Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:10 AM - XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
2. 12:29 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Matt Dralle)
3. 01:25 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
4. 01:58 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Matt Dralle)
5. 02:29 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
6. 02:32 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
7. 02:33 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Matt Dralle)
8. 02:41 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
9. 02:49 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
10. 04:44 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Scott Thibault)
11. 05:16 PM - Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit Squirrely??? (Randy Visentine)
12. 11:33 PM - Official XDP4000X-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
13. 11:37 PM - Official XDP4000X-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
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| Subject: | XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A bit |
Squirrely???
Hello gang (unfortunately the dwindling gang :-( ) . I have an iPod +
XDP4k Question (applies to any XDP + any MP3 Player Setup). I'm a wordy
S.O.B. but I eventually get my point across :-p
I am re-vamping my 1999 Tacoma Audio installation, and I integrated a 30GB
Video iPod with my C90 + XDP-4K combo. I bought a "PAC" brand "Unilink Aux
Input Adaptor" that plugs into the CD-Changer Unilink Input on my XDP-4k,
and tricks the Head Unit (or XDP) into thinking a Unilink CD-Changer is
connected (The C90 displays "CD2, Track 00 Time 00:00" continuously while
listening to the iPod), and allows you to use the associated RCA Inputs for
whatever source you want (an iPod's "Dock" Line Out in my case). I removed
my dual 10-Disc changers in favor of the iPod (and I still have the C90's CD
Player via Toslink for more "Critical Listening").
The PAC Unilink adaptor is like this:
http://home.speedfactory.net/tcashin/pacdongle.jpg
It works fine for the most part, *BUT* if I power-down the C90 (remove +12v
Switched Power from the C90) while I'm on any source *BUT* the iPod (it
appears as "CD2" on the C90), the C90 freaks out on the next power-up, and
freezes up (when I turn on the Truck). So, if I'm on the C90's internal CD
Player (Toslink) or the AM/FM Tuner (RCA) and power down (turn off the
Truck's ignition) - the next time I turn on the Truck, the C90 is freaked
out, and is essentially non-functional (no display, etc). The C90 still
"Beeps" and stuff, but there is no display or blue LED ring around the
rotary encoder at this point (the XDP and Amps will turn on sometimes, and
not at other times! Wierd stuff - I'm lost).
*BUT* if I power down the C90 (turn off the truck's Ignition) while the iPod
is currently selected on the C90 ("CD2" on the C90), I can power back on
just fine (Turn on the Truck), and everything is alright! Odd, huh? Since
I just mounted the iPod, it took me a little while to discover this issue,
and I was very perplexed once I did...
Even when the iPod is selected on power-up, the C90 still does a quick
power-down/reboot as it re-detects the PAC Unilink Adaptor (but it works
fine after that).
Once the C90 "Freezes Up" (from powering-up with the C90's internal CD or
AM/FM Tuner selected), I am able to do a "Reset" from the C90's front-panel
"Reset" button, and it works fine after that (until I power off again with
anything other than the iPod selected). But this entails resetting the
C90's Clock and the Display angle every time this happens (but this is MUCH
easier than removing my passenger seat to un-plug the PAC Unilink Adaptor
from the XDP!). So the iPod works, but it is buggy to say the least...
PS - This also happens when I use my XA-C30 3-Input Unilink box into the
XDP-4k (happens with or w/o the XA-C30). Also happens with and without a
Sony 848x CD-Changer connected to the XA-C30.
Does anyone make a different Unilink Input Adaptor that does not cause this
behavior with an XDP-4k + C90? Or is there anything else I can do to
use the Analog RCA Changer input on the XDP-4k? (PS - I need the
C90's AM/FM Tuner, so I need the XDP's "Master" RCA Input for that
functionallity). Making my own Unilink adaptor is not out of the question
(I have extra Unilink Cables and descent soldering/circuitry skills), but
I'd need a schematic (and I assume it would be a better design than the PAC
Unilink adaptor I already have?).
I have seen the Unilink-to-iPod "Control" type adaptors, but everything I
have read indicates those "lock out" the iPod's front-panel controls, and
force you to use the Sony Head-Unit's controls and display to navigate the
iPod (and we all know you can't read the C90's display before 8PM if your
life depended on it), so I'd prefer to control the iPod from the iPod's
front-panel click-wheel (this rules out the Unilink-to-iPod "Control" type
interfaces IIRC). Is this correct?
I also have a CDX-805 and a CDX-848x 10-Disc Unilink Changer I'd be willing
to bastardize for this project, but other means are preferred before I kill
a perfectly fine Unilink CD Changer (and I'd need specific instructions
before I attempt this)...
One more Q concerning the iPod - I bought an "iPod Dock Cable" that has RCA
Outs and connections for +12V for charging the iPod's battery. The benefits
over a 1/8" Headphone Cable are that it bypasses the iPod's Headphone
Amplifier Stage, and provides a true Fixed Level "Line Out" (volume
independent), plus facilities for charging the iPod from the Vehicle's
electrical system. The drawback is I get odd noise from the iPod when it is
charging (ground loops / differences in ground potential causing noise to
get carried over the audio shields). The iPod's +12V power and ground
terminate with the XDP-4K's +12V power + ground (ground potential is
identical), but I'm still getting odd noise in the iPod's RCA's with the
+12V connected. It sounds like odd HD Head-Seeking (digital) type noise,
not a steady analog hum. If I pull the fuse that feeds the iPod +12V, the
noise goes away - a classic sign of a Ground Loop. But as I ponder it, the
iPod Dock cable does run the +12V and RCA's in the same wire "jacket" for 5
feet (from the iPod connector to where the iPod's RCA's and Power Wires
split) - so it might also be induced noise I'm hearing (That is what I'm
thinking since the noise fluctuates, it's not a steady hum. I'd guess -50dB
or higher on a 0dBfs scale). How can I eliminate this on the +12V side of
the iPod's charging circuitry? I refuse to put a line-level Transformer on
the RCA's, so some type of +12V filter is needed (but I have never had to
rely on such P.O.S. tactics before - so what works, and will any kind of
+12V filter cure this noise?). I have also pondered installing a separate
+12V Toggle Switch for the iPod so it can charge during less-critical
listening or when I'm not in the Truck. Then I can listen with the iPod's
+12V turned "off", and enjoy a low noise floor. Flip the switch as I head
into work for the day, and return (9 Hours Later) to a fully charged iPod
that can be listened to off the internal battery. But a +12V filter is
preferred for simplicity's sake. The iPod mainly lives in the Tuck - I only
bring it inside to Sync it - so some sort of charging mechanism is needed.
