Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:28 AM - Re: Here's a good one (FLYaDIVE)
2. 06:20 AM - Re: Re: Here's a good one (flyv35b)
3. 10:06 AM - Re: Here's a good one (Gary Vogt)
4. 10:08 AM - Re: Re: Here's a good one (Gary Vogt)
5. 10:19 AM - SB-194 (Gary Vogt)
6. 10:51 AM - Re: SB-194 (Bob Steward)
7. 11:22 AM - Re: SB-194 (Gary Vogt)
8. 03:55 PM - Tinnerman speed nuts (Gary Vogt)
9. 04:06 PM - Re: Tinnerman speed nuts (Dj Merrill)
10. 04:24 PM - Re: Tinnerman speed nuts (Dj Merrill)
11. 04:58 PM - Re: Tinnerman speed nuts (Gary Vogt)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Here's a good one |
Gary:
What would your reasoning be that the formation flying was the cause?
And why would serial number 36 make it a one of a kind plane? (As in:
AG5B-10036 ?)
Saw your pictures... What a PITA job. GOOD LUCK.
Barry
On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:55 PM, Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm working on an AG5B. It's serial number 36 so it's a one-of-a-kind
> airplane.
>
> This plane was owned by a guy who did a LOT of formation flying. When I
> got the plane, it had not any ANY routine maintenance in a very long time.
> But, that's another story. Back to formation flying.
>
> When I first flew this plane, I thought the controls had a lot of play in
> them; particularly on the pilots side. I got under the panel and watched
> the U-joints. Hmm. Seems like a lot of play to me. Maybe it's just me.
> So, after installing a new airbox [which increases the manifold pressure
> by up to an inch Hg (never less than .8 inches Hg increase)] I gave the
> plane back to its owner to fly for a while.
>
> The owner also noted there was a lot of play. So, I ordered new U-Joint.
> Garner warned me they'd be difficult to drill, and they were.
>
> After installing the pilot's side first, I moved the yoke back and forth.
> The play was still there, though not as much; I would say 1/4 inch at the
> yoke. I reached up to the sprocket for the control chain and there was
> play between the shaft the u-joint is on and the sprocket. The only thing
> that could be is the pin that holds the sprocket to the shaft. It must be
> crowded out. Now, there's a new one.
>
> I disassembled the shaft assembly and it wouldn't come out. I used a
> drift into the shaft to knock it out. It was really stuck. The roller
> bearings to the shaft were caked with dried grease, the bearings were
> anything but smooth. The shaft has a flat spot in it.
>
> I have a complete control assembly from a 79 Tiger. I took it apart and
> after 32 years, the grease was still good and the bearings smooth.
>
> Bob S., what grease was used in 79? what grease was used in the AG5B?
>
> Just a heads up. If you do a lot of formation flying, watch for play in
> the yokes.
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Here's a good one |
On 12/13/2011 6:38 PM, Gary Vogt wrote:
> Here is the sprocket and shaft. No entries in the log books for this
> shaft. It looks like it had been assembled at the factory with the end
> of the shaft ground in order to fix an obviously bad pin installation. I
> didn't remove the pin. I did try to wedge the pin to tighten the
> sprocket. I wouldn't trust it.
>
> Both universal joints had some play compared to new ones. The biggest
> problem was the loose sprocket.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
From the photo is looks like the pin doesn't fit the shaft hole on one
side (pretty sloppy work). How is the fit at the opposite end? The pin
must be a press fit in the gear stud that fits inside the shaft, and
maybe in the shaft as well. I'd drive the pin out as maybe the hole in
the gear stub has worn and it is loose inside. You could ream the parts
and have an oversize pin machined on a lathe possibly, or just buy new
parts (less hassle).
Cliff
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Here's a good one |
I think the problem was there when the plane was made. -The constant smal
l control corrections while formation flying, especially by a ham-fisted pi
lot, aggravated the problem. -All of the early AG5Bs were different from
each other. -I only wish I had the money to buy the Type Certificate.=0A
=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: FLYaDIVE <flyadive@gmail.co
m>=0ATo: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Wednesday, December 14, 20
11 5:26 AM=0ASubject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Here's a good one=0A =0A=0AGary
:=0A=0AWhat would your-reasoning-be that the formation flying was the c
ause?=0A=0AAnd why would serial number 36 make it a one of a kind plane?
-(As in: AG5B-10036 ?)=0A=0ASaw your pictures... What a PITA job. -GOOD
LUCK.=0A=0ABarry=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:55 PM, Gary
Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:=0A=0AI'm working on an AG5B. -It's s
erial number 36 so it's a one-of-a-kind airplane.=0A>=0A>=0A>This plane was
owned by a guy who did a LOT of formation flying. -When I got the plane,
it had not any ANY routine maintenance in a very long time. -But, that's
another story. -Back to formation flying.=0A>=0A>=0A>When I first flew t
his plane, I thought the controls had a lot of play in them; particularly o
n the pilots side. -I got under the panel and watched the U-joints. -Hm
m. -Seems like a lot of play to me. -Maybe it's just me. -So, after i
nstalling a new airbox [which increases the manifold pressure by up to an i
nch Hg (never less than .8 inches Hg increase)] I gave the plane back to it
s owner to fly for a while. -=0A>=0A>=0A>The owner also noted there was a
lot of play. -So, I ordered new U-Joint. -Garner warned me they'd be d
ifficult to drill, and they were. -=0A>=0A>=0A>After installing the pilot
's side first, I moved the yoke back and forth. -The play was still there
, though not as much; I would say 1/4 inch at the yoke. -I reached up to
the sprocket for the control chain and there was play between the shaft the
u-joint is on and the sprocket. -The only thing that could be is the pin
that holds the sprocket to the shaft. -It must be crowded out. -Now, t
here's a new one. -=0A>=0A>=0A>I disassembled the shaft assembly and it w
ouldn't come out. -I used a drift into the shaft to knock it out. -It w
as really stuck. -The roller bearings to the shaft were caked with dried
grease, the bearings were anything but smooth. -The shaft has a flat spot
in it.-=0A>=0A>=0A>I have a complete control assembly from a 79 Tiger.
