cheetahs are a lot
faster than travelers regardless of engine. Cheetah has very good
speed
and excellent range. Climb performance is lack luster when high and
hot
(a two seater under such conditions).
John
0 -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
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