Once I'm done, this will be my best sounding Mobile Install in my 18 Year
tenure in Car Audio. Thanks in no small part to the XDP-4k and Sony
ES mid/high amplifiers: I'm running a Sony XM-7547 (the big one) Bridged on
a pair of 8.75" Vifa Mid-Woofers, and a Sony XM-100G (Dual Mono Topology) on
a pair of CDT ES-02 2" hand-coated Mid-Tweets in the A-Pillars (crossed at
793 Hz, and possibly at 500Hz/72dB Oct). Combined with a pair of JBL W12GTi
12" subs in a sealed 2.3 Cu Ft enclosure on a Rockford BD1500.1 @ 1.5 Ohms
(approx 2KW RMS). In addition, almost 3 Farads of Stiffening Caps, and that
(along with proper XDP/DSC tuning) should make for a killer system :-)
I'm a little bit excited about this if you can't tell by now :-o
A sincere "Thanks" from a continuing/modernizing XDP4K + C90 enthusiast,
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - |
A bit Squirrely???
At 03:09 AM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
>I am re-vamping my 1999 Tacoma Audio installation, and I integrated a 30GB
Video iPod with my C90 + XDP-4K combo. I bought a "PAC" brand "Unilink Aux
Input Adaptor" that plugs into the CD-Changer Unilink Input on my XDP-4k,
and tricks the Head Unit (or XDP) into thinking a Unilink CD-Changer is
connected (The C90 displays "CD2, Track 00 Time 00:00" continuously while
listening to the iPod), and allows you to use the associated RCA Inputs for
whatever source you want (an iPod's "Dock" Line Out in my case). I removed
my dual 10-Disc changers in favor of the iPod (and I still have the C90's
CD Player via Toslink for more "Critical Listening").
>
>The PAC Unilink adaptor is like this:
><http://home.speedfactory.net/tcashin/pacdongle.jpg>http://home.speedfactor
y.net/tcashin/pacdongle.jpg
Sounds to me like the PacDongle isn't following the Unilink protocol
correctly. There are quite a few "nuances" about the protocol that must be
emulated exactly if reliable operation is expected. I wrote a Unilink
emulator for a 8051-core microcontroller and spent a substantial amount of
effort getting the timing correct and emulating the protocol correctly. To
my knowledge, there is no officially available "specification" from Sony on
the Unilink protocol, and anyone that has ever done it other than Sony, did
it by reverse engineering it.
I was pretty motivated for a while on building a device similar to the
PacDongle that you have and actually have built a system that does a full
CD Changer emulation including track and album information in a test
enviroment. Unfortunately, as you pointed out, the the market for a
Unilink product is dwendling quickly. Here's a couple of pics of the
system I built with a 60GB hard drive. The close up is of the 100 mips
8051-based microcontroller to specifically do the Unilink emulation. It
also does full Unilink decode on the bus and outputs to RS232 for
debugging.
http://www.matronics.com/xdp-4000x/MattsUnilinkMP3-CompleteSystem.jpg
http://www.matronics.com/xdp-4000x/MattsUnilinkMP3-100mips8051.jpg
http://www.matronics.com/xdp-4000x/MattsUnilinkMP3-DebugDecodingDump.pdf
I've been using the Phatnoise Phatbox system in both my car and truck
C90/4000x installations for about 5 years now. http://www.phatnoise.com/
The Phatbox is basically what I was building. The Phatbox is in the trunk
and looks in every way just like a full-featured CD Changer. The Phatbox
has its quirks, but generally works great and has been extremely reliable.
There is a website called PhatHack http://www.phathack.com/ that has hacked
the Phatbox firmware such that you can use your own OEM hard drives now,
and I have recently upgraded both of Phatboxes to 160GB. My library is
currently at 85GB so I can have my entire collection online with the
Phatbox. For me, the best part of the Phatbox type implementation is that
it is truly like a CD Changer in that it is remotely mounted and I simply
control it from the C90 including all track display information. Fumbling
around with an iPod in the passenger area is just a car accident waiting to
happen not to mention pretty kludgy with the wires and what not. Its also
big sign asking someone to break in a steal it.
My recommendation? Dump the iPod and PacDongle and get yourself a sweet
Phatbox setup. Your friends will be impressed and you will be too.
Matt Dralle
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
That's some hadcore DIY'ing, Matt! I considered the Phatbox for some time,
but I could not justify its cost or the cost of it's HD's (the Hacked
Firmware sounds interesting). I can live with this "PAC Issue" like it is,
but it is just annoying. I bet it would work fine w/o the XDP4k (if I had
the PAC adaptor plugged directly into the C90).
But, I can't read the darn C90 Display to begin with - so trying to navigate
through the Phatbox's 10,000 MP3's from that un-readable display is asking
for frustration (and hunching over and using your hands to "Sheild" the sun
from the C90's face is probably more dangerous than clicking through the
iPod - I know I have almost crashed a few times while trying to read the
C90's clock during the day).
I also wanted a high-contrast color Video Screen. So the Phatbox is out
(due to no fault of its own).
I mounted my 30GB Video iPod right next to the C90, and it is in plain view
and sits approx 2" away from the C90's rotary encoder. The wiring is very
clean (one Dock connector cable, about 8" of it is exposed and not cluttered
at all IMO), and the mount is solid (but does not mar the iPod's finish).