-I took it apart and after 32 years, the grease was still good and the be
arings smooth. -=0A>=0A>=0A>Bob S., what grease was used in 79? -what g
rease was used in the AG5B?=0A>=0A>=0A>Just a heads up. -If you do a lot
of formation flying, watch for play in the yokes.=0A>_blank">www.aeroelectr
ic.com=0A.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com=0A="_blank">www.ho
mebuilthelp.com=0A_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution=0Ast" targe
t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List=0Atp://for
=====================
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Here's a good one |
The surface on which the roller bearings ride has been ground off. -When
I got the chain off I tried to turn it without extra drag. -It was VERY r
ough. -This entire part should have been scrapped at the factory.=0A=0A
=0A________________________________=0A From: flyv35b <flyv35b@minetfiber.co
m>=0ATo: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Wednesday, December 14, 20
11 6:17 AM=0ASubject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Re: Here's a good one=0A =0A-->
TeamGrumman-List message posted by: flyv35b <flyv35b@minetfiber.com>=0A=0A
On 12/13/2011 6:38 PM, Gary Vogt wrote:=0A> Here is the sprocket and shaft.
No entries in the log books for this=0A> shaft. It looks like it had been
assembled at the factory with the end=0A> of the shaft ground in order to f
ix an obviously bad pin installation. I=0A> didn't remove the pin. I did tr
y to wedge the pin to tighten the=0A> sprocket. I wouldn't trust it.=0A>
=0A> Both universal joints had some play compared to new ones. The biggest
=0A> problem was the loose sprocket.=0A> =0A> -----------------------------
-------------------------------------------=0AFrom the photo is looks like
the pin doesn't fit the shaft hole on one side (pretty sloppy work).- How
is the fit at the opposite end?- The pin must be a press fit in the gear
stud that fits inside the shaft, and maybe in the shaft as well.- I'd dr
ive the pin out as maybe the hole in the gear stub has worn and it is loose
inside.- You could ream the parts and have an oversize pin machined on a
lathe possibly, or just buy new parts (less hassle).=0A=0A=0A=0ACliff=0A
=- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle
=
Message 5
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Looking over SB-194, -it says to put grease on the chain. -Seems to me,
based on 45 years of riding motorcycles, that a chain lube would make more
sense. -
Message 6
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>Looking over SB-194, it says to put grease on the chain. Seems to
>me, based on 45 years of riding motorcycles, that a chain lube would
>make more sense.
Take it up with Kevin and Lloyd. We lowly mechanics have no say in
altering the approved instructions. :-(
--Bob Steward
Message 7
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I'll get right on that.=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: B
ob Steward <n76lima@mindspring.com>=0ATo: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
=0ASent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 10:48 AM=0ASubject: Re: TeamGrumman-L
ima@mindspring.com>=0A=0A=0A> Looking over SB-194,- it says to put grease
on the chain.- Seems to me, based on 45 years of riding motorcycles, tha
t a chain lube would make more sense.=0A=0ATake it up with Kevin and Lloyd.
- We lowly mechanics have no say in altering the approved instructions. :
=- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle
========
Message 8
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| Subject: | Tinnerman speed nuts |
Or U-nuts. -Or U-clips. -I can't find a good description that fits all
internet searches. -=0A=0AI'm looking for the #4-40 Tinnerman nuts used o
n the canopy window moldings. -The PN I have that seems to find it is C99
1-440. -HOWEVER . . . -I can't find a C199-440 by itself. -I can only
find C199-440-4 or C199-440-3B. -Unfortunately, I can't find a pic that
goes with either of those PNs. -Plus, I can't find any to purchase in qua
ntities less than 1000. -Any ideas?=0A=0AGary
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Tinnerman speed nuts |
On Dec 14, 2011, at 6:52 PM, Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Or U-nuts. Or U-clips. I can't find a good description that fits all int
ernet searches.
>
> I'm looking for the #4-40 Tinnerman nuts used on the canopy window molding
s. The PN I have that seems to find it is C991-440. HOWEVER . . . I can't
find a C199-440 by itself. I can only find C199-440-4 or C199-440-3B. Unf
ortunately, I can't find a pic that goes with either of those PNs. Plus, I c
an't find any to purchase in quantities less than 1000. Any ideas?
>
>
Try McMasterCarr
Are these what you are looking for?
http://www.mcmaster.com/#=fd596i
-Dj
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Tinnerman speed nuts |
>
> Try McMasterCarr
>
> Are these what you are looking for?
> http://www.mcmaster.com/#=fd596i
>
Sorry, search "tinnerman nuts" once you get there.
-Dj
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Tinnerman speed nuts |
http://www.gen-aircraft-hardware.com/images/PDF/tinnerman.pdf=0A=0A=0AWhat
I need looks like "D" only in a 4-40 thread. -I don't see it in-McMaste
rCarr=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Dj Merrill <deej@deej.
net>=0ATo: "teamgrumman-list@matronics.com" <teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
> =0ASent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 4:21 PM=0ASubject: Re: TeamGrumman-
List: Tinnerman speed nuts=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A>=0A>Try McMasterCarr=0A>=0A>
=0A>Are these what you are looking for?http://www.mcmaster.com/#=fd596i
=0A>=0A>=0ASorry, search "tinnerman nuts" once you get there.-=0A=0A-Dj
=========================0A
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