Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:40 AM - Engine cooling air exit deign (discover)
2. 08:14 AM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (Bob Steward)
3. 08:16 AM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (Airport Bum)
4. 08:22 AM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (FLYaDIVE)
5. 09:25 AM - Re: High CHTs (BILL9725@AOL.COM)
6. 10:51 AM - Re: High CHTs (FLYaDIVE)
7. 11:14 AM - Re: High CHTs (BILL9725@AOL.COM)
8. 11:47 AM - Re: High CHTs (discover)
9. 11:57 AM - Re: High CHTs (BILL9725@AOL.COM)
10. 12:34 PM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (Gary Vogt)
11. 12:38 PM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (Gary Vogt)
12. 12:40 PM - Re: High CHTs (Gary Vogt)
13. 01:12 PM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (FLYaDIVE)
14. 01:19 PM - Re: Engine cooling air exit deign (Bob Steward)
15. 05:40 PM - Re: High CHTs (Ronald Millman CPA)
16. 08:36 PM - Re: High CHTs (Gary Vogt)
17. 09:31 PM - Re: High CHTs (Airport Bum)
18. 10:00 PM - Re: High CHTs (Gary L Vogt)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Engine cooling air exit deign |
The Grumman Traveler Engine cooling air exit design changed in 1975. It went from
hanging outside or below the fuselage line to inside the cowl keeping the lower
cowl line even with the fuselage.
The specifications indicate a speed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts. Was this
due primarily to the change in Engine cooling air exit deign?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
Don't forget that 75 was also the change to the cleaned up gear from the Tiger.
Early Travelers had the square edge of the gear legs out in the breeze, and even
those with wheel pants had no brake covers or upper gear leg fairings.
And the blunt nose of the early cowl was probably costly in terms of drag, too.
So there are many factors besides the change in the bottom of the cowling.
--Bob Steward
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
There were also changes in other areas as well. The fuel sump covers as well as
gear leg fairings and nose faring were now the same as cheetah/tiger. I would
guess at least a small part of the speed increase was due to the cowling change
with reduced cooling drag. But think most of the speed was from the gear
cleanup.
Kevin
discover <923te@att.net> wrote:
>
>The Grumman Traveler Engine cooling air exit design changed in 1975. It went from
hanging outside or below the fuselage line to inside the cowl keeping the
lower cowl line even with the fuselage.
>
>The specifications indicate a speed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts. Was this
due primarily to the change in Engine cooling air exit deign?
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
Where are you getting this information from!
Totally off the wall - Totally bogus - But great to start a Bull Session .
How do you separate the speed difference from the fixed cowl flaps to a
speed increase of 6 Kts with JUST the flaps going from outside to flush
mount?
I guess the rest of the cowl change had nothing to do with the speed
increase!
Since I have a AA5 and with your logic I can gain 6 Kts just by removing my
flaps. The increase in 6 Kts of speed should take care of any cooling lost
due to the removal of the flaps. AND since the AA5 has better cooling of
the AA5A or B it won't matter much... Huh!
Barry
On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 10:39 AM, discover <923te@att.net> wrote:
>
> The Grumman Traveler Engine cooling air exit design changed in 1975. It
> went from hanging outside or below the fuselage line to inside the cowl
> keeping the lower cowl line even with the fuselage.
>
> The specifications indicate a speed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts.
> Was this due primarily to the change in Engine cooling air exit deign?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451
>
>
Message 5
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Hi Gary
Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it. I
will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say
with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
gives better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting
disturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a gallon
per
hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been leaned to
peak.
As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say if
we can get these results anyone can!
I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
Thanks and should have pictures downloaded later today.
Bill
In a message dated 10/13/2012 11:18:16 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
teamgrumman@yahoo.com writes:
Bill,
Can you get some pics of the fairing on your plane? Make a spread sheet
with the OAT and CHTs for various climb and cruise conditions. If you have
experience with previous CHTs, include them.