Here is a quick (and dark) pic:
http://img243.imageshack.us/my.php?image=9aipodc90noflashgccl3.jpg
You can see how much brighter the iPod is, and that is with it set at 50%
Brightness! That thing will blind you in a dark truck if you don't crank
down the Brightness! It is so much easier to read and navigate than the C90
IMO (even 100% readable in direct sunlight)...
As far as "Theft" - I think the $,$$$ 12" Subs and amps are more of an
attraction than the $200 iPod, but with literally two clicks (one to remove
the Dock Cable, one to release the iPod Cradle) the iPod comes inside with
me in under 5 seconds :-) Just as easy as removing the C90's face...
I'll probably stick with this install for a year or so, and then rip out the
C90/XDP in favor of a Car-PC + RME "Multiface" Audio Interface to do all of
the Linear-Phase DSP, and I'll get a 7" LCD with DVD-Navigation and endless
storage capacity to boot! That's going to be fun (seems like the next
logical step to me)...
Thanks for the info!
Any ideas on how to kill the noise I'm getting when the iPod is charging?
I'll probably just add a seperate toggle switch so I can charge it when I'm
not listening to it, and play off the Battery while listening (or even do a
"Reverse Relay" that kicks on when I turn off the Truck)...
Randy V
On 7/1/07, Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com> wrote:
>
>
> At 03:09 AM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
>
> I am re-vamping my 1999 Tacoma Audio installation, and I integrated a 30GB
> Video iPod with my C90 + XDP-4K combo. I bought a "PAC" brand "Unilink Aux
> Input Adaptor" that plugs into the CD-Changer Unilink Input on my XDP-4k,
> and tricks the Head Unit (or XDP) into thinking a Unilink CD-Changer is
> connected (The C90 displays "CD2, Track 00 Time 00:00" continuously while
> listening to the iPod), and allows you to use the associated RCA Inputs for
> whatever source you want (an iPod's "Dock" Line Out in my case). I removed
> my dual 10-Disc changers in favor of the iPod (and I still have the C90's CD
> Player via Toslink for more "Critical Listening").
>
> The PAC Unilink adaptor is like this:
> http://home.speedfactory.net/tcashin/pacdongle.jpg
>
>
> Sounds to me like the PacDongle isn't following the Unilink protocol
> correctly. There are quite a few "nuances" about the protocol that must be
> emulated exactly if reliable operation is expected. I wrote a Unilink
> emulator for a 8051-core microcontroller and spent a substantial amount of
> effort getting the timing correct and emulating the protocol correctly. To
> my knowledge, there is no officially available "specification" from Sony on
> the Unilink protocol, and anyone that has ever done it other than Sony, did
> it by reverse engineering it.
>
> I was pretty motivated for a while on building a device similar to the
> PacDongle that you have and actually have built a system that does a full CD
> Changer emulation including track and album information in a test
> enviroment. Unfortunately, as you pointed out, the the market for a Unilink
> product is dwendling quickly. Here's a couple of pics of the system I built
> with a 60GB hard drive. The close up is of the 100 mips 8051-based
> microcontroller to specifically do the Unilink emulation. It also does full
> Unilink decode on the bus and outputs to RS232 for debugging.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/xdp-4000x/MattsUnilinkMP3-CompleteSystem.jpg
>
> http://www.matronics.com/xdp-4000x/MattsUnilinkMP3-100mips8051.jpg
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/xdp-4000x/MattsUnilinkMP3-DebugDecodingDump.pdf
>
> I've been using the Phatnoise Phatbox system in both my car and truck
> C90/4000x installations for about 5 years now. http://www.phatnoise.com/
> The Phatbox is basically what I was building. The Phatbox is in the trunk
> and looks in every way just like a full-featured CD Changer. The Phatbox
> has its quirks, but generally works great and has been extremely reliable.
> There is a website called PhatHack http://www.phathack.com/ that has
> hacked the Phatbox firmware such that you can use your own OEM hard drives
> now, and I have recently upgraded both of Phatboxes to 160GB. My library is
> currently at 85GB so I can have my entire collection online with the
> Phatbox. For me, the best part of the Phatbox type implementation is that
> it is truly like a CD Changer in that it is remotely mounted and I simply
> control it from the C90 including all track display information. Fumbling
> around with an iPod in the passenger area is just a car accident waiting to
> happen not to mention pretty kludgy with the wires and what not. Its also
> big sign asking someone to break in a steal it.
>
> My recommendation? Dump the iPod and PacDongle and get yourself a sweet
> Phatbox setup. Your friends will be impressed and you will be too.
>
> Matt Dralle
>
> Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - |
A bit Squirrely???
At 01:25 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
>That's some hadcore DIY'ing, Matt! I considered the Phatbox for some time, but
I could not justify its cost or the cost of it's HD's (the Hacked Firmware sounds
interesting). I can live with this "PAC Issue" like it is, but it is just
annoying. I bet it would work fine w/o the XDP4k (if I had the PAC adaptor
plugged directly into the C90).
You might want to contact the Dongle manufacture; they might be interested in working
with you on the issue. When I was doing my Unilink development, I found
that even Sony's Unilink implementation varied from head unit to head unit.
On my emulator, something that would work on the C90 wouldn't quite work on a
C8850 for example, so a little timing tweak was required to get them to both
work. I picked up a number of different Sony head units off Ebay so that I could
test my development across a variety of different Sony implementations. Sounds
to me like the developer of your dongle assumed that if his implimentation
worked on one head unit, it would work on all of them. Not.
But screw all that, check out this sweet deal I just found directly from Sony:
http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield for $49.95,
in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a chance to play
with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
> Any ideas on how to kill the noise I'm getting when the iPod is charging? I'll
probably just add a seperate toggle switch so I can charge it when I'm not
listening to it, and play off the Battery while listening (or even do a "Reverse
Relay" that kicks on when I turn off the Truck)...
