Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:40 AM - Re: FW: Jaguar cowling (Gary L Vogt)
2. 12:42 PM - High CHTs (Gary Vogt)
3. 01:32 PM - Re: High CHTs (FLYaDIVE)
4. 01:52 PM - Re: High CHTs (Airport Bum)
5. 06:15 PM - Re: FW: Jaguar cowling (Phil Kelsey)
6. 07:33 PM - Re: High CHTs (Ronald Millman CPA)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: FW: Jaguar cowling |
The standard configuration keeps the same split upper cowling. View some of t
he pics on AuCountry.com.
Gary
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 16, 2012, at 9:30 AM, "Hosler, John" <JHOSLER@epri.com> wrote:
> Phil:
>
> The cowling looks great. I notice that you can open each side of the top c
owling individually (as in original design). Is this configuration standard
for the Jaguar cowling or did you have to modify it?
>
> John Hosler
> (Statesville, NC)
>
> From: owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-teamgrumma
n-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Phil Kelsey
> Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2012 11:09 AM
> To: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
> Subject: TeamGrumman-List: FW: Jaguar cowling
>
>
> Gary asked that I post my jaguar cowling thoughts/results for you all to r
ead. I field installed the cowling in late 2011 finally doing the first fli
ght in December 2011. Since then I have flown my 1979 Tiger about 150 hours
. I commute from Connecticut to South Carolina plus my pilots use the plane
when I=99m not. Feel free to email me with any questions.
>
>
> Phil Kelsey
> Reliant Air
> Danbury, CT
>
> Cowling and baffle install:
>
> I found the overall quality of the cowling as delivered to be excellent. I
probably spent well over 120 hours installing it but that=99s in part
due to not being able to devote full time to fitting and installing.. The b
affling parts all fit well except for the right rear transition for the air f
ilter duct. Spent considerable time getting it to fit exactly the way I wan
ted it. I also wanted to have a flush landing light cover so I fabricated i
t out of lexan. I used a camloc in the front instead of a screw. It worked
out really well. I did have to fabricate my own front top of engine to cow
l baffling. I also used 10 pound struts to hold the cowl lids open. They a
re designed so that they are over center therefore applying slight closing p
ressure on the cowl lid when it is closed.
>
> Performance.
>
> My Tiger is equipped with EI gauges and all before and after readings are
from the EI gauges. All reading are averages in level flight at 2650 rpm ov
er the last 18 months or about 150 hours of flying.
>
> Altitude
> IAS
> OAT =81=B0F
> Fuel Flow
> TAS
> #1 CYL/EGT
> #2 CYL/EGT
> #3 CYL/EGT
> #3 CYL/EGT
> PowerFlow only
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 6500
> 120
> 60
> 11.4
> 140
> 327/1283
> 344/1388
> 371/1326
> 376/1310
> Powerflow and Cowl
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 6500
> 129
> 36
> 12.0
> 142
> 327/1490
> 332/1444
> 336/1413
> 322/1336
>
> I really have only seen a small speed increase with the cow (about 2 knot
s)l. I have seen a dramatic decrease in the spread between hottest and cold
est cylinders. The cowling takes me less than half the time to remove and i
nstall versus the old one. It seems to be holding up very well. I did use t
he new baffling material from aircraft spruce which has a Teflon coating on o
ne side which seems to help chafing.
>
> I was concerned with landing light replacement so I installed an LED one w
hich should last pretty much forever.
>
> I am glad I installed the cowl, would do it again. It wasn=99t ine
xpensive but what in aviation is.
>
>
> <image001.jpg><image002.jpg><image003.jpg>
> <image004.jpg><image005.jpg><image006.jpg>
> <image007.jpg><image008.jpg><image009.jpg>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Message 2
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I need someone who has really high CHTs (and is too cheap to buy a JagCowl
. . . grin) to try one of my special fairings. -=0A=0AYou must have 4-cyl
inder CHT/EGT (and I mean a real one, not some Westach, Falcon, Micro or so
mething else that has no relevance to the real world)=0A=0AYou need to have
good historical data for a before and after comparison.=0A=0AYou'll need t
o remove your nose gear strut to get the boot off. -The fairing screws in
place. -This should make R&R of the cowling easier too.