Are you flying very much? Come up to Auburn and let me see it.
Gary
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 19, 2012, at 8:41 AM, _BILL9725@AOL.COM_ (mailto:BILL9725@AOL.COM)
wrote:
Hi Gary
I am located in Lodi 1O3, Tiger is a 1976 model slowly getting renovated.
Recently put your face panels on and greatly improved look, best
investment so far.
Thanks
Bill Stigile
209-712-6100
In a message dated 9/18/2012 11:11:37 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
_teamgrumman@yahoo.com_ (mailto:teamgrumman@yahoo.com) writes:
Bill, Where are located?
Gary
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2012, at 8:38 AM, _BILL9725@AOL.COM_ (mailto:BILL9725@AOL.COM)
wrote:
Hi Gary
Another Tiger owner very interested in testing your fairing. My Tiger has
200 hrs on a Millenum motor, and JPI 4 probe with download available. Was
thinking of eventually getting a Jaguar before the end of the year if my
ship comes in, death in family, but would love to test the fairing even so
and especially if things don`t allow a new Jaguar by year end. #4 runs hot,
usually 430+ on most days with proper leaning, #3 right behind at 420
usually. Summer or winter, and any altitude, could be the manual leaner, I
know.
Thanks
Bill
Tiger N1540R
In a message dated 9/17/2012 12:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
_teamgrumman@yahoo.com_ (mailto:teamgrumman@yahoo.com) writes:
I need someone who has really high CHTs (and is too cheap to buy a JagCowl
. . . grin) to try one of my special fairings.
You must have 4-cylinder CHT/EGT (and I mean a real one, not some Westach,
Falcon, Micro or something else that has no relevance to the real world)
You need to have good historical data for a before and after comparison.
You'll need to remove your nose gear strut to get the boot off. The
fairing screws in place. This should make R&R of the cowling easier too.
st href="_http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List_
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List)
">_http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List_ (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List)
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">_http://forums.matronics.com_ (http://forums.matronics.com/)
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(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List)
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(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List)
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Message 6
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Bill & Gary:
Attached are some updates to the original data. The original had some
format errors.
The data that seems to be missing is the the Data WITHOUT the Mod. Bill,
do you have any of that?
It would have been very interesting to record the air temps at the exhaust
ramps and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the install. If
the exhaust ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption more air is
exiting the entire cowl. If the temps at each exhaust point were equal you
could make the assumption that the Mod helps balance the flow throughout
the cowl ergo improving the entire engine cooling.
Gary, have you posted a picture of the Mod? One GREAT point of having an
OPEN Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items could easily be retrieved.
That alone is worth hours of frustration.
Barry
On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:24 PM, <BILL9725@aol.com> wrote:
> **
> Hi Gary
>
> Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it. I
> will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say
> with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
> gives better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting
> disturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a
> gallon per hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been
> leaned to peak.
>
> As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say
> if we can get these results anyone can!
>
> I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
> lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
>
> Thanks and should have pictures downloaded later today.
>
> Bill
>
>
Message 7
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Hi Barry
Guess I didn`t say this correctly, but the first is with the Mod, the
listing with the Boot is before the mod. So both are there or at least I
thought so. I do have EGT`s also but that difference was very slight less than
50 degrees before and after, the largest drop was in CHT`s. As to balance
before and after I can almost get all cylinders balanced within 50 degrees
EGT before and after so that did not change either way.
I do have pictures and will download them shortly.
In a message dated 10/16/2012 10:51:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
flyadive@gmail.com writes:
Bill & Gary:
Attached are some updates to the original data. The original had some
format errors.
The data that seems to be missing is the Data WITHOUT the Mod. Bill, do
you have any of that?
It would have been very interesting to record the air temps at the exhaust
ramps and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the install. If
the exhaust ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption more air is
exiting the entire cowl. If the temps at each exhaust point were equal you
could make the assumption that the Mod helps balance the flow throughout the
cowl ergo improving the entire engine cooling.