This problem is almost always related to the grounding and the fact that the C90/4000x/iPod
grounds are not at exactly the same potential. I ran big old 8 gauge
Power AND Ground wire from my stereo power distribution up to the C90 and
also to the 4000x. I don't switch anything through the ignition.
The Phatbox is powered through the Unilink cable though, and I found that if I
screwed the chassis of the Phatbox (metal) directly to the floor pan of my truck
(also metal), I would get a bad whine. I mounted the Phatbox to a piece of
plexiglass and then mounted the plexiglass to the floor pan of the truck and
all the noise went away. Make sure that you run specific ground wires to all
of the components and use big wire like 10 or 8 gauge and tie all the grounds
together. Also, if at all possible isolate all of the components from the car
chassis.
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
My main issue with these type units (any iPod adaptor that controls the iPod
from the Head-Unit) is that they DISABLE the iPod's front-panel controls
(the iPod's Click Wheel becomes useless)! This means you must navigate the
iPod from the C90 - and I can't navigate what I can't physically see (damn
C90 Display). NTM the iPod is so easy to navigate in general - that I would
prefer it's "Click Wheel" over the C90 even *IF* I could read the C90 during
the day. I also recall that these interfaces disable the iPod display, too
(but I'm not sure about that part).
Maybe I'm mistaken, but everything I have read indicates that any iPod
adaptor that "Takes Over" the iPod from the Head-Unit locks out the iPod's
controls (maybe this is an iPod issue?). And I'm not sure if that XA-110IP
box will even work on older Unilink systems (it says for 2006 and newer
units - I guess Sony "Fixed" the Unilink Protocol for the new units, but
"Broke" it's backwards compatibility for older units?). If only a new Sony
HU (with a readable display) would work with the XDP4k :-(
On the noise - The XDP and C90 *already* have dedicated 8Ga Grounds (the
iPod charging wires are tacked on with the XDP - so its ground potential is
identical), and all 8 system grounds terminate at a single point ("Star
Grounding" to an unused 17mm Seat Belt Bolt in the X-Tra Cab). I'm thinking
it is induced noise, as the iPod +12v charge wire runs in the same "Wire
Jacket" as the RCA's for approx 5 feet (from the iPod Dock connector to
where the cable "Breaks out" to seperate RCA/Power wires). The RCA
Sheilding is probably inadequate considering there is a +12v wire run in
parallel with the RCA's for 5 Feet (but Alpine's AI-Net does this for tens
of feet - but probably with better Audio shielding).
On Chassis Ground issues - Right now, I have the C90, XDP, and 2 Amps
all tied into the Metal Chassis, and all is quiet as a mouse over here :) .
Star Grounding with heavy gague wires seems to work well - VERY well. I'm
hooked!
Thanks for the reply, Matt!
Randy V
On 7/1/07, Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com> wrote:
>
>
> At 01:25 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
> >That's some hadcore DIY'ing, Matt! I considered the Phatbox for some
> time, but I could not justify its cost or the cost of it's HD's (the Hacked
> Firmware sounds interesting). I can live with this "PAC Issue" like it is,
> but it is just annoying. I bet it would work fine w/o the XDP4k (if I had
> the PAC adaptor plugged directly into the C90).
>
> You might want to contact the Dongle manufacture; they might be interested
> in working with you on the issue. When I was doing my Unilink development,
> I found that even Sony's Unilink implementation varied from head unit to
> head unit. On my emulator, something that would work on the C90 wouldn't
> quite work on a C8850 for example, so a little timing tweak was required to
> get them to both work. I picked up a number of different Sony head units
> off Ebay so that I could test my development across a variety of different
> Sony implementations. Sounds to me like the developer of your dongle
> assumed that if his implimentation worked on one head unit, it would work on
> all of them. Not.
>
> But screw all that, check out this sweet deal I just found directly from
> Sony:
>
> http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
>
> http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
>
> At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield for
> $49.95, in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a chance
> to play with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
>
>
> > Any ideas on how to kill the noise I'm getting when the iPod is
> charging? I'll probably just add a seperate toggle switch so I can charge
> it when I'm not listening to it, and play off the Battery while listening
> (or even do a "Reverse Relay" that kicks on when I turn off the Truck)...
>
> This problem is almost always related to the grounding and the fact that
> the C90/4000x/iPod grounds are not at exactly the same potential. I ran big
> old 8 gauge Power AND Ground wire from my stereo power distribution up to
> the C90 and also to the 4000x. I don't switch anything through the
> ignition.
>
> The Phatbox is powered through the Unilink cable though, and I found that
> if I screwed the chassis of the Phatbox (metal) directly to the floor pan of
> my truck (also metal), I would get a bad whine. I mounted the Phatbox to a
> piece of plexiglass and then mounted the plexiglass to the floor pan of the
> truck and all the noise went away. Make sure that you run specific ground
> wires to all of the components and use big wire like 10 or 8 gauge and tie
> all the grounds together. Also, if at all possible isolate all of the
> components from the car chassis.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Matt Dralle
>
>
> Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
>
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
PS - I do have dedicated 8Ga +12v runs to the C90 and XDP. I use a simple
Relay to transfer the truck's Switched +12v, so the C90's Switched +12v
currnet still comes form the 8Ga wire that terminates with the rest of the
system power wiring ;-) I didn't mess around with my wiring this time!
On 7/1/07, Randy Visentine <randyman@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> My main issue with these type units (any iPod adaptor that controls the
> iPod from the Head-Unit) is that they DISABLE the iPod's front-panel
> controls (the iPod's Click Wheel becomes useless)! This means you must
> navigate the iPod from the C90 - and I can't navigate what I can't
> physically see (damn C90 Display). NTM the iPod is so easy to navigate in
> general - that I would prefer it's "Click Wheel" over the C90 even *IF* I
> could read the C90 during the day. I also recall that these interfaces
> disable the iPod display, too (but I'm not sure about that part).