Message 3
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Gary:
Love to help.
Tiger with standard cowl,
EI with 4 EGT & 4 CHT and extra 4 Temp Probe locations on switch.
Also have extra Probes for placement within cowl or boot area.
Barry
On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 3:41 PM, Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I need someone who has really high CHTs (and is too cheap to buy a JagCowl
> . . . grin) to try one of my special fairings.
>
> You must have 4-cylinder CHT/EGT (and I mean a real one, not some Westach,
> Falcon, Micro or something else that has no relevance to the real world)
>
> You need to have good historical data for a before and after comparison.
>
> You'll need to remove your nose gear strut to get the boot off. The
> fairing screws in place. This should make R&R of the cowling easier too.
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 4
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Shoo one to me and ill let you know the results.
Kevin
Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I need someone who has really high CHTs (and is too cheap to buy a JagCowl . .
. grin) to try one of my special fairings.
>
>You must have 4-cylinder CHT/EGT (and I mean a real one, not some Westach, Falcon,
Micro or something else that has no relevance to the real world)
>
>You need to have good historical data for a before and after comparison.
>
>You'll need to remove your nose gear strut to get the boot off. The fairing screws
in place. This should make R&R of the cowling easier too.
Message 5
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| Subject: | FW: Jaguar cowling |
Thanks, I=99ll look at the numbers again maybe I screwed up the
spreadsheet somehow.
Phil
From: owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-teamgrumman-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
FLYaDIVE
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2012 18:50
Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: FW: Jaguar cowling
Hello Phil:
Using your supplied numbers, there is an inconsistency. I don't know if
that is the proper term but further investigation is required.
All your EGT reading went UP and your GPH also went UP. If you were to
hold the same altitude and lean in both flights to the same EGT [at
least on one cylinder] the numbers would be more comparable.
Examples:
1 - EGT - Usually cylinders #3 & 4 run the hottest on both CHT & EGT yet
in your second flight the EGT was hotter than the first flight. They
ALL increased - And Cyl #2 jumped UP a whooping 207 F.
And - The OAT was just about HALF of that of the first flight.
And - There was a very slight increase in fuel flow - Less than 1%
If fuel flow increases the EGT usually drops.
IF your timing was off more raw fuel could been dumped into the exhaust
and that could account for higher EGT's.
2 - CHT - Well, there you did pretty good. There was a DROP in CHT on
#2, 3 & 4 but #1 remained the same. WHY?
OAT was lower and speed was higher as well as the fuel flow being
slightly higher.
All of thei s should be reflected in lower CHT's
3 - Now let's take a look at temp spreads:
Flight #1 Delta of CHT was: 49 F
Flight #2 Delta of CHT was: 14 F
This would indicated a BETTER uniform flow of air with the cowl.
And since there was a reduction in CHT [all but Cyl #1] I would say the
cowling is doing good.
Flight #1 Delta of EGT was: 105 F
Flight #2 Delta of EGT was: 154 F
I don't know what this indicates...
My first guess and it really is that a guess; is your baffling needs
some work, not much just some. I sew the overlaps of the side and back
rubber seal together. In such a manor that there is no space and they
are sprung up to force against the cowl.
How is the baffling between and under the cylinders?
What do the ware marks of the baffling against the cowl show, are they
uniform without any spaces?
Any idea why the jump in EGT's from First Flight to Second?
The cowl seems to be working.
Are you flying in the Power Band of the Power Flow Exhaust?
AHhhh! That brings up another question: Why the INCREASE on fuel flow
- Doesn't PF advertise a reduction in fuel flow?