Gary, have you posted a picture of the Mod? One GREAT point of having an
OPEN Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items could easily be retrieved.
That alone is worth hours of frustration.
Barry
On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:24 PM, <_BILL9725@aol.com_
(mailto:BILL9725@aol.com) > wrote:
Hi Gary
Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it. I
will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say
with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
gives better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting
disturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a gallon
per
hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been leaned to
peak.
As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say
if we can get these results anyone can!
I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
Thanks and should have pictures downloaded later today.
Bill
Message 8
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Bill,
The biggest gains I got when trying to decrease my Tiger CHT's was from enlarging
the cylinder wrap baffle exits and cleaning out the casting flash on the fins
between the spark plugs. I did a lot of other things first but the airflow
was being throttled down by the too small exits under the cylinders between the
cylinder baffle wraps
Ned
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385484#385484
Message 9
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Hi Barry & Gary
Attached is a picture of the cuff installed, I send two and overloaded the
server so am sending again. I will run some tests this weekend without
boot or cuff to give comparisons.
Bill
In a message dated 10/16/2012 10:51:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
flyadive@gmail.com writes:
Bill & Gary:
Attached are some updates to the original data. The original had some
format errors.
The data that seems to be missing is the Data WITHOUT the Mod. Bill, do
you have any of that?
It would have been very interesting to record the air temps at the exhaust
ramps and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the install. If
the exhaust ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption more air is
exiting the entire cowl. If the temps at each exhaust point were equal you
could make the assumption that the Mod helps balance the flow throughout the
cowl ergo improving the entire engine cooling.
Gary, have you posted a picture of the Mod? One GREAT point of having an
OPEN Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items could easily be retrieved.
That alone is worth hours of frustration.
Barry
On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:24 PM, <_BILL9725@aol.com_
(mailto:BILL9725@aol.com) > wrote:
Hi Gary
Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it. I
will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say
with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
gives better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting
disturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a gallon
per
hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been leaned to
peak.
As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say
if we can get these results anyone can!
I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
Thanks and should have pictures downloaded later today.
Bill
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
I cleaned up a 74 Traveler in 2003-2004. -The end result was 137 TAS.=0A
=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: discover <923te@att.net>=0A
AM=0ASubject: TeamGrumman-List: Engine cooling air exit deign=0A =0A--> Tea
mGrumman-List message posted by: "discover" <923te@att.net>=0A=0AThe Grumma
n Traveler Engine cooling air exit design changed in 1975. It went from han
ging outside or below the fuselage line to inside the cowl keeping the lowe
r cowl line even with the fuselage. =0A=0AThe specifications indicate a spe
ed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts. Was this due primarily to the chang
e in Engine cooling air exit deign?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online he
re:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451=0A=0A
======================
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
Barry, I know this goes against your belief system but...=0A=0AIn 2001, on
the Jaguar cowling, I tried external exits similar to both the Lancair and
Traveler. -Both of them were 2 to 4 knots slower.=0A=0AOn another note:
-You need to practice reading comprehension. -No one is talking about f
laps.=0A=0AGary=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: FLYaDIVE <fl
yadive@gmail.com>=0ATo: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday, Oc
tober 16, 2012 8:22 AM=0ASubject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Engine cooling air
exit deign=0A =0A=0AWhere are you getting this-information-from!=0A=0AT
otally off the wall - Totally-bogus - But great to start a Bull Session
-.=0A=0AHow do you-separate-the speed-difference-from the fixed c
owl flaps to a speed increase of 6 Kts with JUST the flaps going from outsi
de to flush mount?=0A=0AI guess the rest of the cowl change had nothing to
do with the speed increase!=0A=0ASince I have a AA5 and with your logic I c
an gain 6 Kts just by removing my flaps. -The increase in 6 Kts of speed
should take care of any cooling lost due to the removal of the flaps. - A
ND since the AA5 has better cooling of the AA5A or B it won't matter much..