>
> Maybe I'm mistaken, but everything I have read indicates that any iPod
> adaptor that "Takes Over" the iPod from the Head-Unit locks out the iPod's
> controls (maybe this is an iPod issue?). And I'm not sure if that XA-110IP
> box will even work on older Unilink systems (it says for 2006 and newer
> units - I guess Sony "Fixed" the Unilink Protocol for the new units, but
> "Broke" it's backwards compatibility for older units?). If only a new Sony
> HU (with a readable display) would work with the XDP4k :-(
>
> On the noise - The XDP and C90 *already* have dedicated 8Ga Grounds (the
> iPod charging wires are tacked on with the XDP - so its ground potential is
> identical), and all 8 system grounds terminate at a single point ("Star
> Grounding" to an unused 17mm Seat Belt Bolt in the X-Tra Cab). I'm thinking
> it is induced noise, as the iPod +12v charge wire runs in the same "Wire
> Jacket" as the RCA's for approx 5 feet (from the iPod Dock connector to
> where the cable "Breaks out" to seperate RCA/Power wires). The RCA
> Sheilding is probably inadequate considering there is a +12v wire run in
> parallel with the RCA's for 5 Feet (but Alpine's AI-Net does this for tens
> of feet - but probably with better Audio shielding).
>
> On Chassis Ground issues - Right now, I have the C90, XDP, and 2 Amps
> all tied into the Metal Chassis, and all is quiet as a mouse over here :) .
> Star Grounding with heavy gague wires seems to work well - VERY well. I'm
> hooked!
>
> Thanks for the reply, Matt!
>
> Randy V
>
>
> On 7/1/07, Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > At 01:25 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
> > >That's some hadcore DIY'ing, Matt! I considered the Phatbox for some
> > time, but I could not justify its cost or the cost of it's HD's (the Hacked
> > Firmware sounds interesting). I can live with this "PAC Issue" like it is,
> > but it is just annoying. I bet it would work fine w/o the XDP4k (if I had
> > the PAC adaptor plugged directly into the C90).
> >
> > You might want to contact the Dongle manufacture; they might be
> > interested in working with you on the issue. When I was doing my Unilink
> > development, I found that even Sony's Unilink implementation varied from
> > head unit to head unit. On my emulator, something that would work on the
> > C90 wouldn't quite work on a C8850 for example, so a little timing tweak was
> > required to get them to both work. I picked up a number of different Sony
> > head units off Ebay so that I could test my development across a variety of
> > different Sony implementations. Sounds to me like the developer of your
> > dongle assumed that if his implimentation worked on one head unit, it would
> > work on all of them. Not.
> >
> > But screw all that, check out this sweet deal I just found directly from
> > Sony:
> >
> > http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
> >
> > http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
> >
> > At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield
> > for $49.95, in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a
> > chance to play with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
> >
> >
> > > Any ideas on how to kill the noise I'm getting when the iPod is
> > charging? I'll probably just add a seperate toggle switch so I can charge
> > it when I'm not listening to it, and play off the Battery while listening
> > (or even do a "Reverse Relay" that kicks on when I turn off the Truck)...
> >
> > This problem is almost always related to the grounding and the fact that
> > the C90/4000x/iPod grounds are not at exactly the same potential. I ran big
> > old 8 gauge Power AND Ground wire from my stereo power distribution up to
> > the C90 and also to the 4000x. I don't switch anything through the
> > ignition.
> >
> > The Phatbox is powered through the Unilink cable though, and I found
> > that if I screwed the chassis of the Phatbox (metal) directly to the floor
> > pan of my truck (also metal), I would get a bad whine. I mounted the
> > Phatbox to a piece of plexiglass and then mounted the plexiglass to the
> > floor pan of the truck and all the noise went away. Make sure that you run
> > specific ground wires to all of the components and use big wire like 10 or
8
> > gauge and tie all the grounds together. Also, if at all possible isolate
> > all of the components from the car chassis.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> >
> >
> > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> > 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
> > http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Randy V.
> Houston, TX
> Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
>
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor |
- A bit Squirrely???
At 01:58 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
>
>...check out this sweet deal I just found directly from Sony:
>
> http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
>
> http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
>
>At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield for $49.95,
in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a chance to play
with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
Follow up to this... Reading around the Net there are some serious mixed reviews
on this unit. Seems that it works as advertised, but navigation is sloooow.
It also disables the iPod's controls, which probably won't work for you. Anyway,
I'm anxious to give it a try and see if it will work with the C90 - a nine-year
old deck!
Here's a couple of other options I found surfing around for full control and display
on a Sony head unit over the Unilink from an iPod:
Full Control w/ Display:
http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD001
http://www.amazon.com/Peripheral-Adapter-iPod2Car-connects-iPod/dp/tech-data/B000FUA1IG/ref=de_a_smtd/103-7653789-2989460 (Here's a good review of this one: http://www.thinkmac.net/blog/archives/review-ipod2car-gen-2-ipod-car-integration.html )
Audio-Only, No Control/No Display:
http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002
Matt
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
Killer links! I'm looking into the
http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002 right now.
I ran across most of the iPod adaptors as I was feverishly Googling (before
I started the Install), but this one slipped by me! It might just be
perfect as long as the iPod remains fully operational (it appears it does)
Thanks Matt!!!
Randy V
On 7/1/07, Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com> wrote:
>
>
> At 01:58 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
> >
> >...check out this sweet deal I just found directly from Sony:
> >
> > http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
> >
> > http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
> >
> >At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield
> for $49.95, in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a
> chance to play with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
>
> Follow up to this... Reading around the Net there are some serious mixed
> reviews on this unit. Seems that it works as advertised, but navigation is
> sloooow. It also disables the iPod's controls, which probably won't work
> for you. Anyway, I'm anxious to give it a try and see if it will work with
> the C90 - a nine-year old deck!