Barry
On Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 11:09 AM, Phil Kelsey <Phil@reliantair.com>
wrote:
Gary asked that I post my jaguar cowling thoughts/results for you all to
read. I field installed the cowling in late 2011 finally doing the
first flight in December 2011. Since then I have flown my 1979 Tiger
about 150 hours. I commute from Connecticut to South Carolina plus my
pilots use the plane when I=99m not. Feel free to email me with
any questions.
Phil Kelsey
Reliant Air
Danbury, CT
Cowling and baffle install:
I found the overall quality of the cowling as delivered to be excellent.
I probably spent well over 120 hours installing it but that=99s
in part due to not being able to devote full time to fitting and
installing.. The baffling parts all fit well except for the right rear
transition for the air filter duct. Spent considerable time getting it
to fit exactly the way I wanted it. I also wanted to have a flush
landing light cover so I fabricated it out of lexan. I used a camloc in
the front instead of a screw. It worked out really well. I did have to
fabricate my own front top of engine to cowl baffling. I also used 10
pound struts to hold the cowl lids open. They are designed so that they
are over center therefore applying slight closing pressure on the cowl
lid when it is closed.
Performance.
My Tiger is equipped with EI gauges and all before and after readings
are from the EI gauges. All reading are averages in level flight at 2650
rpm over the last 18 months or about 150 hours of flying.
Altitude
IAS
OAT =81=B0F
Fuel Flow
TAS
#1 CYL/EGT
#2 CYL/EGT
#3 CYL/EGT
#3 CYL/EGT
PowerFlow only
6500
120
60
11.4
140
327/1283
344/1388
371/1326
376/1310
Powerflow and Cowl
6500
129
36
12.0
142
327/1490
332/1444
336/1413
322/1336
I really have only seen a small speed increase with the cow (about 2
knots)l. I have seen a dramatic decrease in the spread between hottest
and coldest cylinders. The cowling takes me less than half the time to
remove and install versus the old one. It seems to be holding up very
well. I did use the new baffling material from aircraft spruce which
has a Teflon coating on one side which seems to help chafing.
I was concerned with landing light replacement so I installed an LED one
which should last pretty much forever.
I am glad I installed the cowl, would do it again. It wasn=99t
inexpensive but what in aviation is.
Image removed by sender. GRUMMAN COWL INSTALL 002.jpgImage removed by
sender. GRUMMAN COWL INSTALL 007.jpgImage removed by sender. GRUMMAN
COWL INSTALL 018.jpg
Image removed by sender. GRUMMAN COWL INSTALL 009.jpgImage removed by
sender. GRUMMAN COWL INSTALL 004.jpgImage removed by sender. GRUMMAN
COWL INSTALL 006.jpg
Image removed by sender. GRUMMAN COWL INSTALL 014.jpgImage removed by
sender. GRUMMAN COWL INSTALL 016.jpgImage removed by sender. GRUMMAN
COWL INSTALL 019.jpg
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Message 6
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I believe that I meet your specifications.Engine with 28 hours. New EGT C
HT 4 probes.High temps per my IA. 450 on climb VX #3.New electronic Tach.
Stock cowl.Ron Millman=2C CPA Glendale=2C CA AA5B @KWHP (Los Angeles)818-
241-3286
Date: Mon=2C 17 Sep 2012 16:32:02 -0400
Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs
From: flyadive@gmail.com
Gary:
Love to help.
Tiger with standard cowl=2C EI with 4 EGT & 4 CHT and extra 4 Temp Probe lo
cations on switch.Also have extra Probes for placement within cowl or boot
area.
Barry
On Mon=2C Sep 17=2C 2012 at 3:41 PM=2C Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wr
ote:
I need someone who has really high CHTs (and is too cheap to buy a JagCowl
. . . grin) to try one of my special fairings.
You must have 4-cylinder CHT/EGT (and I mean a real one=2C not some Westach
=2C Falcon=2C Micro or something else that has no relevance to the real wor
ld)
You need to have good historical data for a before and after comparison.
You'll need to remove your nose gear strut to get the boot off. The fairin
g screws in place. This should make R&R of the cowling easier too.
st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
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