. Huh!=0A=0ABarry=0A=0A=0AOn Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 10:39 AM, discover <923te
23te@att.net>=0A>=0A>The Grumman Traveler Engine cooling air exit design ch
anged in 1975. It went from hanging outside or below the fuselage line to i
nside the cowl keeping the lower cowl line even with the fuselage.=0A>=0A>T
he specifications indicate a speed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts. Was
this due primarily to the change in Engine cooling air exit deign?=0A>=0A>
=0A>=0A>=0A>Read this topic online here:=0A>=0A>http://forums.matronics.com
/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>===
=========0A>List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.co
m/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List=0A>============0A>http:/
/forums.matronics.com=0A>============0A>le, List Admi
n.=0A>="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution=0A>=====
=========================0A
=====
Message 12
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Bill, that is really good news. -=0A=0AI'll be at the airport on Friday.
-Stop by anytime after about 10-11 am=0A=0AGary=0A=0A=0A_________________
_______________=0A From: "BILL9725@AOL.COM" <BILL9725@AOL.COM>=0ATo: teamgr
umman-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 9:24 AM=0ASubje
ct: Re: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs=0A =0A=0AHi Gary =0A-=0AAttached is a
spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it.- =0AI will have p
ictures shortly.- Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say =0Awith co
nviction.- Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly =0Agiv
es better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting =0Adis
turbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a gallon
=0Aper hour by allowing more aggressive leaning.- All tests have been le
aned =0Ato peak.- =0A-=0AAs you are aware my Tiger is not the best aero
dynamically so as they say if =0Awe can get these results anyone can!-
=0A-=0AI have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting t
o fly a =0Alot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that
can work?- =0A-=0AThanks and should have pictures downloaded later toda
y.- =0A-=0ABill =0A-=0AIn a message dated 10/13/2012 11:18:16 P.M. Pa
cific Daylight Time, =0Ateamgrumman@yahoo.com writes:=0ABill,-=0A>=0A>=0A
>Can you get some pics of the fairing on your plane? -Make a spread shee
t with the OAT and CHTs for various climb and cruise conditions. If you ha
ve experience with previous CHTs, include them. -=0A>=0A>=0A>Are you flyi
ng very much? -Come up to Auburn and let me see it.-=0A>=0A>=0A>GarySe
nt from my iPad=0A>=0A>On Sep 19, 2012, at 8:41 AM, BILL9725@AOL.COM wrote:
=0A>=0A>=0A>Hi Gary =0A>>-=0A>>I am located in Lodi 1O3, Tiger is a 1976
model slowly getting renovated.- Recently put your face panels on and gr
eatly improved look, best investment so far.- =0A>>-=0A>>Thanks =0A>>B
ill Stigile =0A>>209-712-6100=0A>>-=0A>>In a message dated 9/18/2012 11:1
1:37 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, teamgrumman@yahoo.com writes:=0A>>Bill, Wh
ere are located?=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>GarySent from my iPad=0A>>>=0A>>>On Sep 1
8, 2012, at 8:38 AM, BILL9725@AOL.COM wrote:=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>Hi Gary =0A>>
>>-=0A>>>>Another Tiger owner very interested in testing your fairing.-
My Tiger has 200 hrs on a Millenum motor, and JPI 4 probe with download
available.- Was thinking of eventually getting a Jaguar before the end o
f the year if my ship comes in, death in family, but would love to test th
e fairing even so and especially if things don`t allow a new Jaguar by yea
r end.- #4 runs hot, usually 430+ on most days with proper leaning, #3 r
ight behind at 420 usually.- Summer or winter, and any altitude, could b
e the manual leaner, I know.- =0A>>>>-=0A>>>>Thanks =0A>>>>-=0A>>>>Bi
ll =0A>>>>Tiger N1540R =0A>>>>-=0A>>>>-=0A>>>>In a message dated 9/17/2
012 12:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, teamgrumman@yahoo.com writes:=0A>>
>>I need someone who has really high CHTs (and is too cheap to buy a JagCo
wl . . . grin) to try one of my special fairings. -=0A>>>>>=0A>>>>>=0A>>>
>>You must have 4-cylinder CHT/EGT (and I mean a real one, not some Westac
h, Falcon, Micro or something else that has no relevance to the real worl
d)=0A>>>>>=0A>>>>>=0A>>>>>You need to have good historical data for a befo
re and after comparison.=0A>>>>>=0A>>>>>=0A>>>>>You'll need to remove you
r nose gear strut to get the boot off. -The fairing screws in place. -
This should make R&R of the cowling easier too.=0A>>>>>st href="http://w
ww.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?TeamGrumman-List s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com p://www
.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution =0A>>>>h
ref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List">http://www.matr
onics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List href="http://forums.matronics.com/">
http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">
http://www.matronics.com/contribution =0A>>>st href="http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGru
mman-List s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com p://www.matronics.c
om/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution =0A>>href="http://
www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navi
gator?TeamGrumman-List=0Ahref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums
.matronics.com=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.