>
> Here's a couple of other options I found surfing around for full control
> and display on a Sony head unit over the Unilink from an iPod:
>
> Full Control w/ Display:
>
> http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD001
>
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Peripheral-Adapter-iPod2Car-connects-iPod/dp/tech-data/B000FUA1IG/ref=de_a_smtd/103-7653789-2989460 (Here's
> a good review of this one:
> http://www.thinkmac.net/blog/archives/review-ipod2car-gen-2-ipod-car-integration.html)
>
>
> Audio-Only, No Control/No Display:
>
> http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002
>
> Matt
>
>
> Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
>
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
Message 9
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|
| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
One thing that scares me a little - That "Connects2" adaptor has a
disclaimer that says "Note: Not suitable for use in conjunction with a CD
changer, or with 1st generation iPods."
I'm not sure if this means you'd need something like a XA-C30 to use a
CD-Changer (since the iPod adaptor eats up your Unilink connnection), or if
there are issues with passing the adaptor's protocol through such Unilink
units (or even passing through a XDP-4k). Any ideas?
It might be worth the cash to try it out. If it doesn't work - off to eBay
it goes...
I'll ponder this for a while before I pull the trigger.
Thanks again
On 7/1/07, Randy Visentine <randyman@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Killer links! I'm looking into the
> http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002 right
> now. I ran across most of the iPod adaptors as I was feverishly Googling
> (before I started the Install), but this one slipped by me! It might just
> be perfect as long as the iPod remains fully operational (it appears it
> does)
>
> Thanks Matt!!!
>
> Randy V
>
>
> On 7/1/07, Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > At 01:58 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
> > >
> > >...check out this sweet deal I just found directly from Sony:
> > >
> > > http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
> > >
> > > http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
> > >
> > >At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield
> > for $49.95, in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a
> > chance to play with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
> >
> > Follow up to this... Reading around the Net there are some serious
> > mixed reviews on this unit. Seems that it works as advertised, but
> > navigation is sloooow. It also disables the iPod's controls, which probably
> > won't work for you. Anyway, I'm anxious to give it a try and see if it will
> > work with the C90 - a nine-year old deck!
> >
> > Here's a couple of other options I found surfing around for full control
> > and display on a Sony head unit over the Unilink from an iPod:
> >
> > Full Control w/ Display:
> >
> > http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD001
> >
> > http://www.amazon.com/Peripheral-Adapter-iPod2Car-connects-iPod/dp/tech-data/B000FUA1IG/ref=de_a_smtd/103-7653789-2989460
> > (Here's a good review of this one: http://www.thinkmac.net/blog/archives/review-ipod2car-gen-2-ipod-car-integration.html
> > )
> >
> >
> > Audio-Only, No Control/No Display:
> >
> > http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> > 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
> > http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Randy V.
> Houston, TX
> Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
>
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
Here is my 2 cents the IPOD outputs video and audio through its headphone jack.
How about using the sony Ipod adaptor and get the cables that hook to the head
phone jack to output video to your screen if you have one.
Randy Visentine <randyman@gmail.com> wrote: One thing that scares me a little
- That "Connects2" adaptor has a disclaimer that says "Note: Not suitable for
use in conjunction with a CD changer, or with 1st generation iPods."
I'm not sure if this means you'd need something like a XA-C30 to use a CD-Changer
(since the iPod adaptor eats up your Unilink connnection), or if there are
issues with passing the adaptor's protocol through such Unilink units (or even
passing through a XDP-4k). Any ideas?
It might be worth the cash to try it out. If it doesn't work - off to eBay it
goes...
I'll ponder this for a while before I pull the trigger.
Thanks again
On 7/1/07, Randy Visentine <randyman@gmail.com> wrote: Killer links! I'm looking into the http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002 right now. I ran across most of the iPod adaptors as I was feverishly Googling (before I started the Install), but this one slipped by me! It might just be perfect as long as the iPod remains fully operational (it appears it does)
Thanks Matt!!!
Randy V
At 01:58 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
>
>...check out this sweet deal I just found directly from Sony:
>
> http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
>
> http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
>
>At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from Crutchfield for $49.95,
in stock. I will post a review when I receive it and had a chance to play
with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
Follow up to this... Reading around the Net there are some serious mixed reviews
on this unit. Seems that it works as advertised, but navigation is sloooow.
It also disables the iPod's controls, which probably won't work for you. Anyway,
I'm anxious to give it a try and see if it will work with the C90 - a nine-year
old deck!
Here's a couple of other options I found surfing around for full control and display
on a Sony head unit over the Unilink from an iPod:
Full Control w/ Display:
http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD001
http://www.amazon.com/Peripheral-Adapter-iPod2Car-connects-iPod/dp/tech-data/B000FUA1IG/ref=de_a_smtd/103-7653789-2989460 (Here's a good review of this one: http://www.thinkmac.net/blog/archives/review-ipod2car-gen-2-ipod-car-integration.html )
Audio-Only, No Control/No Display:
http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002
Matt
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
---------------------------------
The fish are biting.
Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: XPD-4K + C90 with PAC Unilink Aux Input Adaptor - A |
bit Squirrely???
That's a good idea - but I don't have an LCD in my dash yet (my C90 is in
the dash).
When I do finally install a 7" LCD in my dash (2-Din flush mounted), the C90
+ XDP + iPod will all be history, as I will use the Car-PC to do all of that
work (and more) in one box (well 2 boxes if you count the RME "Multiface"
16-Channel Audio Breakout Box - it will go right where the XDP is now).
After I get my new door panels fabbed, A-Pillar Mid/Tweeter Pods fabbed, and
get my new box built and covered - then I will look into doing a Car-PC +
Touchscreen LCD... It's still a little while away (the iPod is a "mid term"
solution for me - I have every intention of going to a Car-PC at some
point).
Rock and Roll
Randy V
On 7/1/07, Scott Thibault <tbone7467@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Here is my 2 cents the IPOD outputs video and audio through its headphone
> jack. How about using the sony Ipod adaptor and get the cables that hook to
> the head phone jack to output video to your screen if you have one.
