---------------------------------------------------------- TeamGrumman-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 07/27/14: 3 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:34 PM - CHT: JPI v. EI (teamgrumman@AOL.COM) 2. 02:56 PM - Traveler Project (teamgrumman@AOL.COM) 3. 03:39 PM - Re: Re T/s Assist (Gary L Vogt) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:34:51 PM PST US Subject: TeamGrumman-List: CHT: JPI v. EI From: teamgrumman@AOL.COM I've been saying this for at least 20 years.=0A=0A=0A=0ACub Cr afters just published a DER report this month that compared various=0Abrands of CHT thermocouples to each other. The cont rolled test show that the=0Aungrounded thermocouples as used in the Electronics International instruments=0Awere as much as 50 d egrees cooler than the grounded thermocouple probes as=0Aused in JPI Alcor and Dynon. We always suspected there was a d ifference=0Ahowever I thought the true temperature would be some where in between.=0AThis report advises that the EI's are indi cating too cold, That might become=0Aa big issue for EI soon . This report is 20 pages long, I don't have a=0Aknown link to it, might be available at Cub Crafters.=0A=0AI have always liked the EI brand, however after reading this report, I have=0Asuspended installing any more EI CHTs until they have a fix, or good evidence=0Aof that their CHTs are reading correctly.=0A=0AReport Title: CC11 CHT System and Probe Compari son=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:56:31 PM PST US Subject: TeamGrumman-List: Traveler Project From: teamgrumman@AOL.COM I thought I posted this before, but I don't see it under sent emails and I don't remember seeing it come over as an email.=0A=0A=0AHere's the skinny.=0A=0A=0APaul bought this plane a few years ago, flew it for about 10 months, and when h e found out the engine had a bad cam, decided to do a restoration.=0A=0A=0AFirst, he sent the engine to LyCon. That was two years ago.=0ASecond, he disassembled the plane to have it painted. =0A=0A=0AAfter it was painted, it sat until LyCon finished the engine. He just got the engine back; i t's been ported and polished and painted to match the plane. It looks real good. =0A=0A=0ASince it's easier to take a plane apart than to put it together, he hung onto the project looking for someone to put it together. He contacte d me a few weeks ago and then brought the plane to Aubur n.=0A=0A=0AWith fresh paint, the fuselage looks pretty good. Wings good too if small hail dents don't bother you. =0A=0A =0ASince he wanted to do this right, he bought a Power Flo w Exhaust System and a LoPresti Nose Bowl. He also bought a Sensenich prop with 445 TTSN.=0A=0A=0AHe has over $20,000 invested in the engine. =0AThe PF exhaust system was $4400. =0AThe LoPresti nose bowl was over $5000. =0AThe Sensen ich prop was $3000=0A=0A=0APaint was also several thousand dolla rs. =0A=0A=0AI started putting the plane together. My firs t step was to hang the engine since it would be easier t o move around with an engine balancing the plane. Then I removed all of the parts that were left inside. It was then that I found a fair amount of corrosion on the top of the center spar. The wings look pretty clean. When I told the owner, he opted to find another project and sel l this one. =0A=0A=0AGood news, he bought the Tiger that was for sale in Virginia. It's a project too, but he ca n fly it.=0A=0A=0AThe Traveler project will need:=0A- Interior=0A- Glass (windows and windshield)=0A- much of the wiring, FWF, 'should' be replaced.=0A- Avionics. Not much in the way of avionics. =0A He will offer the ADF, DME, and whateve r else I remove from the Tiger if you're interested. =0A=0A =0APaul wants $38,000 for the project. Or, he'll sell the ENGINE, PFS, PROP, and nose bowl separately, for what he has in them, and part out the Traveler. The ADF and DME are also available for sale.=0A=0A=0AGary=0AAuCountry Aviation=0A ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:39:30 PM PST US From: Gary L Vogt Subject: Re: TeamGrumman-List: Re T/s Assist I had a similar problem with a Cheetah. -=0A=0ABarry's comment about fuel pressure is a good one the investigate.=0A=0AWhat I did was to send the ca rb to LyCon and have them flow test the carb and repair as necessary. -I don't recall the exact fix but whatever it was, it solved the problem. - =0A=0AOn my website, I have IDLE mixture setting instructions. -Look unde r Technical Stuff. -Most mechanics do not know how to set the IDLE/Mixtur e.=0A=0AI usually set the IDLE to the lowest limits. -This way, when land ing, the engine isn't pulling. -=0AOn a Tiger, I shoot for 500 rpm or les s. -On a Cheetah, 600 rpm or less. -=0A=0AOn N28747, the IDLE was set a t 450rpm. -Never had any problems. -LyCon did my carb too.-=0A=0ABrin g it here and I'll set it up for you.=0A=0AGary-=0A=0A=0AOn Saturday, Jul y 26, 2014 9:00 AM, FLYaDIVE wrote:=0A =0A=0A=0AVery g ood report Bill:=0A=0AThings that I would check - And these are NOT in orde r of severity:=0A1 - Engine temps - Are you seeing high CHT's? -Does the lower part of the engine/cowl feel hotter than normal. -Crazy thought - C ould you be approaching vapor lock. -Yes. vapor lock can happen even with AvGas.=0A2 - Mixture Cable - For smooth operation and full movement.=0A3 - Mixture Cable - For mounting and cable supports.=0A4 - Throttle Cable - Sa me as Mixture Cable above.=0A4a - With these checks you are also LQQKing fo r unwanted movement - Too free a movement.=0A5 - Carb - Any air leaks - Mou nting.-=0A6 - Carb Box - Any thing loose=0A7 - Carb Heat - Is it moving w hen you do not want it to?=0A8 - Carb Heat Cable - You got it - For smooth operation and full movement. For mounting and cable supports.=0A9 - Fuel Pr essure - Is it dropping when you go to idle... -More than allowed, out of the Green Arc?=0A10 - Air filter - Anything blocking the air filter.=0ANot e: -I would NOT do any power off stalls until you solve this problem.=0A =0APlease report back on what you find. -=0A=0ABarry=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Sat, Jul 26, 2014 at 11:17 AM, Bill Chambers wrote: =0A=0A =0A>Team Hi,=0A>-=0A>Need some insight/assistance into an issue we are =0Ahaving with our , O-320, High Compression STC,Power Flow Equipped, 77 =0ACheetah.-After touchdown and roll out our engine will quit unless t hrottle =0Ais cracked open a bit, (we fly out of KSGJ so basically a sea le vel airport), no =0Aissues with restarting it. Typical scenario is on final with power minimum =0A(throttle closed) , mixture full rich, carb heat OFF .- After touchdown, =0Ausually while turning off runway, speed < 20 knots (guess) and pulling off =0Athe runway the engine wants to quit (and has) u nless some throttle is =0Aapplied.- Our mechanic has checked engine at lo w idle RPM (normal range =0A(600-800?at idle).- Hes also checked the idle cutoff rise at idle of ~ 50 =0Arpm.=0A>-=0A>The other day we ran at idle after start for longer =0Athan normal with no problem. So this problem onl y seems to appear after engine =0Ais hot and after touchdown.=0A>-=0A>Any suggestions or experiences such as =0Athis?=0A>-=0A>Thanks=0A>Cheers,=0A >Bill=0A>N26114 KSGJ=0A>st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navi gator?TeamGrumman-List=0Atp://forums.matronics.com=0A_blank">http://www.mat = ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message teamgrumman-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/TeamGrumman-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/teamgrumman-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/teamgrumman-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.