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Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
Gary:
That is what I have, a '73/74. I have to do the simple things first, like
wheel pants, spats & leggins. The cowl - Well, that is another story. I
picked up a Cheetah nose bowl but finding the upper and lower cowl is
expensive. Someday ;-) I almost had a cowl from a Tiger... Remember?
But that fell through :-(
Barry
On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 3:33 PM, Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I cleaned up a 74 Traveler in 2003-2004. The end result was 137 TAS.
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* discover <923te@att.net>
> *To:* teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 7:39 AM
> *Subject:* TeamGrumman-List: Engine cooling air exit deign
>
>
> The Grumman Traveler Engine cooling air exit design changed in 1975. It
> went from hanging outside or below the fuselage line to inside the cowl
> keeping the lower cowl line even with the fuselage.
>
> The specifications indicate a speed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts.
> Was this due primarily to the change in Engine cooling air exit deign?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451
>
>
> -Day Browse, Chat,  ================
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Engine cooling air exit deign |
I think he means those little fixed cowl flaps on the bottom of the early Traveler
cowl lips.
--Bob Steward
Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Barry, I know this goes against your belief system but...
>
>In 2001, on the Jaguar cowling, I tried external exits similar to both the Lancair
and Traveler. Both of them were 2 to 4 knots slower.
>
>On another note: You need to practice reading comprehension. No one is talking
about flaps.
>
>Gary
>
>________________________________
> From: FLYaDIVE <flyadive@gmail.com>
>To: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
>Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 8:22 AM
>Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Engine cooling air exit deign
>
>
>Where are you getting thisinformationfrom!
>
>Totally off the wall - Totallybogus - But great to start a Bull Session.
>
>How do youseparatethe speeddifferencefrom the fixed cowl flaps to a speed increase
of 6 Kts with JUST the flaps going from outside to flush mount?
>
>I guess the rest of the cowl change had nothing to do with the speed increase!
>
>Since I have a AA5 and with your logic I can gain 6 Kts just by removing my flaps.
The increase in 6 Kts of speed should take care of any cooling lost due to
the removal of the flaps. AND since the AA5 has better cooling of the AA5A
or B it won't matter much... Huh!
>
>Barry
>
>
>On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 10:39 AM, discover <923te@att.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>The Grumman Traveler Engine cooling air exit design changed in 1975. It went
from hanging outside or below the fuselage line to inside the cowl keeping the
lower cowl line even with the fuselage.
>>
>>The specifications indicate a speed increase in the 1975 model of 6 kts. Was
this due primarily to the change in Engine cooling air exit deign?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Read this topic online here:
>>
>>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=385451#385451
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>==========
>>List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?TeamGrumman-List
>>==========
>>http://forums.matronics.com
>>==========
>>le, List Admin.