>
> *Randy Visentine <randyman@gmail.com>* wrote:
>
> One thing that scares me a little - That "Connects2" adaptor has a
> disclaimer that says "Note: Not suitable for use in conjunction with a CD
> changer, or with 1st generation iPods."
>
> I'm not sure if this means you'd need something like a XA-C30 to use a
> CD-Changer (since the iPod adaptor eats up your Unilink connnection), or if
> there are issues with passing the adaptor's protocol through such Unilink
> units (or even passing through a XDP-4k). Any ideas?
>
> It might be worth the cash to try it out. If it doesn't work - off
> to eBay it goes...
>
> I'll ponder this for a while before I pull the trigger.
>
> Thanks again
>
>
> On 7/1/07, Randy Visentine <randyman@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Killer links! I'm looking into the http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002
> > right now. I ran across most of the iPod adaptors as I was feverishly
> > Googling (before I started the Install), but this one slipped by me! It
> > might just be perfect as long as the iPod remains fully operational (it
> > appears it does)
> >
> > Thanks Matt!!!
> >
> > Randy V
> >
> >
> > On 7/1/07, Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com > wrote:
> >
> > > >
> > >
> > > At 01:58 PM 7/1/2007 Sunday, you wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >...check out this sweet deal I just found directly from Sony:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.xplodsony.com/xplod/accessories/XA-110IP
> > > >
> > > > http://www.xplodsony.com/files/manuals/XA-110IP_Owners_Manual.pdf
> > > >
> > > >At $50 what have you got to lose? I just ordered one from
> > > Crutchfield for $49.95, in stock. I will post a review when I receive it
> > > and had a chance to play with it. Note that it even charges the IPod.
> > >
> > > Follow up to this... Reading around the Net there are some serious
> > > mixed reviews on this unit. Seems that it works as advertised, but
> > > navigation is sloooow. It also disables the iPod's controls, which probably
> > > won't work for you. Anyway, I'm anxious to give it a try and see if it will
> > > work with the C90 - a nine-year old deck!
> > >
> > > Here's a couple of other options I found surfing around for full
> > > control and display on a Sony head unit over the Unilink from an iPod:
> > >
> > > Full Control w/ Display:
> > >
> > >
> > > http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD001
> > >
> > > http://www.amazon.com/Peripheral-Adapter-iPod2Car-connects-iPod/dp/tech-data/B000FUA1IG/ref=de_a_smtd/103-7653789-2989460
> > > (Here's a good review of this one: http://www.thinkmac.net/blog/archives/review-ipod2car-gen-2-ipod-car-integration.html
> > > )
> > >
> > >
> > > Audio-Only, No Control/No Display:
> > >
> > >
> > > http://www.incarexpress.co.uk/view_product.php?partno=ASOIPOD002
> > >
> > > Matt
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> > > 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | The fish are biting.
> > > Get more visitors<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=49679/*http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php?o=US2140&cmp=Yahoo&ctv=Q107Tagline&s=Y&s2=EM&b=50>on your site using Yahoo!
> > > Search Marketing.
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > <dralle@matronics.com>
> >
> >
--
Randy V.
Houston, TX
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy
Message 12
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|
| Subject: | Official XDP4000X-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the XDP4000X-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below. The
complete XDP4000X-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/XDP4000X-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as
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This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/XDP4000X-List.htm
************************************************************
******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS *******
************************************************************
PLEASE READ. This document contains XDP4000X-List policies and information
for new and old subscribers. Understanding the XDP4000X-List policies will
minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the XDP4000X-List
running smoothly for all of us.
******************************************
*** Quick Start Guide to List Features ***
******************************************
There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each
one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator
you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this
List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?XDP4000X-List
****************************************
*** How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe ***
****************************************
Simply go to the Web Page shown below and enter your email address and
select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. You
may also use the handy "Find" function to determine the exact syntax of
your email address as it is subscribed to the List. Please see the
complete instructions at the top of the Web Page for more information.
The Subscribe/Unsubscribe web page is:
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you will receive TWO conformation emails regarding your subsciption
process. The first verifies that your subscription/unsubsciption request
was received, and the second confirms that the process has been completed.
You should receive the first email within a few minutes of your request.
The second conformation will arrive in less than 24 hours. You cannot post
until you receive the second conformation email message.
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*** How to Post a Message ***
*****************************
Send an email message to:
xdp4000x-list@matronics.com
Your message will be redistributed to everyone currently subscribed
to the List.
*****************************************************
*** SPAM Fighter - You Must be Subscribed to Post ***
*****************************************************
When a new post is received by the system, the From: line of the message
is checked and compared against the current subscription list. If the
email address is found, the message is passed on to the List Processor.
If the email address isn't found in the current list of subscribers, it
is dumped. This serves to very effectively thwart 99% of the SPAM that
gets posted to the Lists.
Remember, however, that the syntax of your email address is very important
with regard to the configuration of your email application such as Outlook
or Eudora. For example, the following two email addresses may be
functionally equivalent, but only one would pass the Matronics Email SPAM
test depending on which was syntax was subscribed to the given List:
smith@machine.domain.com
smith@domain.com
Either email address syntax is alright, just be sure that you configure
your email application to match *exactly* the address you've subscibed to
the List.
**************************************
*** Enclosure Support on the Lists ***
**************************************
Limited posting of enclosures such as pictures, documents, and spreadsheets
is supported on the Lists. There are a number of restrictions, and these
are detailed below. Please abide by the rules put forth regarding the
content of enclosures.
These are some of the features and limits of enclosures on the Matronics
Lists:
1) Enclosures will only be posted to the Real Time version of the Lists.
2) Enclosures will NOT be included in the Daily Digest version of the Lists.
3) Enclosures WILL BE forwarded on to the BBS Forum Web site.
4) Enclosures will NOT be appended to the Archives.
5) Enclosures will NOT be available in the List Browse feature.