>>="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>============================
>====
Message 15
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I am definitely interested in any mods to lower engine temps.Ron Millman
=2C Glendale=2C CARonMillmanCPA@msn.com
Date: Tue=2C 16 Oct 2012 13:50:58 -0400
Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs
From: flyadive@gmail.com
Bill & Gary:
Attached are some updates to the original data. The original had some form
at errors. The data that seems to be missing is the the Data WITHOUT the M
od. Bill=2C do you have any of that?
It would have been very interesting to record the air temps at the exhaust
ramps and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the install. If t
he exhaust ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption more air is exi
ting the entire cowl. If the temps at each exhaust point were equal you co
uld make the assumption that the Mod helps balance the flow throughout the
cowl ergo improving the entire engine cooling.
Gary=2C have you posted a picture of the Mod? One GREAT point of having an
OPEN Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items could easily be retrieved.
That alone is worth hours of frustration.
Barry
On Tue=2C Oct 16=2C 2012 at 12:24 PM=2C <BILL9725@aol.com> wrote:
Hi Gary
Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it.
I will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work=2C and I can s
ay
with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
gives better air flow=2C and judging by the increase in speed not putting
disturbed air out=2C Better fuel consumption=2C verified=2C easily saves .8
a gallon
per hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been leaned
to peak.
As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say if
we can get these results anyone can!
I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
Thanks and should have pictures downloaded later today.
Bill
Message 16
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How about a new cowling Ron. -I'll make you a deal you can't afford . . .
. -strike that. -can't refuse.=0A=0A=0A_______________________________
_=0A From: Ronald Millman CPA <ronmillmancpa@msn.com>=0ATo: Bob Steward Gru
mman Gang <teamgrumman-list@matronics.com> =0ASent: Tuesday, October 16, 20
12 5:39 PM=0ASubject: RE: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs=0A =0A=0A =0A-I am
definitely interested in any mods to lower engine-temps.=0ARon Millman, G
lendale, CA=0ARonMillmanCPA@msn.com=0A=0A-=0A=0A=0A______________________
__________=0ADate: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 13:50:58 -0400=0ASubject: Re: TeamGrumm
an-List: High CHTs=0AFrom: flyadive@gmail.com=0ATo: teamgrumman-list@matron
ics.com=0A=0ABill & Gary:=0A=0AAttached are some updates to the-original
-data. -The-original had some format errors. -=0AThe data that seem
s to be missing is the the Data WITHOUT the Mod. -Bill, do you have any o
f that?=0AIt would have been very interesting to record the air temps at th
e exhaust ramps and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the inst
all. -If the exhaust ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption mor
e air is exiting the entire cowl. -If the temps at each exhaust point wer
e equal you could make the assumption that the Mod helps-balance-the fl
ow throughout the cowl ergo improving the entire engine cooling.=0A=0AGary,
have you posted a picture of the Mod? -One GREAT point of having an OPEN
Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items could-easily-be-retrieved
. -That alone is worth hours of frustration.=0A=0ABarry-=0A-=0A=0A=0A
On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:24 PM, <BILL9725@aol.com> wrote:=0A=0A =0A>Hi Ga
ry =0A>-=0A>Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have fl
own it.- =0AI will have pictures shortly.- Your cuff certainly does wor
k, and I can say =0Awith conviction.- Compared to the boot being installe
d the cuff certainly =0Agives better air flow, and judging by the increase
in speed not putting =0Adisturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verifie
d, easily saves .8 a gallon =0Aper hour by allowing more aggressive leaning
.- All tests have been leaned =0Ato peak.- =0A>-=0A>As you are aware
my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say if =0Awe can get th
ese results anyone can!- =0A>-=0A>I have been very busy with work this
time of year so not getting to fly a =0Alot but could make a trip to Auburn
this week on Friday if that can work?- =0A>-=0A>Thanks and should have
==============
Message 17
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What's the deal?
Kevin
Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>How about a new cowling Ron. I'll make you a deal you can't afford . . . . strike
that. can't refuse.
>
>
>________________________________
> From: Ronald Millman CPA <ronmillmancpa@msn.com>
>To: Bob Steward Grumman Gang <teamgrumman-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 5:39 PM
>Subject: RE: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs
>
>
>
>I am definitely interested in any mods to lower enginetemps.
>Ron Millman, Glendale, CA
>RonMillmanCPA@msn.com
>
>
>________________________________
>Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 13:50:58 -0400
>Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs
>From: flyadive@gmail.com
>To: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
>
>Bill & Gary:
>
>Attached are some updates to theoriginaldata. Theoriginal had some format errors.
>The data that seems to be missing is the the Data WITHOUT the Mod. Bill, do you
have any of that?
>It would have been very interesting to record the air temps at the exhaust ramps
and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the install. If the exhaust
ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption more air is exiting the entire
cowl. If the temps at each exhaust point were equal you could make the assumption
that the Mod helpsbalancethe flow throughout the cowl ergo improving
the entire engine cooling.
>
>Gary, have you posted a picture of the Mod? One GREAT point of having an OPEN
Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items couldeasilyberetrieved. That alone
is worth hours of frustration.
>
>Barry
>
>
>On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:24 PM, <BILL9725@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Hi Gary
>>
>>Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it.
>I will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say
>with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
>gives better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting
>disturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a gallon
>per hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been leaned
>to peak.
>>
>>As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say if
>we can get these results anyone can!
>>
>>I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
>lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
>>
>>Thanks and should have=============
Message 18
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$11,000 installed in Auburn. Painted inside, primed outside.
Gary
Sent from my iPad
On Oct 16, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Airport Bum <aa5_driver@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> What's the deal?
>
>
> Kevin
>
> Gary Vogt <teamgrumman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> How about a new cowling Ron. I'll make you a deal you can't afford . . . .
strike that. can't refuse.
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Ronald Millman CPA <ronmillmancpa@msn.com>
>> To: Bob Steward Grumman Gang <teamgrumman-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 5:39 PM
>> Subject: RE: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs
>>
>>
>>
>> I am definitely interested in any mods to lower engine temps.
>> Ron Millman, Glendale, CA
>> RonMillmanCPA@msn.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 13:50:58 -0400
>> Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: High CHTs
>> From: flyadive@gmail.com
>> To: teamgrumman-list@matronics.com
>>
>> Bill & Gary:
>>
>> Attached are some updates to the original data. The original had some format
errors.
>> The data that seems to be missing is the the Data WITHOUT the Mod. Bill, do
you have any of that?
>> It would have been very interesting to record the air temps at the exhaust ramps
and in the area of the Boot Mod - Before and After the install. If the exhaust
ramp temps dropped you could make the assumption more air is exiting the
entire cowl. If the temps at each exhaust point were equal you could make the
assumption that the Mod helps balance the flow throughout the cowl ergo improving
the entire engine cooling.
>>
>> Gary, have you posted a picture of the Mod? One GREAT point of having an OPEN
Boot Mod would be: Dropped tools and items could easily be retrieved. That
alone is worth hours of frustration.
>>
>> Barry
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:24 PM, <BILL9725@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Hi Gary
>>>
>>> Attached is a spread sheet showing the last 5 hours I have flown it.
>> I will have pictures shortly. Your cuff certainly does work, and I can say
>> with conviction. Compared to the boot being installed the cuff certainly
>> gives better air flow, and judging by the increase in speed not putting
>> disturbed air out, Better fuel consumption, verified, easily saves .8 a gallon
>> per hour by allowing more aggressive leaning. All tests have been leaned
>> to peak.
>>>
>>> As you are aware my Tiger is not the best aerodynamically so as they say if
>> we can get these results anyone can!
>>>
>>> I have been very busy with work this time of year so not getting to fly a
>> lot but could make a trip to Auburn this week on Friday if that can work?
>>>
>>> Thanks and should have=============
>
>
>
>
>
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