6) Only the following file types and extensions will be allowed:
bmp doc dwg dxf gif jpg pdf png txt xls
All other enclosures types will be rejected and email returned to
sender. The enclosure types listed above are relatively safe from
a virus standpoint and don't pose a particularly large security risk.
7) !! All incoming enclosures will be scanned for viruses prior to posting
to the List. This is done in real time and will not slow down
the process of posting the message !!
Here are some rules for posting enclosures. Failure to abide by these rules
could result in the removal of a subscriber's email address from the Lists.
1) Pay attention to what you are posting!! Make sure that the files
you are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB). Remember that there
are still people checking they're email via dial up modem. If you post
30MB worth of pictures, you are placing an unnecessary burden on these
folks and the rest of us, for that matter.
2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES DOWN!!! I don't want to see huge 3000 x 2000
pictures getting posted that are 3 or 4MB each. This is just
unacceptable. Use a program such as Photoshop to scale the picture
down to something on the order of 800 x 600 and try to keep the
file size to less-than 200KB, preferably much less.
Microsoft has a really awesome utility available for free that allows
you to Right-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically
scale it down and resave it. This is a great utility - get it, use it!
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx
Look for the link "Image Resizer"
3) !! This would seem to go without saying, but I'll say it anyway. Do not
post anything that would be considered offensive by your grandmother.
And you know what I'm saying; I don't want to see anything even
questionable. !!
4) REMEMBER THIS: If you post a 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 members
subscribed, your 1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times amounting
to 1MB X 1000 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!! BE CAREFUL and
BE COURTEOUS!
Also see the section below on the Matronics Photo and File Share where
you can have your files and photos posted on the Matronics web server
for long time viewing and availability.
*******************
*** Digest Mode ***
*******************
Each day, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started.
This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended
to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:"
and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting
of a line of underscores.
Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be
combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email list.
To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form
described above, and just select the Digest version of the List.
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions
of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable.
Now some caveats:
* Messages sent to "xdp4000x-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard
email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the
digest List.
* If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you
will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of
the day.
* If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the
normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change
the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please
*do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*.
****************************
*** List Digest Browser ***
****************************
An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain text
or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to
the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found
at the following location:
http://www.matronics.com/digest
*****************************************
*** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag ***
*****************************************
At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a very
small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to archive
it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the
message:
do not archive
Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to List
email distribution as normal.
**********************************************
***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes *****
**********************************************
Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced
email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be promptly
removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving
messages from the XDP4000X-List, go to the following Web page, and look
for your email address and a possible reason for your removal.
The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that
automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that
caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox
full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the
Lists you will find record of it at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribed
If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please feel
free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice.
*******************************
*** List Member Information ***
*******************************
If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and
paper mail address in the following format:
smith@somehost.com
Joe Smith
123 Airport Lane
Tower, CA 91234-1234
098-765-1234 w
123-456-7890 h
Please forward this information to the following email address:
requests@matronics.com
I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when
there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT
be used for any other commercial purpose.
****************************************
*** Realtime Web Email List Browsing ***
****************************************
Recent messages posted to the XDP4000X-List are also made available on
the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are
available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject,
Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are
updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a message
or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming soon).
You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List
Browser Interface in view-mode.
http://www.matronics.com/browselist/xdp4000x-list
*******************************************
*** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface ***
*******************************************
A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all XDP4000X-List content.
content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the email
distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the
List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to the
respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted to
the web Forums.
You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login.
If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you
will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few
minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the
main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also
enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need to
Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the
Email Distribution of the List, however.
The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL:
http://forums.matronics.com
*********************************
*** Matronics Email List Wiki ***
*********************************
In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often accessed
information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at:
http://wiki.matronics.com
The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful information
for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web page
where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki
permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible immediately.
While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be
comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any
images and email it to:
wiki-support@matronics.com
One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct
a Wiki page for you.
Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the
Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that
post and convert it into a Wiki page.
*********************
*** List Archives ***
*********************
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the XDP4000X-List is
available on line. The archive file information is available via the
Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below:
* XDP4000X-List.FAQ
- Latest version of the XDP4000X-List Frequently Asked Question
page (this document).
* XDP4000X-Archive.digest.complete
- Complete file with most of the email header info removed and
page breaks inserted between messages.
* XDP4000X-Archive.digest.vol-??
- Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
can more easily handled.
* XDP4000X-Archive.digest.complete.zip
- Same as the XDP4000X-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* XDP4000X-Archive.digest.complete.Z
- Same as the XDP4000X-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the XDP4000X-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?XDP4000X
*****************************************
**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine ***
*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine
to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the
List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently
available List archives.
http://www.matronics.com/search
****************************
*** File and Photo Share ***
****************************
With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
and other data with members of the List without having to forward a
copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email
them to:
pictures@matronics.com
!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
1) Email Lists that they are related to.
2) Your Full Name.
3) Your Email Address.
4) One line Subject description.
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic.
6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned
for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and
photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to
process them every few days.
Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new
Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
**************************
*** List Archive CDROM ***
**************************
A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM
**********************************
*** List Support Contributions ***
**********************************
The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members.
You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of
annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages
associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November
I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month,
I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they
are comfortable.
I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the
Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated
by companies that are themselves List members.
Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists
including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server
system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many
many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the
variety of services found here.
Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary
and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains
value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude.
Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just
subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in.
The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are
a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and
sending a personal check.
If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to
support its continued operation?
http://www.matronics.com/contributions
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
XDP4000X-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the XDP4000X-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the XDP4000X-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
XDP4000X-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the XDP4000X-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occassional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularyly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
Message 13
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| Subject: | Official XDP4000X-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the XDP4000X-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
XDP4000X-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/XDP4000X-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
XDP4000X-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the XDP4000X-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the XDP4000X-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
XDP4000X-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the XDP4000X-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occassional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularyly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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